# Japji Sahib - "Suniai" Is "Listening" - But Much More Than That



## NamHariKaur (Jul 26, 2005)

The first word of most of the lines of the 8th through the 11th Paurees of JapJi is "SUNIAI" - which is translated as "listening" in some places. 

From the rest of the content of those same lines, it is clear that suniai is far more than an English speaking person would call "listening" - or even "good listening."

In my Nitnem book, published in Amritsar India 24th Edition 2004, suniai is translated as "hearing the name of God."

In The Aquarian Times Magazine MSS Guruka Singh Khalsa writes:

"Suni-ai- Listening. Listening is a state of being. It is a state in which we are fully awake and tuned into the myriad of sensory input so that we spontaneously act in harmony with the very flow of life in each moment."

That is a beautiful exposition of the sort of listening that might lead to what is described in JapJi. Perhaps nothing more needs to be said about it. But I am curious, does this exposition emerge from the meaning of suniai to a native Punjabi speaker or would a scholar of the language of the Guru's times give that description of the word sunia?

It is amazing to me that one word could exist that has such a deeply profound meaning. It is often said that Guru Nanak made every effort to write in language which the common people could understand. Does this suggest that people of India in the times of Guru Nanak commonly "listened" with all their being in the way described above by Guruka Singh?

I would love to hear what a native Punjabi speaking person or one who has studied the older version of the language as used in the time of Guru Nanak might be able to tell me about all this.

Thanks!
Nam Hari Kaur, Eugene Oregon


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## Arvind (Jul 26, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Additional frequently occuring words, but perhaps not correctly translated: 

Naam, Amrit, Kirpan, Purakh...


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## truthseeker (Jul 26, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!!

I am currently reading this book that was written by Sant Naranjan Singh Ji. And in his book he says that the explanation of Suniai is beyond words to descibe. He then later in this book tries to defineSuniai as "listening with a one pointed mind" meaning.. listening to the Words of the Guru with out any other other thoughts flowing through your mind.

It is almost like a state of mind i guess... or at least that is what i understood from it. If we can control our mind... then we can finally understand the Paurres of Suniai in Jap Ji Sahib
Correct me if im wrong.
Bhull Cuk Maaf
Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!!!


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## CaramelChocolate (Jul 27, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Yeah I do have issues with some translations, someone sent me English mool mantar kirtan and it went like this:

We are one with God
this is out true identity
doer of everything
beyond fear
beyond revenge
beyond death
image of the infinite
unborn
full of life
the goodest gives
meditate
primal truth
true for all time
true at this instant
o nanak
forever true

While it is very beautiful there is no mention of the naam, the first two lines are way off! Why do they translate so wrongly? Even as a non-sikh with knowledge I can tell that naam means name, why are they saying 'this is our true identity'??


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## Lee (Jul 27, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				CaramelChocolate said:
			
		

> While it is very beautiful there is no mention of the naam, the first two lines are way off! Why do they translate so wrongly? Even as a non-sikh with knowledge I can tell that naam means name, why are they saying 'this is our true identity'??



Hello Cyber Sangat,

Hey CC,

I know what you mean, but I don't think there is any malicious intent in this translation.  Do you not think that if God is 1, then we are also God?

Just a quick question but how would you translate 'Ikonkar sat naam'

Myself I have always thought: '1 God, whose name is true/truth'

Yet what does this mean?  That there is only one God, yeah I can go with that, is Gods actual name True/truth though?  Perhaps not, but if there is only one God, and God is also 1, then does this not mean that God is the whole, that the truth is that all is God, and God is all.

This is the idea I go with, so if that is the case then God is surley our true identity for God is all, and all is God, including us.

This makes the point of religion, not to find God or reach God, but to realise that we are already a part of God.

So although perhaps not a direct translation, the idea is still sound and true.

Cheers,

lee.


