# Can One Convert To Sikhism?



## Wanderer2369 (Aug 24, 2005)

Can one convert to sikhism? If so, what is the process? If not, Name the reasons why? - Thanks.  - Shukriya.


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## drkhalsa (Aug 24, 2005)

Answer is Yes 
: Really Simple
Becoming a sikh ask for both internal and external commitrnents 
Here is brief discription of ceremony 

*Amrit Sanskar, Baptism*

This is the sacred ceremony for the initiation into the Khalsa brotherhood. It should be taken only by those who are fully mature enough to realize the commitment required and the significance. The initiate may be a man or woman of any caste or previous religion. Generally they are encouraged to start behaving, acting and looking like a Sikh before seeking baptism. The baptism is done in a quiet place away from distractions where Sri Guru Granth Sahib has been installed. The initiate is required to wash their hair, cover their head, wear clean clothes and the 5K's before presenting themselves before 6 amritdhari Sikhs (those who are already baptized). Five amritdhari Sikhs will conduct the ceremony while one reads Sri Guru Granth Sahib. The principals of Sikhism are explained to the initiate and this is followed by Ardas and taking of the Hukam (opening of Sri Guru Granth Sahib to a random page and reading of a hymn). Amrit (sweet sugar water) is prepared in a steel bowl and stirred with a kirpan by the five beloved ones while Japuji, Jaap, Ten Sawayyas, Bainti Chaupai and 6 verses from Anand Sahib are recited. This is followed by Ardas and the initiate drinking the amrit five times in cupped hands and exclaiming Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh (The Pure Belong to God, Victory to God). Amrit is then sprinkled on the hair and eyes of the initiate and any leftover is drunk by all present. This is followed by an explanation of the code of conduct and discipline required for a Khalsa. The Khalsa is required to wear the 5K's and abstain from 1) cutting hair, 2) eating Muslim halal meat, 3) cohabiting with a person other than ones spouse and 4) using intoxicants such as tobacco. Other breaches of the code of conduct are also explained before Ardas is once again repeated. This is followed by taking Hukam and eating of karah prasad (sacred pudding) from a common bowl. If a person does not have a Sikh name, they take a new name at this time. 



[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*Introduction to Sikhism*[/FONT]
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




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A way of life and philosophy well ahead of its time when it was founded over 500 years ago, The Sikh religion today has a following of over 20 million people worldwide. Sikhism preaches a message of devotion and remembrance of God at all times, truthful living, equality of mankind, social justice and denounces superstitions and blind rituals. Sikhism is open to all through the teachings of its 10 Gurus enshrined in the Sikh Holy Book and Living Guru, Sri Guru Granth Sahib.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*Who and What is a Sikh? *[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The word 'Sikh' in the Punjabi language means 'disciple', Sikhs are the disciples of God who follow the writings and teachings of the Ten Sikh Gurus. The wisdom of these teachings in Sri Guru Granth Sahib are practical and universal in their appeal to all mankind.[/FONT] 
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]_"I observe neither Hindu fasting nor the ritual of the Muslim Ramadan month; Him I serve who at the last shall save. The Lord of universe of the Hindus, Gosain and Allah to me are one; From Hindus and Muslims have I broken free. I perform neither Kaaba pilgrimage nor at bathing spots worship; One sole Lord I serve, and no other. I perform neither the Hindu worship nor the Muslim prayer; To the Sole Formless Lord in my heart I bow. We neither are Hindus nor Muslims; Our body and life belong to the One Supreme Being who alone is both Ram and Allah for us."_ (Guru Arjan Dev, Guru Granth Sahib, Raga Bhairon pg. 1136)[/FONT] 
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]_"Any human being who faithfully believes in: (i) One Immortal Being, (ii) Ten Gurus, from Guru Nanak Dev to Guru Gobind Singh, (iii) The Guru Granth Sahib, (iv) The utterances and teachings of the ten Gurus and, (v) the baptism bequeathed by the tenth Guru, and who does not owe allegiance to any other religion is a Sikh."_ (Reht Maryada, Sikh Code of Conduct)[/FONT] 
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*Philosophy and Beliefs*
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 There is only One God. He is the same God for all people of all religions.[/FONT] 
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 The soul goes through cycles of births and deaths before it reaches the human form. The goal of our life is to lead an exemplary existence so that one may merge with God. Sikhs should remember God at all times and practice living a virtuous and truthful life while maintaining a balance between their spiritual obligations and temporal obligations.[/FONT] 
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 The true path to achieving salvation and merging with God does not require renunciation of the world or celibacy, but living the life of a householder, earning a honest living and avoiding worldly temptations and sins.[/FONT] 
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 Sikhism condemns blind rituals such as fasting, visiting places of pilgrimage, superstitions, worship of the dead, idol worship etc.[/FONT] 
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 Sikhism preaches that people of different races, religions, or sex are all equal in the eyes of God. It teaches the full equality of men and women. Women can participate in any religious function or perform any Sikh ceremony or lead the congregation in prayer.[/FONT] 
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*History and Practices*[/FONT] 
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The founder of the Sikh religion was Guru Nanak who was born in 1469. He preached a message of love and understanding and criticized the blind rituals of the Hindus and Muslims. Guru Nanak passed on his enlightened leadership of this new religion to nine successive Gurus. The final living Guru, Guru Gobind Singh died in 1708. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]During his lifetime Guru Gobind Singh established the Khalsa order (meaning 'The Pure'), soldier-saints. The Khalsa uphold the highest Sikh virtues of commitment, dedication and a social conscious. The Khalsa are men and women who have undergone the Sikh baptism ceremony and who strictly follow the Sikh Code of Conduct and Conventions and wear the prescribed physical articles of the faith. One of the more noticeable being the uncut hair (required to be covered with a turban for men) and the Kirpan (ceremonial sword). [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Before his death in 1708 Guru Gobind Singh declared that the Sikhs no longer needed a living and appointed his spiritual successor as Sri Guru Granth Sahib, his physical successor as the Khalsa. Guru Gobind Singh felt that all the wisdom needed by Sikhs for spiritual guidance in their daily lives could be found in Sri Guru Granth Sahib, the Eternal Guru of the Sikhs. Sri Guru Granth Sahib is unique in the world of religious scriptures because not only is it accorded the status of being the spiritual head of the Sikh religion, but besides the poetry of the Gurus, it also contains the writings of saints of other faiths whose thoughts were consistent with those of the Sikh Gurus.[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Sikhism does not have priests, which were abolished by Guru Gobind Singh. The Guru felt that they had become corrupt and full of ego. Sikhs only have custodians of the Guru Granth Sahib (granthi), and any Sikh is free to read the Guru Granth Sahib in the Gurdwara (a Sikh temple) or in their home. All people of all religions are welcome to the Gurdwara. A free community kitchen can be found at every Gurdwara which serves meals to all people of all faiths. Guru Nanak first started this institution which outline the basic Sikh principles of service, humility and equality. [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The most significant historical religious center for the Sikhs is Harmiandir Sahib (The Golden Temple) at Amritsar in the state of Punjab in northern India. It is the inspirational and historical center of Sikhism but is not a mandatory place of pilgrimage or worship. All places where Sri Guru Granth Sahib are installed are considered equally holy for Sikhs.[/FONT]




Jatinder Singh


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## Wanderer2369 (Aug 24, 2005)

One must read to a random passage - Meaning a requirement indeed is the language - for example, i am a protestant. I've been seeking a religion - and therfore a way of life for quite some time. I look onto sikhism for inspiration. But along the way i have had run in's with people who have discarded me- which led me to divulge unto the internet. But anywho - This leads me to two more questions - Must i be fluent in these languages? Secondly, you mentioned i must look like a sikh before the baptism.. - Does this mean eventhough in society my faith isnt "announced" - -Won't i face ridicule by other Sikhs? (If i have forgotten to mention- I'm not of indian origin. I'm Spanish).


