# Answering The Wrong Doubts About Bani Onto Tenth Master



## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

Gurfateh  Gurfateh

You say Tatta for Tainka and then you say you say huge {censored} for appeling women. You said huge (due to lots of intercrouses and) {censored} (Slang of punks from where We are all born).

Anyway is this term not menitoned in Guru Granth Sahib ie place from where we come. Will some someone wrtie it over there?

So das does the work by mercy of Bhagaouti.,who is Mahakal and who is Kalaka and who is Akal.
Chariter 20 78

You have drugged your self rather in ego and fear of Hindus.

It is from 21st,22nd and 23rd Chaectors.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*


Anandpur had been just settles so how could so many prostitutes come there?
If Gangu can come there inpersonatiin as good cook then why canot otheer people come.But where is term Prostitute been writtan even once?

Say if some lady tires to indulge in adulatry due to Pagan  influence while entering as decent lady how can pure minded Sikhs imagine such thing.Just as they are not ******* like you.

At start of 21 Charitar lady is termed as wife of wealthy.So as per your logic all wives of wealth are protiture including mother of das.Well are your father also wealthy?

Anandpur was a place of worship and the character of Sikhs was well known to everyone, then how did the prostitute think of finding work in a place like that? 
 
There is no prositure but wife of rich who after entering Anandpur sahib wants to comit dualtray with Guru.If Pama or Parmanada can come in and think of wrong about Langer(as he finds its anti caste)and incite Hindu kings, so is not he more then lady  trying to comit adultery.

According to the chariters Guru Ji is a worshipper of Bhagauti. Is this not vipran kee reet? Even if Bhagauti is translated as God, why did Guru Ji went to learn Bhagauti mantar? Wasn’t Guru Ji a complete Guru? 
 
If Wahiguru is God and Bhauti is God then what why should not there be Manter in Gurmat.

Wahiguru is Gurmanter,Then we have Mool Mantra and  as per Bhai Daya Sngh JI Beej Mantra is Sat Sri Akal.

In fact to utter disgusting false propogand by you.In 21st Character,Guru in order to get Mantra did Bhaguti Manana and not Mantra.That is a sort of request to Bhaguti.What is our Ardas?Prtham Bhagouti Simar Kai..

Why go to learn mantras if Guru Ji had straight communication with God? 
 
This shows you lack in vocabulary,Mantra also means plan.Mantrana means consultation.Mantiri is a consular and final draft is Matta.Have you not heard of Gurmata..
ਪੰਨਾ 1165, ਸਤਰ 9
ਦੁਸਟ ਸਭਾ ਮਿਲਿ ਮੰਤਰ ਉਪਾਇਆ ਕਰਸਹ ਅਉਧ ਘਨੇਰੀ ॥
दुसट सभा मिलि मंतर उपाइआ करसह अउध घनेरी ॥
dusat sabhaa mil mantar upaa-i-aa karsah a-oDh ghanayree.
The council of villains met and resolved to send Prahlaad into the life hereafter.
ਭਗਤ ਨਾਮਦੇਵ ਜੀ   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*

Man in Guru Granth Sahib there are 74 times term Mantra comes.

Das brings in here only 30.
Page 51, Line 4
ਦੁਖੁ ਕਲੇਸੁ ਨ ਭਉ ਬਿਆਪੈ ਗੁਰ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਹੋਇ ॥
दुखु कलेसु न भउ बिआपै गुर मंत्रु हिरदै होइ ॥
dukh kalays na bha-o bi-aapai gur mantar hirdai ho-ay.
Suffering, agony and fear do not cling to one whose heart is filled with the GurMantra.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 95, Line 4
ਮੈ ਅਉਖਧੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦੀਜੈ ਗੁਰ ਪੂਰੇ ਮੈ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮਿ ਉਧਰੀਐ ਜੀਉ ॥੩॥
मै अउखधु मंत्रु दीजै गुर पूरे मै हरि हरि नामि उधरीऐ जीउ ॥३॥
mai a-ukhaDh mantar deejai gur pooray mai har har naam uDhree-ai jee-o. ||3||
So give me the medicine, the Mantra of the Perfect Guru. Through the Name of the Lord, Har, Har, I am saved. ||3||
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 130, Line 19
ਸਾਧ ਜਨਾ ਕਾ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਕਮਾਏ ॥
साध जना का मंत्रु कमाए ॥
saaDh janaa kaa mantar kamaa-ay.
They practice the Mantra of the Holy.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 156, Line 3
ਅਉਖਧ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਮੂਲੁ ਮਨ ਏਕੈ ਜੇ ਕਰਿ ਦ੍ਰਿੜੁ ਚਿਤੁ ਕੀਜੈ ਰੇ ॥
अउखध मंत्र मूलु मन एकै जे करि द्रिड़ु चितु कीजै रे ॥
a-ukhaDh mantar mool man aikai jay kar darirh chit keejai ray.
O mind, there is only the One medicine, mantra and healing herb - center your consciousness firmly on the One Lord.
*Guru Nanak Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 171, Line 1
ਗੁਰੁ ਪੂਰਾ ਪਾਇਆ ਵਡਭਾਗੀ ਹਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦੀਆ ਮਨੁ ਠਾਢੇ ॥੧॥
गुरु पूरा पाइआ वडभागी हरि मंत्रु दीआ मनु ठाढे ॥१॥
gur pooraa paa-i-aa vadbhaagee har mantar dee-aa man thaadhay. ||1||
I have found the Perfect Guru, through great good fortune; He has given me the Mantra of the Lord's Name, and my mind has become quiet and tranquil. ||1||
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 184, Line 19
ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਤੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਅਉਖਧੁ ਪੁਨਹਚਾਰੁ ॥
मंत्रु तंत्रु अउखधु पुनहचारु ॥
mantar tantar a-ukhaDh punahchaar.
Mantras, tantras, all-curing medicines and acts of atonement,
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 186, Line 7
ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਚਿਤਾਰਿ ॥
कहु नानक गुर मंत्रु चितारि ॥
kaho naanak gur mantar chitaar.
Says Nanak, remember the GurMantra;
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 188, Line 8
ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥
कहु नानक गुरि मंत्रु द्रिड़ाइआ ॥
kaho naanak gur mantar drirh-aa-i-aa.
Says Nanak, the GurMantra has been implanted within me;
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 190, Line 9
ਹਰਿ ਕਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਦੀਓ ਗੁਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ॥
हरि का नामु दीओ गुरि मंत्रु ॥
har kaa naam dee-o gur mantar.
The Guru has given me the Mantra of the Name of the Lord.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 196, Line 1
ਅਉਖਧ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਤੰਤ ਸਭਿ ਛਾਰੁ ॥
अउखध मंत्र तंत सभि छारु ॥
a-ukhaDh mantar tant sabh chhaar.
All medicines and remedies, mantras and tantras are nothing more than ashes.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 196, Line 4
ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦੀਓ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮ ॥
सतिगुरि मंत्रु दीओ हरि नाम ॥
satgur mantar dee-o har naam.
The True Guru has given me the Mantra of the Lord's Name.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 211, Line 14
ਜਾ ਕਉ ਗੁਰੁ ਹਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦੇ ॥
जा कउ गुरु हरि मंत्रु दे ॥
jaa ka-o gur har mantar day.
Those unto whom the Guru gives the Mantra of the Lord's Name,
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 236, Line 12
ਜਿਸ ਕੈ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦੇ ਹਰੀ ॥
जिस कै हिरदै मंत्रु दे हरी ॥
jis kai hirdai mantar day haree.
within whose hearts the Lord has implanted His Mantra.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 257, Line 19
ਨਾਮੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਗੁਰਿ ਦੀਨੋ ਜਾ ਕਹੁ ॥
नामु मंत्रु गुरि दीनो जा कहु ॥
naam mantar gur deeno jaa kaho.
who have been given the Mantra of the Naam by the Guru.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 274, Line 16
ਬੀਜ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਰਬ ਕੋ ਗਿਆਨੁ ॥
बीज मंत्रु सरब को गिआनु ॥
beej mantar sarab ko gi-aan.
The Beej Mantra, the Seed Mantra, is spiritual wisdom for everyone.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 284, Line 2
ਤਿਸ ਕਾ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਨ ਜਾਨੈ ਹੋਰੁ ॥
तिस का मंत्रु न जानै होरु ॥
tis kaa mantar na jaanai hor.
No one else knows the mystery of His ways.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 287, Line 7
ਪੂਰਾ ਗੁਰੁ ਅਖ੍ਯ੍ਯਓ ਜਾ ਕਾ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ॥
पूरा गुरु अख्यओ जा का मंत्र ॥
pooraa gur akh-ya-o jaa kaa mantar.
The Guru is perfect; His Teachings are everlasting.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 371, Line 10
ਗੁਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਮੋਹਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥
गुरि हरि हरि नामु मोहि मंत्रु द्रिड़ाइआ ॥
gur har har naam mohi mantar drirh-aa-i-aa.
The Guru has implanted the Mantra of the Lord's Name, Har, Har, within me.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 377, Line 19
ਜੋ ਇਹੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਕਮਾਵੈ ਨਾਨਕ ਸੋ ਭਉਜਲੁ ਪਾਰਿ ਉਤਾਰੀ ॥੩॥੨੮॥
जो इहु मंत्रु कमावै नानक सो भउजलु पारि उतारी ॥३॥२८॥
jo ih mantar kamaavai naanak so bha-ojal paar utaaree. ||3||28||
One who practices this Mantra, O Nanak, swims across the terrifying world-ocean. ||3||28||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 382, Line 17
ਸੁਖ ਨਿਧਾਨ ਨਾਮੁ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਤੁਮਰਾ ਏਹੁ ਅਬਿਨਾਸੀ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਲੀਓ ॥
सुख निधान नामु प्रभ तुमरा एहु अबिनासी मंत्रु लीओ ॥
sukh niDhaan naam parabh tumraa ayhu abhinaasee mantar lee-o.
Your Name, O God, is the treasure of peace; I have received this everlasting Mantra.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 384, Line 4
ਮਹਾ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਗੁਰ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਬਸਿਓ ਅਚਰਜ ਨਾਮੁ ਸੁਨਿਓ ਰੀ ॥੩॥
महा मंत्रु गुर हिरदै बसिओ अचरज नामु सुनिओ री ॥३॥
mahaa mantar gur hirdai basi-o achraj naam suni-o ree. ||3||
The Guru has implanted the Maha Mantra, the Great Mantra, within my heart, and I have heard the wondrous Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||3||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 387, Line 6
ਮਨਿ ਆਨੰਦੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਗੁਰਿ ਦੀਆ ॥
मनि आनंदु मंत्रु गुरि दीआ ॥
man aanand mantar gur dee-aa.
My mind is filled with bliss, since the Guru gave me the Mantra of the Lord's Name.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 399, Line 13
ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪੇ ਜਪਿ ਜੀਵਣਾ ਗੁਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਇਆ ॥੧॥
नामु जपे जपि जीवणा गुरि मंत्रु द्रिड़ाइआ ॥१॥
naam japay jap jeevnaa gur mantar drirh-aa-i-aa. ||1||
I live by chanting and meditating on the Naam. The Guru has implanted this Mantra within me. ||1||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 447, Line 16
ਗੁਰੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਦ੍ਰਿੜਾਏ ਹਰਿ ਰਸਕਿ ਰਸਾਏ ਹਰਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਹਰਿ ਮੁਖਿ ਚੋਇ ਜੀਉ ॥
गुरु मंत्रु द्रिड़ाए हरि रसकि रसाए हरि अम्रितु हरि मुखि चोइ जीउ ॥
gur mantar drirh-aa-ay har rasak rasaa-ay har amrit har mukh cho-ay jee-o.
The Guru implants His Mantra within the heart, and one savors the sublime essence of the Lord; the Ambrosial Nectar of the Lord trickles into his mouth.
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 477, Line 1
ਤੰਤ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਸਭ ਅਉਖਧ ਜਾਨਹਿ ਅੰਤਿ ਤਊ ਮਰਨਾ ॥੨॥
तंत मंत्र सभ अउखध जानहि अंति तऊ मरना ॥२॥
tant mantar sabh a-ukhaDh jaaneh ant ta-oo marnaa. ||2||
those who know Tantras and mantras and all medicines - even they shall die in the end. ||2||
*Devotee Kabir*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 518, Line 5
ਜਾ ਤੂੰ ਤੁਸਹਿ ਮਿਹਰਵਾਨ ਤਾ ਗੁਰ ਕਾ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਕਮਾਹਿ ॥
जा तूं तुसहि मिहरवान ता गुर का मंत्रु कमाहि ॥
jaa tooN tuseh miharvaan taa gur kaa mantar kamaahi.
When You are pleased, O Merciful Lord, I act according to the Guru's Instructions.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 521, Line 12
ਗੁਰ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੜਾ ਚਿਤਾਰਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਦੁਖੁ ਨ ਥੀਵਈ ॥੨॥
गुर मंत्रड़ा चितारि नानक दुखु न थीवई ॥२॥
gur mantarhaa chitaar naanak dukh na theev-ee. ||2||
Cherish the Words of the Guru's Mantra, O Nanak, and you shall not suffer in pain. ||2||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 544, Line 11
ਬਿਨਵੰਤਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਸੁਣਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਖੀਏ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਨਿਤ ਨਿਤ ਨਿਤ ਜਪਹ ॥੨॥
बिनवंति नानक सुणि मंत्रु सखीए हरि नामु नित नित नित जपह ॥२॥
binvant naanak sun mantar sakhee-ay har naam nit nit nit japah. ||2||
Prays Nanak, hear these teachings, O friends - chant the Lord's Name constantly, over and over again. ||2||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 562, Line 16
ਸਚੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਤੁਮਾਰਾ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਬਾਣੀ ॥
सचु मंत्रु तुमारा अम्रित बाणी ॥
sach mantar tumaaraa amrit banee.
True is Your Mantra, Ambrosial is the Bani of Your Word.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 576, Line 18
ਗੁਰਿ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੁ ਸਬਦੁ ਸਚੁ ਦੀਤਾ ਰਾਮ ॥
गुरि मंत्रु सबदु सचु दीता राम ॥
gur mantar sabad sach deetaa raam.
the Guru has given the Mantra of the Shabad, the True Word of God.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok​


