# Have We Failed Guru Nanak Dev Ji?



## Billsingh (Oct 13, 2006)

In other word have we failed Guru Nanak.

We have lost the essence of sikhism . In the name of maryada we have introduced rituals and practices. The riturals have become more important than the values and essence of sikhism.

While sikh politicians are mostly responsible for the state of affairs, all those who take pride in calling themselves sikhs are also responsible

I would like to have all lovers of sikhism as preached and practiced by Guru Nanak to respond and suggest steps so that corrective action could be taken.

Gur Fateh


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## Dimitri (Oct 14, 2006)

*Re: Was Guru Nanak a Failure*

I do agree. Sikhism has just purely become ritualistic.
But in the end its an individuals choice - do you just wanna go through the motions or actually learn something. 
I personelly feel its better to learn information yourself (which is in sync with sikhi as their is no concept of priest in sikhism, their is nobody in the middle breaking the deal for you as such). Its very easy to learn about the philosophy and teachings of Guru Granth. Internet is great.


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## dalsingh (Oct 14, 2006)

*Re: Was Guru Nanak a Failure*

I think Sikhism is waiting to be fully realised again. But I agree on your criticisms of so called Sikh 'leaders'.

SGPC couldn't be doing a worse job. Crap parchaar, crap literature, corrupt role models.


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## Rajwinder (Oct 14, 2006)

Few things from my side i would like to add :

1. In todays world people follow sikhsim because , there parents were sikhs.

2. In the old age they dont have any thing else to do so why not better go to gurdwara.

3.We are doing sins , manipulating things so we should go to gurdwara so that god should spare us.

4. we have asked something from god and to fulfill that we should do prayers and go to gurdwara.

we are accepting the “DEGRADE VERSION” of sikhism without any opposition, I give u an example , i was looking for a girl to get married and found lot of families which says  " boy should be gursikh" and when u talk to them they say " All we meant was should be wearing turban and having beard plus non drinker". There is another term coined "boy should be maintaining "Saroop". I cant understand will that make any boy a sikh ?  but it is widely accepted. 

There are so many saints around in punajb only ( some are international saints i should say).  what this shows ??? is our sikhism not capable to telling what is the way of life ??? but u will find more people believing in these saints rather then "Guru Granth Sahib ji ". And what we are doing NOTHING... who should go ahead and stood agianst these guys ??

We are having portraits of our gurus around in gurduwars , in our homes .. what are these ??? who told these are our gurus ... from where these pictures came ???/

People go to Religious places in india ... more of adventure rather then religious purpose ???

At this time only there are so many divisions in sikhs only , from where they came ??? are we doing something about it ?? 

I am working in a MNC and people call me sardar ... they dont even have slightest idea what is a sikh ?

If u r wearing a turban and keeping the hairs then u r answerable for many questions in todays world and ironically our parents them selves are not aware of these answers then why todays generation will opt for this extra tension of questions ????  Very common scenrios are :

1. if a boy ask his parents that he will not wear turban and want to be clean shaven .... normal response is " Our gurus have given lives because of sikhi and u say it is bourdon ??? "  what kind of logic is this ... our gurus haven’t given the lives cause they want to wear turban or they want to keep hairs... it is because of the  way of life that they think is perfect and in tune with nature. Muslims do have beard and they wear turban...

2. Ladies in sikh families follow sikhism to the extent they feel "OK"... like go to gurdwara ( plus evening walk)  , go to kirtan ( plus get together) , do path ( because sikhs do path  ) , that's it ...

3. Check out gurdwaras abroad ... purpose :

a. Big money making machines .
b. On sundays we get free indian food called langar.
c. Old champs get time for get together.
d. Ladies after week long of " Odd jobs" got time for chit chat.
e. Kids got to see other " Punjabi" kids and may learn some punjabi.
f . 80 % of the so called " sangat" is clean shaven ..

who will oppose them and what u will do... 

In villages todays generation hardly prefer to wear turban... u can imagine the scene in cities. 

Can u imagine that in todays time if somebody will say that muslims in kashmir or people in assam are having hardships due to terrorism then some sikh youths will go there and fight them and give there lives ... forget about it !! ...

Punjabi language in todays time is a dead language what all additions in words we did in the last few years ??? and what does this mean ???

So I personally believe 

1. Very first thing and above all is " Nature"
2. Human learnt the way to survive on earth from the past experiences.
3. Religions are made to polish the way of life and to keep it in synch with Nature.
4. Sikhsim is one of the youngest and practical religion created by our gurus .
5. Todays generation will firstly ask " why we need religion " before " why we should follow sikhsim". 