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## truthseeker (Aug 24, 2005)

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!

I am truly glad to hear that u have embraced sikhism with such love wanderer JI,

As for facing ridicule from other Sikhs, only those who are ingorant would dare say anything to you. And in that case they are not a TRUE sikh. A true sikh would welcome you with open arms and help u learn mor eand more about the religion. I
f you have fallen in love with the religion and chosen to follow the path of Guru ji then so be it ,don't let what anyone says or does stop you from that. Because you are doing this for yourself and not for them. Try to remember this on your path.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!


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## truthseeker (Aug 24, 2005)

Also... being able to speak, read and understand Panjabi would be a must. BUt as for being totaly 100% fluent, no of course not...i dont think there are even that many ppl born into the religion that cant understand it 100%. as time goes on.. u will learn more.. and slowly begin to understand the language.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!


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## Singhstah (Aug 25, 2005)

Wanderer2369 said:
			
		

> One must read to a random passage - Meaning a requirement indeed is the language - for example, i am a protestant. I've been seeking a religion - and therfore a way of life for quite some time. I look onto sikhism for inspiration. But along the way i have had run in's with people who have discarded me- which led me to divulge unto the internet. But anywho - This leads me to two more questions - Must i be fluent in these languages? Secondly, you mentioned i must look like a sikh before the baptism.. - Does this mean eventhough in society my faith isnt "announced" - -Won't i face ridicule by other Sikhs? (If i have forgotten to mention- I'm not of indian origin. I'm Spanish).



wanderer ji you are not alone, there is a mssive community of non-asian sikhs called 3ho,perhaps you could get in touch with them they may be helpful to you about the language barier and so on.they are based in mexico.


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## drkhalsa (Aug 25, 2005)

Wanderer2369 said:
			
		

> One must read to a random passage - Meaning a requirement indeed is the language - for example, i am a protestant. I've been seeking a religion - and therfore a way of life for quite some time. I look onto sikhism for inspiration. But along the way i have had run in's with people who have discarded me- which led me to divulge unto the internet. But anywho - This leads me to two more questions - Must i be fluent in these languages? Secondly, you mentioned i must look like a sikh before the baptism.. - Does this mean eventhough in society my faith isnt "announced" - -Won't i face ridicule by other Sikhs? (If i have forgotten to mention- I'm not of indian origin. I'm Spanish).


 
Dear Wanderer

I would adviseyo not worry about the others whether they hlep or not 

In sikhism there is no need of any middle man or priest or learned one 
the only guide in sikhism is Sri Guru Granth Sahib and you can read it in you r own language taht is english and you dont need any body else 

Here is the link for the download of whole Guru Granth Sahib in pdf format

http://www.gurbanifiles.org/Gurm%20&%20Devan%20to%20English%20Translation%20&%20Translit%20of%20SGGS,%20SBS.pdf


About your being White or Spanish it doesnot matter There are already thousands like you already practising Sikhism and fortunately there rae also some members on this forum itself who are jsut like yo have joined sikhism recently 
check these links out 

http://prabhukhalsa.blogspot.com/ 
http://www.sikhnet.com 
http://prabhukhalsa.blogspot.com/
http://www.mrsikhnet.com/


Any way every body on this forum will be more than happy to offer you any help you need in this regrad

Good Luck with you r spirtual Journey 

Jatinder Singh


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## Wanderer2369 (Aug 25, 2005)

I have to admit it, but you have made me smile with joy. If i would've known that i could be embraced not for my origin but for my eager to learn a wanted faith - here. I would've so long ago. But drkhalsa, you speak of " true sikh's" I have been ridiculed by many for even speaking of such blasphemy. Actually, three of the Gurdwara's said no, because i wasn't their kind. Their exact words " You're not indian" Which led to my hesitation. But i must know punjabi? Are there schools for such things? can i have like a teacher- tutor if you will? Or is this absurd and not heard from? - Oh, these groups that you speak of.. Where can i contact them. Sorry new to this site and still trying to find myself around.


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## Wanderer2369 (Aug 26, 2005)

Thank you i will also give those sites a shot. I mean since i've been welcomed here and all


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## Lee (Aug 26, 2005)

Wanderer2369 said:
			
		

> Thank you i will also give those sites a shot. I mean since i've been welcomed here and all



Hey wonderer,

Where are you based?

Cheers,

Lee.


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## Wanderer2369 (Aug 26, 2005)

Based? Meaning where am i from? - Canada - Toronto.


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## Lionchild (Aug 26, 2005)

Wanderer2369 said:
			
		

> I have to admit it, but you have made me smile with joy. If i would've known that i could be embraced not for my origin but for my eager to learn a wanted faith - here. I would've so long ago. But drkhalsa, you speak of " true sikh's" I have been ridiculed by many for even speaking of such blasphemy. Actually, three of the Gurdwara's said no, because i wasn't their kind. Their exact words " You're not indian" Which led to my hesitation. But i must know punjabi? Are there schools for such things? can i have like a teacher- tutor if you will? Or is this absurd and not heard from? - Oh, these groups that you speak of.. Where can i contact them. Sorry new to this site and still trying to find myself around.




Where are these gurdwaras? This is very disturbing.


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## Learning_Sikhi (Aug 26, 2005)

Wanderer2369 said:
			
		

> Based? Meaning where am i from? - Canada - Toronto.


 
Hi Wanderer, I am also living in Toronto, Ontario. Can you please let me know which three Gurdawaras u have been, so that i can talk with somebody there regarding this issue? 

Also tell me if I can be any kind of help.

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa Waheguru ji ki Fateh


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## Wanderer2369 (Aug 29, 2005)

Learning_Sikhi said:
			
		

> Hi Wanderer, I am also living in Toronto, Ontario. Can you please let me know which three Gurdawaras u have been, so that i can talk with somebody there regarding this issue?
> 
> Also tell me if I can be any kind of help.
> 
> Waheguru ji ka Khalsa Waheguru ji ki Fateh


 
I tell you Learning_Sikhi, i don't lie. Why start of on the "bad foot" as the saying goes. But I'm sorry, i will not say the locations. I can not incriminate these people. I forgave them within, so it is all dealt with. 

Help? Wow... I gotta' tell you - All. Everyone has embraced me here. Sincerely i feel overwhelmed. thank you. 

But i would like to speak to someone about converting.. If i may. Like the preperations. Actual preperations. Like where do i go. What do i look for? Things of this sort.


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## Lee (Aug 30, 2005)

Wanderer2369 said:
			
		

> But i would like to speak to someone about converting.. If i may. Like the preperations. Actual preperations. Like where do i go. What do i look for? Things of this sort.