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*


With Guru Ji being Mard Agambra, Saint-soldier, with Taij partaap, didn’t the prostitute have fear of Guru Gobind Singh Ji? 
When King Shiv Nabh send Harlots to Guru Nanak Dev Ji and he reformed them.Did not those Sri Lankend daughters of Guru had fearlessness beore meeting the Guru?

What about 400 Hundred Pathans who diteched Guru after staying with him.did they not have fear?When Akal wants bad time for sometime or wants to teach that person a lesson.All fear of good is lost in that.Same is happening to you.


How did a prostitute have the guts to ask Guru Ji for fulfillment of Kaam?
Did not Aurangzeb Had guts to ask Guru to convert to Islam.Sinner is also powerfull and viturus is power full when he defeats sinner.And you know that she was not successsfull.




> Guru Ji knows everything, then why didn’t Guru Ji know what type of woman anoop kaur was?



Why did not Guru knew Gangu Pandit?Guru here also knew about her but whated to make a lesson for us.

Guru knew everything then why did he had faithn in false outght of cow and Kuran by Hindus and Muslimm indavders respectively?

He knew but he had to work Kautak.(acts to teach Sikhs lesson on world).




> also, where did a prostitute get the name Kaur? Was she Amritdhari?



There is pricess in Bharatpur and MP of BJP called Krishendra Kaur.Kaur is word related to work and non Sikhs also use that.Term Koer and not Kaur is writtan for Anup Koer.But for you Tainka and Tatta are one and the same.

Are you awawe that there is place near Vaishnu Devi called Adi Kuwari and in south as Kanya Kumari.Kumari means doughter.

No even a single time term came Anup Kaur.Term is noop Ku-ari to be pronounced as Noop Kuwari.

But if a prostitute also becomes Amritdhari we have no problem.

Did not term prostitue come in Guru Granth Sahib?

Have look.Guru ranth Sahib Ji talked of reforming them too.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*


Page 82, Line 1
ਵਿਚਿ ਹਉਮੈ ਕਰਮ ਕਮਾਵਦੇ ਜਿਉ ਵੇਸੁਆ ਪੁਤੁ ਨਿਨਾਉ ॥
विचि हउमै करम कमावदे जिउ वेसुआ पुतु निनाउ ॥
vich ha-umai karam kamaavday ji-o vaysu-aa put ninaa-o.
Those who do their deeds in ego are like the *prostitute*'s son, who has no name.
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 239, Line 4
ਸਾਕਤ ਬੇਸੁਆ ਪੂਤ ਨਿਨਾਮ ॥੩॥
साकत बेसुआ पूत निनाम ॥३॥
saakat baysu-aa poot ninaam. ||3||
The faithless cynic is nameless, like the *prostitute*'s son. ||3||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 345, Line 4
ਤਾਰੀਲੇ ਗਨਿਕਾ ਬਿਨੁ ਰੂਪ ਕੁਬਿਜਾ ਬਿਆਧਿ ਅਜਾਮਲੁ ਤਾਰੀਅਲੇ ॥
तारीले गनिका बिनु रूप कुबिजा बिआधि अजामलु तारीअले ॥
taareelay ganikaa bin roop kubijaa bi-aaDh ajaamal taaree-alay.
You saved the *prostitute*, and the ugly hunch-back; You helped the hunter and Ajaamal swim across as well.
*Devotee Namdev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 399, Line 11
ਦੁਰਮਤਿ ਮਦੁ ਜੋ ਪੀਵਤੇ ਬਿਖਲੀ ਪਤਿ ਕਮਲੀ ॥
दुरमति मदु जो पीवते बिखली पति कमली ॥
durmat mad jo peevtay bikhlee pat kamlee.
Those fools, who drink in the wine of evil-mindedness, become the husbands of *prostitute*s.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 526, Line 7
ਬੇਸਵਾ ਜੋਨਿ ਵਲਿ ਵਲਿ ਅਉਤਰੈ ॥੨॥
बेसवा जोनि वलि वलि अउतरै ॥२॥
baysvaa jon val val a-utarai. ||2||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a *prostitute*. ||2||
*Devotee Trilochan*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 528, Line 8
ਜਿਉ ਬੇਸੁਆ ਕੇ ਘਰਿ ਪੂਤੁ ਜਮਤੁ ਹੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਨਾਮੁ ਪਰਿਓ ਹੈ ਧ੍ਰਕਟੀ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
जिउ बेसुआ के घरि पूतु जमतु है तिसु नामु परिओ है ध्रकटी ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
ji-o baysu-aa kay ghar poot jamat hai tis naam pari-o hai Dharkatee. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Like the son, born into the house of a *prostitute*, his name is cursed. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 632, Line 4
ਜਿਹ ਸਿਮਰਤ ਗਨਕਾ ਸੀ ਉਧਰੀ ਤਾ ਕੋ ਜਸੁ ਉਰ ਧਾਰੋ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
जिह सिमरत गनका सी उधरी ता को जसु उर धारो ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
jih simrat gankaa see uDhree taa ko jas ur Dhaaro. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Meditating on Him in remembrance, Ganika the *prostitute* was saved; enshrine His Praises within your heart. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Teg Bahadur*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 692, Line 13
ਅਜਾਮਲ ਗਜ ਗਨਿਕਾ ਪਤਿਤ ਕਰਮ ਕੀਨੇ ॥
अजामल गज गनिका पतित करम कीने ॥
ajaamal gaj ganikaa patit karam keenay.
Ajaamal, the elephant, and the *prostitute* committed many sins,
*Devotee Kabir*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 790, Line 1
ਚੋਰਾ ਜਾਰਾ ਰੰਡੀਆ ਕੁਟਣੀਆ ਦੀਬਾਣੁ ॥
चोरा जारा रंडीआ कुटणीआ दीबाणु ॥
choraa jaaraa randee-aa kutnee-aa deebaan.
Thieves, adulterers, *prostitute*s and pimps,
*Guru Nanak Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 830, Line 15
ਅਜਾਮਲੁ ਗਨਿਕਾ ਜਿਹ ਸਿਮਰਤ ਮੁਕਤ ਭਏ ਜੀਅ ਜਾਨੋ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
अजामलु गनिका जिह सिमरत मुकत भए जीअ जानो ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
ajaamal ganikaa jih simrat mukat bha-ay jee-a jaano. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Remembering Him in meditation, even Ajaamal the robber and Ganikaa the *prostitute* were liberated; let your soul know this. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Teg Bahadur*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 837, Line 3
ਬੇਸੁਆ ਕੈ ਘਰਿ ਬੇਟਾ ਜਨਮਿਆ ਪਿਤਾ ਤਾਹਿ ਕਿਆ ਨਾਮੁ ਸਦਈਆ ॥੬॥
बेसुआ कै घरि बेटा जनमिआ पिता ताहि किआ नामु सदईआ ॥६॥
baysu-aa kai ghar baytaa janmi-aa pitaa taahi ki-aa naam sada-ee-aa. ||6||
When a son is born in the house of a *prostitute*, who can tell the name of his father? ||6||
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 871, Line 16
ਕਰਿ ਸੀਗਾਰੁ ਬਹੈ ਪਖਿਆਰੀ ॥
करि सीगारु बहै पखिआरी ॥
kar seegaar bahai pakhi-aaree.
Adorning herself, she sits like a *prostitute*.
*Devotee Kabir*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 874, Line 9
ਸੂਆ ਪੜਾਵਤ ਗਨਿਕਾ ਤਰੀ ॥
सूआ पड़ावत गनिका तरी ॥
soo-aa parhaavat ganikaa taree.
Teaching a parrot to speak the Lord's Name, Ganika the *prostitute* was saved.
*Devotee Namdev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 981, Line 13
ਸੰਗਤਿ ਕਾ ਗੁਨੁ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਅਧਿਕਾਈ ਪੜਿ ਸੂਆ ਗਨਕ ਉਧਾਰੇ ॥
संगति का गुनु बहुतु अधिकाई पड़ि सूआ गनक उधारे ॥
sangat kaa gun bahut aDhikaa-ee parh soo-aa ganak uDhaaray.
The virtues of the Sangat, the Holy Congregation, are so very great. Even the *prostitute* was saved, by teaching the parrot to speak the Lord's Name.
*Guru Ram Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1008, Line 5
ਜਾ ਕਉ ਸਿਮਰਿ ਅਜਾਮਲੁ ਉਧਰਿਓ ਗਨਿਕਾ ਹੂ ਗਤਿ ਪਾਈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
जा कउ सिमरि अजामलु उधरिओ गनिका हू गति पाई ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
jaa ka-o simar ajaamal uDhaari-o ganikaa hoo gat paa-ee. ||1|| rahaa-o.
Meditating in remembrance on it, Ajaamal was saved, and Ganika the *prostitute* was emancipated. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Teg Bahadur*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1029, Line 5
ਜਿਉ ਬੇਸੁਆ ਪੂਤ ਬਾਪੁ ਕੋ ਕਹੀਐ ਤਿਉ ਫੋਕਟ ਕਾਰ ਵਿਕਾਰਾ ਹੇ ॥੫॥
जिउ बेसुआ पूत बापु को कहीऐ तिउ फोकट कार विकारा हे ॥५॥
ji-o baysu-aa poot baap ko kahee-ai ti-o fokat kaar vikaaraa hay. ||5||
Just as no one knows who is the father of the *prostitute*'s son, such are the worthless, useless deeds that are done. ||5||
*Guru Nanak Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1143, Line 9
ਬੇਸੁਆ ਭਜਤ ਕਿਛੁ ਨਹ ਸਰਮਾਵੈ ॥
बेसुआ भजत किछु नह सरमावै ॥
baysu-aa bhajat kichh nah sarmaavai.
He is not ashamed to spend time with *prostitute*s.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1165, Line 4
ਜਿਉ ਬੇਸ੍ਵਾ ਕੇ ਪਰੈ ਅਖਾਰਾ ॥
जिउ बेस्वा के परै अखारा ॥
ji-o baisvaa kay parai akhaaraa.
He is like the *prostitute*, who comes to dance,
*Devotee Namdev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1192, Line 5
ਗਨਿਕਾ ਉਧਰੀ ਹਰਿ ਕਹੈ ਤੋਤ ॥
गनिका उधरी हरि कहै तोत ॥
ganikaa uDhree har kahai tot.
Ganika the *prostitute* was saved, when her parrot uttered the Lord's Name.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1400, Line 11
ਸੋਦਾਮਾ ਅਪਦਾ ਤੇ ਰਾਖਿਆ ਗਨਿਕਾ ਪੜ੍ਹਤ ਪੂਰੇ ਤਿਹ ਕਾਜ ॥
सोदामा अपदा ते राखिआ गनिका पड़्हत पूरे तिह काज ॥
sodaamaa apdaa tay raakhi-aa ganikaa parhHat pooray tih kaaj.
Sudaamaa was saved from misfortune; and Ganikaa the *prostitute* - when she chanted Your Name, her affairs were perfectly resolved.
*Bard Nala-y*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 1415, Line 12
ਬੇਸੁਆ ਕੇਰੇ ਪੂਤ ਜਿਉ ਪਿਤਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਤਿਸੁ ਜਾਇ ॥
बेसुआ केरे पूत जिउ पिता नामु तिसु जाइ ॥
baysu-aa kayray poot ji-o pitaa naam tis jaa-ay.
They are like the son of a *prostitute*, who does not know the name of his father.
*Guru Amar Das*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*


It is said that most prostitutes were Muslim? Then hwy the last name kaur and first name anoop?
 