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## CaramelChocolate (Jul 27, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Sat sri akaal Lee I agree with you I do not think there is a malicious intent, but they have to be careful as they _maybe_ changing Gurubani without knowing it.
Yes, I am not saying that their interpretation of japji sahib is wrong but I am saying it is not accurate as per Gurubani in my opinion.
I do prefer literal interpretation for example:
Ik ongkaar sat naam - 'One God true name' rather than "there is one universal God whose name is true".
Or jaap sahib where the translations say "salutations to the formless" etc etc... why not just say 'salutations formless'? It seems to me that this would me much more accurate.
This is why it takes MUCH longer to read paath in English...


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## truthseeker (Jul 27, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!

U have to remember that when translating from Panjabi to english.... the sentence may not make sense without adding those extra words. Such as ur example "salutations to the formless" this means that we show respect to the formless God... but if we were to just say " salutations formless" one could misinterpret what that means... to me personally if i were to just read that.. i would think it meant something totally different than what we are actually trying to convey. Like i said b4.. when translating from one language to another... u may need to add those extra words in soo that u can convey the correct message. As for accuracy, yes those extra words do not HAVE to be there.. but then again u have to remember that everyone is at a different level...and maybe they dont even kno what "NAAM' is and need as much help as possible when reading gurbani.

The only thing that does bother me is that.. there are soo many different translations for the same thing. They should have one English translating of all of Gurbani... soo that one does not get confused as to which translation is the most correct of accurate.

Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!!


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## CaramelChocolate (Jul 27, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

TruthSeeker I see your point but even in Punjabi you could say there is a problem of misinterpretation as that is literally what is being said.. why make allowances for English translation? Sure there can be articles written on the meaning but for paath format they should be kept in the translation form not interpretation form otherwise they will take double the time to perform and also it is up to the individual to find the meaning not look at what others think this may mean... Which leads me onto another question, are there any websites online with this type of translation?


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## NamHariKaur (Jul 28, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Sat Nam Ji;

I wish I knew the source of the copy of JapJi that I have. It is a pamphlet given out at our Gurdwara but has no credits given. I like it for the very reason you mention. It has a word for word translation. It also has a sentence-like version with the "extra" words below that. It might take me some weeks to find out where this version came from. I too would like to see jaap sahib and even the SGGS with word-for-word translations included. 
I have not seen anything online with word-for-word translations. Nothing at Sikhnet that I have seen is done that way. 

Nam Hari Kaur, Eugene, Oregon



> TruthSeeker I see your point but even in Punjabi you could say there is a problem of misinterpretation as that is literally what is being said.. why make allowances for English translation? Sure there can be articles written on the meaning but for paath format they should be kept in the translation form not interpretation form otherwise they will take double the time to perform and also it is up to the individual to find the meaning not look at what others think this may mean... *Which leads me onto another question, are there any websites online with this type of translation?*


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## Lee (Jul 28, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Sat sri akkal!

Cc and Namhari Kaur,

Yes you are both correct. I understand the problems with changing Gurbani, but as Namhari Kaur says direct translations between two languages does not take into account differing gramatical rules, and so it is not only possible but probable that the meaning of the text will not properly understood.

Even when we as non Punjabi speakers translate Gurbani for ourselves we have to mix around, add words etc.. for it to make gramtical sense to us.

This is not wrong, it would be more wrong for us to misunderstand, and misinterpret Gurbani.  Which is why we do need the definitive translation;  This I see as job for the Sanagt as a whole.

Cheers,

lee.


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## NamHariKaur (Jul 28, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Sat Nam!
Thank you for your description. That was exactly what I was looking for and hoping/expecting maybe to find. I find that what you have written is much the same as what is called Dhyana in the yoga sutras translated by Patanjali.
Wahe Guru!
Nam Hari Kaur, Eugene, Oregon.


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## Gyani Jarnail Singh (Jul 30, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				truthseeker said:
			
		

> Waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!!
> 
> U have to remember that when translating from Panjabi to english.... the sentence may not make sense without adding those extra words. Such as ur example "salutations to the formless" this means that we show respect to the formless God... but if we were to just say " salutations formless" one could misinterpret what that means... to me personally if i were to just read that.. i would think it meant something totally different than what we are actually trying to convey. Like i said b4.. when translating from one language to another... u may need to add those extra words in soo that u can convey the correct message. As for accuracy, yes those extra words do not HAVE to be there.. but then again u have to remember that everyone is at a different level...and maybe they dont even kno what "NAAM' is and need as much help as possible when reading gurbani.
> 
> ...