Hey Wanderer, 

Conversion to Sikhi is very easy, just start living like a Sikh.
Taking Amrit now that's a differant thing(one would imagine, I have not yet done it)

The Rehat Maryada(Sikh code of conduct) says:

 Any human being who faithfully believes in
(i) One Immortal Being,
(ii) Ten Gurus, from Guru Nanak Dev to Guru Gobind Singh,
(iii) The Guru Granth Sahib,
(iv) The utterances and teachings of the ten Gurus and
(v) the baptism bequeathed by the tenth Guru, and who does not owe allegiance  to any other religion, is a Sikh.  This is the basic defineition of a Sikh, now although I have not yet taken Amrit(God willing one day) I still call myself a Sikh.

If you want to convert there really(In my opinion) are no rites, or preperations as such to take.  Go to Gurdwara(temple), get yourself a gutka/nitnem(book of daily prayers), hang around with other Sikhs, talk to Sikhs, and practice the Sikhi life.  In doing this you have converted.

As to taking Amrit(getting baptised), all Sikhs should work towards this, and this happens not by our will but by Gods.  When I feel(or God lets me know) that I can live as a Khalsa(pure) Sikh, then I shall take Amrit, wear the 5 k's and take not a look backwards.

Cheers,

lee.


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## Amerikaur (Aug 30, 2005)

Wanderer,

There may be several reasons why you encountered a less-than-warm reception at a gurdwara near you.  There can be bad reasons such as prejudice or bigotry.  

But there can also be misunderstandings just based on different dialects of English, which may be a second or third language for the gurdwara-attendees.  

Indian English, like Singaporean English, may be based on UK English but has its own tones and inflections.  It is very different than conversational North American English.  I've personally found that many Indo-Americans and Indo-Canadians have said something to me that I thought was very rude...but no harm was meant.

And, it could be pride.  A small number of Panjabis get embarrassed when a westerner follows their faith better than they do...and rather than turning to introspection or to God for help in giving up their bad habits, they expend their energy in vitriol towards the westerner.

None of us...not all Spanish, not all Sikhs, not all Asians, not all Europeans, not all Americans, not all Blacks, not all Whites...none of us are universally good nor are we universally bad.  It takes all types to make up the world, and Sikhi is no different.


There is certainly pride in the Panjabi community, and many that will say that learning Panjabi is "easy."  To that I say apriendo Espanol es facil y con much@s Latin@s en el mundo, es muy importante saber Espanol!  Tal vez, cada Sij debe aprender esta lengua tambien, no?  Naturalmente, es un chiste, pero, espero que mi punto esta entendido.

And if you don't speak Spanish...please forgive me!

Sikhi is a beautiful faith, and being a Sikh is what is in your heart, your mind, your thoughts, your actions.   It is not in your blood line, your eye color, or where your grandparents were born.  If you believe, Guru will guide you.


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## Wanderer2369 (Aug 30, 2005)

Lol! Haha, you have made me laugh on a rough day. Haha. Yes, i understood it. But yeah, living like a sikh? I noticed you dont wear a turban? Does this mean i dont have to as well?


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## Amerikaur (Aug 30, 2005)

Honestly, I couldn't tie a formal turban if my life depended on it.   

Personally, I do take steps to keep my hair covered in some fashion, I don't always succeed.  No one to blame here but myself for my laziness and intermittent discipline.

As far as what you have to do...we all have to cover our head in Gurdwara, but the Rehat Maryada says the turban is required for men, and optional for women, but...that is really more of a question to be meditated on in Simran.  It is one thing to adopt a habit because you know that you are supposed to.  It means even more to adopt a habit because it means something to you.


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## truthseeker (Aug 30, 2005)

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!! 

As part of our rehit we are to keep Kes (unshorn/uncut hair) and soo for men the only practical way of doing this would be to wear a turban. As for women like Amerikaur posed above she just tries to cover her head as much as possible. I personally do the same and wear a ramal on my head.

The turban has a very important meaning in sikhi and you should come to learn more about the meaning of it before you decide to tie one yourself.

Just take it one step at a time and learn more as you go.I Think that that is the only advice one can give to another. Living like a Sikh takes i guess one would say, alot of love for your Guru. But once you develop that love in your heart then nothing it is honestly just amazing.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!


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## Lee (Aug 31, 2005)

truthseeker said:
			
		

> Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!
> 
> As part of our rehit we are to keep Kes (unshorn/uncut hair) and soo for men the only practical way of doing this would be to wear a turban. As for women like Amerikaur posed above she just tries to cover her head as much as possible. I personally do the same and wear a ramal on my head.
> 
> ...



Yeah I'd also like to add that the 5 k's are a requirement for Khalsa Sikhs.
As posted yesterday I have not yet taken Amrit, so although wearing the 5 k's before I have to is a good idea, personly I feel I don't want to do dishonour to the Khalsa by looking the part before I am the part.  Heh and of course I do wear the turban in gurdwara.

Cheers,

Lee


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## Prabhjyotsaini (Dec 29, 2005)

Being a Sikh is being disciplined, fearless & helping the needful. If you want to convert to Sikhism just start disciplining your life as per Sikh rehat maryada before taking Amrit, the baptism. Once you get adjusted to the lifestyle as per Sikhism it will be easier for you to get baptised. Also regarding you being underwent mockery of Gurudwara authorities, its really bad but those people get embarassed easily when they see people like you following their religion so passionately. So don,t worry just make up your mind & go ahead. Once you will be into it there won't be any looking back.
Regards,


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## Yvan (Apr 2, 2006)

Hello,

i searched for "Can one convert to Sikhism" on Google and i found your site that way. I am very pleased to be part of that site. I was curious since quite a long time about Sikhism but I started to read the Guru Granth Sahib lately, after listening to a song called "Aadays Tisai Aadays" from Snatam Kaur cd "Prem". I was deeply touch by that mantra even before i realise it was from the Guru Granth Sahib: "
aadays tisai aadays.
I bow to Him, I humbly bow.
aad aneel anaad anaahat jug jug ayko vays.
The Primal One, the Pure Light, without beginning, without end. Throughout all the ages, He is One and the Same". 

I decided afterwards to start reading Guru Granth Sahib. I live in Montreal and they talked a lot about the kirpan controversy. One positive thing about it is that the Lachine gudwara opened his temple to medias and people interested to know more about sikh religion. I have 2 questions: are there other people from Montreal here and does someone know the difference between those 2 gudwaras: Sikh Temple Association in Lachine and Gurdwara Sahib Quebec in Verdun. I know the Lachine temple can accomodate 3,000 people and some people even come from US to visit that temple. 

I thank you all for your warm reception and for your opening of spirit to the new members in search of information.

Yvan


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## Anoop (Apr 10, 2006)

wanderer, i am 18 years of age. Sometime now, i have had fear of death. An unexpected death of mny grandmother in india has led me to a shock. But then i realsied, what about the gurus? Why wasn it not a big thing for the gurus? And, why is it so easy to die in the first place in life. Maybe we dont actually belong here? This is just like a simulation, a test, a project for god. Sikhism, is about, letting go. Let go, be free, go to the truth, god, who prevails everywhere, were without god there wouldnt be anything, because god is everything. The way the Sikh Gurus died...and yet, people cry over their family members dying. Why? Do we even know where we were before we were born. What were we? Dont you think our souls were invisible, and we were actually everything? We were this world. We were simply with god? And yet we tend to forget that, we actually belong somewhere higher, the ultimate reailty. This life is only physical. Let everything out of you comeout. I truely want to be a sikh, and i want to take amrit, but even thoguh i have learnt alot about sikhism, i am still concerned about my ego, because people may not like me, but im thinkking to go where god inteded us to go in the first place.


