# Professor Darshan Singh: RSS Wanted Nanakshai Calendar Changes In 2003



## spnadmin (Jan 5, 2010)

This message was forwarded to me via a mailgroup. 

"Guru Fateh Khalsa Ji,

Prof. Darshan Singh is always alert about the challenges to Sikh Nation. This video is few years old but it shows that Sudarshan kumar chief RSS had intentions to make changes in Nanakshai calander many years back and Singh sahib warned them you can see that in this video."

YouTube- Prof. Darshan Singh Chellange to RSS


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## kds1980 (Jan 5, 2010)

LOL He was sitting with Sarna who is no less corrupt or bad than Badal and also a congress stooge.At that time BJP was at its peak and everybody was thinking that Atal Bihari will win 2004 election.may be he was also doing propaganda for congress so some sikhs would vote for congress


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## spnadmin (Jan 5, 2010)

kanwardeep singh ji

Do you think that sitting with Sarna affected his thought processes? As it turns out, SGPC leadership in the person of Avtar Singh admits that changes are meant to appease Sant Samaj. And RSS has been romancing Sant Samaj for some time now.

Disdain for the Congress Party should not cloud analysis of issues before the panth today. And these controversies - not limited to the calendar controversy - have been building. Links to the "saffron agenda" have been lingering in the background.


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## kds1980 (Jan 5, 2010)

Narayanjot Kaur said:


> kanwardeep singh ji
> 
> Do you think that sitting with Sarna affected his thought processes? As it turns out, SGPC leadership in the person of Avtar Singh admits that changes are meant to appease Sant Samaj. And RSS has been romancing Sant Samaj for some time now.
> 
> Disdain for the Congress Party should not cloud analysis of issues before the panth today. And these controversies - not limited to the calendar controversy - have been building. Links to the "saffron agenda" have been lingering in the background.



Well Sant samaj has its own thinking and they to are responsible for divisions in sikhs.But on the other hand its also true they are quite powerful in sikhism.

Anyway what I don't like from the day one I started doing internet is that fake fear of RSS is incited in sikhs.RSS is coming,RSS is going to destroy sikhs blah blah .The fear is so high among sikhs outside India that anybody who does not agree with their thinking on net is an RSS agent.On the other hand I don't see RSS SUCH A big threat to sikhism.They themselves are very much failure in entire India and despite repeated attempts they were/are not able to convince Indians to vote for them,so why there is so much RSS phobia among sikhs? who is spreading it ? and what is motive behind it that sikhs are afraid of such a failed organisation


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## spnadmin (Jan 5, 2010)

Thanks for the reply



Kanwardeep Singh said:


> Well Sant samaj has its own thinking and they to are responsible for divisions in sikhs.But on the other hand its also true they are quite powerful in sikhism.
> 
> True and they are so powerful that they have managed to manage Badal, unless we want to think that he is not interested in their money and the votes they control.
> 
> ...



This video is dated to 2003 -- when RSS had a much stronger public presence. And that presence was a public image of violence in many instances. 
 
And Sikhs outside of India have more than one legitimate reason to express grave concerns that the face of Sikhism is being changed by SGPC at the behest of Badal and his associates. More than once I have noted that the religious freedom of Sikhs outside of India is less than that of adherents from any other group because Sikhism is now controlled by a political process that is wiping away the unique identity of Sikhi. Who and what is a Sikh? Does the answer depend on Badal? That is only one reason from the high level of distress. What other religion has its doctrines and practices revamped according to the election cycle in another country?


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## kds1980 (Jan 5, 2010)

> This video is dated to 2003 -- when RSS had a much stronger public presence. And that presence was a public image of violence in many instances.
> 
> And Sikhs outside of India have more than one legitimate reason to express grave concerns that the face of Sikhism is being changed by SGPC at the behest of Badal and his associates. More than once I have noted that the religious freedom of Sikhs outside of India is less than that of adherents from any other group because Sikhism is now controlled by a political process that is wiping away the unique identity of Sikhi. Who and what is a Sikh? Does the answer depend on Badal? That is only one reason from the high level of distress. What other religion has its doctrines and practices revamped according to the election cycle in another country?



Narayanjot ji

First of all Badal and co does not decide who and what is a sikh.It is well known fact that Badal was in favour of sehajdhari sikhs recognised but because of pressure from sant samaj
SGPC did not do that.

