# Who Are Brahmin Sikhs?



## Gurjot317

Could any body throw light on Brahmin Sikhs? I want to get knowledge about dem.


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## Harry Haller

There may be some helpful information here

http://www.india-forum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/2389-brahmin-sikh-history/

while your at it, if you could provide me some information on promiscuous virgins, I would be hugely grateful


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## Gurjot317

harry haller said:


> There may be some helpful information here
> 
> http://www.india-forum.com/forums/index.php?/topic/2389-brahmin-sikh-history/
> 
> while your at it, if you could provide me some information on promiscuous virgins, I would be hugely grateful




You are thinking wrong sir......This is wat i can say..


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## Harry Haller

why is that sir?

I cannot see the difference between a promiscuous virgin and a Brahmin Sikh, perhaps you could explain where my thinking is wrong, I would be eternally grateful


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## Gurjot317

harry haller said:


> why is that sir?
> 
> I cannot see the difference between a *promiscuous virgin and a Brahmin Sikh*, perhaps you could explain where my thinking is wrong, I would be eternally grateful




Firstly,i dont believe in caste etc and i m here to ask about few qns in my mind.

so plz elaborate bold part


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## Harry Haller

Ok, Sikhs do not believe in caste, so are you asking about Sikhs that were originally Brahmin, or Sikhs that consider themselves Brahmin at present?

If you are talking about Sikhs that are currently Brahmin, that is an oxy{censored}. The two, as per Bani, SRM etc cannot co exist. 

A promiscuous virgin is also clearly an oxy{censored}. 

Other examples of oxy{censored} use

A mechanically sound Jeep Cherokee
A round square
A sympathetic lawyer
An honourable banker

etc etc


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## RobbieS

harry haller said:


> Ok, Sikhs do not believe in caste, so are you asking about Sikhs that were originally Brahmin, or Sikhs that consider themselves Brahmin at present?
> 
> If you are talking about Sikhs that are currently Brahmin, that is an oxy{censored}. The two, as per Bani, SRM etc cannot co exist.
> 
> A promiscuous virgin is also clearly an oxy{censored}.
> 
> Other examples of oxy{censored} use
> 
> A mechanically sound Jeep Cherokee
> A round square
> A sympathetic lawyer
> An honourable banker
> 
> etc etc



I think he did mean Sikhs that were originally Hindu brahmins. 

Based on my experience, there are very few of those in Punjab. Nor sure about abroad. I know of only one family who are practicing Sikhs but still use Sharma as their surname.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh

a Brahmin just beginning school is a Brahmin Sikh....or a Beasi Sikh....etc etc..


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## Kanwaljit.Singh

What is hot ice?
What is resting wind?
What is dark light?
What is random eventuality?
What is curious ignorance?


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## Arjan Singh Punj

Dear Harry jee, Sat Sri Akal


Harry Haller said:


> why is that sir?
> 
> I cannot see the difference between a promiscuous virgin and a Brahmin Sikh, perhaps you could explain where my thinking is wrong, I would be eternally grateful



I am a Brahmin Sikh, my forefathers where Brahmins from Punj-Rajouri sector in J&K India. The place is called Pooch now in modern India. Took shelter with our Guru - Navam Patshashi. Our family contributes one Amritdhari Sikh male child as a family tradition since 1699. We moved to France under orders of General Ventura, Commander of Fauj-e-Khaas forces under Maharaja Ranjit Singh.

Another, Brahmin Sikh was Baba Banda Singh Bahadur jee. Born in Chibber Brahmin family in Rajouri. Made 'Singh' by Dasham Pita himself. I am married to a Bhardwaj Sikh girl from Ferozpur, Indian Punjab.

Sikhism equates all castes. But unfortunately we still use terms like Jat Sikhs, Khatri Sikhs, Rajput Sikhs. 

