# Blessing/Ardaas For Kara



## Ishna (Sep 14, 2011)

Gurfetehji

I recently heard that the Sikh kara is forged by a person reciting naam / bani, and is also blessed with an ardaas at Gurdwara before being given to a Sikh.  Is this correct?  Is it a common practice?

The discussion came about when someone asked if they could get a local blacksmith to forge an iron bracelet for them since they were having trouble getting one.  Another member said it wouldn't be a kara unless it was forged by a Gursikh and blessed at a Gurdwara.

If this is true, what about the other kakkars?

Personally I don't see too much value in this kind of behaviour, as the symbolism is more important than the ritual.  It is nice to think my kara may have been forged by a Gursikh reciting bani and then blessed with ardaas in the Gurdwara - just makes the item that much more special, but also puts the kara into the realm of being more than just a bracelet in the physical world.  Then you run the risk of falling into ritualistic behaviour with regards to the kara.  But I could be wrong here, I haven't given it much though.

I thought the symbolism in the item was what matters.  Although, I must say, I had a Waheguru wristband before I got my kara, and I didn't really consider it a kara (not metal for starters).  But even after that, I didn't want to buy a bracelet from a jewellry store to be my kara, I wanted one from the Gurdwara.  So maybe there is some higher sense to it all.

I appreciate your comments with regard to kara traditions and philosophical thought about blessing karas and other kakkars.

Ishna


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 15, 2011)

*re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

The real "*POWER*" of the Karra is AFTER the wearer wears it...its IN THE *PERSON*..not the steel band around his wrist.
There is nothing inherently powerful about anything...like a MAGNET has inherent power to PULL iorn...and it will pull iron no matter who is holding it....even an AUTOMATIC ROBOTIC ARM holding a magnet will work just as fine...the magnet will pull iron and attach itself to it..............BUT a KARRA has no such inherent "power". Its NOT going to automatically stop your hand from stealing/molesting/robbing/whatever....THAT DECISION to NOT do those acts must come form THE PERSON....and a Karra wearer can be a Rapist while a non karra wearer can be the policeman that catches him..and the judge that sends him to prison !! Just like the Uniform of a corrupt polcieman isnt going to hinder him...the Kakaars cant do anything to hinder a corrupt "singh"..Guru nanak Ji Himslef declares..Koi mughal na hoa andha...if someone expects the karra to magically become HOT..and "burn" the Hand that wears it so it wont steal...then I am afraid hes living in a fools paradise....no such will ever happen....or wearing the karra automatically attracts welath etc and brings good luck etc etc its all wrong.


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## Mai Harinder Kaur (Sep 15, 2011)

*re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

One day, I was walking along the street and happened to see a piece of circular metal on the ground.  I picked it up and it appeared to be possibly a machine part?  It was engraved "Made in occupied Japan."  For some reason that touched me.  I put it on and wore it as a kara for several years.  No one can ever convince me that it wasn't a genuine kara. In the intervening years, sadly, it has been lost, but should it turn up again, I would wear it proudly.  BTW, a magnet would attract it, so it was made of the proper material.  These gold "karas"  I have seen are not karas;  they are bangles for brahmins, imo.

I do usually say Ardas over a new kakkar,:  I don't know about others.  Some of my ways are a bit eccentric, I've been told.  :interestedkudi:


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## Ishna (Sep 15, 2011)

*re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Thank you so much Mai ji for sharing that personal snippet.  That's the sort of thing I'm looking for.  mundahug

Gyani ji, if you don't mind my asking, do you know if it is common practice in Gurdwaras to bless karas with ardaas?  The person I have been speaking with was adamant the kara had to be blessed at a gurdwara but when I asked how that was done precisely he could only say a special ardaas is said over it at the gurdwara but didn't know anything past that.

Your knowledge is appreciated.

