# Sikhs Who Do Not Keep Kesh



## Navdeep88 (Jul 15, 2011)

Dear Members, 

This issue is quite a sensitive one but one of great importance to me. I'd like to know where Sikhs who don't keep their hair fit in? I am one of them. 
I love gurbani, love the ideals of Sikhi...they sustain me. But I don't keep my hair, not for any other reason than I don't think my external identity is of any great significance. I dress appropriately, cleanly, and conduct myself respectfully, thats about it. 

I'd like to know the most honest opinions of baptized Sikhs on what they think of their fellow Sikhs who don't keep their hair. I accept that baptized Sikhs are more committed, more knowledgeable and are at the forefront of Sikhi, and rightfully so. Where do you see those who don't keep their hair? 

I HOPE its not the most significant issue of how much of a Sikh one can be, that would be very discouraging. But I'm seriously beginning to doubt, because there is quite a harsh judgement from some. Especially when its people doing seva at the Gurdwara.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jul 15, 2011)

*Re: Sikhs who don't keep hair?*

You are a SIKH...just at a different  "level"...( not  in the sense of being lower/higher - just lateral level...as in a Class...every one is a student progressing at own pace..)

Remember our "religion" is NOT a religion per say....Its a WAY OF LIFE....we Live the Life gifted to us by the Creator...try and improve things, live better - as better human beings..more  loving, more compassionate, more considerate..more truthful, more honest..as each day goes by...so that we arrive at a stage which Bhagat kabir Ji describes as...When we ARRIVED..we cried...and the World Laughed..but when we GO...we LAUGHED and the World CRIED !! IF we can go laughing..we have had a good going  at being a Sikh....ALL those Hundreds of thousands of SIKHS Martyrs...standing in a long line behind Guru Arjun ji Sahib..... who GLADLY CHOSE DEATH - some horribly torturous and terrifyingly horrendous painful deaths even..EACH one--every SINGLE one of them went LAUGHING !!

So no reason to despair..be uncomfortable..feel any lesser or shortcomings...just keep on PROGRESSING....as we are all SIKHS from the first moment here to the last moment here. We dont try and "fit" in because  we are DIFFERENT.


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## Navdeep88 (Jul 15, 2011)

*Re: Sikhs who don't keep hair?*

thank you giani ji!


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## aristotle (Jul 15, 2011)

*Re: Sikhs who don't keep hair?*

The question of Sikhs keeping hair or not has been out there for long. Sikhism, as a religion, is extremely encouraging towards maintaining unshorn hair. This is the highlight of a Sikh's worldly identity. However, we have Muslims without reading namaz five times a day, Christians without Church , Buddhists who don't even give a thought to celibacy.......and Sikhs without unshorn hair.
The argument that it all matters on the inside is very half baked cake sort of stuff; If the inside is devoted to the Guru, the inside obeys Guru's words, and maintaining unshorn hair is one of them. Meanwhile, I don't believe in excluding Sikhs(who don't keep hair) from the Gurudwara activities or from the Sikh community. They should, however, be encouraged to keep hair, and all this I say shouldn't be done forcibly in even the slightest meaning of the word. It is a personal choice, i agree, but we should promote unshorn hair among the Sikh community and show them the true meaning of doing so, how it is so deeply connected with the Sikh and our history.


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## Harry Haller (Jul 16, 2011)

*Re: Sikhs who don't keep hair?*

Navdeepji

As you clearly love sikhi, you are a work in progress, at some stage you will reach a point in your life where you are so in tune with the creator, your soul will want to sing out in praise, at that point you may find a deep desire to take the physical form of a sikh, not only to complement the clear inner sikh in you, but also to inspire others and as a way of honouring the creator. 

Its a long road, we are all seeking enlightenment, long hair does not define a man, but I do believe that if/when you do find yourself close to that enlightenment you will want to share that joy by embracing the k's.


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## Joginder Singh Foley (Jul 16, 2011)

My own opinion on this is that utimately it is up to the individual Sikh what he or she is going to make of his or her Sikhi and much or little he or she is going to practise their Sikhi but ultimately only Guruji can judge us on our commitment to Sikhi and we should not critisc:happysingh:ise another Sikh for his/her commitment and practice of Sikhi. I have seen many instances of Sikhs who do not have full identity even my favorite hate Sikhs who wear hindu strings on their arms that really gets this Singh going but i control my anger and think that they will have to answer to Guruji for their actions just as i will and lieave them to it, Me as someone who was not born to Sikhi but adopted Sikhi will do my best to live and identify my self as a Singh as you as an individual Sikh not only represent your self as a Sikh but you also represent the entire Sikh nation and religion and i am for want of a better word proud to identify myself as a Sikh and a bearded turbaned Punjabi Sikh stands out in a crowd want you are a 6 foot plus 350 pound bearded turbaned Irishman like me you really stand out


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## Kanwaljit.Singh (Jul 16, 2011)

> This issue is quite a sensitive one but one of great importance to me. I'd like to know where Sikhs who don't keep their hair fit in? I am one of them.



