# Jhatka Used For Tilak



## hmatharu (Sep 21, 2009)

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh,

Please somebody explain to me what is meaning of this?  I was told by my cousin that at Hazoor Sahib, at the end of Akhand Path, they sacrifice a lamb and use the blood for Tilak.  I recently had a chance to check this out myself on the Youtube.  I did not believe my cousin at first, but when I saw it with own eyes, I could not believe.  This is Barbaric.  Sikhs, especially Amritdhari, performing this act, and at Hazoor Sahib Gurdwara.  We are suppose to be .... I am sorry I can't understand this.  I feel very saddened.  

Waheguru, bhul chuk maaf karna.

Harjit Singh


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## Randip Singh (Sep 21, 2009)

Ok let me explain something about Hazoor Sahib:


These Sikhs are descended from the original Sikhs that accompanied Guru Gobind Singh. Fought Battles with him and were his personal body guard. They also carry on traditions from 300 years ago, that were around at Guru Gobinds Singh ji time, include Shastar Tilak.
Shastar Tilak is a Kshatriya tradition. The Guru's were Kshatriya and therefore, it is likely they did this too.
The goat is NOT sacrificed, it is Jhatkad and eaten. It is not wasted.
What do you find Barbaric? The fact that Sikhs Jhatka, or weapons are anointed with blood? Either way, if you shirk from the site of blood, how do expect to be a warrior? If the Guru's did this too (which is likely), would you consider them barbaric?
Lastly read this, http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-news/24666-sacrifice-at-hazur-sahib-myth-truth.html before you comment further.


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## faujasingh (Sep 21, 2009)

What i feel is, a man offers to GOd what he eats and slaughtering a goat with a swift is belived to inculcate a martial spirit in the minds of the people, this in fact was for testing the weapons before war. Trust me its not easy, there are one thousand thoughts coming before you try to give 'stroke' when it is the first time . The decapitating at one go gives a kind of excitement and it is testing the blade and also the accuracy of the person who perfoms the act.


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## Tejwant Singh (Sep 21, 2009)

I want the recipe.


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## faujasingh (Sep 21, 2009)

of what ??


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## Tejwant Singh (Sep 21, 2009)

Of goat curry... Dah!!


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## faujasingh (Sep 21, 2009)

are chatkaing one now ?


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## Randip Singh (Sep 21, 2009)

faujasingh said:


> What i feel is, a man offers to GOd what he eats and slaughtering a goat with a swift is belived to inculcate a martial spirit in the minds of the people, this in fact was for testing the weapons before war. Trust me its not easy, there are one thousand thoughts coming before you try to give 'stroke' when it is the first time . The decapitating at one go gives a kind of excitement and it is testing the blade and also the accuracy of the person who perfoms the act.



The Samurai's of Japan, used to do the same with animals.

They were crueller from what I read, they would kill captured prisoners as practice (from what I have read).

At least the Singh's get two things out of this:



A taste of what it is actually like to cut through flesh
Food
Talking to a Martial artist, he tells me that when you actually kill something live there is no substitute. The Guru's also used hunting to train their soldiers, but no parts of  the animals were wasted.


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## hmatharu (Sep 22, 2009)

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh,

Thank you to all for your explanation, but I disagree with you all, and some the comments made, they take it as Joke.  This is not joking matter.  Randip Singh Ji's you asked me how I am to warrior, if I can see the sight of blood.  First of all, correct if I am wrong.  Did Guru Ji's not say, never raise your sword on the unarmed, it is to used to protect your Dharm, innocent, etc.  To me being a warrior means, fighting battles against "Zulms", etc.  You take sword and you....,  where is the daya in that?  From the samaagams, that I have attended, doesn't mention any of this, and that where I have growned into becoming a full Amritdhari Guru's Sikh.  When Amrit sanchaars are done, the "Panj Piares", who initiate the ceremony, tells you specifically, ANDA, MEAT, SHRAB, NASHA KARNA, etc. is against Sikhism, Khalsa.  Yhey even states that if you married, and only one takes Amrit, that there will be no husband/wife relationship, etc. Speaking for myself, only time will tell if I am loyal to my Guru and my dharam.  I am just learning to become a Guru's  Sikh.  

Bhul chuk maaf karna,

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
Wahegur Ji Ki Fateh.


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## faujasingh (Sep 22, 2009)

I respect yor sentiments hmatharu ji, see there is nothing wrong in thinking that way too. the basic element of kindness and a feeling towards another life is existing in us, thus some of us think like this too.Thats why our Gurus too have not insisted on hardcore vegeterianism or promoting meat, we are leaving it to the individual.Everyone's sensitivity is different, some take this issue like me and randip other's take it like as you do. However we need to give space to each other and stay under the the same roof of the Akaal Purakh Waheguru.


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## hmatharu (Sep 22, 2009)

Fauja Singh Ji's,

Very very much thank you.  You have made it more clear.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa
Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh


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## Randip Singh (Sep 22, 2009)

STOP

Did you even bother reading this:

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-news/24666-sacrifice-at-hazur-sahib-myth-truth.html


I guess not or you would make the following comments:



hmatharu said:


> Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa,
> Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh,
> 
> Thank you to all for your explanation, but I disagree with you all, and some the comments made, they take it as Joke.  This is not joking matter.  Randip Singh Ji's you asked me how I am to warrior, if I can see the sight of blood.  First of all, correct if I am wrong.  Did Guru Ji's not say, never raise your sword on the unarmed, it is to used to protect your Dharm, innocent, etc.



NO

You are presuming this animal is innocent? How is this animal innocent? Please explain?




hmatharu said:


> To me being a warrior means, fighting battles against "Zulms", etc.  You take sword and you....,  where is the daya in that?



NO

Please do not confuse Daya with Ahimsa.

Ahimsa is the way of non-violence.

A person can be like Sadhana the Butcher and still have Daya.




hmatharu said:


> From the samaagams, that I have attended, doesn't mention any of this, and that where I have growned into becoming a full Amritdhari Guru's Sikh.  When Amrit sanchaars are done, the "Panj Piares", who initiate the ceremony, tells you specifically, ANDA, MEAT, SHRAB, NASHA KARNA, etc. is against Sikhism, Khalsa.



NO

Sikhism bans intoxication, but it does not ban meat or eggs. That is a personal choice. Infact even intixicants like liquor and bhang can be used in a medicinal manner.

To be a Khalsa, if they are telling you to not to eat meat and eggs then they are quoting their own Maryada, and not the SRM. Meat eating is a personal choice.




hmatharu said:


> Yhey even states that if you married, and only one takes Amrit, that there will be no husband/wife relationship, etc. Speaking for myself, only time will tell if I am loyal to my Guru and my dharam.  I am just learning to become a Guru's  Sikh.
> 
> Bhul chuk maaf karna,
> 
> ...



Sorry, but this is ridiculous. 

No sexual relations with your wife after Amrit? That is sheer idiotic behaviour.

PS You will note I am not as charitable as FaujaSinghji, because I am getting a bit tired of the meat related posts you keep posting.