Ishna


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 15, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Ishna JI..NO.
All the Karras and kakaars sold all over the world outside Gurdwaras and in shops are factory produced...amny KIRPANS are in fact manufactured in COMMUNIST CHINA which cna make them CHEAPER !! That "special ardass" bit is a Sikh URBAN LEGEND...ha ha.
But If you really want soemthing special..proceed to Hazoor sahib..there they use FRESH GOAT BLOOD daily..to apply to shashatrs..perhaps you can get  afew drops for the karra kirpan etc..or you cna JHATKA a goat (maybe a rabbit/baby kangroo/koalal bear).. will do too..and apply the blood while saying a "special ardass"...or let me know and i will do one CYBERMATICALLY over the Net !!
As i said..ITS the PRACTISE of GURMATT to change ur LIFE..thats vital.period. all else is HOGWASH.


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## Mai Harinder Kaur (Sep 15, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Gyani Jarnail Singh said:


> Ishna JI..NO.
> All the Karras and kakaars sold all over the world outside Gurdwaras and in shops are factory produced...amny KIRPANS are in fact manufactured in COMMUNIST CHINA which cna make them CHEAPER !! That "special ardass" bit is a Sikh URBAN LEGEND...ha ha.
> But If you really want soemthing special..proceed to Hazoor sahib..there they use FRESH GOAT BLOOD daily..to apply to shashatrs..perhaps you can get  afew drops for the karra kirpan etc..or you cna JHATKA a goat (maybe a rabbit/baby kangroo/koalal bear).. will do too..and apply the blood while saying a "special ardass"...or let me know and i will do one CYBERMATICALLY over the Net !!
> As i said..ITS the PRACTISE of GURMATT to change ur LIFE..thats vital.period. all else is HOGWASH.



I think, however, using cow would be out, since that would anger the Sikhs' brahmin masters.


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## Ishna (Sep 15, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Thank you Gyani ji for the clarification on no uncertain terms.

Can I just note here that I'm not particularly interested in obtaining and blessed items myself, as per post #1 I had ever given it any thought until I stumbled over someone else's conversation on another forum and wondered about this practice I have been unaware of.  And now I know why I've been unaware of it - it doesn't exist in the main stream!  But I didn't know that until now.

Thanks again.


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## Ambarsaria (Sep 15, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Ishna said:


> Thank you so much Mai ji for sharing that personal snippet.  That's the sort of thing I'm looking for.  mundahug
> 
> Gyani ji, if you don't mind my asking, do you know if it is common practice in Gurdwaras to bless karas with ardaas?  The person I have been speaking with was adamant the kara had to be blessed at a gurdwara but when I asked how that was done precisely he could only say a special ardaas is said over it at the gurdwara but didn't know anything past that.
> 
> ...


Wouldn't it be puzzling Ishna ji and all if all the Kakkars were to be so blessed (as stated by a misleading person to Ishna ji)?

So everyone get your undergarments blessed too lol or you have to go without these.  This is how Guru Nanak would possibly have challenged such thoughts.

Every religion has fair share of mediocrity driven zealots!  So sad.

Sat Sri Akal.


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## Ishna (Sep 15, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Yes indeed, but it is even more sad when those people are telling newcomers to Sikhi this kind of information.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 15, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Ishna said:


> Yes indeed, but it is even more sad when those people are telling newcomers to Sikhi this kind of information.


..

same types who tell you...Amrit gets "broken" even if you pass in front of MCDonalds..or KFC..or you "swallow" a mosquito that flew into your wide open waheguru chanting mouth !!....or you ate a vege pizza that was cut by using the same knife that someone cut his chicken pizza with....or your daal makhnni that was stirred by the same karrchhee used to stir chicken curry..or the kheers cut by the same knife used to slice mutton...etc etc..
They make "Khandeh batte dee PAHUL..forged in a SARB LOH BATTA with SARB LOH KHANDA and AMRIT BANNEES" seem so fragile...a kacha dhaagah...thread made of raw cotton..apt to split apart so easily...as a Mosquito flying into an open mouth accidentally...or sharing karrchhees pateelehs etc. NO SIREE..AMRIT and KAKAARS are not that easily broken..split...soiled...and dont need "special ardasses" said over them time and again...all thats needed is for the AMRITDHAREE to remain TRUE to his Promsies..convenat made with His GURU...to stand up and be counted...be for TRUTH..be for NIRBHAU...NIRVAIR..sans enmity..brother to all..faithful..steadfast...for that you need CHARACTER...DISCIPLINE of the MANN...strength of MORALITY...sant sipahi...not a kirpan brandishing thug attacking another Gursikh  and knocking off his turban or smashing his lips with your two kilo  ( Blessed ??)  karra ..simply because he disagrees with you on some maryada or granth...as one can see on so many U-Tube videos posted....:swordfight-kudiyan:animatedkhanda1


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## Tejwant Singh (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Gyani ji,

Guru Fateh and well said, as usual.