Who told you that?And how did that person knew about that?Did he went to them?

Another non snese thing.

Listen son
You are helping your hindu family.Hindus can have name Anup Kumari(this not even a single time comes in any Charitar).

Why das says that you help hindus.Since times before Muslims came Hindus have tradtions of prostitues.They were refered as Ganika,Veshya etc.And such names are used in Guru Granth Sahib.There is mention of one Urdu name called {censored} also but in Punjabi that is meant by widow.

Other names are Tawaif and kidli.Das could not found a single in that character you are after ie 21 to 23.And lastly since the time before Muslims came to this date it is as per regious santity that Hindus have devdasis ie Prostitutes in temples.And they were mostly Muslim?

And this lady is just at strart being mentioned as wife of wealthy?Are you blind?

[/QUOTE]Yes there is mention of Ganika in Guru Granth Sahib.she was there before Rasol(SWAS) came to world.Ganika and Vaishyas are Sankrit Terms.In Muslims terms are Tavaif and {censored}.So Guru Granth Sahib has both terms Ganika and Vaishya but {censored} is used for widow.
 
so scholar like you is great and wants world to move as you want.




> [*]Also, Gurbani says that if you see the Guru once, you will losse kaam kroadh loab moh annhankar, etc? then why didn’t the prostitute loose it?
> [*]



 

Seeing Guru as per Gurbani is not the physical body but Guru over there is Akal.so seeing Guru is realsinsation of Truth.do you think that you show some bad person Guru Granth sahib and he will losse lust etc.?
Did not Pathan who stabbed Guru also seen physical form of Guru.Fact is that Guru is beyoond any form and Ten Master made us more towards that.

But you still go after phyiscal form and want to decide who is Sikh or who is not.Very well.
1.Baba Srichand Ji as per you were not OK(das respects him).
2.Datu Ji were son of One Guru and kicked the succeeding Guru.
3.Baba Mohan also did not cooprate with Foruth Guru.
4.Then what about Prithwi chand?Did not Chandu also see the Guru and did not Jallad se him?
5.As we move further Bidhichand,did he not see the Guru?
6.By the way if we go by your logic just presetnig any bad man in front of Guru Granth Sahib JI,all will be reformed.7.Then near Decca there were tow villages Guru told one to get uprooted as they were good people and they will spread good things and ,to bad guys Guru told to reamin settled.So did not those Bad guys swa Guru.

It is not Jesus like thing where body is worshipped.The Guru when is seen is seen in all and is not in one body but in all bodies.

 
 



> It says that when Guru Ji saw some people surrounding him, He thought his life was in danger and was helpless as there was no Sikh protecting him. Guru Ji, who says I will make 1 fight 1,000,000 was scared of 4-5 people?



 
First rectify the figure.It is one by 125000 and you talk of 100000 so you are 25000 less.
so yuo wanted Guru to show miracle.Had he jhas to show,he would have done it in while staying at Chamkaur Garhi.

Once Gurus camp was looted,And Sikhs asked him why this Bhana Happned?

Guru said 'that there is a power bigger then him and that controls all'.That defeat was way to let people know that not to worship Guru but Akal.

But you may make an idol of Guru or treat Guru Granth Sahib Ji as idol whithout knowing Akal.Guru did say in Vachitar Natak that people trying to call him Primal god will go to hell.

But in story it is written that there in that place Lord was alone(he went there to meet Magan but a lady was there,Who said that if Lord does not commit Adultary,she will kill him or  will shout.In both case there was to be charctor assination.In  former case Lord
did not want to kill a lonely lady,In second case ,it happened that she shouted and lord grabed her brother and befooled her followers who thought him to be a Thief.And her brother went to jail and Lord reached back safe and sound


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*



It says Guru Ji for his shoes and a shawl at anoop kaur’s house. Why did Guru Ji take off his shoes? 
Why did Guru Ji take off his shawl?
[/QUOTE]
 
Wait there man it seems that you are paranoid and *******ed.Term Pani Pamri is written that means rich footwear.Term Panhi comes only when that lady is summoned in the court.And Panhi means blanket.As we have to fight and run both footwears like Chappel and blanket are not handy.As you may never have fought and if you want you can wear them and see how good could you fight ,Lord,when lady shouted, leaft shoe and blanket and them made her brother get cought by her own men.It was only after when Lord refuse to commit Adultary then she wanted to trap lord,then in order to face dangers handly did lord removed hindrances.
did not Guru use to put gold in arrow to kill enemy so that with mony of that arrow enmy fmaily can get funaral done?

Guru donates something and 

GuruBani says jY fITY mnu DIrIAY iklivK vM\in@ dUry] sUhI mhlw 5, 761. Jai Deethay Mnu Dheereeae Vanjyhan Dooray] Soohee Mehala 5, 761. Then how did a woman get inflicted by kaam? 
 
It is state of seeing Akal in all and not the seeig of Phyiscal body.Do not you think that Baba Maan Singh Of Pehva saw and read Guru Granth Sahib?

Ang 761.
ਜੈ ਡਿਠੇ ਮਨੁ ਧੀਰੀਐ ਕਿਲਵਿਖ ਵੰਞਨ੍ਹ੍ਹਿ ਦੂਰੇ ॥ 
जै डिठे मनु धीरीऐ किलविख वंञन्हि दूरे ॥ 
jai dithay man Dheeree-ai kilvikh vaNnjniH dooray. 
Seeing Him, my mind is comforted and consoled, and my sins and mistakes are far removed. 
ਸੋ ਕਿਉ ਵਿਸਰੈ ਮਾਉ ਮੈ ਜੋ ਰਹਿਆ ਭਰਪੂਰੇ ॥੭॥ 
सो किउ विसरै माउ मै जो रहिआ भरपूरे ॥७॥ 
so ki-o visrai maa-o mai jo rahi-aa bharpooray. ||7|| 
How could I ever forget Him, O my mother? He is permeating and pervading everywhere. ||7|| 

She saw body of lord and Not the Guru who is in all.



How dare did a prostitute threaten Guru Ji? 
Did not Hindu Kings and Moghuls also threatened Guru and they were worse then prostitues.

Did not Sodi of Kartarpur said bad words for Guru.What about Brahmins of Kurukshetras?They also said wrong things to Guru?

Anyone who is to go for wrong time gets non sense mind and say wrong things to Guru like you are doing.

Is not this written in Gurubani that people called Guru Ghost and spirit in dead body.
ਮਾਰੂ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ॥ 
मारू महला १ ॥ 
maaroo mehlaa 1. 
Maaroo, First Mehl: 
ਕੋਈ ਆਖੈ ਭੂਤਨਾ ਕੋ ਕਹੈ ਬੇਤਾਲਾ ॥ 
कोई आखै भूतना को कहै बेताला ॥ 
ko-ee aakhai bhootnaa ko kahai baytaalaa. 
Some call him a ghost; some say that he is a demon. 
ਕੋਈ ਆਖੈ ਆਦਮੀ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਵੇਚਾਰਾ ॥੧॥ 
कोई आखै आदमी नानकु वेचारा ॥१॥ 
ko-ee aakhai aadmee naanak vaychaaraa. ||1|| 
Some call him a mere mortal; O, poor Nanak! ||1|| 
ਭਇਆ ਦਿਵਾਨਾ ਸਾਹ ਕਾ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਬਉਰਾਨਾ ॥ 
भइआ दिवाना साह का नानकु बउराना ॥ 
bha-i-aa divaanaa saah kaa naanak ba-uraanaa. 
Crazy Nanak has gone insane, after his Lord, the King. 
ਹਉ ਹਰਿ ਬਿਨੁ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਜਾਨਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
हउ हरि बिनु अवरु न जाना ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
ha-o har bin avar na jaanaa. ||1|| rahaa-o. 
I know of none other than the Lord. ||1||Pause|| 
ਤਉ ਦੇਵਾਨਾ ਜਾਣੀਐ ਜਾ ਭੈ ਦੇਵਾਨਾ ਹੋਇ ॥ 
तउ देवाना जाणीऐ जा भै देवाना होइ ॥ 
ta-o dayvaanaa jaanee-ai jaa bhai dayvaanaa ho-ay. 
He alone is known to be insane, when he goes insane with the Fear of God. 
ਏਕੀ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਬਾਹਰਾ ਦੂਜਾ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਜਾਣੈ ਕੋਇ ॥੨॥ 
एकी साहिब बाहरा दूजा अवरु न जाणै कोइ ॥२॥ 
aykee saahib baahraa doojaa avar na jaanai ko-ay. ||2|| 
He recognizes none other than the One Lord and Master. ||2|| 
ਤਉ ਦੇਵਾਨਾ ਜਾਣੀਐ ਜਾ ਏਕਾ ਕਾਰ ਕਮਾਇ ॥ 
तउ देवाना जाणीऐ जा एका कार कमाइ ॥ 
ta-o dayvaanaa jaanee-ai jaa aykaa kaar kamaa-ay. 
He alone is known to be insane, if he works for the One Lord. 
ਹੁਕਮੁ ਪਛਾਣੈ ਖਸਮ ਕਾ ਦੂਜੀ ਅਵਰ ਸਿਆਣਪ ਕਾਇ ॥੩॥ 
हुकमु पछाणै खसम का दूजी अवर सिआणप काइ ॥३॥ 
hukam pachhaanai khasam kaa doojee avar si-aanap kaa-ay. ||3|| 
Recognizing the Hukam, the Command of his Lord and Master, what other cleverness is there? ||3|| 
ਤਉ ਦੇਵਾਨਾ ਜਾਣੀਐ ਜਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਧਰੇ ਪਿਆਰੁ ॥ 
तउ देवाना जाणीऐ जा साहिब धरे पिआरु ॥ 
ta-o dayvaanaa jaanee-ai jaa saahib Dharay pi-aar. 
He alone is known to be insane, when he falls in love with his Lord and Master. 
ਮੰਦਾ ਜਾਣੈ ਆਪ ਕਉ ਅਵਰੁ ਭਲਾ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ॥੪॥੭॥ 
मंदा जाणै आप कउ अवरु भला संसारु ॥४॥७॥ 
mandaa jaanai aap ka-o avar bhalaa sansaar. ||4||7|| 
He sees himself as bad, and all the rest of the world as good. ||4||7|| 

Ang 991


Guru Ji condemns jantras and mantras, then why did Guru Ji go and learn mantras from a woman, especially at night? 
 
Lord went to know about Plan and he knew that Magan a man will be there,who came on behest of lady.
Even if we deem it spell,Going of lord was more in line of First Maste goig to
1.Haridwar to expose superstition
2.To Kalijug Panda to remove myth about miracle he was showing.
3.To Jaggananth to expose myth about Arti.
4.to Mecca,to expose that God is not restricted to any direction.

He did not go there to worship.Anyway after reading this text of Charitrano one will belive in going to learn Mantra from anybody.So purpose of Charitar is done.

While the prostitute was drugged up and unconscious, for what good deed did Guru Ji place 60 coins beside her? 
 
Akal ill reborn you as a Hindu and then you will speak lies as per your faith.In Charitars 21 to 23rd it is not at all written.And do tell otherwise where it is written?

Then Guru Ji announced that whoever finds my shoes and shawl and brings it to me will get rid of the cycle of life and death. What was so special about those shoes and shawl that Guru Ji wanted to end someone’s cycle of birth and death for that shawl and that pair of shoes? 
 
That lady tried to spread disinfo about lord.Lord preempted this by saying that his stuff is lost and any Sikh who retrive it will get no death coming near to him.That may mean teqaching of Weapoanry or Gurmat teaching.It may not mean salvation as you write.