 
Waheguru Ji ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji KI fateh.

The reason for thsoe "extra words" that you refer to...are necessary not only becasue it is translating from Punjabi to English...MAINLY thta is because GURBANI IS POETRY...and we translate poetry to ESSAY Form WAARTAK...that means we need a lot more words.

Poetry writers have something called POETIC LICENSE... they can Shorten words even ideas to express in a LIMITED number of words, plus they have to see that it all RHYMES..and an additional burden on Gurbani is that it is POETRY in RAAG...Raag measures put  a further restrain on MEASURED WORDS....and when we transalte it all into English...there is no need for the restrictions of "poetry", raag is out as well and we can use as many as words we like... ITS  A CASE OF "TRANSLATING APPLES TO ORANGES....
Jarnail Singh gyani


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## jagmeet (Jul 31, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				Lee said:
			
		

> Just a quick question but how would you translate 'Ikonkar sat naam'
> 
> Myself I have always thought: '1 God, whose name is true/truth'
> 
> Yet what does this mean?


 
Could it mean '1 God,true is his 'NAAM'---rather than say His name is truth?

I have used 'NAAM' in place of name because I'm not sure if  name is an equivalent of 'NAAM'--as far as I know there are books written describing what 'NAAM' is,so it's not easy to translate or even understand it.

Bhul chuk maaf,
Jagmeet


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## Lee (Aug 2, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				jagmeet said:
			
		

> Could it mean '1 God,true is his 'NAAM'---rather than say His name is truth?
> 
> I have used 'NAAM' in place of name because I'm not sure if name is an equivalent of 'NAAM'--as far as I know there are books written describing what 'NAAM' is,so it's not easy to translate or even understand it.
> 
> ...



Sat sri akaal!

 Jagmeet Ji, Cyber Sangat,

 I understand Jagmeet, much has been written about Naam, yet still we are told that name is a correct translation, if not a full one.

 I think though when it comes to understanding God and Gods plan, then we have to try to communicate our ideas in a way that is not straight forward.

 For example, when you say '1God true is his naam'  What exactly does this mean in this context?  What is Gods naam?

I would suggest that if we take that naam means name, then Gods name is truth?

Now what sort of sense does that make?  Not that much until you get to thinking about the rest of the sentance.

Iknokar, satnaam.

1 God who is truth.  I.E.  The 1 God, the creator, is truth, all else is false.

So in this case, naam is being used both as Gods name, and as a discriptive label for what God is.  Remember the way we learn about things is to label them.

God is not only true, but Gods truth is the only truth, because as we are told ikonkar 1 God = 1 truth.  So could we say that naam has multiple meanings, and that the direct translation of name, is but touching upon the surface?

Cheers,

Lee.


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## CaramelChocolate (Aug 2, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Lee I agree, essentially Waheguru is nameless, Waheguru is simply used for praise and from what I understand satnaam actually means that the name Waheguru is true, true meaning the most true praise, the meaning behind it is true [wow enlightener or wonderful Lord]. I know in Sikhism God is nameless as it is written in Jaap Sahib.
So Waheguru is essentially a praise, also to allow Sikhs so discuss God... if we took this literally and we treated God as nameless it would be hard to ever discuss him right??? It also helps give Sikhism a disctinct culture and image as Muslims have Allah Hindus have Raam etc. etc.


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## Lee (Aug 2, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				CaramelChocolate said:
			
		

> Lee I agree, essentially Waheguru is nameless, Waheguru is simply used for praise and from what I understand satnaam actually means that the name Waheguru is true, true meaning the most true praise, the meaning behind it is true [wow enlightener or wonderful Lord]. I know in Sikhism God is nameless as it is written in Jaap Sahib.
> So Waheguru is essentially a praise, also to allow Sikhs so discuss God... if we took this literally and we treated God as nameless it would be hard to ever discuss him right??? It also helps give Sikhism a disctinct culture and image as Muslims have Allah Hindus have Raam etc. etc.