These roadblocks created by many Taksals and Derawalas are making it difficult for a common person to grasp the beautiful message of Sikhi given to us by our visionary Gurus in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, our only Guru. They rather discourage  them to delve into Gurbani and coerce the followers to become mechanically ritualistic with their self made rules.

We had a Gurmat camp in Las Vegas for a week and the organisers came from The Surrey Gurdwara in B.C., Canada. The majority belonged to the AKJ group and for 5 day they did not eat Langar at the Gurdwara but lived on Dorritos and other junk food which they found purer than Guru Ka Langar prepared with love by many Keshadharis, Amritdharis and clean shaven Sikhs.

They have no idea nor are they bothered to think that the people who were involved in making that junk food which the AKJers gobbled for 5 straight days;how many of them took smoking breaks and/or did not wash their hands after using the loo.

I came to know that the rest of them who participated in the Langar came from Khalsa School, Surrey with whom I had a very good interaction. All the AKJers left the diwan hall daily during ardaas. They did not even partake in the Karah Prasad.

So, this kind of Talibanisation of Sikhi only hurts Sikhs, no one else. The hypocricy is amazing, because they know they can not travel with their Kirpans which is OK for them but not Langar, if not cooked by their kind.

It has been decided that the next time, only people who will partake in the Guru Ka Langar would be invited to teach at the Gurmat camps.

Regards

Tejwant Singh


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## Navdeep88 (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Gyani Jarnail Singh said:


> ..
> 
> same types who tell you...or you ate a vege pizza that was cut by using the same knife that someone cut his chicken pizza with.... :swordfight-kudiyan:animatedkhanda1


 
Giani Ji,

It was MERELY AN OBSERVATION, if a person has knowledge that they're about to eat something that possibly has meat, and they're vegetarian, wouldnt they want to avoid it if they can???? I never said it was a groundbreaking, life altering, amrit threatening thing. Not even close. 

I dont appreciate being shoved into the category of people who believe ludacris things are significant. But considering that being vegetarian is a part of the lifestyle (well, the household I grew up in anyways. idk about all this halal stuff), I think its worth mentioning. With all due respect, if that information is completely and utterly useless to you, I respect that. But theres no need to repeat it like its completely garbage information. I never even mentioned it in the context of Amrit, I'm not even an Amritdhari Sikh, so I get no say on that, and WOULDNT WANT ANY! I hold amritdhari sikhs in high esteem (my parents are them)... but recently I've found them to be more and more insulated, and some to be just plain pushy. 

Here's my Rant:
If Sikhi is supposed to be all of humanity, why do we not remember the jewish holocaust in as deep reverence as we do 1984? Were they not people who suffered unneccessarily? How were they so different?


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## Navdeep88 (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

And I belong to no type, I'm even hesitant to call myself a Sikh...

But here's a question, all these Sikh-Canadian rappers that are popping up, young turban wearing Sikh men... why are they swearing, talking about pornography etc in their lyrics? Why do they have names like "Sikh Knowledge" and in one video they're talking about 1984, and the next its some song about grinding, and drinking and girls in the most disrespectful manner? I dont understand it at all. These are guys who come from Sikh households... what's happening? Why are they making such grave compromises and throwing the image of Sikhi and everything that comes with it, in the dirt? 

These are question I pose as someone who is not fully in the panth, to those who are in it. What's going on?


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## Ishna (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

I have to say, the more I'm reading on this other forum, the more terrified I'm becoming.  Navdeep makes an interesting point of contrast:  in one corner we have the wacky fundamentalist types (I like to say funnymentalists... teehee) and in the other we have the wacky far-too-liberal types.