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## Lionchild (Apr 12, 2006)

Anoop said:
			
		

> wanderer, i am 18 years of age. Sometime now, i have had fear of death. An unexpected death of mny grandmother in india has led me to a shock. But then i realsied, what about the gurus? Why wasn it not a big thing for the gurus? And, why is it so easy to die in the first place in life. Maybe we dont actually belong here? This is just like a simulation, a test, a project for god. Sikhism, is about, letting go. Let go, be free, go to the truth, god, who prevails everywhere, were without god there wouldnt be anything, because god is everything. The way the Sikh Gurus died...and yet, people cry over their family members dying. Why? Do we even know where we were before we were born. What were we? Dont you think our souls were invisible, and we were actually everything? We were this world. We were simply with god? And yet we tend to forget that, we actually belong somewhere higher, the ultimate reailty. This life is only physical. Let everything out of you comeout. I truely want to be a sikh, and i want to take amrit, but even thoguh i have learnt alot about sikhism, i am still concerned about my ego, because people may not like me, but im thinkking to go where god inteded us to go in the first place.



Thanks Anoop, very refreshing... i think we have to be fearfull of our death of the mind. We may live and die physically, but we must always meditate and beleive in our guru and never let ourselves go off the true path, no matter what it is.


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## Sathanuman Singh (Apr 26, 2006)

The Path of Nanak is one of experience not beliefs. It can come by Grace, it can come by destiny. Although many Sikhs originated in the Punjab, since 1969, the 500th anniversary of Guru Nanak's birth, many more non-Punjabis have adopted the teachings of the Shabd Guru. 
This path is not a philosophy. It is discipline. It requires commitment to the Soul. 
Bani, Bana, Simran, Seva. These are 4 pillars of Sikhism. (Sikhi) I don't see it as converting. I see it as remembering who you are. When one arrives at that state of consciousness, one has "Free -Will" That Divine Will is the ONLY Will. Everything else is illusion. Maya. Its all God, but God is the Doer. God is the Devotion, but beyond emotion. Its is the Intelligence but beyond the intellect. 
This path is one that must be lived from the moment you rise to the moment you lay your head down on the pillow and eventually leave this earhtly abode. 
Spiritual path is one that prepares the life for death. 
When one dies while still alive, one is liberated. This comes when the 10th gate opens and the soul merges with Akal Purkh. The undying Soul. 
I humbly suggest that you learn to meditate using Wahe Guru or Sat Nam while linking it to your breath. 
Its doesn't matter that anyone looks at you with disdain or they may be embarassed that they don't practice the Rehit of Guru Sahib. You have to face the Lord with the courage of a LIon. Youi must make your self so beautiful and shining that the God comes to sit with you. 
This path is challenging but with Guru's Grace you will complete the journey. WE all will.
Blessings oh pilgrem. Keep Up and Keep going.........


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## Lionchild (Apr 26, 2006)

some more helpful advice for new ppl entering sikhi..

*You don't have to learn punjabi nor be of the culture
*guru ji accepts you, so be who you are
*5 K's is a must for khalsa, alos recommended for keshdai's and regular sikhs
*Ask around in you local sangat for other sikhs who have converted.
*Do sewa when youcan, and meditate on god, wahegur, etc...


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## HannahBanana (Sep 12, 2006)

I've been studying Sikhism recently, and even am considering conversions. But I need much more time studying. I have not gone to a gurdwara yet (even just to see what it is like), I never have even seen one in South Florida.

But Wanderer, I would love to chat and see what you know and maybe we can learn from each other. I am half Brazilian, half Italian and Swiss. Only, I look very white so no one believes me!

Lionchild, I have a question on your advice. I've read of the 5 Ks, and one of them is a sort of instrument like a small dagger, correct? (I'm new at this, so please tell me if I'm being offensive). How would one carry this around at school or in an airport? That is one things that worries me, I don't want to get arrested. And with the stereotypes, people might think I'm a terrorist.


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## Tejwant Singh (Sep 13, 2006)

Conversion means changing one's mechanical rituals from one religion to the other. Inner quest is not guaranteed as one is bogged down and busy adopting the dogmas of the new found religion. 

Sikhi doesnot convert because Sikhi is not a dogmatic religion but a pragmatic way of life.

Pragmatism needs no conversion but an extreme makeover from inside out. Like from a caterpillar to a butterfly, metamorphosis.

Sikhi is the only way of life named for the followers unlike all other major raligions. And to be a Sikh is not exclusive to anyone. Any person who is a seeker, a learner, a student, IS a Sikh, irrespective of the hue,creed or faith.

Tejwant


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## Dimitri (Sep 13, 2006)

I am not a baptized Sikh and I haven't even thought about baptizing (5'Ks of Khalsa) at the moment. Certain events or say somehow I was forced to think about God and why *I *don't believe in it. Reading Guru Granth I have done 180 degrees on this. I have realised what Humay is, translated in english "*I*". Guru Granth has removed my doubt. 
Guru Granth is written in a poetic form, in my opinion to fully admire it you have to read it in Gurmukhi/Punjabi. In my opinion this is your greatest challenge. 

Guru Grant is written in Ragas (melodic modes used in Indian classical music). The first Rag is _Shrirag, _Rag for night or darkness and last one is Rag _Prahbat _, rag for morning - light. Rag Jaijawanti was later added by Guru Gobind to the final composition. So for fools like me the darkness is dispelled as we go through the journey.

You can get good understanding of it in english but you will appreciate it a lot more if read in punjabi - mind you further translation of the words is still required but these days it all easy. its all on the net.


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## HannahBanana (Sep 14, 2006)

I have a question. Is it okay to call oneself a Sikh if one has not converted yet? As long as we believe it with all our hearts and are students (which makes one a Sikh, true?) always learning more about the Gurus and Sri Guru Granth Sahib. 

There is a gurdwara in Central Florida, I am in the South. That is quite a trip for a high schooler to make. And who's to say they'd accept me? Especially since I am not 18 yet.

Also, is it allowable to have any of the five K's if I am not converted officially?


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## drkhalsa (Sep 14, 2006)

Dear HannahBanana ji


Yes definately you can call yourself Sikh as everybody is infact a student ( SIKH ) so no bother there .

About the 5K  , you can start with Uncut Kesh( HAIR ) and KARA ( Iron Bangle).


About going to Gurdwara , it would be nice if  you can make upto it but if not possible then reading at home and alos at SPN is not bad either to start with as the main purpose of gurdwara is to join congretion in Presence of Guru Granth sahib .

Jatinder Singh


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## HannahBanana (Sep 14, 2006)

Thank you so much for clarifying that! 

If I do manage to go to a gurdwara, I would have to cover my head, correct?
What about choosing a Sikh name? 

Again, thank you, Jatinder Singh Ji!


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## Neemai108 (Sep 15, 2006)

Hi HannahBanana,

Im somehwat like you, in the middle of everything, still trying to figure things out. But at one point, I used to visit the Gurudwara every sunday (which I should once again resume) and everytime I covered my head. Covering your head in the presence of Guru Granth Ji is a sign of respect. Even in other cultures this is present, that when one enters a house of worship or holy place, they cover their head out of respect for God. Most muslims cover their head when they pray or enter a dargah or mosque. Many hindus also cover their heads, but not as many today. besides the fact that it is required to cover your head at the gurudwara, I chose to cover my head, because its my way of showing respect to Guruji when I am in his presence. 