Secondly I don't know How Badal affect the lives of sikhs outside India.If you are pointing towards Hukamnaama's then I am sorry to say even Gurdwara's in India don't obey them
so Sikhs outside India are free to do what they want.



> What other religion has its doctrines and practices revamped according to the election cycle in another country?



There are 2 points on this I want to say

1)In sikhism there is democracy in Gurdwara's.which other religion hold elections? We all know that democracy is not good in many circumstances.

2)Which other religion has its 99% followers from one ethnicity I think very few so comparision of sikhism with other religions is not O.K.

also many times policies of sikhism will be formed on the basis of where majority live i:e Punjab.Whether the sikhs living in other parts of India or world will like it or not but Truth is numbers hold the power


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## spnadmin (Jan 5, 2010)

Kanwardeep Singh ji

With deep respect I must react, 



Kanwardeep Singh said:


> Narayanjot ji
> 
> First of all Badal and co does not decide who and what is a sikh.
> 
> ...



Raw numbers do not hold the power. The numbers who vote, who organize, who advocate are the ones who exert power. That is in part why the Diaspora is not taking the calendar change passively.


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## Admin (Jan 5, 2010)

Kanwardeep Singh said:


> LOL He was sitting with Sarna who is no less corrupt or bad than Badal and also a congress stooge.At that time BJP was at its peak and everybody was thinking that Atal Bihari will win 2004 election.may be he was also doing propaganda for congress so some sikhs would vote for congress


Dear All

Cool Down! 

What may or may not have been the political scenes in 2003 is we do not know... Let us not get into speculation... 

Even if he may have been invited by Sarna, Prof. Darshan had a specific topic in mind and in this video and he did not deviate from it...  It would be quite interesting as to how Sant Samaj would have dealt with this message from Mr. Sudarshan besides seeking help from likes of deceptive G.S. Lambah & Co.

On a sidenote, even if speech of Prof Darshan may have politically helped Congress to win back a majority in Delhi... its more like favoring the lesser of two evils... rather than completely alienating themselves from Indian political scene altogether, Delhi Sikhs may have found a better political allay in Congress rather than fanatical RSS.

My political sense is poorest of poor. Since 1984, I have voted only once in the Indian political scene and voted for SAD... and they lost... :shock: Politics is such a dirty game after all...

Just my two cents...

Gurfateh!


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## kds1980 (Jan 5, 2010)

> Badal and co may not decide openly who and what is a sikh. Rather they control the SGPC and the Akal Takht who decide what Sikhs should believe, who is a heretic, and the contents of the Sikh Rehat Marayada



Its true that Badal have lot of influence on SGPC



> This says a lot. Badal was openly in favor of sehajdhari sikhs, but behind the scenes he caved to sant samaj. He is a politician. Sant Samaj has votes and cash. If that is not the case then why have there been so many stories of Badal and his courtship of every so many babas in the past year? SGPC does not take any action without Badal's political interests in mind.



How can we say that Badal was behind sant samaj at that time.?Infact it was pro congress DSGPC which was proudly saying that we stopped the entry of sehajdhari sikhs



> That is interesting. Then why have hukamnamas at all. Is it play-acting? If it is play-acting why?



We have hukamnama's because in theory all sects should have to obey it but the problem is that whenever any hukamnama does not suit them they reject it.Meat issue is a classic example of that.Despite pro jhatka hukamnama many sects clearly propagated vegetarianism



> Kanwardeep Singh ji, It is always "OK" to compare religions. Sikhism is compared all the time in this forum, other forums, and in comparative religion



Its ok to compare but we have to look which other religion which we can compare when we
compare functioning of sikhism.Its obvious we cannot compare sikhism with billion plus population religions like islam,christianity and even hinduism.There functioning,problems
are obviously going to be different.You mentioned about elections of one country obviously in these big religions 1 country is not of much importance


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## kds1980 (Jan 5, 2010)

> On a sidenote, even if speech of Prof Darshan may have politically helped Congress to win back a majority in Delhi... its more like favoring the lesser of two evils... rather than completely alienating themselves from Indian political scene altogether, Delhi Sikhs may have found a better political allay in Congress rather than fanatical RSS.



 Aman singh ji I am surprised that you are saying congress as lesser evil even after killing 4000 + sikhs in Delhi .How congress is lesser evil? I think you should visit some indian message boards where people make mockery of sikhs that even after killing 4000 + sikhs they vote for congress and laugh at stupidity of them


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## spnadmin (Jan 5, 2010)

Kanwardeep Singh ji

Here is my dilemma. It is based on several "if" questions.