Hey CC,

Yes I agree, as I say we as humans need to label things to enable us to learn about them, and also as you point out to communicate our ideas.

What you say about Satnaam meaning the name Waheguru is true is interesting, I have not thought about it that way before.  
If we then conbine this with my previous thoughts, then we get the idea that not only is God true, but that wonderous enlightener is also true, and also that waheguru is the true enlightnener, so God is true, and is our truth, and our way to truth.

Heh Supperb!

Cheers,

lee.


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## Arvind (Aug 2, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				CaramelChocolate said:
			
		

> Lee I agree, essentially Waheguru is nameless, Waheguru is simply used for praise and from what I understand satnaam actually means that the name Waheguru is true, true meaning the most true praise, the meaning behind it is true [wow enlightener or wonderful Lord]. I know in Sikhism God is nameless as it is written in Jaap Sahib.
> So Waheguru is essentially a praise, also to allow Sikhs so discuss God... if we took this literally and we treated God as nameless it would be hard to ever discuss him right??? It also helps give Sikhism a disctinct culture and image as Muslims have Allah Hindus have Raam etc. etc.


This sounds so concise and right.


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## jagmeet (Aug 6, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

Could I say the following:-
Since 'Satnaam' appears after the kaar,it probably means that God is in the form of 'naam'(which is 'sat' or true) in this universe.This 'naam' is some subtle vibration that pervades the whole universe.I don't remember where I read the analogy with vibration.
Also see the following article in Gurmat Prakash:-
http://www.sgpc.net/gurmat_parkash/gurmatparkash.asp?id=385

Bhul chuk maaf.
Jagmeet


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## Lee (Aug 15, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				jagmeet said:
			
		

> Could I say the following:-
> Since 'Satnaam' appears after the kaar,it probably means that God is in the form of 'naam'(which is 'sat' or true) in this universe.This 'naam' is some subtle vibration that pervades the whole universe.I don't remember where I read the analogy with vibration.
> Also see the following article in Gurmat Prakash:-
> http://www.sgpc.net/gurmat_parkash/gurmatparkash.asp?id=385
> ...



I'm afraid I don't know what kaar means?

That naam can be equated as vibration is also very interesting in light of string theory.

Cheers,

lee.


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## jagmeet (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

If you look at the shape of 'oankaar' carefully,it is modified from gurmukhi's first alphabet 'uuda'--the modification is the addition of 'kaar' to it.'kaar' (as far as I know) means creation---so the God is in his creation as well(as independent of it).Or perhaps one could say that when God created this universe,he transformed himself to be present in his creation.

May be some learned person in these forums can correct me if I am wrong(which I probably am) and throw more light on this.

Bhul chuk maaf,
Jagmeet


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## Lee (Aug 16, 2005)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



			
				jagmeet said:
			
		

> If you look at the shape of 'oankaar' carefully,it is modified from gurmukhi's first alphabet 'uuda'--the modification is the addition of 'kaar' to it.'kaar' (as far as I know) means creation---so the God is in his creation as well(as independent of it).Or perhaps one could say that when God created this universe,he transformed himself to be present in his creation.
> 
> May be some learned person in these forums can correct me if I am wrong(which I probably am) and throw more light on this.
> 
> ...



Jagmeet, Cyber Sangat,

This seems correct to me, also to touch upon God's presence within and without the universe.  I always thought that before the universe, there was only God, and when God made the universe God made it out of God.

So in a very real sense, the universe can be said to be at least in part the body of God?

Cheers,

lee.


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## kaur-1 (Oct 15, 2006)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

I just came across this article on  SikhSpectrum.com Quarterly               Issue No.25, August 2006

Concept of Sünya (Sünn) ) in Aad Guru Granth Sahib *By Hardev Singh Virk* 

As the article has copyright attached, I will provide the link only.