Also, if you have any meat related queries (because it is obvious it is something that plays on your mind), then read this:

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/8828-fools-who-wrangle-over-flesh.html


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## faujasingh (Sep 22, 2009)

Randip singh ji this entire debate is a pandora's box. I have lived a large part of my life surrounded by fanatic vegeterians who could chop me for chopping a chicken but would not even touch the chicken ! 

I am a strict non vegeterian but do respect the sentiments of vegeterians, the more we argue over it the more there is counter arguement. I met nihangs of the tarna dal who dont do jhatka and have enough explanation to not do it and I met the nihangs of Budha dal who had enough reasons to do it . 

My say is why worry lets make chicken curry !:happy:


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## Randip Singh (Sep 22, 2009)

faujasingh said:


> Randip singh ji this entire debate is a pandora's box. I have lived a large part of my life surrounded by fanatic vegeterians who could chop me for chopping a chicken but would not even touch the chicken !



Exactly.

People would kill and attack a fellow human being to save a chicken. 

How ridiculous.



faujasingh said:


> I am a strict non vegeterian but do respect the sentiments of vegeterians, the more we argue over it the more there is counter arguement. I met nihangs of the tarna dal who dont do jhatka and have enough explanation to not do it and I met the nihangs of Budha dal who had enough reasons to do it .
> 
> My say is why worry lets make chicken curry !:happy:



I respect the sentiments of vegetarians. Hell I even keep separate dishes for them.....but I cannot respect pigheaded ness. 

Hmatharu, has been presumptuous in his post and has made judges without knowing, History, Bani, or read the article by Nanak Singh Nishter.

I can take or leave meat, I just eat what is given to me. I do not judge, I do not purify, I eat whatever is given with good faith.

But I do not tell vegetarians to eat meat. In the same way vegetarians should respect meat eaters and not tell them not to eat meat.

Hmatharu is being judgemental, and I cannot respect that.


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## faujasingh (Sep 22, 2009)

the prob here is both sides have taken the Guru's word in their stride and supported their arguement. He knows the Bani what has been taught to him and we know what is taught to us. There is a large chunk of clergy amongst us who have the same views as our brother matharu. I dont blame him.


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## Randip Singh (Sep 23, 2009)

faujasingh said:


> the prob here is both sides have taken the Guru's word in their stride and supported their arguement. He knows the Bani what has been taught to him and we know what is taught to us. There is a large chunk of clergy amongst us who have the same views as our brother matharu. I dont blame him.



Maybe he should consider learning Bani himself, rather than learning it third hand from someone else?

You are correct, I do not blame him, but not to read sources and evidence given to him is unforgivable.


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## faujasingh (Sep 23, 2009)

Randip veer ji Banis are being edited big time and again it all depends what sangat a person is with, you know the dominance of certain jathas of today, will they let the Bani survive as it is ? They won't. We blame so many other people for being a bottle neck  for parchaar, the truth we have a large chunk amongst us who want to give remixed Bani to suit their own ideas and whims. They shout 'brahmin and brahminism' sounding like 'islam khatre me hai' but they themselves are no less brahmins who wont eat from the common langar, they bring their own utensils and cook their own langar. Their entire philosophy is anti gurmat.

Randip ji what we are heading for is a total chaos. We will have struggle to get the correct undiluted Bani. Bhai  matharu ji might have been in touch of certain 'intellectuals' due to which there is some opposition when something different is coming up. There are many like him. All we can do is try to explain and do ardas for them. Rest all is Waheguru's wish.

Peace


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## Randip Singh (Sep 23, 2009)

faujasingh said:


> Randip veer ji Banis are being edited big time and again it all depends what sangat a person is with, you know the dominance of certain jathas of today, will they let the Bani survive as it is ? They won't. We blame so many other people for being a bottle neck  for parchaar, the truth we have a large chunk amongst us who want to give remixed Bani to suit their own ideas and whims. They shout 'brahmin and brahminism' sounding like 'islam khatre me hai' but they themselves are no less brahmins who wont eat from the common langar, they bring their own utensils and cook their own langar. Their entire philosophy is anti gurmat.
> 
> Randip ji what we are heading for is a total chaos. We will have struggle to get the correct undiluted Bani. Bhai  matharu ji might have been in touch of certain 'intellectuals' due to which there is some opposition when something different is coming up. There are many like him. All we can do is try to explain and do ardas for them. Rest all is Waheguru's wish.
> 
> Peace



The upshot of this is the Paanth gets split.

People who know me, know I have only one goal, and that is unity of Paanth. The meat issue is a needless issue that has been pushed forward.

In my mind, alongside caste this issue is the most destructive issue in the Paanth.

I really cannot understand why people cannot respect differences. 

Ironically if you ask these Jathabandi's (who have a hernia over a chicken drumstick), that caste should be ignored and differences respected, cannot apply the same logic to diet and ignore it, and respect differences.


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## faujasingh (Sep 23, 2009)

Caste and diet are differences hard to resolve, on face they agree but their inner self does not let them sublime. I would never wish that the Panth split but i really dunno where are we going. There is a lot of cleaning to be done.


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## Tejwant Singh (Sep 23, 2009)

Panth is already split into different "Manmat Sects". All different Jathas fall into this catogory. We make our own rules and call ourselves Sants and babble what attracts money rather than Gurmat. We keep SGGS as an idol so people can leave money in front of it and fail to follow our Gurus' teachings.

This meat thing is a guilt trip concocted by some Jathas to lasso people like Matharu veer ji. There are many more like him who are stuck in the same net by the same people who have no idea what Gurbani teaches us.

So, once we start studying the SGGS, our ONLY GURU, and start putting the teachings given to us in this wonderful tool box, then only we can call ourselves Gursikhs and pass on what we have learnt to others like the scent of a flower which emits its scent in all directions sans bias. This is what true Sikhi is all about. Nothing more.

Tejwant Singh


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## faujasingh (Sep 23, 2009)

Vegeterianism is pre dominantly a virtue in the minds of the people of Indian origin and then it became a status. They started digging for it in the Bani too and if they found something that suit their opinion, without even getting the context in which anything was said, they just jumped on it.

I would say if you promote vegeterianism dont trample on non vegeterians, i feel it is good to be a vegeterian although i had been one only for a period of 5 years.Things can be said in different ways unfortunately they are not !

I also would agree to a group of sikhs like 3ho who are for vegeterianism. This is a social aspect and its good to have our share in promoting it. But we need to understand that being a vegeterian and being a sikh cannot be interconnected.

I have read on other sikh sites where they curse and slander the budha dal nihangs for the chatka. There is no end to such tantrums. We have to just fold our hands and say  'do what is good for you and let me do what is good for me'


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## harbansj24 (Sep 23, 2009)

Well said faujasingh ji. We have been repeatedly coming to the same conclusion of this being a personal choice.

But I would like to add one thing. None of our Gurus promoted vegetarianism. But they did talk about "sanjam" or moderation. Our eating of non veg should be need based and we should not be seen as gluttonous meat eaters. 