If the current controversies over the calendar, Professor Darshan Singh, Dasam Granth, etc. were about differences in religious interpretation of the Sikh religion.

If the current controversies were about religious doctrine.

If these controversies were about honest differences in the understanding of scholarly writing, Sikh history, or ways of practicing Sikhism in one tradition versus another.

If these controversies were really about defining Sikhism as a religion. Is it a reconstituted form of Vedanta? Or is it truly unique? 

If we could say yes to any or all of the above "if's" -- then I would listen with sympathetic attention to those with whom I disagree.

But I don't see "yes" answers. To me it looks like political manipulation of the panth for political reasons. Political means used to achieve political ends. And I do not think I am alone.

And honestly I do not understand why Sikhism should be off the table for comparison because of its demographics? 

Aman ji - thanks for the request to cool down.


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## Admin (Jan 5, 2010)

Whatever manner we would like to write the script, the fact, remains that Delhi Sikhs have voted and voted a big time in favour of Congress, who were expected to lose the elections in 2004. Quite interestingly SAD has alliance with BJP... i do not understand Sikh politics at all... :roll: :crazy:


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## Admin (Jan 5, 2010)

Kanwardeep Singh said:


> Aman singh ji I am surprised that you are saying congress as lesser evil even after killing 4000 + sikhs in Delhi .How congress is lesser evil? I think you should visit some indian message boards where people make mockery of sikhs that even after killing 4000 + sikhs they vote for congress and laugh at stupidity of them


Whatever manner we would like to write the script, the fact, remains that Delhi Sikhs have voted and voted a big time in favour of Congress, who were expected to lose the elections in 2004. Quite interestingly SAD has alliance with BJP... i do not understand Sikh politics at all...


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## kds1980 (Jan 5, 2010)

Aman Singh said:


> Whatever manner we would like to write the script, the fact, remains that Delhi Sikhs have voted and voted a big time in favour of Congress, who were expected to lose the elections in 2004. Quite interestingly SAD has alliance with BJP... i do not understand Sikh politics at all...



Even after watching sajjan kumar as outer Delhi candidate, and Tytler as North East Delhi candidate if sikhs still voted for congress then I only have one thing to say that soul of this community is Dead.No self respect is left in 
this community.Is it any wonder that no justice is delivered  in 1984 cases


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## Admin (Jan 5, 2010)

Its all so messed up all around that looking back and reflecting or even trying to pick up and untangle broken threads looks like a Herculean task... We talk of unity, how is that going to ever  happen...


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## kds1980 (Jan 6, 2010)

> And honestly I do not understand why Sikhism should be off the table for comparison because of its demographics?



N.kaur ji

Let me try to explain

If we try to compare china with one of European countries then we can get nowhere.similarly functioning of sikhism at present cannot be compared with other big religions.For example Punjabi,problems of Punjab ,water issue's of Punjab are always a central point on sikh sites ,sikh media.On the other hand have you ever seen that problems of pakistan or bangladesh are anywhere on the islamic site.?They are hardly anywhere because islam is such a big religion that condition of 1 country is not of much concern.on the other hand we are so small that everything related to Punjab become our
central piece of our discussion.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jan 6, 2010)

Here are the people who arranged those changes to the Nanakshahi Calendar..see how low they get in misinterpreting Gurbani...too...

YouTube- Sikhs to support Ram Setu and Ayodhya Ram Mandir


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## satnamr46 (Jan 6, 2010)

Dear Gyani ji,
                        Waheguru ji ka khalsa
                        Waheguru ji ki fateh

                                                     Thanks for this interesting video.I have seen seen it before and meant to import it here but could not do it because of my poor  understandinding of internet technology. This video and the video introduced by Narayanjot  Ji do convey very important messages. It is how Gurbani is being misinterpreted and Bipran ki Reet endorsed so shamelessly and vociferously by the stooges of Saffronista Brigade.

The need is not to pounce upon Prof. Darshan Singh for conveying a message .If what he is saying is in consonance with Gurbani and promotes Sikhs' unique identity,then it needs to be supported.