Concept of Sünya (Sünn) ) in Aad Guru Granth Sahib


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## kaur-1 (Jan 25, 2008)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



jagmeet said:


> Could I say the following:-
> Since 'Satnaam' appears after the kaar,it probably means that God is in the form of 'naam'(which is 'sat' or true) in this universe.This 'naam' is some subtle vibration that pervades the whole universe.I don't remember where I read the analogy with vibration.
> Also see the following article in Gurmat Prakash:-
> Online Gurdwara Publications, Punjabi Religious Publications, Religious Publications Online, Sikh Religious Publications, Online Free Publications, India
> ...



Yes it does make sense. It also follows on to why we are asked how to be truthful ( + truthful living..) and how to 'discover and obtain' naam ie by "gur kai sabadh veechaaraa" (Ang 754) as Gurbani is based on the truth "Satgur ki bani sat sat kar jaanuh gur sekhuh Har Karta aap muhuh kadhaa-ay" (Ang 308)

quote: 'His name is the Truth – Satnaam. Only God and His name are for ever. Everything else in this world is short lived'


                                                    ***********

Re: Suneea. Suneea in punjabi to listen or listening but we must do with Surtee is my understanding.

Vaaran Bhai Gurdas :Vaar15Pauri16:SearchGurbani.com

                    Vaar 15 Pauri 16 Guru-Disiple and disciple-Guru
                    ਰਤਨਾ ਦੇਖੈ ਸਭੁ ਕੋ ਰਤਨ ਪਾਰਖੂ ਵਿਰਲਾ ਕੋਈ । 
ratanaa daykhai sabhu ko ratan paarakhoo viralaa koee|
The jewels are beholden by all but the jeweller is any rare one who test checks the jewels.
ਰਾਗ ਨਾਦ ਸਭ ਕੋ ਸੁਣੈ *ਸਬਦ ਸੁਰਤਿ *ਸਮਝੈ ਵਿਰਲੋਈ । 
raag naad sabh ko sunai *sabad surati samajhai viraloee*|
All listen to the melody and rhythm but a rare one understands the mystery of Word consciousness,

  ਗੁਰਸਿਖ ਰਤਨ ਪਦਾਰਥਾ ਸਾਧਸੰਗਤਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਮਾਲ ਪਰੋਈ । 
gurasikh ratan padaaradaa saadhasangati mili maal paroee|
The Sikhs of the Guru are pearls who are strung in the garland in the form of congregation.
ਹੀਰੈ ਹੀਰਾ ਬੇਧਿਆ ਸਬਦ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਮਿਲਿ ਪਰਚਾ ਹੋਈ । 
heerai heeraa baydhiaa *sabad surati mili parachaa hoee*|
Only his consciousness remains merged in the Word whose mind diamond remains cut by the diamond of* Word, the Guru*.
 ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਪੂਰਨ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਵਿੰਦੁ ਸਿਾਣੈ ਸੋਈ । 
* paarabrahamu pooran brahamu guru govindu siaanai soee|*
The fact that the transcendental Brahm is the prefect Brahm and the Guru is God, is only identified by a gurmukh, the Guru-orientated one.
 ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਸੁਖਫਲੁ ਸਹਜਿ ਘਰੁ ਪਿਰਮ ਪਿਆਲਾ ਜਾਣੁ ਜਣੋਈ । 
* guramukhi sukhadhalu sahaji gharu piram piaalaa jaanu janoee*|
Only gurmukhs enter the abode of inner knowledge to attain fruits of delight and only they know the delight of the cup of love and make others also know it.

 ਗੁਰੁ ਚੇਲਾ ਚੇਲਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਹੋਈ ॥੧੬॥ 
guru chaylaa chaylaa guru hoee ॥16॥
Then the Guru and the disciple become identical.


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## jagmeet (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

What is sabad surati?

What is naam?

I know these are difficult to answer questions,but I hope some enlightened soul(s) here shed some light.


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## Astroboy (Jan 26, 2008)

Malār mehlā 1. 
Malaar, First Mehl: 

ਜਿਨਿ ਧਨ ਪਿਰ ਕਾ ਸਾਦੁ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਸਾ ਬਿਲਖ ਬਦਨ ਕੁਮਲਾਨੀ ॥ 
जिनि धन पिर का सादु न जानिआ सा बिलख बदन कुमलानी ॥ 
Jin ḏẖan pir kā sāḏ na jāni&shy;ā sā bilakẖ baḏan kumlānī. 
The soul-bride who has not known delight with her Husband Lord, shall weep and wail with a wretched face. 