Is there any formation of middle-ground for regular Sikhs?

The uncle who runs the Gurbani class at my Gurdwara (gee I love my Gurdwara now) recently gave me some issues of Abstracts of Sikh Studies to read.  One volume happens to be the Khalsa Tercentenary Number Volume 1 Issue 2, from April-June 1999.

In it, there are lots of articles talking about the state of Sikhi and the way forward.

It was a sad muddle then apparently, and in 12 years not a great deal has changed, in fact I would muse it's getting worse.  From my observations, the funnymentalists are actually winning the ground where it counts, in the sangats, with the people, and the far-too-liberal are winning ground where it hurts, in the takhts.

I admit I haven't been in the Sikh community for very long and I don't know that much about the history, but does anyone else have that yucky feeling of dread about the fate of Sikhi?


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Navdeep Ji,
The comment is not aimed at you at all. It has been brought up at the numerous talks i have and mails sent to me personally....this about Pizza and many many other similar incidents/happenings. So dont think i am targetting you or pushing you anywhere..no ji - not at all. Simialrly the Mosquito swalloing incident is REAL and it can be seen on a Forum about 2 years back....questions alike these arise day after day...you just happeend to be the most recent one to raise this on spn..its not new to me at all.

SGGS declares..Gurbani is Sat- TRUTH..and our AIM in LIFE is to be.."GURBANI BANNEAYEAH"......become GURBANI !!........and GURBANI has none of these rituals and pesky inhibitions anywhere to be seen....SIKHS are rational intelligent logical beings...not blind yes men. Our Khandeh batte Dee pahul, our Maryada, our GURU is strong and able to withstand much more than these small irritants....so called "beadbis"..amrit brokens..shattered blah blah. and I ma sure you will be stronger by the day as you progress along the Gurmatt Path as shown in Gurbani.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

and about the Holocaust....vis a vis the Ghallugharas....YES we have a number of them..1984 just happens to be the latest one...in one of the earlier ones nearly 80% of the ENTIRE SIKH NATION/KAUM was KILLED in just a DAY....1984 is nothing compared to that Wadda Ghallughara...and YET we survived and post 1984 also we WILL survive. 
You see post 1984 the "enemy" is killing SIKHI more than its killing SIKHS...the phenomenon you mentioned about lyrics and drinking gangster style rappers and all..are part and parcel of this worldwide effort.
So when our own Amritsar is burning..it would be rather too much to ask us to "remember" the Great Fire Of London in 1666 or How Rome Burned while Nero played the flute...LET SIKHS put out the Fires in Amrtisar first...then we can rememeber the day London burnt to the ground..or Rome was destroyed...I havent yet come across any SIKHS DENYING the Holocaust as the IRANIANS, or our very own EX-PM does. To them the Holocaust NEVER happeend at all...neither did 9/11 attack on the Twin Towers..all these are JEWISH conspiracies against the Muslim world..BUT SIKHS know better !!...becasue they also share the same history of Holocausts and massacres and ghallugharas...
The JEWISH LOBBY is much much more powerful than any sikh lobby...perhaps we SIKHS can work at getting THEM to "rememeber" OUR Ghallugharas and 1984 as they do the Holocaust and elt us SHARE their Platform to fight unjustice...


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

ISHNA ji..
The SIKH is himself/herself..the MIDDLE GROUND !! Gurbani already declares.."Some join the DHARRA (group) of their relatives...some join their friends..others join the powerful politicians..yet others the rich and the famous....Guru Arjun ji says..MY DHARRA is with MY GURU...and ONLY MY GURU !!

The SGGS..the GURU is there right in front of our nose...JOIN HIM. no compulsions to join anyone else...not the funny-mentalists, nor the fundah-mentalists, neither the liberals..nor the labouristas..or the kaamrades..the moscowites...the pekingese...the talibans or the akjs ..the nanaksariahs..the dhadriwallahs or the ghagreewallahs...neelpanthis or the radha soamis...ABSOLUTLEY NO COMPULSION !!

THE decision is OURS..and OURS ALONE.PERIOD.