Also can anyone help me on a question. Regarding the uncut kesh. Im not a born sikh, Ive grown up as a hindu so i dont know the detail details about exceptions and what not. I have a skin condition which requires me to keep short, if any hair otherwise my scalp and face and places around my ears break out into rashes and i scratch till it bleeds. Hence even the doctor has advised me to keep as short hair as possible. Now seeing that the uncut kesh is a requirement of Sikh, how can follow through when I have this condition. Does anybody know. The same with my beard, I cannot keep it long, I  have to shave it off otherwise my face breaks out into rashes and it flakes. Its something out of my reach. Its kind of depressing because i have a desire to keep these things and follow the sikh faith as much i can, but i cant. What should be advised? 

Thanks

Suren


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## HannahBanana (Sep 15, 2006)

I'm not an expert, but my opinion is that God will understand.

Oh and thanks for answering my question, Neemai Ji!


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## drkhalsa (Sep 15, 2006)

> Also can anyone help me on a question. Regarding the uncut kesh. Im not a born sikh, Ive grown up as a hindu so i dont know the detail details about exceptions and what not. I have a skin condition which requires me to keep short, if any hair otherwise my scalp and face and places around my ears break out into rashes and i scratch till it bleeds. Hence even the doctor has advised me to keep as short hair as possible. Now seeing that the uncut kesh is a requirement of Sikh, how can follow through when I have this condition. Does anybody know. The same with my beard, I cannot keep it long, I have to shave it off otherwise my face breaks out into rashes and it flakes. Its something out of my reach. Its kind of depressing because i have a desire to keep these things and follow the sikh faith as much i can, but i cant. What should be advised?




Dear Suren 


My personal Opinion !

If cuting your hair is part of genuine Medical problem then offcourse you can cut them as these peractices in Sikhism are meant to motivate us for Spirtual Path but till you cant do it for medical reason I think it is ok!





> What about choosing a Sikh name?




many times people new into sikhism  keep new name which is spirtual name , kind of signifying start of something new . But keeping your name is also Ok!

In Sikhism Officially All males uses SINGH ( roughly meaning Lion)as Surname and  Females use KAUR ( meaning Princess)as surname.
So you can Just add surname to your name 


Jatinder Singh


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## HannahBanana (Sep 16, 2006)

Hmm...Hannah Kaur. How does that sound?


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## Neemai108 (Sep 16, 2006)

Thank you for the answer Dr. Khalsa ji. I had a feeling that would be the answer. If i could, I would most definately have grown out a kesh, but ufortunately im unable to, but im still devoted to God, and I think as long as I have deep devotion for him, he will understand. Though i cannot have long hair, I still wear a kara which reminds me of God constantly. The circle of the Kara has no beginning nor end, just as God. It represents the number 0 which is infinite in reality, just as God is. (ive also gotten Ek Ongkar, Satnaam Sri Waheguru engraved on it ). 

This november will be my very first (and hopefully not last) trip Sri Darbaar Sahib. Im also visitng places like Sis Ganj in Delhi, Gurudwara Rajghat in Kurukshetra, and also to Anandpur Sahib, and if possible to Hazur Sahib in Nanded. I cannot wait for this trip. Its my dream to one day go to the major historical gurudwaras in india, especially to Hemkund Sahib, and also Nanakana Sahib and Panja Sahib in Pakistan. Ive been suffering from severe depression for the past two years, and this trip to India i am visiting many places of pilgrimage and i pray that the atmosphere will have an affect on me. There is no doubt God resides within every atom in this universe, but I think that visiting a spiritual place does have a positive reenforcing affect on us. Who knows maybe by the mercy of the Lord, and Guru Ji, my condition may improve and one day i might be able to grow a kesh. But for now, whatever God wills, I shall follow . Are there any tips as to what I should do when I visit Darbaar Sahib to ensure that my trip there is complete? 

Hahaha, Hannah Kaur. It sounds good haha. Hannah, how did you come into contact with the Sikh faith and the teachings of the Gurus, etc? 

Thanks once again Dr. Khalsa.

Suren 

(Suren is short for Surendra, in Punjabi that would be Surinder )


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## HannahBanana (Sep 16, 2006)

I feel kind of stupid saying this, but I saw Bend It Like Beckham. Everytime they mentioned Guru Nanak I felt a kind of warm feeling. It was odd. I saw the wedding which took up the last 1/4 of the movie and I loved it. So after I saw that I started researching and I loved what I read. Some may think that a movie is an immature way to find a religion, but teens these days (well, I love to read, so maybe not me) don't seem to like to read, and sometimes only movies reach out to them.

Anyway, this made me begin my life as a Sikh. I also spent some time reading quotes from the Gurus and they were very very wise men. I loved it.

Oh, do you know where I can get an English copy of GSS? I would love to learn Punjabi and read the original one, but that is quite hard to do right now, what with school and French class. But I will try to learn some things.

How did you find Sikhism, if you don't mind my asking.

Peace Neemai Ji,

Hannah (But I thought Sabooree might be a nice name, what do you think?)


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## Neemai108 (Sep 16, 2006)

Hii Hannahh!

Haha, i dont think its stupid that you found Sikhism in that way. Afterall God leads us to him in many different ways, and who knows a movie can be one . Thats good you find it nice. I believe its always always good to find something that  is spiritually solid, no matter what religion it may be. All religions lead to the same God, like all rivers lead to the same ocean. But some rivers curve alot, some are straight, some have more obstacles then others and requirements, but eventually they meet the great infinite ocean. And in my opinion, I find sikhism quite straightforward, and with the least number of obstacles. 

Honestly, when I was a child, I was afraid of Sikhs . I was terrified of turbans and big beards. (But then again I was also afraid of bald people, hence Gandhi was  for me). But eventually i outgrew that childrish fear. My first real encounter with the faith was at my cousins wedding. He married a Sikh, and after the wedding ceremony, they did some Shabad Gurbani and Kirtan, and when I listened to it, it filled my heart with joy, happiness, and bliss. and thats when I looked into it seriously. Since I grew up as Hindu, I saw God always in the form of Rama, the hero of the Ramayana. So no matter what spiritual path I follow, even if it doesnt worship the Rama of the Ramayan, I still certainly call that God by the name Rama. Once I was in doubt about God, and I got rather confused about his relation to other Gods and all that. But that sunday I had gone to the Gurudwara, and I guess they had issued a Random Hukumnama for that day, and it came from Shalok, Mahalla 9. And quoted the 9th master: "Sub Sukh Data Ram Hai, Dusar Nahi Na Koi". "There is One Blissful Lord, And no Other" And I felt as if my prayer and my doubts were directly cleared by God via Guruji. And since then my faith in Guruji has been great. I may not see my God Rama as the Hero of the Ramayan anymore, but he is still Rama as the cosmic creator, time less Lord. Afterall, Goswami Tulasidas writes in his own Ramayan, that above the formed and the formless Rama, there is the name of Rama which is supreme. Just thought I would share my experiencee of how I started to follow Guruji's words. 