ਭਈ ਨਿਰਾਸੀ ਕਰਮ ਕੀ ਫਾਸੀ ਬਿਨੁ ਗੁਰ ਭਰਮਿ ਭੁਲਾਨੀ ॥੧॥ 
भई निरासी करम की फासी बिनु गुर भरमि भुलानी ॥१॥ 
Bẖa&shy;ī nirāsī karam kī fāsī bin gur bẖaram bẖulānī. ||1|| 
She becomes hopeless, caught in the noose of her own karma; without the Guru, she wanders deluded by doubt. ||1|| 

ਬਰਸੁ ਘਨਾ ਮੇਰਾ ਪਿਰੁ ਘਰਿ ਆਇਆ ॥ 
बरसु घना मेरा पिरु घरि आइआ ॥ 
Baras gẖanā mėrā pir gẖar ā&shy;i&shy;ā. 
So rain down, O clouds. My Husband Lord has come home. 

ਬਲਿ ਜਾਵਾਂ ਗੁਰ ਅਪਨੇ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਮ ਜਿਨਿ ਹਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਆਣਿ ਮਿਲਾਇਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
बलि जावां गुर अपने प्रीतम जिनि हरि प्रभु आणि मिलाइआ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
Bal jāvāŉ gur apnė parīṯam jin har parabẖ āṇ milā&shy;i&shy;ā. ||1|| rahā&shy;o. 
I am a sacrifice to my Guru, who has led me to meet my Lord God. ||1||Pause|| 

ਨਉਤਨ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਸਦਾ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਸਿਉ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਭਗਤਿ ਸੁਹਾਵੀ ॥ 
नउतन प्रीति सदा ठाकुर सिउ अनदिनु भगति सुहावी ॥ 
Na&shy;uṯan parīṯ saḏā ṯẖākur si&shy;o an&shy;ḏin bẖagaṯ suhāvī. 
My love, my Lord and Master is forever fresh; I am embellished with devotional worship night and day. 

ਮੁਕਤਿ ਭਏ ਗੁਰਿ ਦਰਸੁ ਦਿਖਾਇਆ ਜੁਗਿ ਜੁਗਿ ਭਗਤਿ ਸੁਭਾਵੀ ॥੨॥ 
मुकति भए गुरि दरसु दिखाइआ जुगि जुगि भगति सुभावी ॥२॥ 
Mukaṯ bẖa&shy;ė gur ḏaras ḏikẖā&shy;i&shy;ā jug jug bẖagaṯ subẖāvī. ||2|| 
I am liberated, gazing on the Blessed Vision of the Guru's Darshan. Devotional worship has made me glorious and exalted throughout the ages. ||2|| 

ਹਮ ਥਾਰੇ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣ ਜਗੁ ਤੁਮਰਾ ਤੂ ਮੇਰਾ ਹਉ ਤੇਰਾ ॥ 
हम थारे त्रिभवण जगु तुमरा तू मेरा हउ तेरा ॥ 
Ham thārė ṯaribẖavaṇ jag ṯumrā ṯū mėrā ha&shy;o ṯėrā. 
I am Yours; the three worlds are Yours as well. You are mine, and I am Yours. 

ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਮਿਲਿਐ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਪਾਇਆ ਬਹੁਰਿ ਨ ਭਵਜਲਿ ਫੇਰਾ ॥੩॥ 
सतिगुरि मिलिऐ निरंजनु पाइआ बहुरि न भवजलि फेरा ॥३॥ 
Saṯgur mili&shy;ai niranjan pā&shy;i&shy;ā bahur na bẖavjal fėrā. ||3|| 
Meeting with the True Guru, I have found the Immaculate Lord; I shall not be consigned to this terrifying world-ocean ever again. ||3|| 

ਅਪੁਨੇ ਪਿਰ ਹਰਿ ਦੇਖਿ ਵਿਗਾਸੀ ਤਉ ਧਨ ਸਾਚੁ ਸੀਗਾਰੋ ॥ 
अपुने पिर हरि देखि विगासी तउ धन साचु सीगारो ॥ 
Apunė pir har ḏėkẖ vigāsī ṯa&shy;o ḏẖan sācẖ sīgāro. 
If the soul-bride is filled with delight on seeing her Husband Lord, then her decorations are true. 