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## Ishna (Sep 16, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Gyani ji, there does seem to be a kind of compulsion to become Khalsa.  I'm reading this a lot in the tercentenary issue of Sikh Studies.  Then one has to choose, WHICH Khalsa.  It would be awesome to be Khalsa of Guru Granth Sahib Ji but it doesn't work that way in the physical world... although in our hearts we strive to be Khalsa of SGGS, in the temporal world you have to choose... SGPC Khlasa, AKJ Khalsa, Damdami Khalsa... etc.

Although any individual can choose to become Khalsa or not, the SRM says a Sikh must at least believe in the Khalsa institution, and then a Sikh has to at least decide which one to align themselves with, no?

In an ideal world there would only be one path, and true Sikhs are united on that one path in spirit, but in the temporal world it is not so clear cut.


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## rajneesh madhok (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Gyani Jarnail Singh said:


> But If you really want soemthing special..proceed to Hazoor sahib..there they use *FRESH GOAT BLOOD daily.*.*to apply to shashatrs..perhaps you can get  afew drops for the karra kirpan etc..or you cna JHATKA a goat (maybe a rabbit/baby kangroo/koalal bear).. will do too..and apply the blood while saying a "special ardass"...or let me know and i will do one CYBERMATICALLY over the Net !!
> As i said..ITS the PRACTISE of GURMATT to change ur LIFE..thats vital.period. all else is HOGWASH.*


Gyaniji, I talked more than 10 sikh families those visit Hazoor Sahib every year. One of my friend had been to Hazoor Sahib about 10 times but he has not confirmed this practice. Have you having any link to this matter on the website. 
Regards,
Rajneesh Madhok


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## rajneesh madhok (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Gyaniji,
One of my friend has replied who had been to Gurdwara Hazoor Sahib consecutively for the last 10 years: that no such tradition is applicable in Gurdwara Hazoor Sahib. He says: 
As per Sri Guru Granth Sahib: "Chukar az haman heer te dar gurdast, halalas burdas shamsheere dast" there may be mistake in the pronunciation or in writing of the above lines as the words are from Persian language which I don't know. The meaning of those words are: Try to convince the enemy with all means and always fight defensive, Guru Sahib fought 14 battles by adopting defensive policy, he never fought on the cause of Zar, Zoru, Zameen, (Zar means money, Zoru--- lady, Zameen--Land) he fought the battles on the cause of INJUSTICE. He never insisted to lift the arms (Shastra) scriptures (Shastras). *He is quite sure and has attended the morning prayer in Gurdwara at least 100 times. He has never seen such an occassion of washing of scriptures with blood. He says that the arms/ammunition/ scriptures are being washed daily by bringing water from Godavari river. In any Gurudwara all over the world there is no such tradition of oblation by sacrificing  any creature.
I am sure Hon'ble members those have visited Gurudwara Hazur Sahib will throw light on the matter. 
Regards, 
Rajneesh Madhok
*


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Rajneesh ji,
Just Google :Jhatka at hazoor sahib....will bring up U-tube videos and articles on this practice. IT is being practised DAILY. The Shastars are given blood tilak from a freshly slaughtered goat.
just this one link is interesting..  .http://worldsikhnews.com/21 January 2009/Goat Sacrifice at Hazur Sahib  Myth & Truth.htm


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## rajneesh madhok (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

Gyaniji,
In Gurmukhi the Sword is called "Kirpan". In 1699, Guru Gobind Singh told his Sikhs at the Baisakhi Amrit Sanchar to constantly and regularly wear a KIRPAN at all times. This is the weapon for defence. The injuntion was primarily in orfer to protect the weak from tyranny and slavery.
The word Kirpan has two roots, the first root is Kirpa which means Mercy, grace, compassion, kindness and the second root is Aan which in turn means Honour, Grace, dignity. So if we unite the two words the meaning is that the dignity and honour of compassion kindness and mercy. Physically Kirpan is an instrument of Ahimsa ---Non violence. Part of Guru Gobind Singh ji's teaching: 
Dehi shiva bar mohe i he --O God, give me these boons, 
Shubh karman se kabhun na taron--Never shall I shirk from doing good deeds, 
Na daron ari son jab jai laron--- Never shall I fear when I go to fight the enemy, 
Nischey kar apni jeet karon-- And with surety I shall attain victory. 
I still doubt the history behind sacrificing of goats daily in Gurdwara Hazur Sahib. 
Regards,
Rajneesh Madhok


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## spnadmin (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

rajneesh ji

Only the gentlest of criticisms here. You have quoted verses that  capture the meaning of kirpan, but kirpan does not stand for ahimsa or nonviolence.You  will probably get some flack for your comments. I am trying to head the flack off if possible.