The prostitute brought the items herself, then was her cycle of birth and death ended? 
 
No Sikhs,who got hold of Lady had along side bought the items as proof of her stealing from Lord.Do not tell lies.Lord ordered them to do so.That happened when lord came to know from Sikhs about her having a defomation campaign.




> Chariter also says that Guru Ji gave the prostitute 20,000 coins when she came to Guru Darbar with the items. Was it suitable to give hard earned money of Sikhs to a prostitute?



do yuo know that Guru used to give medicine via Bhai Ghannaya to people who were injuiered even from opponent side.So you can ask how and why for that also?Hard eaerned mony of Sikhs been givne to those who came to kill Sikhs?

What about Gurus putting gold in arrow so that kins to victum of that arrow get his funral done by that Gold.

When she was indoctrionated( into good faith),as in inscentive,for doing good even to bad, Lord gave him expenditure of six month packed.

These chariters in past tense. Then how could they be written by Gu Ji? 
 
Is there no verse in Guru Granth Sahib,which is in past tense?And should same logic of your be applied over there?


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*

Whichy tense is this?
Page 626, Line 16
ਹਰਿ ਗੋਵਿਦੁ ਪ੍ਰਭਿ ਰਾਖਿਆ ॥
हरि गोविदु प्रभि राखिआ ॥
har govid parabh raakhi-aa.
God saved Hargobind.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
Page 807, Line 1
ਵਡੀ ਆਰਜਾ ਹਰਿ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਕੀ ਸੂਖ ਮੰਗਲ ਕਲਿਆਣ ਬੀਚਾਰਿਆ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
वडी आरजा हरि गोबिंद की सूख मंगल कलिआण बीचारिआ ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
vadee aarjaa har gobind kee sookh mangal kali-aan beechaari-aa. ||1|| rahaa-o.
He has blessed Hargobind with long life, and taken care of my comfort, happiness and well-being. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok​ 
If I and me work here then why are they not working in 71st Charitar or say discourse over as in 21st one?

Have you got something or not?

All bani is work of Akal and there is no pattern of first,secod or third being fixed.

They are also second or even third person. Then how are they written by Guru Ji? 
Why there is third person over here?
Ang 1165 and 1166
ਸੁਲਤਾਨੁ ਪੂਛੈ ਸੁਨੁ ਬੇ ਨਾਮਾ ॥ 
सुलतानु पूछै सुनु बे नामा ॥ 
sultaan poochhai sun bay naamaa. 
The Sultan said, "Listen, Naam Dayv: 
ਦੇਖਉ ਰਾਮ ਤੁਮ੍ਹ੍ਹਾਰੇ ਕਾਮਾ ॥੧॥ 
देखउ राम तुम्हारे कामा ॥१॥ 
daykh-a-u raam tumHaaray kaamaa. ||1|| 
let me see the actions of your Lord."||1|| 
ਨਾਮਾ ਸੁਲਤਾਨੇ ਬਾਧਿਲਾ ॥ 
नामा सुलताने बाधिला ॥ 
naamaa sultaanay baaDhilaa. 
The Sultan arrested Naam Dayv, 
ਦੇਖਉ ਤੇਰਾ ਹਰਿ ਬੀਠੁਲਾ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
देखउ तेरा हरि बीठुला ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
daykh-a-u tayraa har beethulaa. ||1|| rahaa-o. 
and said, "Let me see your Beloved Lord."||1||Pause|| 
ਬਿਸਮਿਲਿ ਗਊ ਦੇਹੁ ਜੀਵਾਇ ॥ 
बिसमिलि गऊ देहु जीवाइ ॥ 
bismil ga-oo dayh jeevaa-ay. 
Bring this dead cow back to life. 
ਨਾਤਰੁ ਗਰਦਨਿ ਮਾਰਉ ਠਾਂਇ ॥੨॥ 
नातरु गरदनि मारउ ठांइ ॥२॥ 
naatar gardan maara-o thaaN-ay. ||2|| 
Otherwise, I shall cut off your head here and now."||2|| 
ਬਾਦਿਸਾਹ ਐਸੀ ਕਿਉ ਹੋਇ ॥ 
बादिसाह ऐसी किउ होइ ॥ 
baadisaah aisee ki-o ho-ay. 
Naam Dayv answered, "O king, how can this happen? 
ਬਿਸਮਿਲਿ ਕੀਆ ਨ ਜੀਵੈ ਕੋਇ ॥੩॥ 
बिसमिलि कीआ न जीवै कोइ ॥३॥ 
bismil kee-aa na jeevai ko-ay. ||3|| 
No one can bring the dead back to life. ||3|| 
ਮੇਰਾ ਕੀਆ ਕਛੂ ਨ ਹੋਇ ॥ 
मेरा कीआ कछू न होइ ॥ 
mayraa kee-aa kachhoo na ho-ay. 
I cannot do anything by my own actions. 
ਕਰਿ ਹੈ ਰਾਮੁ ਹੋਇ ਹੈ ਸੋਇ ॥੪॥ 
करि है रामु होइ है सोइ ॥४॥ 
kar hai raam ho-ay hai so-ay. ||4|| 
Whatever the Lord does, that alone happens."||4|| 
ਬਾਦਿਸਾਹੁ ਚੜ੍ਹ੍ਹਿਓ ਅਹੰਕਾਰਿ ॥ 
बादिसाहु चड़्हिओ अहंकारि ॥ 
baadisaahu charhHi-o ahaNkaar. 
The arrogant king was enraged at this reply. 
ਗਜ ਹਸਤੀ ਦੀਨੋ ਚਮਕਾਰਿ ॥੫॥ 
गज हसती दीनो चमकारि ॥५॥ 
gaj hastee deeno chamkaar. ||5|| 
He incited an elephant to attack. ||5|| 
ਰੁਦਨੁ ਕਰੈ ਨਾਮੇ ਕੀ ਮਾਇ ॥ 
रुदनु करै नामे की माइ ॥ 
rudan karai naamay kee maa-ay. 
Naam Dayv's mother began to cry, 
ਛੋਡਿ ਰਾਮੁ ਕੀ ਨ ਭਜਹਿ ਖੁਦਾਇ ॥੬॥ 
छोडि रामु की न भजहि खुदाइ ॥६॥ 
chhod raam kee na bhajeh khudaa-ay. ||6|| 
and she said, "Why don't you abandon your Lord Raam, and worship his Lord Allah?"||6|| 
ਨ ਹਉ ਤੇਰਾ ਪੂੰਗੜਾ ਨ ਤੂ ਮੇਰੀ ਮਾਇ ॥ 
न हउ तेरा पूंगड़ा न तू मेरी माइ ॥ 
na ha-o tayraa pooNgarhaa na too mayree maa-ay. 
Naam Dayv answered, "I am not your son, and you are not my mother. 
ਪਿੰਡੁ ਪੜੈ ਤਉ ਹਰਿ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਇ ॥੭॥ 
पिंडु पड़ै तउ हरि गुन गाइ ॥७॥ 
pind parhai ta-o har gun gaa-ay. ||7|| 
Even if my body dies, I will still sing the Glorious Praises of the Lord."||7|| 
ਕਰੈ ਗਜਿੰਦੁ ਸੁੰਡ ਕੀ ਚੋਟ ॥ 
करै गजिंदु सुंड की चोट ॥ 
karai gajind sund kee chot. 
The elephant attacked him with his trunk, 
ਨਾਮਾ ਉਬਰੈ ਹਰਿ ਕੀ ਓਟ ॥੮॥ 
नामा उबरै हरि की ओट ॥८॥ 
naamaa ubrai har kee ot. ||8|| 
but Naam Dayv was saved, protected by the Lord. ||8|| 
ਕਾਜੀ ਮੁਲਾਂ ਕਰਹਿ ਸਲਾਮੁ ॥ 
काजी मुलां करहि सलामु ॥ 
kaajee mulaaN karahi salaam. 
The king said, "The Qazis and the Mullahs bow down to me, 
ਇਨਿ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਮੇਰਾ ਮਲਿਆ ਮਾਨੁ ॥੯॥ 
इनि हिंदू मेरा मलिआ मानु ॥९॥ 
in hindoo mayraa mali-aa maan. ||9|| 
but this Hindu has trampled my honor."||9|| 
ਬਾਦਿਸਾਹ ਬੇਨਤੀ ਸੁਨੇਹੁ ॥ 
बादिसाह बेनती सुनेहु ॥ 
baadisaah bayntee sunayhu. 
The people pleaded with the king, "Hear our prayer, O king. 