ਅਕੁਲ ਨਿਰੰਜਨ ਸਿਉ ਸਚਿ ਸਾਚੀ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਧਾਰੋ ॥੪॥ 
अकुल निरंजन सिउ सचि साची गुरमति नामु अधारो ॥४॥ 
Akul niranjan si&shy;o sacẖ sācẖī gurmaṯ nām aḏẖāro. ||4|| 
With the Immaculate Celestial Lord, she becomes the truest of the true. Following the Guru's Teachings, she leans on the Support of the Naam. ||4|| 

ਮੁਕਤਿ ਭਈ ਬੰਧਨ ਗੁਰਿ ਖੋਲ੍ਹ੍ਹੇ ਸਬਦਿ ਸੁਰਤਿ ਪਤਿ ਪਾਈ ॥ 
मुकति भई बंधन गुरि खोल्हे सबदि सुरति पति पाई ॥ 
Mukaṯ bẖa&shy;ī banḏẖan gur kẖolĥė sabaḏ suraṯ paṯ pā&shy;ī. 
She is liberated; the Guru has untied her bonds. Focusing her awareness on the Shabad, she attains honor. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਰਿਦ ਅੰਤਰਿ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਮੇਲਿ ਮਿਲਾਈ ॥੫॥੪॥ 
नानक राम नामु रिद अंतरि गुरमुखि मेलि मिलाई ॥५॥४॥ 
Nānak rām nām riḏ anṯar gurmukẖ mėl milā&shy;ī. ||5||4|| 
O Nanak, the Lord's Name is deep within her heart; as Gurmukh, she is united in His Union. ||5||4|| 
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Jagmeet ji,

The closest thing to your physical body is your heart beat and your swaas (breathing).

The closest thing to Soul (our real self) is Naam which is the Celestial Music we (souls) hear. Our individuality as a separate soul still remains even after physical death because beyond the physical are other dimensions life. Life after death of the physical body continues but it is not merger with God. Our physical existence has the shortest span while our emotional body (also known as Astral body) continues its existence without changing into another astral body. Merger with God is not possible until impurities of the mind are reduced to a merger level. That's when HIS grace does the merger. 

If one does not hear the Anhad Dhun, it doesn't mean it isn't here. 

Just like the heart beats because it is made from the body or part of the embryo developed into an organ, so is Soul developed from the nourishment of the Celestial Music. Without the wisdom of Guru Ji, soul development can take ages. Guru Ji's wisdom quickens the process of merger with God. 

Why does everyone stick with the same story when explaining spiritual matters? 
That because it has gained a wider acceptance level. But reality and theory differ way too widely. Spiritual wisdom cannot be put into words. Only can be experienced. 

When you have trained yourself to hear the Anhad Dhun (Naam) it will take you in stages of realization and one such stage is that this sound current is not just heard but also part of you without which soul cannot exist in the worlds of separation (from God).


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## Sardara123 (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



jagmeet said:


> What is sabad surati?
> 
> What is naam?
> 
> I know these are difficult to answer questions,but I hope some enlightened soul(s) here shed some light.


 






If you are looking for materialistic logics to argue about these terms, then - Sorry

BUT If you have some respect for Gurbani – Guru Granth, then – You have to become a Gurmukh to find the answer to these terms as it is akath ki katha. Gurbani is the only answer for a GurSikh. 