First things first, you don't love your parents for the approval of your 'siblings' or 'relatives'. You love them because you love them. Similarly you don't keep hair for acceptance from Panth, you keep them for they have been gifted to you by Guru Himself. Guru said that those who call themselves My Sikhs and Love Me, will keep their hair uncut. You just live up to that.



> I love gurbani, love the ideals of Sikhi...they sustain me.



Isn't hair an ideal of Sikhi? Do you just love ideals or do you work towards them?



> But I don't keep my hair, not for any other reason than I don't think my external identity is of any great significance.



Hair is nothing external, Hair is part of you. After millions of years of evolution from monkey to human, we have lost our tails but kept thick hair on our head. Why? Because hair supports the high voltage neutral activity that goes on in our brain. It is not with us by chance!



> I dress appropriately, cleanly, and conduct myself respectfully, thats about it.



You clean yourself for your mental peace. But you dress yourself to fit in the society. Guru is asking you to keep your hair not to fit in but for your peace.



> I'd like to know the most honest opinions of baptized Sikhs on what they think of their fellow Sikhs who don't keep their hair. I accept that baptized Sikhs are more committed, more knowledgeable and are at the forefront of Sikhi, and rightfully so. Where do you see those who don't keep their hair?



What do I feel about people without hair? I pity them just like I pity myself for not listening to Guru and acting under the influence of Kaam (Lust), Krodh (Anger), Lobh (Greed), Moh (Attachment) and Ahankar (Ego). I see them wandering in this lifetime just like I am, when I don't get up for Amrit Vela. I don't see myself fit for part of Panj Piyare for giving someone Khande Ki Pahul, doing Akhand Paath or Kirtan. But I don't wish to do it to fit into definition of an Amritdhari. I do it for I promised Guru. And Jin Prem Kiyo Tin Hi Prabh Payo.



> I HOPE its not the most significant issue of how much of a Sikh one can be, that would be very discouraging.



Guru has asked for Hair. If Guru comes to you and asks for something, will you be discouraged? Or jump with joy to do something for Guru?



> But I'm seriously beginning to doubt, because there is quite a harsh judgement from some. Especially when its people doing seva at the Gurdwara.



People do so in their moment of weakness. They end up saying wrong words, rather than giving right advice.

Rest is up to you. It is your life and your way of living. Guru asks you not to cut hair. You may not or you might. Guru will surely find other way to convince you, so that you can go on your path of Sikhi without Hurdles and meet Him. But do you wish to wait more?

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa
Waheguru ji ki Fateh


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## calkaur (Jul 22, 2011)

Kanwaljit Singh said:


> Guru said that those who call themselves My Sikhs and Love Me, will keep their hair uncut.


 
So, who exactly is a Sikh?  Should those who are not baptised with amrit not call themselves "Sikh" because they are not actually following what guru teaches?


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## Ishna (Jul 22, 2011)

Calkaur ji and Kanwaljit ji

If the only people allowed to call themselves Sikh were those people who follow Guru ji's teachings 100%, there would be very, very few people calling themselves Sikh indeed!  Those following the essence of Sikhi in their hearts but not outwardly, well they couldn't call themselves Sikh.  Similarly those who follow the outward show of Sikhi but don't follow the essence in their hearts, they couldn't call themselves Sikh either.

A Sikh is a student of Guru Sahib... student means they don't know everything yet.  I think the term is fully applicable to anyone who is *sincerely committed to Sikh faith*, no matter where they are on the path.  Only the individual really knows.  They should be *committed to growing on the path*, and I personally believe that involves keeping kesh eventually.  Everyone struggles with some aspect of discipline.  I struggle with many!  But I still call myself a Sikh because I have the intention of learning, moving forward and ultimately overcoming my shortfalls to be the kind of person who, if Guruji were to magically appear before me, he'd recognise me in my outward appearance and in the sincerity of my heart that I'm a Sikh.  With Guruji's kirpa I will hopefully get there one day (with my fellow bhajis and bhenjis!).

I think the label of Khalsa would apply to those people who in their heart and outward appearance they are true Gursikhs but even they are rare in this world, with a lot of fake Khalsas running around looking like "real Sikhs" but really their hearts are full of the five vices.