​ਨਾਮੇ ਸਰ ਭਰਿ ਸੋਨਾ ਲੇਹੁ ॥੧੦॥ 
नामे सर भरि सोना लेहु ॥१०॥ 
naamay sar bhar sonaa layho. ||10|| 
Here, take Naam Dayv's weight in gold, and release him."||10|| 
ਮਾਲੁ ਲੇਉ ਤਉ ਦੋਜਕਿ ਪਰਉ ॥ 
मालु लेउ तउ दोजकि परउ ॥ 
maal lay-o ta-o dojak para-o. 
The king replied, "If I take the gold, then I will be consigned to hell, 
ਦੀਨੁ ਛੋਡਿ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਕਉ ਭਰਉ ॥੧੧॥ 
दीनु छोडि दुनीआ कउ भरउ ॥११॥ 
deen chhod dunee-aa ka-o bhara-o. ||11|| 
by forsaking my faith and gathering worldly wealth."||11|| 
ਪਾਵਹੁ ਬੇੜੀ ਹਾਥਹੁ ਤਾਲ ॥ 
पावहु बेड़ी हाथहु ताल ॥ 
paavhu bayrhee haathhu taal. 
With his feet in chains, Naam Dayv kept the beat with his hands, 
ਨਾਮਾ ਗਾਵੈ ਗੁਨ ਗੋਪਾਲ ॥੧੨॥ 
नामा गावै गुन गोपाल ॥१२॥ 
naamaa gaavai gun gopaal. ||12|| 
singing the Praises of the Lord. ||12|| 
ਗੰਗ ਜਮੁਨ ਜਉ ਉਲਟੀ ਬਹੈ ॥ 
गंग जमुन जउ उलटी बहै ॥ 
gang jamun ja-o ultee bahai. 
Even if the Ganges and the Jamunaa rivers flow backwards, 
ਤਉ ਨਾਮਾ ਹਰਿ ਕਰਤਾ ਰਹੈ ॥੧੩॥ 
तउ नामा हरि करता रहै ॥१३॥ 
ta-o naamaa har kartaa rahai. ||13|| 
I will still continue singing the Praises of the Lord."||13|| 
ਸਾਤ ਘੜੀ ਜਬ ਬੀਤੀ ਸੁਣੀ ॥ 
सात घड़ी जब बीती सुणी ॥ 
saat gharhee jab beetee sunee. 
Three hours passed, 
ਅਜਹੁ ਨ ਆਇਓ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣ ਧਣੀ ॥੧੪॥ 
अजहु न आइओ त्रिभवण धणी ॥१४॥ 
ajahu na aa-i-o taribhavan Dhanee. ||14|| 
and even then, the Lord of the three worlds had not come. ||14|| 
ਪਾਖੰਤਣ ਬਾਜ ਬਜਾਇਲਾ ॥ 
पाखंतण बाज बजाइला ॥ 
paakhantan baaj bajaa-ilaa. 
Playing on the instrument of the feathered wings, 
ਗਰੁੜ ਚੜ੍ਹ੍ਹੇ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਆਇਲਾ ॥੧੫॥ 
गरुड़ चड़्हे गोबिंद आइला ॥१५॥ 
garurh charhHay gobind aa-ilaa. ||15|| 
the Lord of the Universe came, mounted on the eagle garura. ||15|| 
ਅਪਨੇ ਭਗਤ ਪਰਿ ਕੀ ਪ੍ਰਤਿਪਾਲ ॥ 
अपने भगत परि की प्रतिपाल ॥ 
apnay bhagat par kee partipaal. 
He cherished His devotee, 
ਗਰੁੜ ਚੜ੍ਹ੍ਹੇ ਆਏ ਗੋਪਾਲ ॥੧੬॥ 
गरुड़ चड़्हे आए गोपाल ॥१६॥ 
garurh charhHay aa-ay gopaal. ||16|| 
and the Lord came, mounted on the eagle garura. ||16|| 
ਕਹਹਿ ਤ ਧਰਣਿ ਇਕੋਡੀ ਕਰਉ ॥ 
कहहि त धरणि इकोडी करउ ॥ 
kaheh ta Dharan ikodee kara-o. 
The Lord said to him, "If you wish, I shall turn the earth sideways. 
ਕਹਹਿ ਤ ਲੇ ਕਰਿ ਊਪਰਿ ਧਰਉ ॥੧੭॥ 
कहहि त ले करि ऊपरि धरउ ॥१७॥ 
kaheh ta lay kar oopar Dhara-o. ||17|| 
If you wish, I shall turn it upside down. ||17|| 
ਕਹਹਿ ਤ ਮੁਈ ਗਊ ਦੇਉ ਜੀਆਇ ॥ 
कहहि त मुई गऊ देउ जीआइ ॥ 
kaheh ta mu-ee ga-oo day-o jee-aa-ay. 
If you wish, I shall bring the dead cow back to life. 
ਸਭੁ ਕੋਈ ਦੇਖੈ ਪਤੀਆਇ ॥੧੮॥ 
सभु कोई देखै पतीआइ ॥१८॥ 
sabh ko-ee daykhai patee-aa-ay. ||18|| 
Everyone will see and be convinced."||18|| 
ਨਾਮਾ ਪ੍ਰਣਵੈ ਸੇਲ ਮਸੇਲ ॥ 
नामा प्रणवै सेल मसेल ॥ 
naamaa paranvai sayl masayl. 
Naam Dayv prayed, and milked the cow. 
ਗਊ ਦੁਹਾਈ ਬਛਰਾ ਮੇਲਿ ॥੧੯॥ 
गऊ दुहाई बछरा मेलि ॥१९॥ 
ga-oo duhaa-ee bachhraa mayl. ||19|| 
He brought the calf to the cow, and milked her. ||19|| 
ਦੂਧਹਿ ਦੁਹਿ ਜਬ ਮਟੁਕੀ ਭਰੀ ॥ 
दूधहि दुहि जब मटुकी भरी ॥ 
dooDheh duhi jab matukee bharee. 
When the pitcher was filled with milk, 
ਲੇ ਬਾਦਿਸਾਹ ਕੇ ਆਗੇ ਧਰੀ ॥੨੦॥ 
ले बादिसाह के आगे धरी ॥२०॥ 
lay baadisaah kay aagay Dharee. ||20|| 
Naam Dayv took it and placed it before the king. ||20|| 
ਬਾਦਿਸਾਹੁ ਮਹਲ ਮਹਿ ਜਾਇ ॥ 
बादिसाहु महल महि जाइ ॥ 
baadisaahu mahal meh jaa-ay. 
The king went into his palace, 
ਅਉਘਟ ਕੀ ਘਟ ਲਾਗੀ ਆਇ ॥੨੧॥ 
अउघट की घट लागी आइ ॥२१॥ 
a-ughat kee ghat laagee aa-ay. ||21|| 
and his heart was troubled. ||21|| 
ਕਾਜੀ ਮੁਲਾਂ ਬਿਨਤੀ ਫੁਰਮਾਇ ॥ 
काजी मुलां बिनती फुरमाइ ॥ 
kaajee mulaaN bintee furmaa-ay. 
Through the Qazis and the Mullahs, the king offered his prayer, 
ਬਖਸੀ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਮੈ ਤੇਰੀ ਗਾਇ ॥੨੨॥ 
बखसी हिंदू मै तेरी गाइ ॥२२॥ 
bakhsee hindoo mai tayree gaa-ay. ||22|| 
Forgive me, please, O Hindu; I am just a cow before you.||22|| 
ਨਾਮਾ ਕਹੈ ਸੁਨਹੁ ਬਾਦਿਸਾਹ ॥ 
नामा कहै सुनहु बादिसाह ॥ 
naamaa kahai sunhu baadisaah. 
Naam Dayv said, "Listen, O king: 
ਇਹੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਪਤੀਆ ਮੁਝੈ ਦਿਖਾਇ ॥੨੩॥ 
इहु किछु पतीआ मुझै दिखाइ ॥२३॥ 
ih kichh patee-aa mujhai dikhaa-ay. ||23|| 
have I done this miracle? ||23|| 
ਇਸ ਪਤੀਆ ਕਾ ਇਹੈ ਪਰਵਾਨੁ ॥ 
इस पतीआ का इहै परवानु ॥ 
is patee-aa kaa ihai parvaan. 
The purpose of this miracle is 
ਸਾਚਿ ਸੀਲਿ ਚਾਲਹੁ ਸੁਲਿਤਾਨ ॥੨੪॥ 
साचि सीलि चालहु सुलितान ॥२४॥ 
saach seel chaalahu sulitaan. ||24|| 
that you, O king, should walk on the path of truth and humility."||24|| 
ਨਾਮਦੇਉ ਸਭ ਰਹਿਆ ਸਮਾਇ ॥ 
नामदेउ सभ रहिआ समाइ ॥ 
naamday-o sabh rahi-aa samaa-ay. 
Naam Dayv became famous everywhere for this. 
ਮਿਲਿ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਸਭ ਨਾਮੇ ਪਹਿ ਜਾਹਿ ॥੨੫॥ 
मिलि हिंदू सभ नामे पहि जाहि ॥२५॥ 
mil hindoo sabh naamay peh jaahi. ||25|| 
The Hindus all went together to Naam Dayv. ||25|| 
ਜਉ ਅਬ ਕੀ ਬਾਰ ਨ ਜੀਵੈ ਗਾਇ ॥ 
जउ अब की बार न जीवै गाइ ॥ 
ja-o ab kee baar na jeevai gaa-ay. 
If the cow had not been revived, 
ਤ ਨਾਮਦੇਵ ਕਾ ਪਤੀਆ ਜਾਇ ॥੨੬॥ 
त नामदेव का पतीआ जाइ ॥२६॥ 
ta naamdayv kaa patee-aa jaa-ay. ||26|| 
people would have lost faith in Naam Dayv. ||26|| 
ਨਾਮੇ ਕੀ ਕੀਰਤਿ ਰਹੀ ਸੰਸਾਰਿ ॥ 
नामे की कीरति रही संसारि ॥ 
naamay kee keerat rahee sansaar. 
The fame of Naam Dayv spread throughout the world. 
ਭਗਤ ਜਨਾਂ ਲੇ ਉਧਰਿਆ ਪਾਰਿ ॥੨੭॥ 
भगत जनां ले उधरिआ पारि ॥२७॥ 
bhagat janaaN lay uDhri-aa paar. ||27|| 
The humble devotees were saved and carried across with him. ||27|| 
ਸਗਲ ਕਲੇਸ ਨਿੰਦਕ ਭਇਆ ਖੇਦੁ ॥ 
सगल कलेस निंदक भइआ खेदु ॥ 
sagal kalays nindak bha-i-aa khayd. 
All sorts of troubles and pains afflicted the slanderer. 
ਨਾਮੇ ਨਾਰਾਇਨ ਨਾਹੀ ਭੇਦੁ ॥੨੮॥੧॥੧੦॥ 
नामे नाराइन नाही भेदु ॥२८॥१॥१०॥ 
naamay naaraa-in naahee bhayd. ||28||1||10|| 
There is no difference between Naam Dayv and the Lord. ||28||1||10|| 
​ 



chariters refer to Guru Ji as raja. Was Guru Ji only a raja? Bhai Nand Lal says Guru Ji is Emperor of emperors. Isn’t this downgrading to what Nand Lal said? 
 
Are you made or fool or too much clever who tells so much of lies?

Das gives word to word tranalation of Charectors 21,22,23 and 71 and there term Rai is used and not Raja,where is term Raj used other that and that also for Guru?Tell it?

And Rai means Lord and not the King.So term Rai is used for Akal.Ham Ghar Ram Rai..
Mere Ram Rai..

So Akal can not be termed as Rai.Wait.

You want to question that Sixth Master gave Guruship to his grand son with namr Har Rai.Was not name of Tenth Master also Gobind Rai, Before he became Singh?
So who so ever gave  surname Rai,to Gurus,were not OK as per you

ਪੰਨਾ 171, ਸਤਰ 12
ਇਸੁ ਗੜ ਮਹਿ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਮ ਰਾਇ ਹੈ ਕਿਛੁ ਸਾਦੁ ਨ ਪਾਵੈ ਧੀਠਾ ॥
इसु गड़ महि हरि राम राइ है किछु सादु न पावै धीठा ॥
is garh meh har raam raa-ay hai kichh saad na paavai Dheethaa.
Within this body-fortress is the Lord, the Sovereign Lord King, but the stubborn ones do not find the taste.
ਮਃ 4   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
ਪੰਨਾ 172, ਸਤਰ 1
ਘਟਿ ਘਟਿ ਰਮਈਆ ਰਮਤ ਰਾਮ ਰਾਇ ਗੁਰ ਸਬਦਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਲਿਵ ਲਾਗੇ ॥
घटि घटि रमईआ रमत राम राइ गुर सबदि गुरू लिव लागे ॥
ghat ghat rama-ee-aa ramat raam raa-ay gur sabad guroo liv laagay.
The All-pervading Sovereign Lord King is contained in each and every heart. Through the Guru, and the Word of the Guru's Shabad, I am lovingly centered on the Lord.
ਮਃ 4   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
ਪੰਨਾ 172, ਸਤਰ 8
ਮੇਰੈ ਹੀਅਰੈ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿ ਰਾਮ ਰਾਇ ਕੀ ਗੁਰਿ ਮਾਰਗੁ ਪੰਥੁ ਬਤਾਇਆ ॥
मेरै हीअरै प्रीति राम राइ की गुरि मारगु पंथु बताइआ ॥
mayrai hee-arai pareet raam raa-ay kee gur maarag panth bataa-i-aa.
My heart is filled with love for the Sovereign Lord King; the Guru has shown me the path and the way to find Him.
ਮਃ 4   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
ਪੰਨਾ 204, ਸਤਰ 18
ਕਿਨ ਬਿਧਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਗੁਸਾਈ ਮੇਰੇ ਰਾਮ ਰਾਇ ॥
किन बिधि मिलै गुसाई मेरे राम राइ ॥
kin biDh milai gusaa-ee mayray raam raa-ay.
How may I meet my Master, the King, the Lord of the Universe?
ਮਃ 5   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok​ਪੰਨਾ 449, ਸਤਰ 5
ਦੀਨ ਦਇਆਲ ਸੁਣਿ ਬੇਨਤੀ ਹਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਇਆ ਰਾਮ ਰਾਜੇ ॥
दीन दइआल सुणि बेनती हरि प्रभ हरि राइआ राम राजे ॥
deen da-i-aal sun bayntee har parabh har raa-i-aa raam raajay.
O Merciful to the meek, hear my prayer, O Lord God; You are my Master, O Lord King.
ਮਃ 4   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok
ਪੰਨਾ 479, ਸਤਰ 9
ਕਹੁ ਕਬੀਰ ਹਮ ਰਾਮ ਰਾਖੇ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਇ ॥੫॥੧॥੧੪॥
कहु कबीर हम राम राखे क्रिपा करि हरि राइ ॥५॥१॥१४॥
kaho kabeer ham raam raakhay kirpaa kar har raa-ay. ||5||1||14||
Says Kabeer, the Lord preserves me; the Lord, my King, has showered His Blessings upon me. ||5||1||14||
ਭਗਤ ਕਬੀਰ ਜੀ   -  view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*


Didn’t the Sikhs know that it is a prostitute who has brought Guru Ji’s shoes? What effect did that have on Sikhs? 
You are lier.Sikhs on order of Lord borugght the thief lady with items which were as per lord were stolen.
Sikhs got hold of a lady,who was wofe of wealthy and who was accused of stealing the stuff of the lord.

Tankahnaama Bhai Nanad Lal says Kwlsw soie jo pridRst iqAwgY] Kwlsw soie jo prnwrI qy BwgY] Then why did Guru Ji go to a woman at night? Guru Ji performed different from what Guru Ji taught? 
Lord in the story did not Go to women,But was cold by man called Magan(agent of Lady).Had Lord was easy to go to Lady she should have come her self calling him in night.Lord Saw lady only after he entered the camp.and became thoughtfull.

Chariter says that when prostitute says “thief, thief, thief!” People come and surround Guru Ji. People who lived in Anandpur were mostly Sikhs and who had faith in Guru Ji. So Guru Ji’s own followers thought of Guru Ji as a thief? 
No it is written that people came,who were followers of lady.Lord held her brother,made him uncontious with muthahiri,If you want to have taste of it,Das can help you.And then by that time Lord’s Sikh took her borther to jail or Lord.Lord reached back to his home safely.