Regarding where to find a copy of the Guru Granth Sahib Ji. I found a copy of the Adi Granth (pretty much same as the Guru Granth Sahib, excepting the title) from Amazon.com, but it was about 70 some dollars. I found my copy of the Dasam granth from Amazon as well. but since your a student you might not have the money for that Id suggest reading it online: 
Holy Guru Granth Sahib . 
You can find the whole thing there online. And im positive there are probably other sites out there which have it as well. And if staying on the internet to read it is an issue, at the most you can print it out and read it, just keep it clean and nicely, maybe even bind it, because it should be respected just as any scripture, and especially for sikhs as the Granth  Sahib (aka Adi Granth) are the words of the living Guru and embodiment of the 10 Gurus. Hopefully this will be helpful. I myself cannot read or write Punjabi, but I i can atleast understand msot of it. I suppose as you become more fimilar with the religion and while listening to the Gurbani etc you'll catch on too. Its helpful. although even when not understanding it, the way the gurbani is sung, it immediatly pierces your heart. 

Hope this all helps,

Suren


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## HannahBanana (Sep 16, 2006)

Hello, Neemai Ji!

Thank you for understanding. I love your story! I would love to go to a Sikh wedding, Think how joyous it must be! 

I listened to a random Hukumnama today in Punjabi, then the man went into detail translating each line. It was about 23 minutes. I found it here: Daily Hukamnama from Harimandir Sahib, the Golden Temple just in case you want to take a look.
I love how Gurabani sounds, they sing it with such passion and devotion.

Thank you for the link!! I couldn't possibly print all that! But maybe some of it at a time, so no one will notice all the ink gone in the printer in one day! haha

How do you do Banis? Do you have a Gutka? 


Thank you a million times!
Hannah


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## Neemai108 (Sep 16, 2006)

Hii Hannah!

Yes Sikh weddings are wonderful! I love them! Its very beautiful. I like it especially because its much shorter than a hindu weddings (which I find utmost boring  and nonsensical at some points). My cousin had both weddings. I dont know, it was a a long while ago, so I dont really remember, I was still a kid at the time. But in any case it was my first real sikh experience. 

Im glad the link came in handy, im sure there are other websites that have varied translations of the Adi Granth. But if you were to go for a hardcover, try and find one at a good price, I had to pay handsomely for mine. But in anycase, I feel its worth it because the words of the Guru are priceless. 

Regarding how I pray and worship. I usually try and find transliterations (not translations) of the script from Gurmukhi to Roman so I can read it aloud. I cannot read Gurmukhi script (heck I cant even read devanagari [hindi]). I found a transliterated form of the Jaapji which I try and read. Regarding Shabads and such, I know some of them by heart and I sing them, but at this point I mostly listen to them. My favorite is found in Raag Malhaar, fifth mahalla, by Guru Arjan Dev, it goes as such "Hey Gobind, Hey Gopal". It is my favorite, and I know the whole thing by heart, and I sing that always. For the most part I do naam simran (remembering the name) with my mala(108 beads or rosary) or just in my mind either Eg Onkar Satnaam Sri Waheguru, or the holy name of Rama. 

Honestly I still have some hindu influence in my since I was raised as one. For hindus, the worship of God comes in stages. Im sure its quite similar in the Sikh faith as well. It goes: Shravanam, Kirtanam, Smaranam, Vandanam, and Pad Sevanam. Shravanam to hear about God or his names, Kirtanam means to chant or sing his names or glories, Smaranam means to remember his names or glories, Vandanam means to worship him, and Pad Sevanam means to serve his lotus feet. For hindus the last one is usually physically actually worshipping the feet of the idol, which i dont find necessary, afterall there is nothing better than worshipping his name, for me atleast. So at this point, im at the Shravanam stage of simply listening, mainly because im not fluent in pronouncing punjabi, though i can understand it pretty well since its quite similar to hindi. But I think when i can freely pronounce the words, ill be able to sing more often. So I either sing Hey Gobind Hey Gopal or I do Naam Simran or something of that sort. Atleast for now. I hope i progress slowly . 

I read the Hukumnamas time to time, especially when I feel in doubt, or somethings bothering me, or I have a question for God, I turn to Guruji. Like I think I had mentioned  before, once I was very troubled and full of doubt, but when I went to the Gurudwara, my answer was answered in the Hukumnama. I truely believe the Hukumnama is the word of the Guru live and it is there to clear out thoughts, doubts, and give us instruction. Hence I truely believe in it. I think its amazing that the Gurus Speak through the Granthji. Even at times when I dont know what to do, i randomly turn to a page in the Granthji and look up a verse to find peace. Im going to Sri Darbaar Sahib (Harmandir Golden Temple) this November for the first time, and I cant wait. Im so excited. I think it will be an amazing experience, I simply cannot wait. I hope that I can wake up before sunrise and see the procession of the Granth Ji from the Akal Thakt to Harmandir Sahib in the morning. I really hope to witness that, Ive read much about it and hear its amazing. Ill be sure to take plenty of pictures, maybe ill share them with you when I come back. Im visiting other historical gurudwaras as well, like Anandpur Sahib, birthplace of the Khalsa. 

Do you have a kara (steel bangle)? If you cant find one where you are, maybe I can bring you back one from Amritsar or somewhere in India. Id be more than happy to. I hope it would add motivation and faith in God. My kara reminds me of him constantly, and I never remove it. 

I wish you well on your spiritual quest.

suren


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## HannahBanana (Sep 17, 2006)

Hello Suren Ji! 

Oh, I will certainly invest in a GSS Ji as soon as I can, I should probably try to get a job anyway! haha

I also favor the transliterations, but I also recently started to read the translations more so that I know exactly what I'm saying when I say it. I should start to memorize the prayers' meaning and then read out the transliterations. It would make me feel closer to God praying in Punjabi.

Oh you are soooo lucky! What I would give to go to India, and the Golden Temple!! I could cry just thinking about it. I hear Amritsar is so beautiful a city. I have the Golden Temple as my desktop picture right now.

I have been meaning to get a kara! You would get one for me? That is so nice! Are they expensive? If so, then I'll find a way to get one on my own. I don't want you to go out of your way on your trip!


Have an enlightened day...or night...ph geez I should go to sleep! Night!

Hannah


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## drkhalsa (Sep 18, 2006)

Dear Friends ,



If you dont mind me adding here some more resources for your need.


*FOR SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB FULL IN PDF  FORMAT FILE  ( DOWNLOADABLE)



http://www.gurbanifiles.org/translations/Gurmukhi%20to%20English%20translation%20&%20transliterat%20of%20SGGS,%20SBS.pdf*


*( INSTRUCTIONS: Right Click on this link above and choose save target as )*



*FOR NITNEM BANIS  ( BANIS READ DAILY ) IN PDF FORMAT FILE ( DOWNLOADABLE)

http://www.gurbanifiles.org/translations/Nitnem%20by%20Dr.%20Kulwant%20Singh,%20with%20Punjabi%20&%20Eng%20transla%20&%20PT.pdf*


*( INSTRUCTIONS: Right Click on this link above and choose save target as )
*




*FOR ONLINE SRIGURU GRANTH SAHIB WITH MORE THAN ONE TRANSLATION IN ENGLISH AND PUNJABI *

*http://www.srigranth.org

* 

*( INSTRUCTIONS  Just Click on the above link )



*
*FOR BUYING ANY SIKH ARTICLE IN USA INCLUDING KARA < KIROAN < NECKLACE < GUTKAS< GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI

*SikhLink.net

*( INSTRUCTIONS  Just Click on the above link )
*




*LINK SPECIFIC FOR KARA*

*http://www.sikhlink.net/store/catsearch.asp?cat=Karas&type=kakkars&display=Karas*

*( INSTRUCTIONS  Just Click on the above link )*





*Jatinder Singh

*


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## HannahBanana (Sep 18, 2006)

Thank you for all the links!