Awsw mhlw 4 ]
ihrdY suix suix min AMimRqu BwieAw ]
gurbwxI hir AlKu lKwieAw ]1]



Constantly listening to the Ambrosial Gurbani in the heart, it becomes pleasing to the mind.​ 

Through Gurbani, the Incomprehensible Lord is comprehended. ​ 



iqsu rUpu n ryiKAw Git Git dyiKAw gurmuiK AlKu lKwvixAw ]1] rhwau ]

He has no form or shape; He is seen within each and every heart. The Gurmukh comes to know the unknowable. ||1||Pause|| Ang:129



Git Git hir pRBu eyko suAwmI gurmuiK AlKu lKwieAw ]
The One Lord God, the Master, is in each and every heart; the Gurmukh sees the unseen. Ang:772




iqsu rUpu n ryK Aidstu Agocru gurmuiK AlKu lKwieAw ]
He has no form or shape; He is unseen and unknown. The Gurmukh sees the unseen Lord. Ang:448



How one becomes a Gurmukh: By Obeying the Guru, I hope that don’t need any further explanations.


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## spnadmin (Jan 26, 2008)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*

dUir prwieE mn kw ibrhw qw mylu kIE myrY rwjn ]3] 
[FONT=Tahoma,Verdana,Arial]_door paraa-i-o man kaa birhaa taa mayl kee-o mayrai raajan. ||3|| 
_[/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Tahoma,Arial]_When the sense of separation was removed from my mind, then I was united with the Lord, my King. ||3||_[/FONT]

ibnisE FITw AMimRqu vUTw sbdu lgo gur mITw ] 
[FONT=Tahoma,Verdana,Arial]_binsi-o dheethaa amrit voothaa sabad lago gur meethaa. 
_[/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Tahoma,Arial]_My stubbornness is gone, Ambrosial Nectar rains down, and the Word of the Guru’s Shabad is sweet and pleasing to me._[/FONT]

jil Qil mhIAil srb invwsI nwnk rmeIAw fITw ]4]3] 
[FONT=Tahoma,Verdana,Arial]_jal thal mahee-al sarab nivaasee naanak rama-ee-aa deethaa. ||4||3|| 
_[/FONT][FONT=Georgia,Tahoma,Arial]_He is pervading everywhere, in the water, on the land and in the sky; Nanak beholds the all-pervading Lord. ||4||3||

_(Bani of Guru Arjan Dev ji; SGGS; Ang 671)[/FONT]


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## jagmeet (Jan 27, 2008)

namjap said:


> Malār mehlā 1.
> Malaar, First Mehl:
> 
> ਜਿਨਿ ਧਨ ਪਿਰ ਕਾ ਸਾਦੁ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਸਾ ਬਿਲਖ ਬਦਨ ਕੁਮਲਾਨੀ ॥
> ...


 
Thank you (and others)  for the answer(s).To be able to get god's grace and hear the naam(anhad dhun as you say)  should one do repetition of God's name(is this different from naam?)--or something else also?

Pl. shed some more light on sabad surati.


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## kaur-1 (Jan 27, 2008)

I remember these words used alot "surt , surtee and dhian.." by my parents when we were young and doing our homework etc.. he he

Punjabi Dictionary : SURT

consciousness, awareness, understanding, mental activity or functioning, sanity, attention;power of reflection and recollection, memory


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## spnadmin (Jan 27, 2008)

jagmeet ji

Do not despair. The discussion of "surt" is hard to follow for me too. Very mystical, very subjective. There are people who have written page upon page about this, and how to "pull in the surt." What to do. Why to do it. The right way to do it. What happens if you do it. 

You may just have to "experience" it once to understand it for yourself. It may be that "surt" is one of those things that reading and writing make even harder to understand. Making it too theoretical. Perhaps it is a more natural process--  Like getting the butter-fly stroke right for the first time when swimming -- and then you don't have to think about it again.


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## BhagatSingh (Jan 27, 2008)

*Re: Japji Sahib - Suniai "Listening" - but much more than that*



Lee said:


> Jagmeet, Cyber Sangat,
> 
> This seems correct to me, also to touch upon God's presence within and without the universe.  I always thought that before the universe, there was only God, and when God made the universe God made it out of God.
> 
> ...


well, bani also says God is formless. What kind of things are formless? feelings, ideas, relations, etc. So God is this idea/feeling/relation?


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