Unfortunately that exactly is the image of  Sikhs. Eat merrily and wash it down with generous amount of whiskey! _All our gurus have actively prohibited taking of intoxicants. But a majority of Sikhs are great drinkers._ In fact if you go to any market in Punjab, every fourth shop is liquor shop. The consumption of alcohol in punjab is the highest in India. I do not have the stats but I guess that the quantity consumed in Punjab must be equal to the rest of India!


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## faujasingh (Sep 23, 2009)

You are right harbans ji, what we need to understand is our Gurus were neither for it or against it. There are so many saloks where you find that vegeterianism is promoted and many others which tell us to not wrangle over it . 

Liquor addiction is a huge prob in states all over India where there is stress laid on no consumption at all ! Gujarat, Punjab, Rajasthan all are leading . What goes along is wife beating and many other factors leading to bankruptcy.


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## Randip Singh (Sep 24, 2009)

harbansj24 said:


> Unfortunately that exactly is the image of  Sikhs. Eat merrily and wash it down with generous amount of whiskey! _All our gurus have actively prohibited taking of intoxicants. But a majority of Sikhs are great drinkers._ In fact if you go to any market in Punjab, every fourth shop is liquor shop. The consumption of alcohol in punjab is the highest in India. I do not have the stats but I guess that the quantity consumed in Punjab must be equal to the rest of India!



Ironically I know many Sikhs who are great alcohol drinkers yet vegetarians.

They say to me they are not harming any life....but I think to myself they are harming the most precious of life. Human Life!


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## Randip Singh (Sep 24, 2009)

Tejwant Singh said:


> Panth is already split into different "Manmat Sects". All different Jathas fall into this catogory. We make our own rules and call ourselves Sants and babble what attracts money rather than Gurmat. We keep SGGS as an idol so people can leave money in front of it and fail to follow our Gurus' teachings.



I think, once a section of Sikhism becomes a teaching or interpretation of one person, rather than Guru Paanth, it becomes Maanmat. I think you are right on this point.

SGPC, maybe imperfect, but it is a form of democracy.


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## baljeet_singh (Apr 27, 2010)

I had a question about the whole jhatka think. I read the article which explains why the Nihangs of Hazur Sahib do it etc. but I still don't understand what the actual point of the tilak is? I don't understand how goat's blood has anything to do with shastar... and if it is purly symbolic.... then what is the point of killing the animal purely for some kind of ritual involving blood?


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## spnadmin (Apr 27, 2010)

Randip Singh said:


> I think, once a section of Sikhism becomes a teaching or interpretation of one person, rather than Guru Paanth, it becomes Maanmat. I think you are right on this point.
> 
> SGPC, maybe imperfect, but it is a form of democracy.



Almost one year later. Randip ji Do you still agree with this statement. Or were you speaking of SGPC in theory as a form of democracy?


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## Randip Singh (May 4, 2010)

Narayanjot Kaur said:


> Almost one year later. Randip ji Do you still agree with this statement. Or were you speaking of SGPC in theory as a form of democracy?


 

Theory!


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (May 5, 2010)

NOW..the SGPC is the Sikhs WORST ENEMY..by its sheer size and control of huge resources which are brign used (misused) to UNDERMINE Gurmatt, SGGS, Takhats, SRM.Sikh History, ..virtually EVERYTHING Sikhi. It is vastly more dangerous disesase than nay Baba dera/Jatha/Taksaal due to its sheer size, control of all sikh institutions, historical gurdwras and their Golucks, sikh colleges, schools hopsitals, sikh museums, publishing house. gurmatt parchaar... etc. SGPC has out-sourced " Gurmatt parchaar" to the various Babas/kirtaniyahs, dhadees who shout louder than any worthwhile history/katha etc, management of gurdwara buildings to Kar sewa Babas..its elections are OILED by tons of free flowing LIQUOR and DRUGS.:}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}::}--}:


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## hpannu (May 5, 2010)

Going back into history of Jhatka @ Takht Shri Hazoor Sahib - Giani Ji at our Gurduara Sahib explained - Times were so bad at one time, there were only few sikhs left. Enemy was everywhere and environment was hostile. When a Sikh had to go out to buy groceries, coming back in one piece or alive was not always possible. So Sikhs had to prepare themselves for this hard times. It was during those times they started to do Jhatka of Bakra's (Goats) out in the  open / street - warning people that they can defend themselves. The sole intent was not to mess with the Sikhs. And in this way tradition of Jhatka @ Shri Hazoor Sahib was born out of defense for the few remaining Sikhs. This tradition continues to this day.

Bhul Chuk Maaf - I am neither in favor of it or oppose it. Infact i have never been to Hazoor Sahib. But i will definately visit Hazoor Sahib at least once to do Darshan of the Takht Sahib.:happysingh:


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## Randip Singh (May 6, 2010)

hpannu said:


> Going back into history of Jhatka @ Takht Shri Hazoor Sahib - Giani Ji at our Gurduara Sahib explained - Times were so bad at one time, there were only few sikhs left. Enemy was everywhere and environment was hostile. When a Sikh had to go out to buy groceries, coming back in one piece or alive was not always possible. So Sikhs had to prepare themselves for this hard times. It was during those times they started to do Jhatka of Bakra's (Goats) out in the  open / street - warning people that they can defend themselves. The sole intent was not to mess with the Sikhs. And in this way tradition of Jhatka @ Shri Hazoor Sahib was born out of defense for the few remaining Sikhs. This tradition continues to this day.
> 
> Bhul Chuk Maaf - I am neither in favor of it or oppose it. Infact i have never been to Hazoor Sahib. But i will definately visit Hazoor Sahib at least once to do Darshan of the Takht Sahib.:happysingh:



*No offence, but this is a myth*!:seriousmunda:

That is not the reason for Jhatka at all.

Sikhs do not kill animals to frighten people or pleasure.

They kill animals for:


Food
Protect Human and Live stock (in the case of wild animals)
Training for martial arts (in which case 1 and 2 is applicable)


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## sachbol (Aug 7, 2011)

faujasingh said:


> What i feel is, a man offers to GOd what he eats and slaughtering a goat with a swift is belived to inculcate a martial spirit in the minds of the people, this in fact was for testing the weapons before war. Trust me its not easy, there are one thousand thoughts coming before you try to give 'stroke' when it is the first time . The decapitating at one go gives a kind of excitement and it is testing the blade and also the accuracy of the person who perfoms the act.



Fauza Singhji for actual test of Mardangi there should not be a goat but an equally strong man with a sharp sword in handswordfightswordfight


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## kds1980 (Aug 8, 2011)

sachbol said:


> Fauza Singhji for actual test of Mardangi there should not be a goat but an equally strong man with a sharp sword in handswordfightswordfight



Sure and then be prepared to spend rest of your life in Jail as no country allow these type of practices


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## sachbol (Aug 8, 2011)

I spent two years in Srilanka as part of Peace Keeping force. We used to get "meat on hoof" ie live goats as meat ration. 
We employed some local Tamils to slaughter the goats. Being operational area this was done in the camps where we lived.
 Within a short period around 80% of our non-veg loving troops turned vegetarians!