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## Arvind (Sep 19, 2006)

Dear Hannah,

You may like to read
MrSikhNet.com: Youth of the Month - Sukhmani Kaur and
s*kaur*.blogspot.com/

Regards.


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## HannahBanana (Sep 19, 2006)

Hey, thank you I will check it out!


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## trilochankaur (Sep 20, 2006)

you may also check The Sikhism Home Page for better understanding about sikhism.


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## HannahBanana (Sep 20, 2006)

Thank you, trilochankaur Ji!


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## CaliforniaSeeker (Sep 21, 2006)

Hi, Hannah Ji --

 The Khalsa Consensus Translation is considered one of the best translations available. (If you're interested in a comparison of the different translations, sikhs.org has one: The Sikhism Home Page: Sri Guru Granth Sahib) It's available many places online -- I usually go to srigranth.org, as that's the one I can most easily remember. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be available in printed format anywhere. And I know what you mean about possibly printing a few pages at a time -- I figure if I print 10 pages a day, it'll only take 5 months! 

I don't think it's stupid or silly to have first learned about Sikhi from a movie. I learned about it in an even more roundabout way (I read a book on chanting, which referenced a book on Meditation as Medicine, which led me to look into 3HO, which led me to learn about mainstream Sikhi).

I think suren Ji's suggestion of reading along in a transliteration while listening to recorded banis is an excellent one for those of us who don't yet read Gurmukhi. Have you heard anything by the musician Dya Singh? He's a Sikh of Punjabi heritage who grew up in Malaysia and now lives in Australia, which gives him an interesting set of musical influences. He describes his group as "bringing Sikh music to the world, and world music to the Sikhs." Most of his tracks can be listened to as streaming audio online (Gurbani Music, Shabd Kirtan, Sikh stories and videos, MP3 files and more -- in the "BROWSE MEDIA BY:" box, choose "Musician", then scroll to Dya's name).

I love Dya's music, and I admire him very much as a person. I've been fortunate enough to meet him in person a couple of times, when he and the group have performed at gurdwaras in my area, and he's someone who seems to just radiate love of Waheguru and warmth and honesty and all those good things. To me he seems very Gurmukh -- committed to simran and seva and encouraging others to let go of haumai and immerse themselves in the naam. The more I listen to Dya's music, the more I feel drawn to reading bani and doing simran.


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## HannahBanana (Sep 21, 2006)

California Ji, thanks! The music sounds great. Well, how you said it it sounds great. I haven't listened yet. lol Thanks for the suggestion.


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## adityashivkumar (Nov 3, 2006)

dear all,i am aditya from cardiff,wales.i have always been interested in the sikh way of life and i have read about sikhism. i am a hindu,but i would like someone to help me out with embracing sikhism in cardiff.i believe sikhism gives me internal peace and salvation. would be grateful if someone could help me out. thank u.


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## max314 (Nov 3, 2006)

It depends on how one chooses to define 'Sikkhism'.

If it is defined as a particular group of people who have a certain set of rituals and practices and observe a specific code of conduct and who identify with one another through concepts they believe to be exclusive only to their community, then yes, I would say that there exists a conversion process of some description.

But if you define Sikkhism as a concept to which a name has to have been forcibly given due to the limitations of the human mind to grasp concepts that have no name, a concept that defies the idea of division, a concept that defies all constructs that we as humans take for granted, a concept that binds all life in the universe in a way that is singular and pure? Then, no. I don't think you can 'convert' to something that is, has and will forever remain the only Truth in the cosmos.

Because you are already a part of that Truth.


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## adityashivkumar (Nov 3, 2006)

dear max ji, 
guru fateh.

i do subscribe to your thoughts.i agree with your point of view which is that of part of truth. what i look for is the procedural coversion into this great religion of mankind,the gift our great guru guru nanak ji has given us. 

i would like your advice on the actual procedural conversion into sikhism and the proper baptism ceremony and the change of name.
would be grateful ji if u could help me out.


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## Tejwant Singh (Nov 3, 2006)

Sikhi is against conversion because conversion does nothing  but to change the  mechanical external rituals based in dogmas- man made truth- subjective reality.

Sikhi is based on pragmatism not on any do's and don't prescribed by any dogma.

For a Sikh it is not  what I can or can not do but what I will or will not do.


Hence  Sikhi needs metamorphosis- extreme makeover- from a caterpillar to a butterfly. From being dogmatic to pragmatic..

For a Sikh, seeking IK ONG KAAR is a an internal manifestation not an external imposition... 


So no conversion needed to become a seeker, a learner, a student- a SIKH.


Tejwant


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## max314 (Nov 3, 2006)

adityashivkumar said:


> dear max ji,
> guru fateh.
> 
> i do subscribe to your thoughts.i agree with your point of view which is that of part of truth. what i look for is the procedural coversion into this great religion of mankind,the gift our great guru guru nanak ji has given us.
> ...



I think what you're looking for is a conversion into the Khalsa panth.  There is actually no 'conversion' process for becoming 'a Sikkh'.

A Khalsa warrior is one who dedicates his or her life to the service of humanity by suscribing to a regime of emotional and physical discipline as outlined by the Tenth Guru.  It is not a path for everyone, as it demands a lot of a person.  Of course, one who is truly devoted to any discipline will find it much easier, but let there be no illusions about the fact that this is a path the width of a sword's edge.

The ceremony by which one joins this 'Brotherhood of Humanitarian Knights', as it were, is a process referred to as "taking _amrit_", which involves the recital of certain prayers and the drinking of a particular type of water known as _amrit_, which is essentially just water with sugar mixed with a steel blade.

It's actually a very deliberate political and ideological statement by the Tenth Guru, in which he replaced the ceremony of people drinking the water in which the feet of a Gurus or Sant of the old whom they followed would  have been dipped.  Guru Gobind Singh Ji was essentially saying "worship only the power of the sword, for it has the power to change destiny" by dipping the blade into the water instead of the ritualised (and wrong) dipping of feet.

The Sikkh community at large as you probably see and understand it undergoes no ritual of 'baptism', however.  I suppose you'd just go to the Gurudwara regularly and listen and absorb _gurbani_.

It may be of interest for you to know that nowhere in the Guru Granth Sahib is the keeping of hair or the formation of the Khalsa mentioned.  It is mentioned only in the Dassam Granth; a volume whose authorship and authenticity is still highly debated, but whose devout followers are the Khalsa of today.  The Tenth Master never dubbed this volume as a 'Guru' as he did the Granth Sahib, and I think it's very important that people recognise his choice in doing so.  It has always occured to me that the Khalsa is a cult of Knights created for a specific purpose.  Whilst it contradicts certain passages in the Granth (such as the useless nature of wearing particular clothes, or the uselessness of the keeping of hair), it is a 'necessary evil' in that it allowed these Knights to rally around a particular image (that of a Khalsa) and to allow this to invigorate their fighting spirit to preserve the text that would preserve humanity's freedom.

They were the isolated and often violent shell comprised of men and women who sacrificed their lives to this way of life in order to protect the universal and peaceful philosophy of the Granth, and who took it upon themselves to fight for those who could not fight for themselves.


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## Lionchild (Nov 4, 2006)

I really think as a community we really need ot move on and search for sikhs outside of our community. This means spreading sikhi on a mass scale, something that hasn't been done since the days of the gurus. Of course, we have to start off small, and it won;t be easy to spread to other cultural areas of the world, however, the "rewards" for spreading outside are many.