A re-read and there is something else, very different




> Dehi shiva bar mohe i he --O God, give me these boons,
> Shubh karman se kabhun na taron--Never shall I shirk from doing good deeds,
> Na daron ari son jab jai laron--- Never shall I fear when I go to fight the enemy,
> Nischey kar apni jeet karon-- And with surety I shall attain victory.



The chaupai has a different ring to it.


The kirpan does not stand for ahimsa. Non-violence is not part of Sikhi which nutures the ideal of sant and sipahi. Saint and soldier. Kirpan stands for mercy and clemency, the use of the sword to do right by humanity, to install dharma and justice, to protect the oppressed and be ready to rescue and forgive the evil ones from their own evil, as Nanak redeemed Babar and Gobind Singh gave Aurangzeb a chance to redeem himself. 

Hazoori? The tilak and many other practices fall into the Hazoori rehat which is very short and very different from Tat Khalsa practice. For example, the jathedar must remain celibate, a bachelor, bind his chin with a scarf to remind him never to speak, and he may never leave the Hazoori compound. 

See Flikr photostream with a pic number 11 of the jathedar. This is copyrighted otherwise I would post it. http://www.flickr.com/photos/brind/sets/72157621151975393/with/3755004000/

The origins of these practices can be discussed, but in the end their origins are most likely lost in the fog of history, misunderstood but dear to the people of the region. I have always thought that at Hazoori isolated remnants of Brahminical practice were captured from the region's past, cobbled together like a quilt, and then they became Hazoori tradition. 

These are folk traditions, and folk traditions are the soul of a people. Criticize them and emotions can flare.

The jatkha of coconuts, the jatkha of goats and tilak of shastars and pages of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, are no longer uniquely that of Hazoori Sahib and its sangat. It has spread to the US


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

That "kirpa..and the AAN" bit was  afavourite of Mahatma Gandhi....he never let go an opportunity to throw it in the face of the Sikhs....and He was mightily surprised at what the PEACEFUL, KIRPAN WEARING and fully AMED Sikhs in their thousands sat chanting Waheguru waheguru while the British Police armed with 12 foot long METAL CAPPED LATHIS rained blows on them and the Horse riding cavalry stomped on the injured ones on the ground..not a single Hai or a single sword came out of the SCABBARDS becasue the Akalis had pledged it would be PEACEFUL. The Christian Priest Chris Andrews who saw this happening exclaimed..Today I have seen JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF..in the thousands of peaceful Sikhs turning the other cheek. Gandhi sent a Telegram to Baba Kharrak Singh SGPC president...Congratulations..TODAY the SIKHS have WON the First battle of INDIAS INDEPENDENCE !! This was the Agitation called the MORCHA for the freedom to collect deadwood from GURU KA BAGH belonging to Harmandar sahib which the British backed MAHANT claimed was his private property. The dead wood was for the Guru ka Langgar at Harmandar sahib stoves. This Morcha was WON when the British Govt declared Sikhs could collect any firewood they liked form Guru ka Bagh.
2. The SECOND TIME such an ATROCITY was carried out on PEACEFUL ARMED SIKHS was in May 1950 when a Procession of nearly 12,000 Sikhs was set upon by the POLICE of NEHRU GOVT on the streets of DELHI. The SIKHS were matching to be allowed the FREEDOM to ASK for and CHANT the SLOGAN..PUNJABI SUBA ZINDABAD....which had been declared BANNED by the Nehru Administration. Merciless Lathi Charging and stomping by horse riding Delhi police injured hundreds of the ARMED but pledged to PEACE SIKHS. A few thousand were arrested as well and later charged in courts for illegal assembly and severly fined etc...BUT not a SINGLE SWORD came out of the SCABBARDS..only WAHEGURU and Punjabi Suba Zindabad !!