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## kds1980 (Aug 8, 2011)

sachbol said:


> I spent two years in Srilanka as part of Peace Keeping force. We used to get "meat on hoof" ie live goats as meat ration.
> We employed some local Tamils to slaughter the goats. Being operational area this was done in the camps where we lived.
> Within a short period around 80% of our non-veg loving troops turned vegetarians!



Our Puratan sikhs use to hunt and do chatka ,but they did not turn vegetarian.
I am sure somewhere pakistani soldiers also get their ration as live goats but they also don't turn vegetarian.

Indians have this type of mentality that is why vegetarian baba's attract them a lot


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Aug 8, 2011)

And Now nearly two YEARS fater the FACT....I suddenly realised that I had forgotten to question the very Basis/Title of this Thread vis a vis GURBANI in SGGS....and That is...

IN GURBANI spanning 1429 pages of SGGS..there is no BLOOD TILAK at all. The "TILAK" of Gurbani is the Passing on of GYAAN....handing over of the GYAAN KHARRAGH..the SWORD of KNOWLEDGE....opening of our Third Eye to Genuine SPIRITUAL KNOWLEDGE of AKAL PURAKH means we have the TILAK on our foreheads....
NO OTHER "TILAK" is even mentioned in SGGS...not even once....
And dont even begin to tell us that...OH..weapons came later...after SGGS..WEAPONS were in the HANDS of even the BHAGATS like Bhagat Kabir Ji...gagan dama bajio...Soora so pehchanneayeah...Jo  larreh deen ke het..Purza purza katt mareh  kabhoon an chhaddeh khet....Guru nanak ji had the GYAAN KHARRAGH in HIS HAND when he faced Emperor Babars Bloody SWORD !!   LONG BEFORE a Mentally deprived Slave for a THOUSAND YEARS can even look at a knife without cringing in FEAR.......he needs the GYAAN KHARRAGH to fortify his mental strength..and SPIRIT...and thats what the Bhagats and the Gurus did....until the SIKHS were READY to carry the actual physical weapons of steel in Guru hargobind Jis Army...and FIGHt to WIN !! against the greatest odds and most profesisonally trained hardened soldiers of the Mughal Empire !! a FEAT ?? sure !!  a SUPER FEAT no less...

There is no historicla record that Guru hargobind Sahib began rearing captive goats so his sikhs could play "butcher" and learn the art of war or practise warfare..NO WAY. IF Guur Hargobind Ji didnt need goats bloodf on swords..why do we ?? a Plainly goofy idea. and against Gurbani as well..a clearly archaic game of mans superiority over a helpless animal...If it was me i would suggest those Nihung wanna be warriors get lap Tops and play Street Fighter 2 or one of those Games my sons play all the time...way more War training in thsoie simulation games than in a bleeding goat !!( My fav game then was Wolfstein..)


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## sachbol (Aug 8, 2011)

Gyani Jarnail Singh said:


> And Now nearly two YEARS fater the FACT....I suddenly realised that I had forgotten to question the very Basis/Title of this Thread vis a vis GURBANI in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji....and That is...
> 
> IN GURBANI spanning 1429 pages of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji..there is no BLOOD TILAK at all. The "TILAK" of Gurbani is the Passing on of GYAAN....handing over of the GYAAN KHARRAGH..the SWORD of KNOWLEDGE....opening of our Third Eye to Genuine SPIRITUAL KNOWLEDGE of AKAL PURAKH means we have the TILAK on our foreheads....
> NO OTHER "TILAK" is even mentioned in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji...not even once....
> ...



Even in present day warfare training no army uses live stock to practice bayonet fighting, hand to hand fighting or to check the effectiveness of ammunition or fire arms.


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## findingmyway (Aug 8, 2011)

I don't think the killing of a goat for meat is the problem. It is the way it is done as a religious event that is the problem-it should be separate. The biggest problem I have with the affair is the use of blood as a tilak. As Gyani ji says, the concept of tilak in its physical form is not in SGGS and it becomes a form of shastar worship. Again worship of objects is not part of the philosophy in SGGS.


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## sachbol (Aug 8, 2011)

Slaughtering a goat for food is OK. It is our personal matter. If you like meat have it and if you do not like do not eat. Some times when a person takes Amrit he is told not to take meat at all and sometimes he is told to stay away from Non-Jhatka ie kutha. 

What I think that it must not be done in Gurdwaras. Using goat blood is another ritual which is not allowed in our religion. Using tilak of any kind is not Sikhi. Also as our most learned Singhs have said, the tilak of shasters is akin to worshipping them which is again not allowed.

It is high time our Jathedars of all the Takhats must sit togather again and again to have a common and only one Maryada for all Takhats and for all Gurdwaras. The Gurdwaras which do not follow this maryada must be declared "Non Sikhi Gurdwara" and the jathedars and sewadars of these Gurdwaras must be excommunicated from Panth. But question is "Is it possiblejapposatnamwaheguru:


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## kds1980 (Aug 8, 2011)

My question is still not answered why only this ritual comes under attack.


bangla sahib distribute holy water which they call Amrit not only sikhs but hindu's to line up to drink that water.Is there anywhere written in Guru granth sahib to distribute this type of water?


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## findingmyway (Aug 8, 2011)

kds1980 said:


> My question is still not answered why only this ritual comes under attack.
> 
> 
> bangla sahib distribute holy water which they call Amrit not only sikhs but hindu's to line up to drink that water.Is there anywhere written in Guru granth sahib to distribute this type of water?



Lets tackle one thing at a time. This thread is about tilak. In order to discuss other issues, feel free to use other threads.


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## sachbol (Aug 8, 2011)

kds1980 said:


> my question is still not answered why only this ritual comes under attack.
> 
> 
> Bangla sahib distribute holy water which they call amrit not only sikhs but hindu's to line up to drink that water.is there anywhere written in guru granth sahib to distribute this type of water?



There is history behind this water which is connected to Guru Saheb but there is no history behind this unusual and cruel ritual. 
Guru Gobind Singhji never slaughtered any goat and then applied the blood as tilak to shatars. This is against the teaching of 
Guru Gobind Singhji. Tomorrow a number of Sikhs/non Sikhs will turn up in huge number to slaughter or sacrifice large number of
 goats. That day may come(kind curtsy to some sant babaji) and nothing will be done. *Khalsaji jago !*


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## kds1980 (Aug 8, 2011)

sachbol said:


> There is history behind this water which is connected to Guru Saheb but there is no history behind this unusual and cruel ritual.
> Guru Gobind Singhji never slaughtered any goat and then applied the blood as tilak to shatars. This is against the teaching of
> Guru Gobind Singhji. Tomorrow a number of Sikhs/non Sikhs will turn up in huge number to slaughter or sacrifice large number of
> goats. That day may come(kind curtsy to some sant babaji) and nothing will be done. *Khalsaji jago !*



How could anyone be so sure that there is no history behind Jhatka

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Jhatka


Introdcution


The practise of Jhatka is one of the most recognisable rituals of the Nihang Singhs. It involves killing an animal, usually a goat, with one swift swing of a sword which painlessly kills the animal with one blow. Jhatka is one of the most contentious and misunderstood traditions of the Nihang Singhs. It has always been an important tradition within the Khalsa and its existence is well documented in historical literature. At major festivals and celebrations Nihang Singhs perform Jhatka and distribute the resulting goat meat which is termed Mahaparshad, meaning blessed food. Within the Dalpanth, mobile battalions of the Nihang Singhs, Jhatka is performed much more regularly and meat forms and important part of the diet due to the rigorous and physically demanding lifestyle its members live.