Regards
Arjan


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## Harry Haller

Arjan Singh Punj said:


> Dear Harry jee, Sat Sri Akal
> 
> 
> I am a Brahmin Sikh, my forefathers where Brahmins from Punj-Rajouri sector in J&K India. The place is called Pooch now in modern India. Took shelter with our Guru - Navam Patshashi. Our family contributes one Amritdhari Sikh male child as a family tradition since 1699. We moved to France under orders of General Ventura, Commander of Fauj-e-Khaas forces under Maharaja Ranjit Singh.
> 
> Another, Brahmin Sikh was Baba Banda Singh Bahadur jee. Born in Chibber Brahmin family in Rajouri. Made 'Singh' by Dasham Pita himself. I am married to a Bhardwaj Sikh girl from Ferozpur, Indian Punjab.
> 
> Sikhism equates all castes. But unfortunately we still use terms like Jat Sikhs, Khatri Sikhs, Rajput Sikhs.
> 
> Regards
> Arjan


many thanks, I did not mean it an offensive way only that it seems a contradiction in terms, ie, I did not know such a thing existed. 

What is a Brahmin Sikh?


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## Harry Haller

Arjan Singh Punj said:


> I am a Brahmin Sikh,





Arjan Singh Punj said:


> Sikhism equates all castes. But unfortunately we still use terms like Jat Sikhs, Khatri Sikhs, Rajput Sikhs.



Could you also explain the contradiction in the above, my point was that a Brahmin Sikh does not actually exist, we are all Sikhs regardless of our background. I am with you on the second point, but confused by the first, you are labelling yourself and then protesting at the labels of others.


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## Arjan Singh Punj

The contradiction is in our society. I had to write the word 'Brahmin Sikh' to explain such a thing exists. I highlighted the contradiction by further mentioning the divide of caste-ism easily seen in terms like Jat Sikhs, Khatri Sikhs etc. Ideally there should not be any term like Brahmins, Khatris or Jats in our religion, and that is where you are right. But thats ideal scenario, not reality. Infact, there should not be any second-name(surname) apart from Singh. Hope I answered you well.


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## Arjan Singh Punj

Arjan Singh Punj said:


> The contradiction is in our society. I had to write the word 'Brahmin Sikh' to explain such a thing exists. I highlighted the contradiction by further mentioning the divide of caste-ism easily seen in terms like Jat Sikhs, Khatri Sikhs etc. Ideally there should not be any term like Brahmins, Khatris or Jats in our religion, and that is where you are right. But thats ideal scenario, not reality. Infact, there should not be any second-name(surname) apart from Singh. Hope I answered you well.


May I add that all the above terms that I mentioned are equally analogous to a promiscuous Virgin. Regards


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## Harry Haller

Arjan Singh Punj said:


> May I add that all the above terms that I mentioned are equally analogous to a promiscuous Virgin. Regards



I am getting more confused, a promiscuous virgin does not exist, to be promiscuous one cannot be a virgin. To be a Brahmin, one cannot be a Sikh, one would have given up any reference to Brahmin upon embracing Sikhism.

Is there a practice that would help me that is exclusive to Brahmin Sikhs? You mentioned the contribution of a child, could you explain further?


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## swarn bains

matidas sati das and father praga now chhibbers


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## Arjan Singh Punj

Harry Haller said:


> I am getting more confused, a promiscuous virgin does not exist, to be promiscuous one cannot be a virgin. To be a Brahmin, one cannot be a Sikh, one would have given up any reference to Brahmin upon embracing Sikhism.
> 
> Is there a practice that would help me that is exclusive to Brahmin Sikhs? You mentioned the contribution of a child, could you explain further?


All I am saying is that you are right. 

Regarding your second question:
Some Brahmin families in Punjab still have a tradition of making 1 son an Amritdhari.. I am one like that and so is my father, but not my brother. It is popular in my family that Dasham Guru had desired his brahmin followers to contribute atleast 1 son to be a soldier, and hence the tradition. Whichever son has more inclination towards religion can choose to be Amritdhari. Nobody forces the other son to be Amritdhari. 