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## kds1980 (Nov 4, 2006)

Lionchild said:


> I really think as a community we really need ot move on and search for sikhs outside of our community. This means spreading sikhi on a mass scale, something that hasn't been done since the days of the gurus. Of course, we have to start off small, and it won;t be easy to spread to other cultural areas of the world, however, the "rewards" for spreading outside are many.



i totaly agree with it instead of forcing sikhi to our children which are not interested in sikhi we  need people which are realy interested in sikhi.


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## max314 (Nov 4, 2006)

kds1980 said:


> i totaly agree with it instead of forcing sikhi to our children which are not interested in sikhi we  need people which are realy interested in sikhi.



Why force children?  Why not just teach them gently from an early age and allow them to make up their own minds instead of waiting for them to start finishing puberty and then jamming it down their throats when their habits and thoughts have already been formed?

I was born and brought up in a Sikkh family, and I have a real passion for the things that Guru Nanak attempted to teach.  This is mostly because my bedtime stories and childhood experiences were a healthy combination of Western fairy tales and Sikkh history.  My parents always believed in trying to make sure that their children were as well rounded as possible; there is a difference between stifling your children in an attempt to brainwash them, and teaching them in a relaxed and gentle manner.

Also, the problem is that everyone's view on precisely what Sikkhi is, is a little bit different depending on who you ask.  Some believe it's necessary to wear a turban.  Others think that it's not a requirement.  Other more minor differences would also exist, and it depends on the open-mindedness of both the parent and the child.


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## kds1980 (Nov 4, 2006)

dear max

i am not saying that we should force sikhi to children but whether you accept it or not majority of young urban sikhs in india that are wearing turban and keeping hair is because of parents pressure.give them a chance to cut their hair and majority of them will happily do it.


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## max314 (Nov 4, 2006)

Yes, I too have experienced sentiments from people very similar to the ones you have expressed.  But, if I might be so bold, it would seem that you are linking in the wearing of a turban into the belief in the words of the Granth.  Immediately, we are faced with an interpretive issue.

You see, my interpretation of _gurbani_ has lead me to believe that the wearing of a turban is not a necessity to harbour a love and a passion for Sikkh teachings and Sikkh history.  But your interpretation is obviously somewhat different.

I think that if parents focussed less on dress codes and more on moral and ethical codes of honourable and decent conduct, instilling their children with stories of chivalry, bravery and integrity from *all* cultures - including, of course, Sikkhi - then those same children will at least be formed into more decent human beings.


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## kds1980 (Nov 4, 2006)

<<You see, my interpretation of gurbani has lead me to believe that the wearing of a turban is not a necessity to harbour a love and a passion for Sikkh teachings and Sikkh history. But your interpretation is obviously somewhat different.>>

i too beleive that inner spirituality is much more important than outer appearance.


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## Lionchild (Nov 4, 2006)

In terms of outward appearance, wearing a turban, 5 k's and other things are pointless if the person wearing them does not know the basic meaning of sikhi or the symbols themselves. This is a radical departure for most people today, but it's the right way. 

The first step in becoming a Sikh of waheguru, and any church or faith for that matter is to learn what god is and "his" qualities are, and about the basic principles and values. If you follow that and build on that, the physical outward appearance will naturally follow.


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## Suntink (Nov 13, 2008)

I think it is fine or even good if one converts to Sikhism. But my question is the person converting are they going to follow Sikhism or are they going to follow  a new branch that has come from Sikhism. Like the teachings of 3HO, Radhasoami's, radicalism, black magic. 
I have no problem at all with a person converting to Sikhism, but I want them to know that as a Sikh you can wear whatever clothes you want, do whatever yoga, speak whatever language, where whatever colour turban and eat whatever meat as long as the animal was not tortured. 

Why are so many new converts to Sikhism following practices that when a Sikhs whose great grand parents where Sikh asks his/her parents about these practices they know absolutely nothing about them. Are people trying to tell us that Kundalini yoga will help you with Sikhism and it is a really good practice for Sikhism? Well let's be frank our great-great grandparents where Sikh and no one in our families for generations know anything about Kundalini Yoga. Not just that but a living human Guru, black magic, inner light and sound, Hind Gods, idol worship. We don't know anything about these things and some internet sites tells us that Sikhs are also Hindus and that they believe in Hindu Gods and that you can see light after doing Yoga. I think I saw something on this post about people not being allowed to convert. 
In my opinion I hope Sikhs remember that Guru Nanak’s message is that everyone is always allowed at a Gurdwara. We are a non-denominational religion. 

I really believe that what I wrote is completly appropriate, so I hope it is not taken in the wrong way.


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## Randip Singh (Nov 13, 2008)

Suntink said:


> I think it is fine or even good if one converts to Sikhism. But my question is the person converting are they going to follow Sikhism or are they going to follow  a new branch that has come from Sikhism. Like the teachings of 3HO, Radhasoami's, radicalism, black magic.
> I have no problem at all with a person converting to Sikhism, but I want them to know that as a Sikh you can wear whatever clothes you want, do whatever yoga, speak whatever language, where whatever colour turban and eat whatever meat as long as the animal was not tortured.
> 
> Why are so many new converts to Sikhism following practices that when a Sikhs whose great grand parents where Sikh asks his/her parents about these practices they know absolutely nothing about them. Are people trying to tell us that Kundalini yoga will help you with Sikhism and it is a really good practice for Sikhism? Well let's be frank our great-great grandparents where Sikh and no one in our families for generations know anything about Kundalini Yoga. Not just that but a living human Guru, black magic, inner light and sound, Hind Gods, idol worship. We don't know anything about these things and some internet sites tells us that Sikhs are also Hindus and that they believe in Hindu Gods and that you can see light after doing Yoga. I think I saw something on this post about people not being allowed to convert.
> ...



I think Sikhism is broad enough to encompass many diverse opinions. Follow what is in your heart and I don't think you can go wrong.


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## spnadmin (Nov 13, 2008)

Suntink said:


> I think it is fine or even good if one converts to Sikhism. But my question is the person converting are they going to follow Sikhism or are they going to follow  a new branch that has come from Sikhism. Like the teachings of 3HO, Radhasoami's, radicalism, black magic.
> I have no problem at all with a person converting to Sikhism, but I want them to know that as a Sikh you can wear whatever clothes you want, do whatever yoga, speak whatever language, where whatever colour turban and eat whatever meat as long as the animal was not tortured.
> 
> Why are so many new converts to Sikhism following practices that when a Sikhs whose great grand parents where Sikh asks his/her parents about these practices they know absolutely nothing about them. Are people trying to tell us that Kundalini yoga will help you with Sikhism and it is a really good practice for Sikhism? Well let's be frank our great-great grandparents where Sikh and no one in our families for generations know anything about Kundalini Yoga. Not just that but a living human Guru, black magic, inner light and sound, Hind Gods, idol worship. We don't know anything about these things and some internet sites tells us that Sikhs are also Hindus and that they believe in Hindu Gods and that you can see light after doing Yoga. I think I saw something on this post about people not being allowed to convert.
> ...



Suntink ji

Actually I think you would find many SPN members in agreement with what you have posted above. Reading some months and years back in the SPN forum threads you will see that many of the issues you have mentioned have been discussed and your point of view is well-represented. I don't think Sikhism is non-denominational as much as it is a tolerant religion. Don't let people on the Internet rattle your cage.


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