“Jhatka is a distinguishable tradition of the Nihang Singhs. The Khalsa has been performing Jhatka since the time of the Gurus, it is part of our Kshatri (warrior) tradition. One is at liberty to choose for themselves whether or not they wish to eat Mahaparshad. Many oppose the tradition of Jhatka and the British tried to ban it, this means nothing to us and we will carry practising the traditions entrusted to us by our Gurus.” (Jathedar Baba Joginder Singh Nihang 96 Krori, Audio Recording May 2009)

The Process 


The internationally renowned Sikh preacher Giani Thakur Singh Ji, a student of Damdami Taksal, explains the tradition as follows: 

"Nihang Singhs eat Jhatka meat because of their traditions. The Guru allowed this tradition of Jhatka to be practised within his army and by his soldiers; it was not for civilians to eat. Maharaj said to them that if need be you may Jhatka an animal and eat it, not just goats or chickens but any animal you may find in the jungle. The Nihang Singhs of today still follow this tradition. When performing Jhatka on a goat, first the goat is bathed, then Japji Sahib and Chandi Di Var are read. One Singh stands by the head of the goat and upon the final lines of Chandi Di Var being read, ‘Those who sing this divine ballad will be liberated from the realm of life and death’, at this moment the goat is decapitated with one blow and the soul of the goat is liberated. The goat itself lowers its head to receive salvation”. (Giani Thakur Singh, Asa Di Var Viakhya Part 25)




The late Jathedar Baba Kharak Singh, a revered warrior-saint of the Budha Dal, performs Jhatka



Once the goats head has been removed in one blow, the blood is collected in an iron utensil and is used to anoint the Guru’s battle standards and weaponry in the Gurus army. This is a form of shastar puja or weapons worship. Jathedar Baba Surjeet Singh explains;


“Weapons are sustained by blood. We make an offering to our weapons which have been praised extensively by the Tenth Guru within their writings. We offer the blood to the Guru’s battle standards and pray that whenever we go to war with the Guru’s grace we shall be victorious.” (Oral Interview, July 2007)


The goat is then skinned; the skin of a goat has historically had great worth within the Sikh tradition. As well as being used to make various utensils and clothing, goats skin continues to be used to prepare Tabla drums which can be found in all Sikh Gurdware to accompany other instruments in the rendition of Kirtan (religious music). Furthermore, goats skin was also used to make the battle drums (nagara) of the Khalsa. Rattan Singh Bhangu mentions that when a small group of Singhs under the command of Nihang Tara Singh Wan were preparing for battle against a large Turk force sent from Lahore; 


‘Jhatka was performed on a goat and its skin was removed. Immediately the Singhs made a nagara (battle drum) using its skin.’ (Pracchin Panth Parkash Steek, Part 1, Page 531) 



A Nihang Singh removes the skin of a goat following Jhatka.


The meat of the goat is cooked and served as mahaparshad ‘blessed food’. There are various accounts of Sri Guru Gobind Singhs Ji themselves eating Mahapashad, including the meat of a lion;


‘On one occasion Guru Sahib went to hunt prey. They showed the Rajput princes how to kill a lion and then ate the mahaparshad.’ (Sau Sakhi Steek, Part 1, page 197)


Jhatka in Sikh history and philosphy


The tradition traces back to the time of Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji who started the tradition of hunting for Sikhs. Even today Nihang Singhs continue to enjoy hunting trips and often wear either boar tusks or lion claws as a decorative piece as a trophy of their hunt. The Sikh community situated at Hazoor Sahib also frequently hunt in the jungles surrounding Nander. However, Shikaar (hunting) and Jhatka have been a much more ancient tradition practised by Rajputs and Kshatris, i.e. warriors of India. The goat is the favourite animal for Nihang Singhs to Jhatka. Bhai Gurdas Ji, the foremost philosopher of the Sikh tradition elucidates various reasons for this;


In the inimitable Sikh spirit of divine service to humanity, Sardar Karam Singh ji, the father of Baba Mit Singh ji , sadly passed away in 1903 while freely administering medicine to plague victims in the region. Baba Mit Singh ji was also briefly infected with the deadly plague, though he was marvellously healed by God's holy touch.


‘The proud elephant is inedible and none eats the mighty lion. The Goat is humble and hence it is respected and honoured everywhere. On occasions of death, joy, marriage and such celebrations only its meat is accepted. Among the householders its meat is acknowledged as sacred and with its gut stringed instruments are made. From its leather the shoes are made to be used by the saints merged in their meditation upon the Lord. Drums are mounted by its skin and then in the holy congregation the delight-giving kirtan, eulogy of the Lord, is sung. In fact, going to the holy congregation is the same as going to the shelter of the true Guru.’ (Vaar 23, Pauri 16)


The tradition was later reinforced by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji, who upon delivering baptismal vows to the Khalsa instructed;


‘Drink the immortal nectar and upon joining the Khalsa fold go hunting. Continually seek to perfect your use of weapons. Perform Jhatka and eat goats. Do not even go near Halal meat.’ (Pracchin Panth Parkash Steek, Part 1, Page 110)


As well as providing nutritional value, Jhatka helps prepare one for the scenes which are witnessed in warfare, many do not take likely to scenes of blood and death and therefore the exposure to Jhatka is essential. Furthermore, the head of goat is believed to require roughly the same amount of force that is required to take off the head of a man. Thus, Jhatka has been a great way for Nihang Singhs to practise their martial skills.


Importantly the ritual of Jhatka has further esoteric value for a spiritual seeker. Firstly, it involves a series of prayers and forms of worship. It involves visualising the destructive energy of the Divine in the form of the sword. Mahakaal, the timeless aspect of the divine is invoked as death approaches for the animal which ultimately lowers it head surrendering before God. It is said if an animal suffers at death or is frightened one bares that suffering and emotion upon consuming its flesh. This belief system suggests that the consumption of that food, where the animal has died surrendering itself before God would promote humility and Godly devotion within those who eat the flesh. The stroke of the sword personifies the speed within which death may strike down all. Jhatka can also be seen as an expression of one conquering their own animalistic instincts, moving beyond their lower self. In the same way that reading duels between forces of good and evil one seeks to conquer their own demons, upon visualising Akaal and performing Jhatka one offers a prayer to the Guru to rid them of their inner pasu, characteristic of the lower self. It is the historical traditions and spiritually enriching elements associated with Jhatka that are important, rather than simply just the consumption of flesh, that is important for warrior Nihang Singhs of the Guru to maintain. Therefore, all Nihang battalions forbid the consumption of non-Jhatka meat, this will be looked at in greater detail later in the article.