I feel many Indian families dont do that actively now


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## Harry Haller

Arjan Singh Punj said:


> All I am saying is that you are right.
> 
> Regarding your second question:
> Some Brahmin families in Punjab still have a tradition of making 1 son an Amritdhari.. I am one like that and so is my father, but not my brother. It is popular in my family that Dasham Guru had desired his brahmin followers to contribute atleast 1 son to be a soldier, and hence the tradition. Whichever son has more inclination towards religion can choose to be Amritdhari. Nobody forces the other son to be Amritdhari.
> 
> I feel many Indian families dont do that actively now



In all honesty I am fascinated, so is your wife a Sikh? would that mean your brothers are Hindus? but your father is a Sikh?


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## swarn bains

in my knowledge the hindus who made their first son a Sikh are generally khattris not brahamans. but there are odd brahmin who become Sikhs but their first son not necessary


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## Dalvinder Singh Grewal

Gurjot317 said:


> Could any body throw light on Brahmin Sikhs? I want to get knowledge about dem.


Sikhism does not believe in castes. Whosoever follows the ten gurus and Sri Guru Granth sahib is a Sikh. There are no Brahmin, Arora, Khatrim Jatt, Ramgarhia Sikhs. Those who follow castes are not Sikhs. Manas ki jaat sabhai eko pehchanbo.


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## Harry Haller

accepted, but what exactly is someone who labels themselves a Brahmin Sikh? what does it involve, how does it affect families?


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## Dalvinder Singh Grewal

Harry Haller said:


> accepted, but what exactly is someone who labels themselves a Brahmin Sikh? what does it involve, how does it affect families?


Labeling by some one else for some exterior motive does not change the actual hence should not be matter of concern hence ignored.


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## Harry Haller

dalvindersingh grewal said:


> Labeling by some one else for some exterior motive does not change the actual hence should not be matter of concern hence ignored.



The title of this thread is quite clear as to its content, such an answer does not make sense, maybe if we ignored a bit less, we might understand better our own brothers and sisters, right across the spectrum, there are Gay Sikhs, Christian Sikhs, Hindu Sikhs, Living Guru Sikhs, Fighting Sikhs, the list goes on, somewhere there is a label, by ignoring, we will always end up splintered.


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## Tejwant Singh

As Sikhs saved many Hindu lives, it was  not uncommon for a Hindu family to make one son Sikh because it shows integrity,bravura, honesty among other traits. Perhaps by making one a Sikh could change their mental paradigm in the family, eventually. The interesting part is that the daughter remains a Hindu for some reason.

As far as Promiscuous  Virgins are concerned, they do exist because virginity is between one's  two ears.


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## Tejwant Singh

Arjan Singh Punj said:


> Another, Brahmin Sikh was Baba Banda Singh Bahadur jee. Born in Chibber Brahmin family in Rajouri. Made 'Singh' by Dasham Pita himself. *I am married to a Bhardwaj Sikh girl from Ferozpur, Indian Punjab.*



It is very rare to find people from my hometown.


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## Dalvinder Singh Grewal

Harry Haller said:


> The title of this thread is quite clear as to its content, such an answer does not make sense, maybe if we ignored a bit less, we might understand better our own brothers and sisters, right across the spectrum, there are Gay Sikhs, Christian Sikhs, Hindu Sikhs, Living Guru Sikhs, Fighting Sikhs, the list goes on, somewhere there is a label, by ignoring, we will always end up splintered.


I have not found this domination of Brahmin Sikhs anywhere else but on this net only. hence this is not not logical to propagate differentiation among Sikh at this level. Is it building a community system within the overall gambit of  the definition of Sikh?


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## Harry Haller

dalvindersingh grewal said:


> I have not found this domination of Brahmin Sikhs anywhere else but on this net only. hence this is not not logical to propagate differentiation among Sikh at this level. Is it building a community system within the overall gambit of  the definition of Sikh?



The definition of a Sikh already exists in the SRM, what can be lost by furthering our knowledge and understanding on a term that we can now agree exists?


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