I don’t want to start about the marriages in Sikhism as that will make this post so big … so ending here only … Please rectify my mistakes if any in the above saying.

Regards


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## kaur-1 (Oct 21, 2006)

Sad but True.


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## skeptik (Nov 1, 2006)

> We have lost the essence of sikhism . In the name of maryada we have introduced rituals and practices. The riturals have become more important than the values and essence of sikhism.


 Like what? Name these. 





> While sikh politicians are mostly responsible for the state of affairs, all those who take pride in calling themselves sikhs are also responsible


 Sikh politicians? What have they done? What is _wrong_ ? Tell us what problems you are referring to please. This is too vague!


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## skeptik (Nov 1, 2006)

> SGPC couldn't be doing a worse job. Crap parchaar, crap literature, corrupt role models


 Acha. Since you can see these flaws of theirs so well, maybe you should aspire to take their place - and do things right? What do you say?


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## skeptik (Nov 1, 2006)

> 2. In the old age they dont have any thing else to do so why not better go to gurdwara.


 HAHA! Yes why go to the gurdawra when you can go to a pub instead. Thats a great point! It never crossed my mind to think this way but you are right ofcourse! 

And as to doing things wrong, praying for forgiveness and asking for material gains, as reason for going to gurdwara well thats fine actually - if a man can go to gurdwara and pray for his own house, or for the benefit of his family then I think he is doing somethign right in bringing his problems to the attention of his Guru. 




> we are accepting the “DEGRADE VERSION” of sikhism without any opposition, I give u an example , i was looking for a girl to get married and found lot of families which says " boy should be gursikh" and when u talk to them they say " All we meant was should be wearing turban and having beard plus non drinker". There is another term coined "boy should be maintaining "Saroop". I cant understand will that make any boy a sikh ? but it is widely accepted.


 Brother, get over it! I am a singh too, I dont see any Kurrian going crazy over me either  Yes that sucks but that is life!  If i were a different man, but still a Singh i could get any girl I wanted. As it happens I am not - but fir ki hogea? As it happens I am glad that there is all this extra pressure on us Singhs not to be Singhs, it gives us the incentive to be better Singhs. Word!




> There are so many saints around in punajb only ( some are international saints i should say).  what this shows ???


 You'd think the world has run out of murderers, rapists, communists, thieves and politicians that we so concerned about them celebrity sant/babe. Btw it seems to me that people have their own sants who they revere, but they look down on other peoples sants. Whats up with that? And yeh iam talking about you gernail singh followers. 




> We are having portraits of our gurus around in gurduwars , in our homes .. what are these ??? who told these are our gurus ... from where these pictures came ???


 Oh fir ki qamaat agii?? Photos have failed Guru Nanak. Please dont be stupid and repeat this again. I implore you.




> People go to Religious places in india ... more of adventure rather then religious purpose ???


 Acha. Why not show us the true religious purpose so we can follow you? But careful that you dont become another sant baba. oh oh 




> At this time only there are so many divisions in sikhs only , from where they came ??? are we doing something about it ??


 Which ones? be specific. 




> I am working in a MNC and people call me sardar ... they dont even have slightest idea what is a sikh ?


 Whats that got to do with anything??! People choose to be ignorant about certain things, thats nothing to do with Sikhi. Sigh.




> if a boy ask his parents that he will not wear turban and want to be clean shaven .... normal response is " Our gurus have given lives because of sikhi and u say it is bourdon ??? " what kind of logic is this ... our gurus haven’t given the lives cause they want to wear turban or they want to keep hairs... it is because of the way of life that they think is perfect and in tune with nature.


 You are wrong about this, and the parents are right. IT has nothing to do with perfection and nature and everything to do with our past history and tradition. Thats where we find meaning for our Kesh and our Dastaar - not in nature or perfection.




> 2. Ladies in sikh families follow sikhism to the extent they feel "OK"... like go to gurdwara ( plus evening walk) , go to kirtan ( plus get together) , do path ( because sikhs do path ) , that's it ...


 Acha una nu jana ni chaida? Please! Let the ladies go to gurdwara and do what they want. No need to pick flaws about them not doing enough. Start with yourself first and foremost.




> 3. Check out gurdwaras abroad ... purpose :


 We are highly successful people. We have a lot of money. We build nice gurdware. Get over it. 




> In villages todays generation hardly prefer to wear turban... u can imagine the scene in cities.


 Doesnt matter. There are plenty of singhs still around. 




