# Define Pain - The Sikh Response



## Randip Singh (Aug 20, 2008)

Hi Guys,

On another thread a chap talked a lot about pain and inflicting pain etc. He talked  about higher senses and pain, yet what is pain?

I have witnessed people walk on hot coals, smash bricks with heads, people with stab wounds, and none of these people have been in pain.

Yet I have seen people with splinters, or losing a loved one crryin out in terrible pain?

My question is what is pain and what is the Sikh view point on Pain?


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## dalsingh (Aug 20, 2008)

I'm not sure of the answer but attachment may be one part of it.


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## Astroboy (Aug 20, 2008)

Pain can be defined in many ways but nothing comes near experience.


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## Randip Singh (Aug 20, 2008)

So are we saying pain is something subjective i.e. it is relative or specific to a person, and the circumstances?


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## dalsingh (Aug 20, 2008)

Well pain comes in differing forms. There is physical pain i.e being punched in face and there is emotional pain i.e. losing something that you felt close to. 

I would say the latter is more subjective than the former. However even physical pain has a subjective element as what may cause severe physical pain to one person may not have the same effect on another due to biological differences perhaps.

But yes, I think we are on safe grounds to go with pain being somewhat subjective.


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## spnadmin (Aug 21, 2008)

Is there a Sikh point of view on pain? _Dukh _does not in the context of Gurbani refer to physical pain -- or at least in my reading of the shabads it does not. 

Might actually be worthwhile for us  to explore the meanings of _Dukh_ in relation to your question, Randip ji. Members of the medical profession, psychotherapists, neuroscientists, who are also Sikhs, might give some interesting answers. Or maybe not so surprising.


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## Randip Singh (Aug 21, 2008)

Looking back out Sikh warriors they were able to withstand tremendous pain. Is this linked to discipline? or is there a medical explanation for this (eg trauma).


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## Sinister (Aug 21, 2008)

randip singh said:


> Looking back out Sikh warriors they were able to withstand tremendous pain. Is this linked to discipline? or is there a medical explanation for this (eg trauma).


 

A little bit of both discipline and trauma.

There are 3 types of pain somatic, visceral and neuropathic

In battle we are talking about somatic pain which can be the result of the activation of pain receptors that are cutaneous (superfiscial on the body) or musculoskeletal (deep tissues).

Pain is perceived via Nocirecetors (which are slow firing neurons that trigger the parasympathetic 'fight or flight response to stress'…adrenaline is then released by the adrenal gland into the bloodstream…this increases heart rate, awareness and has been shown to short-circuit pain sensation temporarily; by overloading and refocusing the brain on completing specific tasks...achieving safety)

this is why some people, when they are in the heat of a thick battle, can mentally block out the tremendous pain and carry out a task, when they are wounded. (you hear war stories of navy pilots who didn't even feel the pain of a missing arm until they are out of the dog-fight)

The other type of pain is neuropathic pain…when nerves in the central or peripheral nervous system are damaged (stroke, disease can cause chronic neuropathy…unrelated to what you are talking about). 

pain is very unusual
-there are people who can mentally block out pain more than others
especially if they have the mental capacity to refocus their minds on something else (easier said than done...when you're missing an arm). 

-Oddly and rarely, there are actually some people who enjoy pain and get sexually aroused by it. Certain kinds of pain can also become eroticized through their association with sexual pleasure, or in anticipation of it. (dont ask me how i know this :}{}{}


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## Randip Singh (Aug 21, 2008)

haha, nice post. The end was funny.:happy:


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## Astroboy (Aug 21, 2008)

Paulo Coelho:	 	         But there is suffering in life, and there are defeats. No one can avoid them. But it's better to lose some of the battles in the struggles for your dreams than to be defeated without ever knowing what you're fighting for.


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## Saint Soldier (Aug 21, 2008)

:yes:


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## Randip Singh (Aug 21, 2008)

Didn't Nitzche say say "What does not kill us can only make us stronger" ?


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## Sinister (Aug 21, 2008)

randip singh said:


> Didn't Nitzche say say "What does not kill us can only make us stronger" ?


 
yeap that was nietzsche

and it's true...slipping out of extreme stress situation gives us experience, if not a taste of what pain is, also it improves the way we look at life.

which is why older and "seasoned" troops are always more effective in battle. 

everyones quoting someone here, I wanna fit in tooo! 

"Pain is inevitable; suffering is optional"
-Anon


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