On this topic, I was reading McAuliffe's first volume of _The Sikh Religion_ last night and read this:
A Jogi went to visit the Guru and congratulate him on the large number of converts he had made. The Guru replied that he had few real Sikhs, as the Jogi himself would see. The Guru and the Jogi determined to proceed into the forest and there make trial of the Sikh converts who accompanied them in numbers. For this purpose the Guru assumed a terrible guise. He put on dirty, tattered clothes, took a knife in his hand, and proceeded with some hunting dogs into the forest, ostensibly in quest of game. On this several of his Sikhs fled. It was on that occasion the Guru composed the following:-- (go here to read the shabad and the full page of text)...

As the party proceeded they found the road covered with copper coins. Some Sikhs took them up and departed. Further on were found silver coins. Several Sikhs took up the silver coins and returned home. As the Guru's party proceeded further, they saw gold coins on the road. Several of the remaining Sikhs took up the gold coins and quickly vanished. Only the Jogi, two Sikhs, and the Guru's attendant Lahina now remained.​Even Guru Nanak realised there were many people who called themselves Sikhs, but weren't "true Sikhs".  Not everyone "gets it" right away but to deny the sincere seeker the fellowship of Sikhs (and self-identification as one) I think is cruel.

Hair is one of a number of things which make up the full Khalsa identity and you don't get there overnight.  :grinningkaur:


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jul 22, 2011)

Guru Arjun Ji refers to HIMSELF..as "half a Sikh" at best..the only Complete SIKH in His time was GURU RAMDASS JI.

SEE How High the Level bar can be ?? Some are able to walk..they call themsleves "jumpers..long jumpers..others cna jump a few feet higher..the call themsleves High Jumpers..some can jump while running..they call themsleves hurdles jumpers...yet otehrs jump much higher..pole vaulters...so many levels..so many types...why do people like to comparatmentalise..put others/themsleves into tiny boxes...and compartments/pigeon holes..the WORLD is an OYSTER...anyone can achieve naything..any level..  There were "Sikhs" like Bhai Duni Chaand who lived close to the Guru in Fort Anandpur Sahib and ate the most karrah parshaad daily...Everyone called him..the Guru's Elephant.....One day news reached the Fort that the enemy ahd brought in a Mast Elephant, almost mad with rage and that it would be attacking the fort gates the next day...Guru Ji Laughed out LOUD ( LOL ) and said..Why worry..we also have our very own Elepphant..Dunni Chaand..tomorrow we will send him out to Battle the Mast Elephant...and while Duni Chand sat beside Guru ji and received the Pat on his back form Guru Ji..deep inside he was thinking..what Madness is this..did I come here to DIE ?? How cna a human battle  amad raging Bull of an elephant and survive ? In the depth of the night Duni Chand tied a rope to the fort balustrade and jumped down over the walls to escape......even a broken leg in the process didnt stop him form disappearing into the night...Next Morning...the Sikhs were sent to seek out Duni Chand so Guru Ji could make him ready for battle....but DC was persona-non-findo...he had vanished into thin air...LOL....Guur Ji pointed His Divine finger at the DIMINUTIVE..thin and wiry just 4 ft 10 inches tall..skinny looking Bahi bachittar Singh and said..THAT ELEPHANT will fight for us and DEFEAT the Mad raging Bull hammering at our gates.....and Bhai bachittar Singh accomplished just that...a MIRACLE of sorts...when with the Gurus Blessings and special {censored}screw spear called naagnni, he charged the mad raging drunk elephant outside the gates of Anandpur...and standing on his horse's back, he plunged the spear into the elephants skull, piercing through metal plates tied there to protect the elephnats naturally thick skull..the elephnat badly wounded turned around and beagn to flee...Bahi bachitar singh caught hold of its tail and climbed atop its back slashing right and left its ears and trunk...the elephant raced through the mughal forces trampling dozens perhaps hundreds in its rage and death throes...and Bhai bachitar Singh returned back to the Fort to resounding cries of Boleh So nihaal !! BOTH Duni Chand and Bachitar Singh were "SIKHS" who had lived close to the GURU !!! but clearly of different LEVELS....and to the GURU..they were BOTH."MY SIKHS". Period.:redturban:mundahuglol:sippingcoffeemunda::happysingh:


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## Kanwaljit.Singh (Jul 22, 2011)

May Guru test us like Duni Chand everyday, help us realize when we fail and get back on the right track, not make us run away from Guru.

@Calkaur ji

We only know what Guru wants from us (and information too is getting lost with generations), but only Guru knows what He thinks.