3. These same SIKHS however used their weapons..against the PAKISTANI INVADER in Kashmir....1947-2011.....against the Communist CHINESE INVADER in 1962....against the Pakistani Army in 1965....against the pakistani Army in 1971....and in 1984 against those who dared to violate the SANCTITY of Harmandar sahib and 52 OTHER HISTORICAL GURDWARAS that were attacked by their own INDIAN ARMED FORCES. SO Sikhs KNOW when and where to USE the KIRPAAN....against INJUSTICE..whether its by the foreign invader or the BROTHER who has forgotten his  sworn duty to DEFEND them and instead turns on them....


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## Ambarsaria (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

rajneesh madhok ji are you for real when you say the following as referring to the wearing of Kirpan by Sikhs,



> The word Kirpan has two roots, the first root is Kirpa which means  Mercy, grace, compassion, kindness and the second root is Aan which in  turn means Honour, Grace, dignity.


You mean to say in fights during Guru Gobind Singh ji's times and later Sikhs will wear two Kirpans.  One with Ahimsa symbol and the other to protect and kill the enemy!

Would it make a difference in your thinking if it was called a sword, talwar or shamsheer.

There appears to be a way of twisting elements of Sikhi in many of your posts including the fake coins, I don't know the motives as it to be plain ignorance or disdain of Sikhism or both!

Sat Sri Akal.


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## Kanwaljit.Singh (Sep 17, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*

If I could I would rather have Kara forged by Hands of Guru.

The value is not in how gift reaches you. The values is in the gift and how you use it.

I think in Sikhi there is no Anth (end) to how things can be improved. But no standard of Sikhi is high or low, just like no two Truths are higher or lower. If you believe you can improve your life as a Sikh, go for it. If someone asks you to go to a particular town and particular shop to get the right fit, its hard. 
It kind of matches with the philosophy of KAHE RE BANN KHOJAN JAYEE.

You just need your KARA of IRON and a heart of IRON. The guy who makes it keeps it in his possession for a few hours. You keep it with you for years.

Whatever said and done, the importance of Ardas cannot be contested.


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## rajneesh madhok (Sep 18, 2011)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Ambarsaria said:


> rajneesh madhok ji are you for real when you say the following as referring to the wearing of Kirpan by Sikhs,
> 
> You mean to say in fights during Guru Gobind Singh ji's times and later Sikhs will wear two Kirpans.  One with Ahimsa symbol and the other to protect and kill the enemy!
> 
> ...


I don't want to make confrontation on the silly points. Kindly go through the Encyclomedia of the Sikhs and decide yourself for what purpose Kirpan is being used. 
http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Kirpan


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## rajneesh madhok (Sep 18, 2011)

Koi Bole Raam Raam      - YouTube


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## Ishna (Nov 18, 2013)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Mai Harinder Kaur said:


> BTW, a magnet would attract it, so it was made of the proper material.


 
So what about a bracelet made of a type of stainless steel that isn't magnetic?  If it looks like a kara, smells like a kara, has the meaning of a kara to the wearer but a magnet won't stick, is it still a kara?

Thanks


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## Mai Harinder Kaur (Nov 18, 2013)

*Re: Blessing /Ardaas for Kara*



Ishna said:


> So what about a bracelet made of a type of stainless steel that isn't magnetic?  If it looks like a kara, smells like a kara, has the meaning of a kara to the wearer but a magnet won't stick, is it still a kara?
> 
> Thanks



I personally prefer an iron kara, but that's just me.

If it looks like a kara, smells like a kara, has the meaning of a kara to the wearer but a magnet won't stick, it is a kara.  

I think Sikhi is primarily about love and service and devotion.  Some rules are necessary, but getting bogged down with rules, to me, is silly.  Who am I to decide for someone else?  If someone tells me it's a kara, I won't argue with them.  Leave that to the jathedars;  I'd really rather be doing sewa or simran or something.


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## Ishna (Nov 18, 2013)

I expected nothing less of your reply Mai Ji.  Thank you.


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