Prostitutes must have come to Anandpur only if they had customers? Who were the customers when the city was controlled and run by Guru Ji himself? Sikhs were the customers? Do you guys go to places like that too? I guess you guys do so do the people who teach you that Chariters belong to Guru Ji. 
As you blames other for that,may be you are such type o prostitues visiters obsessed by *****s.She is writan as wife of rich man and who call her protitute?Strange?

Aren’t you disrespecting Guru Ji in countless ways by saying these chariters are written by Guru Ji? 
People disrecpect Akal by un having faith and spreading lies about Charectors.

Is it not true the present dasam granth was known as “bachitter natak” then known as “dasam paatshah ka granth”, then known as “dasam granth” and now people like you guys call it dasam guru granth sahib”. Why the name changes? 
Do you knw that there are mnay names for Guru Granth Sahib.

Adi Granth.Darbar Sahib,Guru Granth Saib,Adi Guru Darbar.

One version is refere by Gyani Gyan Singh JI as one of Tenth Master.So as per your logic some one can talk ill of our Eternal Guru.

Is it not true that there are many versions of dasam granth? Why? If it is written by Guru Gobind Singh Ji? 
Das wil give you thre versions of Guru Granth Sahib JI.
1.Mithi Beerh(of Kartarpur Sahib)
2.Khari or Bhai Bannu Wali Beerh(of Kanpur)
3.Damdami Beerh(our present Guru).

So Bhai Mani Singh version is only respected copy of Dasham Granth Sahib.

Is it not true that first copy doesn’t have Sri Mukhwak paatshahi 10 at start of chariters, it also doesn’t have Sri Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh? 
Which one is the fisrt copy?Can you elaborate and das will verify.

This is rather as good news if it is true.So far Kala Afghana Sahib used to say that writer himself can not write his own name at start like Guru Gobind Singh Ji can not write Sri Mukhwak Patshahi Dasvin ,but some other could write that.So you are removing that error.


Guru had time to write 404 chariters but no time to write even one word about Peer Buddhu Shah and his sons who sacrificed their lives for Guru Ji? 
Tommorow you will ask that why did not Mata Gujri’s Sacrifise not mentioned by Guru.What about Bhai Vachitar Singh?

Das told your stone mind that peer Budhu Shah had casulities and true Army man prefer to talk more of harm to foe then talking about csaulity on own side.

Would you like to discuss a lot about harms evil govt did to our Gurudwara,Kala Afghan Sahib did talk such things when he says that Water of Amritsar can not be Amrit as mnay Singhs dead body were afloat in that,after opratio blue star.


If chariters are written by Guru Ji, then why isn’t chariter katha even done in Gurudwaras? 
It is done at Chavanis of Nihungs,Taksal and Hajuris but there also,there are very few who can understand the stuff and can even pronouce what is written in there.

There are mnay verse in Darbar Sahib,of which,it is not easy to explain and only expert can do.There is one verse of St. Kabeer ,which talks of death of many after one dies.Not all can do Katha or explantion.

They are never even read. Why? 
They are read and read in other countires also

When Akhand Paath of dasam granth is performed, Chariters are read silently. Why if it is Gurbani? 
Stoop lying and spreadin false propoganda.They are there and then read and soon you will have their online Path also avialble.

Why isn’t a Hukamnama taken from chariters? 
It is taken.you do not know,that’s the problem.

What if hukamnama from chariters is taken and hukamnama says call for opium, weed, liquor, morphine, etc. Have a lot of intercourse with all types of women. Are you going to follow the order? Are you going to take drugs? Are you going to have intercourse with all types of women?
By your logic explantion of evil at start of Japu Ji Sahib are more to encourage bad and we read bad in morning daily.
ਅਸੰਖ ਮੂਰਖ ਅੰਧ ਘੋਰ ॥
असंख मूरख अंध घोर ॥
asaNkh moorakh anDh ghor.
Countless fools, blinded by ignorance.
ਅਸੰਖ ਚੋਰ ਹਰਾਮਖੋਰ ॥
असंख चोर हरामखोर ॥
asaNkh chor haraamkhor.
Countless thieves and embezzlers.
ਅਸੰਖ ਅਮਰ ਕਰਿ ਜਾਹਿ ਜੋਰ ॥
असंख अमर करि जाहि जोर ॥
asaNkh amar kar jaahi jor.
Countless impose their will by force.
ਅਸੰਖ ਗਲਵਢ ਹਤਿਆ ਕਮਾਹਿ ॥
असंख गलवढ हतिआ कमाहि ॥
asaNkh galvadh hati-aa kamaahi.
Countless cut-throats and ruthless killers.
ਅਸੰਖ ਪਾਪੀ ਪਾਪੁ ਕਰਿ ਜਾਹਿ ॥
असंख पापी पापु करि जाहि ॥
asaNkh paapee paap kar jaahi.
Countless sinners who keep on sinning.
ਅਸੰਖ ਕੂੜਿਆਰ ਕੂੜੇ ਫਿਰਾਹਿ ॥
असंख कूड़िआर कूड़े फिराहि ॥
asaNkh koorhi-aar koorhay firaahi.
Countless liars, wandering lost in their lies.
ਅਸੰਖ ਮਲੇਛ ਮਲੁ ਭਖਿ ਖਾਹਿ ॥
असंख मलेछ मलु भखि खाहि ॥
asaNkh malaychh mal bhakh khaahi.
Countless wretches, eating filth as their ration.
ਅਸੰਖ ਨਿੰਦਕ ਸਿਰਿ ਕਰਹਿ ਭਾਰੁ ॥
असंख निंदक सिरि करहि भारु ॥
asaNkh nindak sir karahi bhaar.
Countless slanderers, carrying the weight of their stupid mistakes on their heads.
ਨਾਨਕੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਕਹੈ ਵੀਚਾਰੁ ॥
नानकु नीचु कहै वीचारु ॥
naanak neech kahai veechaar.
Nanak describes the state of the lowly.
ਵਾਰਿਆ ਨ ਜਾਵਾ ਏਕ ਵਾਰ ॥
वारिआ न जावा एक वार ॥
vaari-aa na jaavaa ayk vaar.
I cannot even once be a sacrifice to You.
ਜੋ ਤੁਧੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਸਾਈ ਭਲੀ ਕਾਰ ॥
जो तुधु भावै साई भली कार ॥
jo tuDh bhaavai saa-ee bhalee kaar.
Whatever pleases You is the only good done,
Ang 4


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 25, 2006)

*Re: Answering the worng doubts aboout Bani onto Tenth Master*

Gurfateh
Das is happy that all matter has come.By mercy of Akal das will try to answer more false propoganda or doubt if rissan.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 27, 2006)

Gurfateh

Das will today put some errata in what he wrote.

1.He wrote Vidhichand for Dheermal who forecably took Darbar Sahib from Ninth Master.

2.There is stroy of 16th Charitar which appears to be like that of 21st,22nd and 23rd and there is Prostitute over there,A King over there,A Mantra story and Bhang and all such things.

Das read it from book of Ambala Sahib and Kala Afghana Sahib that King(termed Raja also in the this stroy) is refered to Guru Sahib).

Das will tell over here that Kala Afghana Sahib say that King did not have sex only thinking that else he would have pimp or Prostitue in his offspring had he has sex.

But things do not end over here.He goes further to state ,that had condoms been there then he would have gone ahead.He writes that,this King is Guru.

The facts given by THe Khalsa Fauj Ji are also more then sufficinet that,that person can not be Guru.Yet there are four points which shows this kings simlarity with Guru.Das will take care of them.

But coing back to Kala Afghana Sahib JI.

Did not he knew?
1.In Holy Bible he we have stroy of a person,who while doiing intercourse,let his ejacoulation happen on ground(So no seman was transfered in women).This was the way of preventing pragnency in past.(Das confirmed this from our Drkhalsa Ji and Gurpreeet Singh Ji,but das has forgot the term used for that.If they read,they can put it.

2.In one interpretation of Islamic scritpure,we have Feamle being said as field to be toiled from front and back.So some say as per it Anal Sex is OK.And that is mentioned as Guda Bhog in Dasham Granth Sahib but more in terms of homosexaulity(A KIng wants to rape a lady,she sends a Wrestler,in guise of her,He {censored}s the king and king,feels ashamed and defeated).So Anal sex could have been done.Kala Afghana Sahib also terms Bhand as Dalla,Bhand is not pimp or Dalla but Bhand Mirasis are more jokers who come to enertain.Also sometime they play instrumnets while lady dancer dances.

Das hereby give four reasons.
1.King(termed bothas LOrd and King) lives on the banck of Satluj).
2.King has people coming to him and having wishes fullfilled.
3.King at last conceds to spread glory of his lord.
4.Good lot of simlarity with 21st,22nd and 23rd Charitars.

Dissmilirities
1.Name of Prostitue(Termed as Ram Jani ie God is only father(as no one know who is he father) are two but non is Anup Kaur.
2. She her self makes an attire of Harmit.
3.She does occult to win the king.In time when she wnated to meet him and after when he actualy comes to her.
4.She actualy calls people once and tells them that I just had a dream,while she does this to intimedate king.
5.King druhgs her and leaves 60 coins at her back.

But now only das could understand that this king also some schlors wants to say is Guru.But is it True?

Das will explain ,that why das thinks otherwise(to be continued..)


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 28, 2006)

Gurfateh

At the end of 16th Chairtar doubt can come about two lines if they are in First persoan and who could be the speaker?

so dobuts could be 5 and das will adress them .

Then we have some more things to be discussed over here abut Charitars and how Kala Afghana Sahib describe them.

He qoutes that a person called Gyani as Gyani Naryan Singh says that Charitars are Chalitars (or bad charectors as Kala Afghana Sahib wants to interpret)and we should agree to them.

When Same Gyani Say that this Bani is of Tenth Master,then he is wrong but when he rtrys to talk of something which sutis Kala Afghana Sahib,it is OK.

Strange justice of Police officer.

So coming to point what does Charitar means?

If we read Charrector in English we find that it similar in apperance with word Charitar,reason could be both from Sanskrit.If we use Ch in Charectors as ch of change and not k of kill,then Charector will sound similar ot Charitras.

In Hindi and Sanskrit Charecterless is meant by Charitarheen ie Charitar(Charector) and Heen(less),and person with High moral Charector is called Charitarwan ie Charitar(Charector)Wan(posser).

So if some one calls Sirdar Sahib as Charitarwan,he may think that they are abusing him.

Charitar and charectors are same and may rather does not mean bad charectors.It is more a neutral term.(to be continued...)


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 28, 2006)

Gurfateh

Das will end some doubts about 16 Charectors within some days.Akal Bless.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

*Note: It is poet soom sofi, not poet saam sofi. I apologize for the error. Sorry for the mistake.*

“So das does the work by mercy of Bhagaouti.,who is Mahakal and who is Kalaka and who is Akal.
Chariter 20 78
You have drugged your self rather in ego and fear of Hindus.
It is from 21st,22nd and 23rd Chaectors.”
I don’t fear hindus. Why would I fear hindus? I fear Guru and Akaal and I fear the unseen soti (stick) of Akaal. Do you? Anyone saying tria chariters (koke shaster / kaama sutra / kaam shaster) isn’t Sikh and doesn’t fear Akaal at all. Not only that, in 1973, Akaal Takht made it clear that tria chariters isn’t work of Guru Gobind Singh Ji. This was before the derawaala/rss influence on Akaal Takht. All day you talk about drugs and sexual stories and promote them yet you think you are preaching Gurmat. Wake up!
That chariter 20 and 78 thing is not related to anoop kuar story. That is some code I use to find some things. It has nothing to do with noop kuar.
Kal can’t = Akaal. These are opposite words. Just Mahakaal is just bigger kaal and can’t be Akaal. Even though poets shyam, raam and soom sufi think so along with poet kal.
Ashutosh is also bihari and he acts holy too but he has been exposed.
RSS agents promote caste system and divide people into caste system.
Vijaydeep, didn’t you make fun of juts on msn when you talked to me? You thought I believed in caste system but I didn’t. Sikhs don’t believe in caste system, know this well. Tria chariters also divide people into caste and divides people. Anyone promoting it is a promoter of caste system. No wonder nihungs have different Amrit for people belonging to different castes. Damdami Taksal also followed this practice until Kartar Singh became their Jathaydar. However, from recent reports, Akhara pind still follows this and gives leftover Amrit to lower castes. This is direct violation of Guru’s maryada and is direct opposition of the most fundamental principles of Gurmat if not the fundamental principle.