> Can u imagine that in todays time if somebody will say that muslims in kashmir or people in assam are having hardships due to terrorism then some sikh youths will go there and fight them and give there lives ... forget about it !! ...


 Whom should they fight? Whom should they give their life against? Before calling for the martrdom of precious sikh munde, you should have good answers to these questions. 




> Punjabi language in todays time is a dead language what all additions in words we did in the last few years ??? and what does this mean ???


 Bizarre.




> Todays generation will firstly ask " why we need religion " before " why we should follow sikhsim".


 Us youngsters are silly, its true. But dont give up on us, and we wont give up on you.


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## Lionchild (Nov 1, 2006)

What needs to be done is teach more from the Guru granth sahib ji, and not just maryada's. We have really become too depended on the rehat maryada, it needs to be second to the guru's knowledge. It also doesnt help that there are so many out there.


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## GURVINDER (Nov 1, 2006)

What Is The Good Suggestioin For Thise


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## Rajwinder (Nov 1, 2006)

Skeptik Ji , 

1. Tusin "Degraded Verison" nu kuch hor samaj gye ... I dont know from where these Gf came in that  ... all i am saying is that if today we accept that a boy hsould wear a turban and that is enough to call him a sikh's son then tommorow even that will go ...

2. About saints u made me follower of gernail singh ... LOL ...  Anyways all i meant was if our gurus told us not to follow any other guru then GGSJ then either they were wrong or we are lost ..

3. Having portriats ... and u said "fer ki qyamat a gayii" that is all i am trying to explain that our gurus studied all the religions and after great thoughts told us not to do these things and today we are saying " fer ki qyamat a gayee " that is all i am afraid of that tommorow  we will start putting idols and then start consulting pandits for furture and then again come to the same point from where our gurus tried to refine ....

4. Paji ur reply on religious places is tooo muchhhh hehehe ...  well now as u have said that i should become baba.. then take my advice ... if u want adventure then nature has got plenty of places for that why to make mockery of these religious places... 

5.  Division in sikhs : Jatt , saini , Chamar , chure , Kamboj , Arora , Namdhari , Neelkhanth , Kahtari .. and guess what some of these have some totally diff views the GGSJ..

6. Well parents are Right "hmmmmmm"  buddy better go through these articles first 

timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/223276.cms
timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/223158.cms
timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/223276.cms

so kids are not following " what is right " so who is responsible parents ???

7. Well about ladies .... again accept them as it is ( Atleast they are doing something right ??? ... well atleast not acceptable to me ... 

8. Well whom they should fight ... ??? well i need to read on this one to chk out how our gurus have selected the people to fight agianst ... give me some time on this one ..

9. "We are highly successful people. We have a lot of money. We build nice gurdware. Get over it. "  U make me laugh  and here comes another comfortable term " Nice Gurdwara " what u think makes a gurdwara nice ???  u have a lot of money and u r highly successfull ...  btw what u think made u highly successfull ??? u r hardwork ???

10 . "Doesnt matter. There are plenty of singhs still around" See again u r almost right but the sentence should be " Doesnt matter. STILL there are plenty of singhs around" and after some time even this still will go ... singhs cant keep sikhi in PUNJAB itself but no worries hmmmm .. grt thoughts ..

Well u know what guys ... this is what i have thought before replying :

First i decided not to reply as it seems arguing with another sikh ... but then i thought that again i am doing a compromise as if i am wrong then proove it with some suitable example or the other should better understand that he is wrong... so bhul chuk maiff even i am from a new generation but i before getting clean shaven i want to explore as there must be something that our gurus tried to gave to us but wouldnt reached atleast to me  ...


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## max314 (Nov 1, 2006)

The fact that you are even discussing this issue means that Guru-ji has not been failed.  For the time being, at least.


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## ajaybills (Sep 28, 2009)

Mr Skeptic is just right Rajwinder. Stop looking outwards, Start looking inwards. Dharam di duniya andar hai Bahar nahin. 
Tenth Guru Nanak ie. Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji has given us a two fold path of Shakti and Bhagti. Improve upon it. forget about others. You will start seeing many sikhs around.


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## ajaybills (Sep 28, 2009)

I will give AN ANSWER FOR HAIR TOMORROW BOSS


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## spnadmin (Sep 28, 2009)

I just had to repeat this ajaybills ji because it is one of the important keys that opens the locked door.
*
Tenth Guru Nanak ie. Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji has given us a two fold path of Shakti and Bhagti. Improve upon it. forget about others. You will start seeing many sikhs around.




* 

Thanks :yes:


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