I reply promptly at times, it's mostly due to my passion or stupidity, don't know. Other thing I now observe about myself, is that I am constricting my mind's grip around Sikhi, which at times is leading to loss of open thinking. I try to find a balance within myself. I at times wish that I could converse only using Gurbani tuks, not using any other word out of Sri Guru Granth Sahib. Till now, I don't have that depth and strength of knowledge to go that far. So I am using other options.


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## Ambarsaria (Jul 22, 2011)

So far I see only Sikhs in the replies!  I cannot say if they are Guru ji's piyare yet from inside and out!  Haven't seen test results for these lately.  With the current state of Sikhism and attacks on its core values, the day is not far when people will be tested.

I have great faith.  However I suspect that there will be a very high failure rate during the first real test.  Many will have to relearn a thing or two including yours truly.

Rest are words and talk from me, you and all.

Sat Sri Akal.


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## Harry Haller (Jul 23, 2011)

Is a sikh is someone who never stops the search, always onwards, upwards,

 could the creator be like a film with no end? in which case all we have is what we have learnt today, and what we could learn tommorow, till we die

As sikhs, we want to be like the Guru's. We want the contentment, knowledge, the peace, knowing in our hearts that our way is the creators way, without doubt or fear, as time goes on, for us mona types, we will want to look like our Guru, to make him our ultimate role model, when teenagers get entranced by pop stars, they look upon that person as an image of who they themselves want to be, as we get older, our heroes change, from pop stars to movie stars, but the ultimate role models were the Gurus, they encapsulated everything that a balanced individual could want to be like, and what more could a sikh want, than to emulate and look like 10 of the best stars in the world


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jul 23, 2011)

Ambarsaria said:


> So far I see only Sikhs in the replies!  I cannot say if they are Guru ji's piyare yet from inside and out!  Haven't seen test results for these lately.  With the current state of Sikhism and attacks on its core values, the day is not far when people will be tested.
> 
> I have great faith.  However I suspect that there will be a very high failure rate during the first real test.  Many will have to relearn a thing or two including yours truly.
> 
> ...



How coincidental..i just wrote my verison of the baove in my facebook Account..

" Modern Sikhs mostly just look like Sikhs..inside  they are miles away from True Rehat of Gurbani....even the OUTWARDLY  SIKH look alikes are NOT Sikhs inside....and the other side.."sikhs" who  cannot/dont want to.."look" like Sikhs claim they are Sikhs  "inisde"...what an anamoly..ascharajta...stra<wbr>​ngeness..one SIKH is  carrying a FUSED LIGHT BULB in PLAIN SIGHT..attached to RED and Black  Wire, complete with SWITCH and ALL ( 5 kakaars kesh, kirpan karra etc  etc).....but is oblivious to the fact that his BULB is not giving out  any :"light" as it is FUSED/BURNT out and just looks like a BULB  !!...The Other "sikh" claims his LIGHT BULB is working and bright..BUT  hidden inside his Jacket....also oblivious to the fact that a "Working  lighted bulb" will RADIATE HEAT and LIGHT even from deep within and soon  *SHOW UP on the surface* !! NO Amount of red wire, Black wire, On Off  Switch etc will work to light up a Fused Bulb/as there is NO ELECTRICITY  Flowing from WITHIN...its the REHAT..the Discipline that manufactures  this Electricity !!...END OF QUOTE:

Watch this...http://blip.tv/sikhnet/rehni-rahe-soi-sikh-mera-4154786


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## Ambarsaria (Jul 23, 2011)

Gyani Jarnail Singh ji I get humbled by your thanks in this regard.  You are a fountain of knowledge whereas I just go to the fountain for a drink.  

Your contributions are of great value.  As Khalsa we need to be polite and all that but we cannot just keep beating around the bush for some dialog which relates to core values of Sikhism.  Clarity of thought and directness of statements with respect is the highest of all high methods of sharing.

Sat Sri Akal.


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## sachbol (Aug 1, 2011)

I am a soldier. A soldier in improper uniform is punished by commanders. Nobody can become a Sikh just by growing hair.
 But Hair is a part of our uniform.

Looking from a different angle, I think a person(With cut hair) with full faith in Sri Guru Granth Saheb must be accepted 
as a Sikh and must be given full respect. Some of the Neo Babbe are taking wrong advantage of this point.

I used to keep my beard short while in army. My commanding officer appointed me Gurdwara Secretary and asked me to 
encourage Jawans toward proper Sikhi. He allowed me to keep my beard short. After a short period I had a long flowing 
beard. This may not work for all but I think we must encourage such people to take part in Gurdwara activities.

Gurfateh


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