# Jaisee Main Avae Khasam Kee Bani, Taisra Kari Gyaan Vae Lalo



## Neutral Singh (Aug 11, 2004)

These tukks have always intrigue me in from Babar Bani... Literally means... 

*"I reveal to you dear Lalo, Whatever the Almighty reveals to me..."* 

Are these tukks Prophetic ? Is Guru Nanak staking claim of Prophthood ? Please Discuss...


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## Arvind (Aug 11, 2004)

Me curious too.. and strange enuf, I am humming these tukks for past 2 hours, without any reason!! Well, perhaps I dont know the reason then, I guess.


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## Neutral Singh (Aug 13, 2004)

I guess its in the tune by bhai harjinder singh ji...  I live the way he recites bani although not classical... 

I got this reply from one member... What do you think...? It kind of seems appropriate to me.



> sikhphilosophy wrote:
> 
> Can it be a metaphor to make us submit to the will of the Almighty ? I am curious to know more about this.
> 
> Regards


 
According to Guru Granth every thing we do is will of God and Guru Nanak said the above in same context. 

In Sikhism there is no intermissionary. Guru Nanak is trying to find God along with his followers. Guru Nanak exchanged dialogue with Brahmins in Benaras, discussed with Sidhs. 

There is a distinct difference between mystic religions ( eastern religions) and Semitic religions. Mystic religions believe human beings have direct relationship with God and God is everywhere, God is within human beings. Read mool matra and defination of God according there is no being sitting up heaven talking..God is everywhere, it is inside the human beings. Mystic religiions which Sikhism is part believe in Karma and reincarnation. It makes no difference weather you listen to Nanak or not as long as you live truthful life. 

Semitic religions believe that God does what prophet tells him to and if you annoy the Prophets such as Jesus, Mohammad then God will punish you. On judgement day all dead will rise and prophet will sit next to God and God will only do what prophet wants him. One may be good person but if he doesn't respect and listen to prophet s(he) will go to hell. The only way to avoid hell fire is to show respect to prophet. Also, God only talks to messenger. 

To say Guru Nanak talked to God is to bring down Sikhism and Islamize it. To take away the greatness of Great Gurus who sacrificed their families to show their students that everybody can rise and do the same and not give up their freedom. Gurus were not fake prophets making stories for personal gain..they were great sages who told the truth. 

Gurus have very clearly said that we are servants of God like all you that is why they vested all the power in Sangat and that is why they started the concept such as "Ape Guru Ape Challa" they said again and again they are not special...they are just teacher trying to find God.


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## Arvind (Aug 13, 2004)

That s right. I was watching the cassette by Bhai Harjinder Singh ji.

'Ape Guru Ape Chela', 'Braham mein jan, jan mein parbraham', 'Guru Gobind dou kharee, kake lago paye...' all these indicate the futility of this dicussion. Or Am I missing something?

Regards.


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## Neutral Singh (Aug 14, 2004)

ThinkingOne said:
			
		

> That s right. I was watching the cassette by Bhai Harjinder Singh ji.
> 
> 'Ape Guru Ape Chela', 'Braham mein jan, jan mein parbraham', 'Guru Gobind dou kharee, kake lago paye...' all these indicate the futility of this dicussion. Or Am I missing something?
> 
> Regards.


Please elaborate.


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## Kandola (Aug 22, 2004)

SGGS is basically talks and dialouges. people asked the gurus questions, and they answered it.

i think its the same with bhai lalo ji. 

all i can think of, is a bhai lalo ji asked a few questions to maharaj, and maharaj responded by saying what he said here.

bhol chukke muaff


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## singh99 (Aug 27, 2004)

Neutral Singh said:
			
		

> I guess its in the tune by bhai harjinder singh ji...  I live the way he recites bani although not classical...
> 
> I got this reply from one member... What do you think...? It kind of seems appropriate to me.
> 
> ...



WJKK WJKF

Bhaji, I agree with you regarding the difference between the mystic religions and the semitic religions. Sikhism teaches that each and every human being can experience Waheguru and there is no need to live ones life under the assumption that a prophet has revealed everything in a book and all one needs to do is follow the holy book and you are guaranteed a life in heaven. 



> To say Guru Nanak talked to God is to bring down Sikhism and Islamize it. To take away the greatness of Great Gurus who sacrificed their families to show their students that everybody can rise and do the same and not give up their freedom. Gurus were not fake prophets making stories for personal gain..they were great sages who told the truth.



This comes down to the fundamental difference between  between Sikhism and the semitic religions. The concept of what is man's relationship with God. Semitic religions teach that man is apart from God and both are separate. Sikhism teaches that the entire existence is a part of God and man's ultimate aim in merger in the divine. Sikhism also teaches that man can attune his soul to that of the supreme soul. This is why it would be wrong to say Guru Nanak talked to Waheguru. 'Talking' to God can only occur if ultimately there is a difference between the two taking part in the conversation. This is not the case because Guru Nanak's jot with attuned to that of Waheguru so it was a part of Waheguru. Talking to God implies that at some stage the talking ceases, but as the Guru's jot was attuned to Waheguru then the relationship between the jot and the mahan jot would be one of constantly being ONE. 

As the semitic religions view man as separate from God this is why the prophets had to talk with God. God passed his instructions to the prophets and they passed these on to the people. The separateness of man and God is shown in these religions as the prophets had to go to secluded places to 'find' God and their religious experience was almost one of violent seizures and fits. No Guru, Brahmgiani or Mahan Purkh ever went through these type of experiences in Sikhi.

GurFateh


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## Ambarsaria (Jul 17, 2018)

singh99 ji thanks for your post.

I generally agree with your post. 

I do want you to consider that the business of merging of "jot" and "mahan jot" is also worth questioning. We never are separate from "mahan jot". What may be missing is our realization of the same. God is recognized through manifestation in SGGS. Manifestation is the totality of creation. It is for us to recognize, experience and otherwise cherish as much of God's/creator's manifestation which is the challenge. When one is in tune with the manifestation of God/creator then one has the opportunity to live therin with tranquility , peace and oneship. It may be classified a state of merging but that I believe it is a wrong depiction. One should endeavor for the complete _(actually as much as we possibly can)_ understanding of the manifestation. However, SGGS teaches us not to set knowing 100% as an objective. Early on in mool mantar the concepts of infiniteness, etc., are stated regarding God/creator/creation which clearly guide that 100% is not realistic objective. SGGS instead teaches us to yearn for as much understanding as we can and always striving for more. More importantly beyond understanding, coupling of understanding to living accordingly is the core essence. Sikhisnm is a way to live within and not live without. It is a continuum and a journey. That is as good as it gets from what I understand. I paraphrased it as "living in consonance" with creation and improving on this as more is understood with every passing moment in our lives. A state of continuously improving awareness could be another depiction.

Just some thoughts.

Sat Sri Akal


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