Guru Nanak started  a Nirmal Panth and It has its own Niyaaraapan  and this uniqueness and novelty of divine message has always been the target of brahamannical forces which appear variously disguised.We need to isolate,identify and confront these foces head on.The message Which Guru Nanak gaveis: AAD SACH, JUGAAD SACH.Let us stay connected to Truth and we will always be in Charhdi Kala. Thanks

Satnam Singh


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## spnadmin (Jan 6, 2010)

satnam singh ji

Thank you for the important reminder. 

*Guru Nanak started a Nirmal Panth and It has its own Niyaaraapan and this uniqueness and novelty of divine message has always been the target of brahamannical forces which appear variously disguised.We need to isolate,identify and confront these foces head on.The message Which Guru Nanak gaveis: AAD SACH, JUGAAD SACH.Let us stay connected to Truth and we will always be in Charhdi Kala. Thanks*

This is why I am a Sikh. I need to be reminded now and then. May I add that when Guru Nanak met a scoundrel he did not look the other way. Wake up Khalsa ji!


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## Admin (Jan 6, 2010)

*Charanjit Singh ji & Singh Sahib, Prof. Darshan Singh ji on Nanakshai Calendar & January 7, 2010.*

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## International Akaali (Jan 6, 2010)

Naranjyot has taken the words out of my mouth. I agree with her 100%. 

I would like to add to this topic, During the Fategarh Sahib political stages displayed by the parties in Punjab, the only words out of avtar singh makkar and badals mouth were Congress are sikhs enemies, Congress are sikh enemies. I have heard this argument thousands of times now. Now if congress is sikhs enemies then ok, but what has badal party done that warrents even one vote for sikh community? They go to Sirsa Sadh who has mocked the khanday thee pahul ceremony of the sikhs. The main thing to look at here is they have a direct alliance with the BJP. The BJP and RSS and both brothers and sisters there is no difference. Kanwardeep Singh you had said there is no influence of RSS in India i tend to disagree because the only reason for the badal party to be in power is because of the alliance with the extremist BJP party unless you beg to differ? 

BJP/RSS - Against Nanakshahi Calender

= BJP and Badal Political Alliance. For badal to stay in power do what BJP/RSS wants

Badal has control of SGPC. Badal chooses jathedar to do his dirty work.

Their is a direct connection between all of them. BJP/Badal parties need votes to get into parliment and thus will grant the wishes of big group of voters like the Sant Samaj. Sant Samaj says, excommunicate Prof Darshan Singh, Change Nanakshahi Calender and eventually change rehit maryada. 

Badal Sarkaar is no different then the Congress Party. Congress party destroyed Sri Akal Takht Sahib, which Badal party is destroying the very foundation of sikh identity from the inside.


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## spnadmin (Jan 6, 2010)

International Akaali ji

I am really very new to these matters, but have been working extra hard to read everything I can about BJP and RSS. And only a few days ago there was a news story about meetings in which BJP was romancing RSS. Whether this was some kind of play acting, how can one know? But it seemed very strange to read about political match-making right in the middle of 4 controversies related to Sikhi.


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## roab1 (Jan 6, 2010)

Neither is RSS and BJP brother and sister nor are they romancing each other. RSS is parent body of BJP. The BJP president is RSS man.  BJP is the political face of RSS. As for congress, well Badal won his first election as a legislator from Congress ticket. He soon realised he won't reach top in congress so slowly took control of Akali Dal and changed it's constituion and became its Master. In the past all Akalis used to fight elections on congress tickets as Akali Dal was only a religious party before Badal changed its constitution to political party. Politics is a dangerous game and Sikhs are paying a price because
1. There is no Unified voice as far as religion is concerned.
2. There is no religious party. Akali Dal was but now it being a political party Sikh institutions are in grave danger.
3. Akali dal has Hindu members too, therefore Akal Takht and SGPC are not under the control of a purely Sikh religious party.

Compare it to RSS and BJP. BJP has members from all walks of life, Hindus, Christians, Muslims, Sikhs. But all control and decision making, regarding Hindutva rests with purely Hindu body, RSS. Now compare with SGPC, a purely Sikh body under the control of a multireligious political party, although Sikhs are a majority in it, whose primary goal is political power and not religious goals.


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## kds1980 (Jan 7, 2010)

> Kanwardeep Singh you had said there is no influence of RSS in India



I haven't said that there is no influence of RSS in India.The only thing I said that RSS is
is very very weak now.they don't have any charashmatic Young leader.Even at the Peak days of RSS/BJP There best performence was 180 seats out of 540 in 98/99 and that too with a person like Atal bihari vajpayee.Even in Haryana elections Badal preferred INLD over BJP because BJP is powerless in Haryana.The question is why we sikhs are so afraid of RSS?