“If Gangu can come there inpersonatiin as good cook then why canot otheer people come.But where is term Prostitute been writtan even once?
Say if some lady tires to indulge in adulatry due to Pagan influence while entering as decent lady how can pure minded Sikhs imagine such thing.Just as they are not ******* like you.
At start of 21 Charitar lady is termed as wife of wealthy.So as per your logic all wives of wealth are protiture including mother of das.Well are your father also wealthy?”
Raamjani means prostitute (Chariter 16). How can pure Guru imagine being fooled by a prostitute?
“Na Oh Mrai Naa Thaagai Jaahay, Jin Kay Raam Vsai Mun Maahai”
So Guru doesn’t get fooled.
What is the star for? What are you trying to call me? Are you losing it? Send that word to me in personal message. Why are you putting statements into my mouth? Where did I say all rich women are prostitutes? Are you going to make you case properly or just confuse people and bash them? What is protiture? Never heard of that word. Someone who can’t even type properly is here to debate on big issues. Why do you care if my father is wealthy? You want money to join the right side? Wives of wealth doesn’t make sense either. When did wealth start having wives? My father won’t give you a penny. He isn’t corrupt and doesn’t indulge in corruption. He doesn’t take anyone’s money and neither does he give money as bribes. He never did it and the whole area around my village knows and everyone respects my dad. Do you have any jealousy issues with my dad? If you want to talk bachitter natak granth with him, send me you phone number. He will call you. Don’t blame me after that he was rude to you. He does have anger management problems. He can’t keep it under control. If you are brave, then postmail me your phone #. Next time have proper sentences and type properly or don’t post. Make your statements precise if you are so smart. I don’t like reading confusing words that don’t exist in the dictionary as I don’t like it and is a waste of time.

“There is no prositure but wife of rich who after entering Anandpur sahib wants to comit dualtray with Guru.If Pama or Parmanada can come in and think of wrong about Langer(as he finds its anti caste)and incite Hindu kings, so is not he more then lady trying to comit adultery.”
Sexual positions are described in many other chariters. Chariter followers should first read history and then chariters? A lot of things would be clear. Someone probably read some tria chariters and had a wet kuschee after which the person didn’t read any more. This is a different situation. This has to do with character defamation (note the spelling) of Guru Ji and has nothing to do with opposition of langer or nagara or whatever you want to link to it. Anyone participating in defamation of Guru’s character is not only a Panth dokhi but is an enemy of society and is not even a human; forget about being a Sikh.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“If Wahiguru is God and Bhauti is God then what why should not there be Manter in Gurmat.
Wahiguru is Gurmanter,Then we have Mool Mantra and as per Bhai Daya Sngh JI Beej Mantra is Sat Sri Akal.
In fact to utter disgusting false propogand by you.In 21st Character,Guru in order to get Mantra did Bhaguti Manana and not Mantra.That is a sort of request to Bhaguti.What is our Ardas?Prtham Bhagouti Simar Kai.”
Bhai Daya Singh rehatnama is not even 50% correct. It has a lot of flaws just like the 4 vedas. Do you even know what character means? It is chariter, not character. Don’t invent your own new definitions of words. Chundee Dee Vaar isn’t Gurbani either so I don’t know what you are on about. Didn’t you know already? Want to report me to Vedanti and get me summoned to Akaal Takht? Vedanti isn’t Akaal Takht jathaydaar, I don’t accept him as Jathaydaar or his buddies who issue hukamnamas against Panthic GurSikhs and give siropas to Panthic dushts. This isn’t false propaganda. I will translate chariter 16, 21, 22, 23 and post the real meaning without have corruption in mind to fool innocent GurSikhs. Why would the writer say Bhagauti? When Guru Ji left, Guru Ji said
Pooja Akaal Dee and not pooja bhagauti dee. It says there was a raja and uses third person. The quotes you posted have English translations which are not correct and it seems like it is 3rd person when it is Bhagat Namdev Ji talking about himself. There is no false propaganda; in fact, there is no propaganda at all. It is all about facts with me.

“This shows you lack in vocabulary,Mantra also means plan.Mantrana means consultation.Mantiri is a consular and final draft is Matta.Have you not heard of Gurmata.”
Lack of vocabulary? Hahaha! At least I don’t invent meanings. Hahaha! Why couldn’t the Guru consult with the jogi (woman) in Darbar? Why did it have to be at night? Maybe you didn’t know but the the jogi also says that with the blessing of Gorakhnaath, the raja won’t go empty handed. Therefore, mantar doesn’t mean consultation but the jantar mantar one. Then it says that the jogi asked raja to send out all the people in presence outside and bring dhoof (sandalwood wick?), deeva (wick lamp), chawal (rice), full (flowers) and good liquor. Then it says that the raja did as ordered. Would someone ever ask Guru to bring liquor when the Guru tells Sikh not to even think about drinking it? If this mantra wasn’t related to the tantar mantar one then what was the need for dhoof, deeva, rice and flowers? How stupid and low are the tria chariter promoters going to get to defame 10th Guru Nanak? I don’t know why these low life skunks are even sent to this planet. There is more to it which I won’t go through right now as the replies are going to be really long anyways. Related chariters will be talked about after. Only rare people have the bibek buddi to realize truth. Only those who really care about Panth and Guru get the real bibek budh. Not those who have personal agendas.

“Man in Guru Granth Sahib there are 74 times term Mantra comes.
Das brings in here only 30.”
Posting unrelated Gurbani quotes and going off topic will not make the statements any more credible. I already proved in the previous post what the word mantra means in that situation.

“When King Shiv Nabh send Harlots to Guru Nanak Dev Ji and he reformed them.Did not those Sri Lankend daughters of Guru had fearlessness beore meeting the Guru?
What about 400 Hundred Pathans who diteched Guru after staying with him.did they not have fear?When Akal wants bad time for sometime or wants to teach that person a lesson.All fear of good is lost in that.Same is happening to you.”
Guru Nanak Dev Ji reformed the dancers easily. It is said that the dancers stopped their misbehavior when they saw Guru Nanak’s. Why didn’t Guru Gobind Singh Ji use the same power to make the prostitute get to the right path? Those pathans weren’t Sikh and were after the money only. When the pathans were gone, they were gone. There should have been fear of God which they didn’t have. Here, it should have been fear of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s shasters. Pathans thought hill rajas would back them up and they would win but they didn’t know how strong the Sikh army was. Too bad they lost. Why are you personally attacking me again? If you want to indulge in personal attacks, come back on msn like last time. On msn you initially said that poet raam, shyam, etc. were names pen names of Guru Ji but when I said it is hindu thing, you backtracked by saying that no, this is what some people say. This is how much truth you have. Looks like the bad times for Dasam Granth chelas are coming, won’t be long before they are kicked out of Gurudwaras and sent packing to their real locations, bollywood, or Hollywood, or some other {censored} khana place because Dasam Granth promoters are nothing but a bunch of kanjars.

“Did not Aurangzeb Had guts to ask Guru to convert to Islam.Sinner is also powerfull and viturus is power full when he defeats sinner.And you know that she was not successsfull.”
Aurangzeb never even talked to Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji, he was in south. Do you even know history? She was successful. She wanted money and she got the 60 coins+. At the start of the chariter it clearly says what the motive of the woman was. Chariter followes should read the chariters before they debate on them. Looks like the chariter followers only read the posted quotes and make up garbage to justify they are Gurmat. Gurmat is so cheap that any garbage can be linked to my Guru. Gurmat is priceless but what would a sarkaree agent know about it?

“Why did not Guru knew Gangu Pandit?Guru here also knew about her but whated to make a lesson for us.
Guru knew everything then why did he had faithn in false outght of cow and Kuran by Hindus and Muslimm indavders respectively?
He knew but he had to work Kautak.(acts to teach Sikhs lesson on world).”
Gangu was just a cook and he betrayed the Sahibzadas, Mata Ji and Guru Ghur. Guru Sahib knew it and it doesn’t harm the image of Guru Ji. It doesn’t defame Guru Ji but it promoted the greatness of Guru Ji and the sahibzadas and mata ji. It set an example for Sikhs to keep their Khalsa spirits. It was the Shaheedi of Sahibzadas and Guru Ji which enraged the Sikhs to destroy Sihund and take charge. It wasn’t hanuman chalisa or 24 avtar as RSS agents say. Guru Hargobind Singh Ji started the singing of Dhadi Vars to instill bir russ into Sikhs. Garbage like 24 avtars isn’t needed. That is work of poet Shyam anyways. As the opening of it stated “Burnutt Shyam Juthaa Mutt Bhaa-ee” meaning “Shyam states narrates the stories according to his knowledge/understanding.” The only lesson taught from tria chariters is women are evil and do bad things and should not be trusted. Sikhs had already learned not to get into other women by Guru Nanak and Bhai Gurdass’s vars make it clear. Don’t tell me tria chariters give better lesson the Guru Granth Sahib Ji. There is also something called Sikh rehat maryada which tells Sikhs what to do and what not to do. Character defamation can’t be accepted at kautak and neither can be {censored} poetry. If someone doesn’t believe me, just look at the situation of saad babas. They promote Dasam Granth and are the biggest kanjars and kaamis. Their bhoras aren’t made for bhugtee but to drag girls there and rape them. Don’t get mad at me and harass me, just read the newspapers and the person would understand.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“There is pricess in Bharatpur and MP of BJP called Krishendra Kaur.Kaur is word related to work and non Sikhs also use that.Term Koer and not Kaur is writtan for Anup Koer.But for you Tainka and Tatta are one and the same.”
What is pricess? I can’t find that word in dictionary. Did the writer mean prices? Doesn’t make sense. Tainka is t and tuttaa is q. Someone who doesn’t know how to properly read Punjabi or understand Punjabi (self admitted) is teaching me how to read Punjabi. Now biharis are going to teach Punjabis how to read Punjabi. What is the world coming to? I didn’t say there aren’t other kaurs. Where did I say other people can’t be kaurs? However, how do you know that the person isn’t trying to defame the Sikh Kaurs?

“Are you awawe that there is place near Vaishnu Devi called Adi Kuwari and in south as Kanya Kumari.Kumari means doughter.”
What is awawe? I have never seen that word in dictionary either. Kuare kuAir does mean kumari also but in Punjab people don’t have names like that. Kaur also means princess. So the lady can be a Sikh girl in chariters 21-23 but who knows what poet the poet means. It is not like the poet was a Sikh. Raam, Shyam, Kal or Soom aren’t Sikhs. Do you think I care about your vaishnu devi? She is just mythical like 24 avtar.

“No even a single time term came Anup Kaur.Term is noop Ku-ari to be pronounced as Noop Kuwari.”
True that it doesn’t come as Anoop Kaur but it is not Noop Ku-ari either. It is Noop Kuar. It is very important to learn to pronounce Gumukhi. Learning the alphabet isn’t good enough to pronounce Punjabi words.
Kuare kuAir does have 2 meanings:

A girl under 5 years old
A princess. (what is the last name of Sikh women?)
 
“But if a prostitute also becomes Amritdhari we have no problem.
Did not term prostitue come in Guru Granth Sahib?
Have look.Guru ranth Sahib Ji talked of reforming them too.”
I don’t accept prostitutes becoming Amritdhari. This is too much. Prostitute must live a good life as juttee jqI sutte for like 10-15 years before she can be called Amritdhari. Here I mean juttee jqI  according to Gurmat and not according to brahmnical philosophy. When did I say Guru Granth Sahib Ji doesn’t talk about reforming bad people? RSS agents should be reformed too. So should be tria chariter followers. However, some pass the line and are too far to be reformed. Where did I say that the term prostitute doesn’t come in Guru Granth Sahib Ji? People should respect Guru Granth Sahib Ji and shouldn’t say “Guru ranth Sahib Ji”. Thirty points aren’t needed to prove a point. For me, one Gurbani tukh is enough. Proves that there is no need for tria chariters and there is no way it could have been written by Guru Ji, especially when the poets clearly identify themselves. I will post quotes later. Remind me if I don’t as I have a fairly busy schedule.