Dasam Bani


The tradition of Jhatka is closely related to the martial writings of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji which often discuss the ancient and cosmically ongoing warfare between the forces of good and evil. Many ignorant people and their farcical organisations may seek to question the writings of the Tenth Guru, but they alone who spent many hours reciting the writings of their father know the Bir Ras (warrior spirit) which is contained within the Tenth Guru’s writings. Baba Teja Singh Nihang Singh, a student of Sant Giani Gurbachan Singh Bhinderanwale, notes the additional practises which occur when Nihang Singhs perform an Akhand Path (continuous reading) of Dasam Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji;


‘Throughout the whole reading coconuts and sugarcanes are chopped, large amounts of Karah Parshad (blessed food) is given out openly and Shaheedi Degh (drink of the martyrs) made with some amount of Sukhnidhan (cannibas) is also given out openly. Once the reading has been completed Jhatka is performed upon a goat and its blood is used as an anointment. These maryada (traditions) are very difficult to maintain and is practised by great warriors... for more information regarding these traditions one should speak the Guru’s beloved Nihang Singhs.’ (Adi-Dasam Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji de Patha Dee Sankheph Maryada, Page 23)



A Nihang Singh sits through the night during an Akhand Path of Dasam Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji


The tradition of ritually sacrificing goats and consuming Mahaparshad remains alive not only with the Nihang Singh Dals, but also at Sachkhand Sri Hazoor Sahib and Sachkhand Sri Patna Sahib (two of the Sikhs holiest shrines). It is also worth noting that the ‘official’ Akal Takht maryada published SGPC also permits the consumption of jhatka meat.


Opposition


Jhatka also used to happen at the Sri Akal Takht Sahib. According to the historical literature of the Sikhs, when a dispute between the Tat Khalsa and Bandai Sikhs was resolved in favour of the Tat Khalsa Nihang Singhs, Jhatka was performed in front of the Akal Takht and the Bandai Sikhs were only reaccepted into the Khalsa fold after the eating meat as an act of rejecting the Bishnoi practices which they adopted. With the Tat Khalsa and Bandai Khalsa divide also came about the first division of differences regarding diet. The nephew of Sant Baba Thakur Singh, Jathedar Baba Trilok Singh Ji states;


‘We read in history that when a dispute between the Sikhs arose it was settled in favour of the meat eating Tat Khalsa. A slip was taken from Tat Khalsa and one from Banda Khalsa and placed in the holy pool at Harimandir Sahib for the Guru to decide which group were the true Sikhs. It was the meat eating Tat Khalsa Nihang Singhs that the Guru chose to show were the true Khalsa.’ (Oral Interview, February 2009)


The practise of Jhatka outside the Akal Takht was only stopped in the twentieth century by the SGPC (organisation entrusted with running of Sikh temples) despite the official Akal Takht code of conduct published by the SGPC stating that Sikhs may eat Jhatka meat. During the British Raj various measures were taken in order to dilute the martial spirit of the Sikhs in order to rid the Sikhs of their natural revolutionary resistant spirit. The British had many individuals and groups working directly and indirectly to push forward their innovations within the Sikh community. Of the most noted individuals is one Teja Singh Bhasuaria of the Panch Khalsa Diwan; a retired government employee who is held responsible for raising doubts over the Raagmala, writings of the Bhagats, writings of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji and for removing the word Bhagauti (meaning sword) from the Sikh Ardas. Furthermore, he and his cult were also responsible for removing hymns which invoke martial spirit from traditional Sikh prayers such as Rehras Sahib. 


From the writings of Principal Teja Singh, a vivid Sikh academic who often criticised British involvement in Sikh affairs, we learn that the ritual of Jhatka was banned by the British:


‘The Guru introduced this idea of Jhatka among his followers, which being incorporated later on by Guru Gobind Singh among the baptismal vows prescribed by him is still insisted on by Sikhs as a mark of their liberty. It stands for freedom of food, which was maintained as long as Sikhs were politically free. But with the coming of the British it was suspended for us, and we are still waiting for the day when we should be again free in the matter of food.’ (Sikhs as Liberators, page 5)


Despite this particular writing of Principal Teja Singh being published by the SGPC, it is the SGPC which has taken great efforts to minimise the significance and hide the history of Jhatka from the Sikhs. For example as well as willingly stopping the Jhatka from happening in front of Sri Akal Takht Sahib as it had been for centuries, they also restricted the availability of the Jhatka Parkash Granth – a text written by Bhai Narinjan Singh Saral on the tradition of Jhatka. Thus, despite historically having members who were critics of British influence in Sikh affairs, the Nihang Singhs and many Sikhs believe that as an organisation the SGPC is but an extension of British attempts of reforming Sikhi. 


Jhatka Parkash Granth


The Jhatka Parkash Granth is a direct refutation of the misinformed but largely propagated views of Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh Ji regarding the tradition of Jhatka. Bhai Randhir Singh was a highly respected Sikh saint and reformist during the twentieth century whose views were largely influenced by Bhasauria due to the strong relationship the two held for many years. Eventually Bhai Randhir Singh broke ties with Bhasauria once the latter had been excommunicated from the Sikh community after committing many blasphemies. However, some of his ideas continued to resemble those of Bhasauria who had managed to dramatically change the ideological foundations of the Sikh tradition with long standing consequences.


Disturbed by the views of Bhai Randhir Singh regarding meat which were outlined in his text ‘Tat Gurmat Nirne’, Giani Narinjan Singh Saral, a leading preacher of the SGPC, in detail refuted Bhai Randhir Singh’s views on Jhatka. Foremost, he highlights that Bhai Randhir Singh grossly misunderstood and misrepresented certain passages of Gurbani and that this misunderstanding is that root of his misinformed views on Jhatka and outlines complexities of scriptural interpretation. Giani Narinjan Singh addresses the root of every question and doubt raised against Jhatka by eloquently analysing etymology, ideology, history and philosophy surrounding Jhatka and related concepts. He praises Nihang Singhs for keeping alive the tradition of Jhatka and highlights that at the time of his writing Jhatka was performed at all Sikh Takhts, thrones of temporal authority:


‘The traditions of Kshatri Dharam, the ideals of Jhatka and the custom of anointing weapons with blood have been kept alive until now by the Nihang Singh battalions. Until today this tradition still exists at all Sikh Takhts, should for any reason this be stopped it would be great manmat (egocentric action of men which is against the teachings of the Gurus)’ (Jhatka Parkash, Page 228)



Jhatka being performed outside Hazoor Sahib during the 300 Sala celebrations


Giani Niranjan Singh states that during the writing of his book and afterwards he received many threats from the followers of Bhai Randhir Singh. Bhai Randhir Singh devotees consisted of largely urban well to do Sikhs who as a result of their financial strength had significant influence within the religious sphere. It is unfortunate that great efforts were taken to remove Jhatka parkash from all libraries and book shops limiting its existence to handful of private collections


Jhatka and Individual Spiritual Development


As a result of such historical whitewashing, today many practising Sikhs believe that Sikhs of old never practised Jhatka, despite ample references and sources to Jhatka and hunting existing in literature stretching around four centuries to the time of the 6th Guru. As well as deliberate attempts to rid Sikhi of its martial elements, this is also partly due to the influence of Sants (saints). Promoting the value of Satogun (saintly virtues) amongst their followings, Sants encourage their followers to refrain from meat as it considered to promote Tamogun. However, the value of Tamogun does form part of the Nihang Singh lifestyle (for more information see philosophy section). Recognising the importance of Jhatka for Nihang Singhs many Sants of past and present have at times made offerings of Goats to Nihang Singh battalions. Sant Joga Singh of Karnal closely associated with the Nanaksar samprada is one such saint.