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jan 7, 2010)

Kanwardeep Singh Ji,

SIKHS have no choice but to be "laughed" at !!
YES Congress killed/caused thousands  to be killed....BUT the BJP distributed LADDOOS..read the Advani Book My country my Life !! SO who should the Delhi Sikhs VOTE FOR ?? Laloo ? Mayawati ?? Does Laloo haev undisguised respect/Love for Sikhs ? Does Mayawati love Sikhs more than anyone else ?? (BTW these two are just names i picked up from  a hat...you can name any other leader/s/party/parties that Sikhs can vote for and be NOT LAUGHED AT.

The Laughter is NOT because we are FUNNY..its because in a DEMOCRACY..the BHEDDS..sheep are more valuable due to their NUMBERS..LIONS are LAUGHED AT because when the "Votes" are counted..the Lion gets so FEW that everybody bursts out LAUGHING !!!! sad but a fact of Democracy !!! The Same Bhedds who used to come begging the Lions at MIDNIGHT to go rescue their Daughters form muslim invaders..NOW LAUGH at SARDAR JI BARAAN WAJJ GAYEH !!! AT that time their NUMBERS served for ZERO POWER..and the LION was USEFUL...now its democracy...bheedds have the numbers....thier votes count.."lions" have no value !!

SO YES the SIKHS of DELHI and PUNJAB have to make a difficult choice..either the DEVIL or the SEA....sometimes the DEVIL does get a bit kind in his evil heart...BUT the SEA always remains DEEP !! The Congress Devil did pass water laws to save Punjab..but the SEA has been DROWNING the SIKHS uninterrupted....not a single action of Badal/Bjp has been in favour of SIKHS....not in the last 50 years... The DEVIL demolished the Physicla Akal Takhat (which has been rebuilt and Quite EASILY......BUT the SEA is fast closing OVER the SPIRITUAL AKAL TAKHAT..like the Titanic..that will be an utmost difficult thing to revive it back later ..once the Boa Constrictor swalloes...only a dead body merges after cutting it open...


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jan 7, 2010)

Kanwardeep singh ji..
You are Referring to the "politcial" RSS as a body/party..thoise that wear Khakhi Nickers and carry trishuls and march or hold yoga camps....etc etc...and those that stand for elections as RSS/Bal Thackery shiv sena etc etc......what I and most others refer to are the "Keshadharee Brahmins"...the RSS Types..the Nirmalas, the Saadhs, the Udasees, the Derawallahs..who wear Kesh/dastaars, carry 3 ft kirpans, etc etc BUT DEEP INSIDE are RSS ideology followers...they do SAFFRONISATION of Sikhism....every which way they drag Sikhi /Gurmatt of Guru ji towards Brahminsim...towards Sangrands and pooransmashis..towards Talls and aartees, towards slaughtering goats and Tilaks of blood..towards shubh dins and ashibh dins, towards jnatars, mantars, towards kullnees, and rashis, towards good luck and tweets, towards avoiding Buree Nazar...etc etc pakhands...they want JYOTS burning in the hazree of Jagdee JYOT SGGS...they want Jagdee Jyot SGGS covered with WARM CLOTHES in Winter and cool airr conditioners in summer...thye wnat teerath baths, hardwaar ashes...they want karva chauth fasts, they wnat diwali lakhshmi poojas..deepmallas in Gurdwaras...they wnat TILAKS on their foreheads from hanuman mandirs befoe they matha tek in Gurdwaras...They wnat to interpret RAAM Krishna in SGGS as the Ramchander of Ayudhia..and Krishan of Bindrabann.....and NOT the Akal Purakh as intended by Guru Ji...you get what is really our concerns about "RSS"...????Its the IDEOLOGY !!! infiltrating and saffronisng Gurmatt and its a FACT..not imaginary at all. Thats is why Diaspora Sikhs are aware...and Indian Sikhs are sleeping...the ENEMY of Gurmatt is WITHIN and its roots are in INDIA...and so all we can do is worry and protest....while Indians chide us as unnecessarily worrying !!l


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## spnadmin (Jan 8, 2010)

Here is an interesting reflection on the relationship between RSS, BJP and Akaali Dal.

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/hard-talk/28856-this-above-all-masters-of-doublespeak.html#post118415


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