The effect of meat on a person’s spirituality varies from individual to individual, the great saint and author Bhai Raghbir Singh Bir in his writings on spiritual living writes;


‘It is my personal view that excessive consumption of meat has evil effects and retards the spiritual progress. Its consumption should be reduced to the minimum. More liberal use should be made of milk, fruit and vegetables. I have, at times, eaten meat daily, and at other times, avoided it for a full year at a stretch, and have come to the conclusion that meat should be eaten sparingly, say, once or twice a week. Of course, those who do not eat meat at all, considering it unsuitable for spiritual growth are at liberty to do so as they choose.’ (Bandgi Nama – Communion with the Divine, page 194) 



Mahaparshad being prepared in the Bidhi Chand Dal


The possible negative impacts of meat consumption should also be considered. For example if an individual has difficulty maintaining self discipline such as arising early in the morning and following a set routine, then consumption of heavy food such as Jhatka meat should not be consumed. For this reason Jhatka is only practised by Nihang Singhs as a matter of preserving the Gurus tradition and not for pleasure of the tongue. It should only be eaten by those of martial inclination; 


“Today people have changed traditions in order to please the desire of the tongue and eat other forms of meat from shops etc...Jhatka was a special tradition that was only for the soldiers of the Guru to practise, not normal householder Sikhs.” (Giani Thakur Singh, Asa Di Var Viakhya Part 25)


Partap Singh Mehta, while commenting on the Gurus instructions regarding meat states;


‘Satguru has ordered one to make the following choice, first draw a line and decide which side you want to stand on. If you wish to carry arms and live according to Kshatri Dharam (way of a warrior) then you should go hunting, hold foremost Kshatri ideals and eat meat. If you wish to stay Vaishnu (vegetarian) or follow the path of the saints then meat is forbidden. Those who wish just to meditate on God and those of Sattvic nature should not eat meat as it promotes Tamogun within the mind. They who practise for Dharam yudh and the protection of the weak, in battle they must spill much blood and be ready to sacrifice their own life. Such a person should have no fear of hunting and eating meat as they are preserving their Kshatri Dharam. But remember this, to eat meat because the tongue desires it or to indulge in pleasure is sin and in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji it is said such a person will reap severe punishment.’ (Sau Sakhi Steek, Part 2, page 137)


Liberating the Animal


Those Sikhs who study history or the writitings of the Guru’s learn that Jhatka was performed and the Gurus themselves were fond hunters. However, many Sikhs object to the idea of killing animals. A common belief is that it was ‘acceptable’ for the Gurus to kill animals because they had within them the ability to liberate the animals while humans do not. Indeed many lay Sikhs confidently and assertively propound this argument believing it to be an enlightened observation, in truth it is a flawed observation and shows a lack of understanding of Sikh tradition. Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji and Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji would take their beloved troops hunting and encourage such martial practises, therefore it is little surprise that the these traditions continue to flourish within the Guru’s battalions. With regards to the power of a human, it is entirely correct that one mortal being does not have the ability to liberate another. However, as a whole the Khalsa was invested the authority of Guru which ultimately implies that within the Khalsa resides the same miraculous ability and grace that was possessed by the Guru in their human form. It is the Gurbani which ultimately liberates the animal, as highlighted at the beginning of this article Jhatka is performed following the concluding lines of the Chandi Di Var which ends;


‘The composition of Durga has been poetically composed. Whosoever recites that shall not again take birth.’ (Dasam Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, Ang 325)


Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji at Kurukshetra


It is unfortunate that meat has become a popular issue of debate within Sikh circles at the expense of greater attention to matters more beneficial to an individual’s spiritual development. Indeed, amongst the Brahmin community who for centuries intellectually dominated India, the consumption of flesh was considered as a vile practise. Thus the performance of Jhatka and consumption of Mahaparshad is a clear inversion of brahmanical values. Upon cooking the meat of a deer in the holy city of on a solar eclipse, considered an auspicious occasion, Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji wrote the following shabad following discourse with leading Brahmin scholars; 


‘The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom. What is called meat, and what is called green vegetables? What leads to sin? It was the habit of the gods to kill the rhinoceros, and make a feast of the burnt offering. Those who renounce meat, and hold their noses when sitting near it, devour men at night. They practice hypocrisy, and make a show before other people, but they do not understand anything about meditation or spiritual wisdom. O Nanak, what can be said to the blind people? They cannot answer, or even understand what is said. They alone are blind, who act blindly. They have no eyes in their hearts. They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers, but they do not eat fish or meat. But when men and women meet in the night, they come together in the flesh. In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. O master, you believe that flesh on the outside is bad, but the flesh of those in your own home is good. All beings and creatures are flesh; the soul has taken up its home in the flesh. They eat the uneatable; they reject and abandon what they could eat. They have a teacher who is blind. In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. Meat is allowed in the Puraanas, meat is allowed in the Bible and the Koran. Throughout the four ages, meat has been used. It is featured in sacred feasts and marriage festivities; meat is used in them. Women, men, kings and emperors originate from meat. If you see them going to hell, then do not accept charitable gifts from them. The giver goes to hell, while the receiver goes to heaven - look at this injustice. You do not understand your own self, but you preach to other people. O Pandit, you are very wise indeed. O Pandit, you do not know where meat originated. Corn, sugar cane and cotton are produced from water. The three worlds came from water. Water says, ""I am good in many ways."" But water takes many forms. Forsaking these delicacies, one becomes a true Sannyaasee, a detached hermit. Nanak reflects and speaks. ||2|| (Adi Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, Ang 1289)



Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji in discourse with religious scholars at Kurukshetra


Khulla Maas-Freedom of Meat


Nihang leaders stress the point meat resulting from Jhatka performed according to Nihang Singh traditions may be consumed, no other meat from shops etc, known as ‘khulla mass’ or freedom of meat, can be eaten:


‘This is not Kshatri Dharam (way of a warrior). Don’t shame us by wondering in shops, restaurants, market places etc eating meat, refrain from doing this! Perform Jhatka with your own hands and go hunting for prey. Only then are we permitted to eat meat’ (Jathedar Baba Santa Singh, Pracchin Panth Parkash Steek, Part 1, page 110)


“Those who wish to eat meat should eat Jhatka which gears individuals towards warfare. Those Sikhs who just wish to perform selfless service and meditate should avoid meat and maintain a very simple diet. There is no obligation on anyone to eat meat, one should never eat khulla mass.” (Jathedar Baba Joginder Singh, Oral Interview July 2006)


“It is important to perform Jhatka to anoint our weapons with blood and make an offering to Bhagauti. It then becomes mahaparshad (great blessed food) and one is free to make their own choice whether or not they want to eat this. Guru Sahib has instructed that one may perform Jhatka and eat meat. However, one should never eat meat brought from shops, butchers or restaurants. Who knows in what condition the animal, what illnesses it may have had and by what means it was killed?”(Jathedar Baba Surjit Singh, Oral Interview July 2007)


Conclusion


Jhatka is an ancient Kshatri ritual which the Sikhs have practised since the times of Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji and was reinforced by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji. It is of great spiritual significance and also serves physical purposes. Prominent Sikh historians of past and present and non-Sikhs sources have given various examples of Jhatka being performed, including at the Sri Akal Takht Sahib. Deliberate attempts to demilitarise Sikhs and efforts of Sikh saints have lead to many Sikhs being ignorant of this historical tradition. Nihang Singhs and other Sikhs have kept alive this tradition and forbid consumption of non-Jhatka meat.

http://www.nihangsingh.org/website/trad-jhatka.html
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Also the saakhi behind holy water is as reliable as as history behind jhatka


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## findingmyway (Aug 9, 2011)

KDSji,
 There are many problems with the article posted but in the spirit of the thread I will stick to just one:



> Importantly the ritual of Jhatka has further esoteric value for a spiritual seeker. Firstly, it involves a series of prayers and forms of worship.


 
This clearly makes the goat sacrificed so it is no longer jhatka and that is the issue i have with it. Jhatka is a practical action to provide food etc so why associate with religion? It makes no sense and puts the goat meat in a similar category to halal!  
</pre>


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Aug 9, 2011)

This Giani Thakur Singh mentioned ....is a colourful character...some of his vidoes run along the exact same lines as the Christians etc who foretell the END of the World...Exact Same words..exact same images..but interpolating with "Gurbani" ( without actual quotes because then it woudl eb exposed) instead of the BIBLE/KORAN etc of those other Doomsayers...thise scaremongering rubbish is available on U Tube..
This same person amde claims that he was with Bhinderawallah in 1984..and Bhai Subegh Singh died in his lap....he ran away form the Gurdwara in NEW ZEALAND when asked to prove these...in  A Gurdawara in Australia also he was stopped by sangat from doing such kathas. Read more about all this on Khalsa News Webisites.
According to Thakur singh the various earthquakes tsunami in japan sinking of hosues etc in germany china etc are all SIGNS fot eh END fo the World...only being postpoend becasue so many "MAHAPURASHS" are in Samadhi holding on to Akal Purakhs feet pleading for more time..a patently anti-Gurmat stand. He also claims this End would have come 540 years ago..BUT Akal Purakh felt PITY..and sent GURU NANAK....and now 540 years later Huamnity has gain fallen down to level of Guru nanak Jis time...and so now AP may just not be pitiful anymore...and SO..END OF THE WORLD IS HERE !! WATCH OUT !!
I am NOT providing the Video link..because I dont want to propogate UTTER RUBBISH. I wouldnt be even referring to this person if he had not been featured in above Article on Jhatka. IMHO just the quote from such a person invalidates the entire Article....
BTW I have been watching the thousands of Videos etc on U-Tube uploaded by various SCARE MONGERS, Conspiracy theorists, neo-scientists, futurologists etc etc...and was wondering when a "BABA/MAHAPURASH" form the SIKHS would jump on the Bandwagon..and this GIani Thakur Singh made my day !! SO NOW we have "KATHAWACHAK"...telling us SIGNS OF THE END OF THE WORLD..quoting the same  PSEUDO-science/etc ..and using the same "TACTICS" to scare people and make them religious !! ha ha The japanese TSUNAMI would have been 25 times WORSE..BUT it was STOPPED in its TRACKS by a  MAHAPURASH who locked himslef up in hsi room/BHORA and MEDITATED for 25 days....can you imagien this ??? I wonder WHY this Baba didnt samadhee for a couple of days MORE and STOP the Tsunami 100% ?? maybe he wnated to show some power ??? I wonder if any baba/mahapurash is Mediating and LIMITING the LONDON RIOTS Damage ?? GURDWARAS are in Danger !!! The Mahapursh should mediate NOW !!!


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Aug 9, 2011)

BTW...YES..the Bangla sahib Holy Water is a RED HERRING brought up to deflect the Jhatka thread...there is NOTHING behind the holy water..because Gurbani tells us clearly that there is only *ONE AMRIT- GURBANI*. The Khandey batte DEE PAHUL is for initiation into Khalsa Brotherhood. There is no "HOLY WATER" concept supported by Gurbani...not in Bangla sahib and not in Bangladesh !!.....Not in the Ganges River and certianly not in hemkunt or Amritsar..or Panja Sahib..or Hazoor Sahib..or TIMBUKTOO.


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## sachbol (Aug 10, 2011)

kds1980 said:


> How could anyone be so sure that there is no history behind Jhatka
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> Jhatka
> ...



I do not believe in most parts of Dasam Granth but I am reading it. So far I have not come across any story about Jhatka in Gurdwaras.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Aug 10, 2011)

and YOU WONT...because DG is NOT about GURDWARAS at all...you will find out soon enough...Happy reading...( But be sure to watch out and be careful....certain parts are For ADULTS ONLY - not SIKH ADULTS..but DG Adults )


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## Randip Singh (Aug 14, 2011)

sachbol said:


> I do not believe in most parts of Dasam Granth but I am reading it. So far I have not come across any story about Jhatka in Gurdwaras.



Please elaborate? What do you mean by this? You ahve never come accross Jhatka or it was never done in Gurudwara's?

They you will also know this practice was quite common up until the 1920's? It was done around many temples.


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## sid (Jun 18, 2012)

hello i belong to rajput(kshatriya) family so i can explain it very easily in its original and oldest form
JHATKA word is used first time when Kshatriya of india saw that whenever Muslims kill a goat or any animal they chop off  the neck slowly not in single attempt and they call it HALAAL,but in rajput tradition animal was used to be killed in one attempt with farsa (ax),talwaar(single edged sword) or khanda(double edged sword).
the idea behind it was that animal will die suddenly and will not agonized.
Tilak was a sanskaar of rajput(kshtriya) to become a complete mature warrior(i dont know if a unmarried was eligible for TILAK) where the blood was taken either from that JHATKA animal or from fingers of oneself and then apply this blood on forehead in proper pattern before leaving for battle field but now a days this sanskaar has lost almost every where i think


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