“Another non snese thing.
Listen son
You are helping your hindu family.Hindus can have name Anup Kumari(this not even a single time comes in any Charitar).
Why das says that you help hindus.Since times before Muslims came Hindus have tradtions of prostitues.They were refered as Ganika,Veshya etc.And such names are used in Guru Granth Sahib.There is mention of one Urdu name called {censored} also but in Punjabi that is meant by widow.
Other names are Tawaif and kidli.Das could not found a single in that character you are after ie 21 to 23.And lastly since the time before Muslims came to this date it is as per regious santity that Hindus have devdasis ie Prostitutes in temples.And they were mostly Muslim?”
What is non snese? Did the writer mean non sneeze? What does sneezing have to do with tria chariters? Is it abshagun? Gurmat doesn’t believe in sagans or absagans. I help everyone who asks for help. I think good for all in the world. World is in turmoil and will stay this way until Akaal does blessing. Of course hindus have prostitutes. That is why those types of people wrote tria chariters so they can pull the Sikhs to the same boat but it will not happen. Sikhs are waking up and will take charge when Akaal orders. Your knowledge on prostitutes doesn’t help promote kaam shaster as Guru written. It is still the work of soom, raam, shyam and kal. I not talking about prostitutes in mandirs. Mandirs have a tradition of having devdaasis. Mandirs in still have them. A lot of other ones were Muslim.

“And this lady is just at strart being mentioned as wife of wealthy?Are you blind?”
This is another direct attack to disrespect me. Where did I noup kuar was poor? Quote it. Why are two chariters being mixed up? Chariters 21-23 and 16 are different. They should not be fixed. If the difference between chariters can’t be hold by some people, how can they tell the difference between Gurbani and stories of corruption? Gurmat is about Guru and Akaal. Gurbanis connects the person to Akaal and brings peace of mind while tria chariters make all relationships in the world questionable. E.g. No one is willing to accept such garbage as tria chariters as Gurbani unless the person is anti-Panthic or uneducated.

“so scholar like you is great and wants world to move as you want.”
I want world to focus on Guru Granth Sahib Ji and discard anything which defames Guru Ji or questions the social structure of society. If Dasam Granth is read by everyone, say goodbye to all relationships in the world.

“Seeing Guru as per Gurbani is not the physical body but Guru over there is Akal.so seeing Guru is realsinsation of Truth.do you think that you show some bad person Guru Granth sahib and he will losse lust etc.?
Did not Pathan who stabbed Guru also seen physical form of Guru.Fact is that Guru is beyoond any form and Ten Master made us more towards that.
But you still go after phyiscal form and want to decide who is Sikh or who is not.Very well.”
Without understanding, nothing is gained. Understanding is the key. Did the woman understand? No she didn’t. She didn’t accept she was wrong so then there is issue (chariter 16). I am talking about the personality of the Guru and not the physical attributes. My mistake if I wasn’t clear. Pathan was just a gdaar like tria chariter promoters and had no gyan or dhyan. Without gyan and dhyan, the person is lost. Pathan was brainwashed by mullas just like Dasam Granth promoters brainwash their students. However, in Sikhi, both physical form and internal form must be inline with Gurbani. Guru has power to change the mind of people if wanted. E.g. Said Khan. Everyone has a weakness except Guru Ji. There are words which change even the worst of the worst. E.g. Guru Nanak Dev Ji changing Sajjan Thug, Kauda Bheel, etc.; Guru Aangad Dev Ji changing Hmaayu and others. Guru Gobind Singh Ji changing Said Khan, Dulla and then finally changing Aurangzeb. However, this woman talked back to Guru and had no honor. More flaws in these chariters will be exposed when translations are done. They will be done so Sikhs are no longer fooled by RSS propaganda.
Guru Ji says
“Saabat Soorat Dastaar Siraaa” so physical saroop is also important.

“1.Baba Srichand Ji as per you were not OK(das respects him).
2.Datu Ji were son of One Guru and kicked the succeeding Guru.
3.Baba Mohan also did not cooprate with Foruth Guru.
4.Then what about Prithwi chand?Did not Chandu also see the Guru and did not Jallad se him?
5.As we move further Bidhichand,did he not see the Guru?
6.By the way if we go by your logic just presetnig any bad man in front of Guru Granth Sahib JI,all will be reformed.
7.Then near Decca there were tow villages Guru told one to get uprooted as they were good people and they will spread good things and ,to bad guys Guru told to reamin settled.So did not those Bad guys swa Guru.”
Baba Siri Chund was not a Sikh. He started his own mutt. He didn’t stay much with Guru Nanak Dev Ji so he didn’t have the understanding. Datu was inflicted by ego and wanted to be Guru just like those labeled sants and brahmgyanis. They also want to be called Guru thus defame Guru Ji by linking Guru Ji to ******* poetry such as tria chariters. However, they know that if they directly claim to be Guru, they will be kicked out like narakdharis and kookas. Baba Mohan gave pothis to Guru Arjan Dev Ji as per some sakhis but it is not true. Bani was handed over to Guru from Guru. This is not true. These are just Sakhis made up. Prithvi was run by ego and had wanted to be Guru. As for jallad, jallad was just doing as ordered. He didn’t want to make Guru Ji Shaheed. He also killed Chundoo after, if you didn’t know. Chandu was a terrorist and was with jahagir. This is history and doesn’t defame Guru Ji but does praise of Guru Ji as it shows how Guru Ji didn’t fear, didn’t change Bani and didn’t bow to anti-Panthic forces to please them. This is totally different from tria chariters. If someone can’t tell the difference then there are personal issues to take care of. Dheermal was from Guru Khaandaan and wanted to be Guru so this is also a different case. He it does Guru Upma again as Guru Sahib recited Adi Granth Sahib from spiritual strength again. This does praise of Guru again. The bad people and good people story isn’t related in this situation. They didn’t see Guru because they didn’t have the understanding. It doesn’t fault the Guru. What can Guru do if the chela is blind? Gurbani says this. However, the chariter situation is different. It is defaming Guru Ji by saying Guru Ji got fooled by a woman full of lust. I don’t know all these points are related? It is a totally different situation. If tria chariter followers want to question Guru by saying Guru wasn’t all powerful, then that is their issue. It is unbelievable on how low the people are willing to do to promote tria chariters but if we think about it, it isn’t hard to understand. Thos who can link garbage written by shyam, raam, kal and soom to Guru Ji, they won’t have trouble attacking Guru Ji in other situations either. May Akaal give them some wisdom and understanding and show them the light of truth.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“It is not Jesus like thing where body is worshipped.The Guru when is seen is seen in all and is not in one body but in all bodies.”
Where is the quote where I said to worship the body? Am I worshipping the body or are those who say chariters are bani just because it says Paatshai 10 at the start. How hard is it to write Paatshahi 10 at the start of a book? Poets raam, shyam, kal and soom identify themselves and say we are the ones writing these then how does it come to be Guru Gobind Singh Ji?

“First rectify the figure.It is one by 125000 and you talk of 100000 so you are 25000 less.
so yuo wanted Guru to show miracle.Had he jhas to show,he would have done it in while staying at Chamkaur Garhi.”
That number is wrong too. 20,000 per month = 120,000 for 6 months. Guru Sahib doesn’t show miracles as they aren’t Gurmat but Guru still is the knower of all. Why would Guru go to place where his integrity would be attacked? Doesn’t make sense and as for miracle, making 40 fight against countless is a miracle. Escaping alive from the fortress while the attackers were challenged to catch Guru Ji was a miracle which people and cult followers fail to realize.

“Once Gurus camp was looted,And Sikhs asked him why this Bhana Happned?
Guru said 'that there is a power bigger then him and that controls all'.That defeat was way to let people know that not to worship Guru but Akal.”
When did I say worship Guru? This thread isn’t about Sakhis. Akaal is above all and no one needs to tell me that.

“But you may make an idol of Guru or treat Guru Granth Sahib Ji as idol whithout knowing Akal.Guru did say in Vachitar Natak that people trying to call him Primal god will go to hell.”
Those who just read Guru Granth Sahib Ji without understanding are doing idol worship. Bachitter natak isn’t Gurbani either. Document on this will come later. Bachitter natak is also full of flaws. E.g. No mention of Peer Buddu Shah but mention of Sango Shah, Peer Buddu Shah wasn’t martyred in the battle. He was given a lot of respect by Guru Ji and Guru Ji asked what he wished for and he was given what he wished for. 

“But in story it is written that there in that place Lord was alone(he went there to meet Magan but a lady was there,Who said that if Lord does not commit Adultary,she will kill him or will shout.In both case there was to be charctor assination.In former case Lord did not want to kill a lonely lady,In second case ,it happened that she shouted and lord grabed her brother and befooled her followers who thought him to be a Thief.And her brother went to jail and Lord reached back safe and sound”
How was the lady going to kill Guru? Guru Ji could have taken away whatever she wanted to use to kill him. Guru Ji didn’t have to kill her. Did she have some automatic gun which she was going to use to kill Guru? Why was Guru fooling people? It says raja grabbed the beard of her brother, why is that part being skipped? It also says the turban was grabbed off from the brother’s head. Why was this poor guy put in trouble and shamed? Is this what the Guru did to others? So Guru acted as a thug? What happened to the teachings that never grab a person’s turban even if the person is enemy. Even the Sikhs in old times never attacked a turban or beard of a pathan or mughal who was fighting them. Guru forgot his own teaching? Where did the woman suddenly get sewaks with weapons? Was she a leader of a group? Woman had her brother in town but where was her husband? Didn’t the servants know who Guru Gobind Singh Ji was? Even the enemies respected character of Sikhs and had to call Sikhs lions to show respect. In tria chariters, their Guru’s character is put in question in a city established by Guru Tegh Bahadur and nourished by Guru Gobind Singh Ji. How many servants did she have? 3? 5? Were they hard to handle for Guru Ji? There are more flaws they will be talked about later with translations of these chariters.

“Wait there man it seems that you are paranoid and *******ed.Term Pani Pamri is written that means rich footwear.Term Panhi comes only when that lady is summoned in the court.And Panhi means blanket.As we have to fight and run both footwears like Chappel and blanket are not handy.As you may never have fought and if you want you can wear them and see how good could you fight ,Lord,when lady shouted, leaft shoe and blanket and them made her brother get cought by her own men.It was only after when Lord refuse to commit Adultary then she wanted to trap lord,then in order to face dangers handly did lord removed hindrances.
did not Guru use to put gold in arrow to kill enemy so that with mony of that arrow enmy fmaily can get funaral done?”
What is that word which has been starred? Can it be post mailed or emailed to me? It is not pani (water), it is pnee (footwear). Paamree is blanket. There was no running in this chariter. It says it was forgotten. When did Guru start forgetting? Last time I read Guru Granth Sahib Ji, it said that Guru and Kartar don’t make mistakes. When the brother was already labeled as the thief and sent to jail, then what was the need to run? Who was going to fight? Why were those items taken to woman if they weren’t to be used? Guru made mistake?

“It is state of seeing Akal in all and not the seeig of Phyiscal body.Do not you think that Baba Maan Singh Of Pehva saw and read Guru Granth Sahib?”
Mann Pehova doesn’t sing Gurbani. He sings kuchee bani and loots people. He doesn’t even follow Guru Granth Sahib Ji it is same and never reading. He doesn’t even follow the first concept which is kirat kurna. Not only that, his rapes are the result of tria chariters. He read most of the tricks in Dasam Granth. He isn’t the only one. More saad baabas are exposed daily and some went unexposed but Akaal knows all.

“How dare did a prostitute threaten Guru Ji?
Did not Hindu Kings and Moghuls also threatened Guru and they were worse then prostitues.
Did not Sodi of Kartarpur said bad words for Guru.What about Brahmins of Kurukshetras?They also said wrong things to Guru?
Anyone who is to go for wrong time gets non sense mind and say wrong things to Guru like you are doing.”
Hindu rajas and mughals had armies, weapons and cannons. They didn’t threaten Guru Ji face to face. They talked smack in the back just like general from Delhi. These guys don’t even have the guts to come in front of Guru face to face and lay a challenge. She wasn’t a soldier. If it was a soldier, then it is a different situation as fighting skills drive ego to the top. What did a prostitute have to back her up? What fighting skills did she have? Sodis were again family members of Guru and were descendents of Guru family and did have firepower. Brahmans were high in number but they were shamed and accepted their faults. I like to hear facts. Those who follow and promote tria chariters are in their bad times and don’t realize the truth. They are lost and guided by maya. Their personal agendas and motives will only ruin their reputation and tria chariters will never ever be accepted as work of Guru Gobind Singh Ji because it isn’t.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“Lord went to know about Plan and he knew that Magan a man will be there,who came on behest of lady.
Even if we deem it spell,Going of lord was more in line of First Maste goig to
1.Haridwar to expose superstition
2.To Kalijug Panda to remove myth about miracle he was showing.
3.To Jaggananth to expose myth about Arti.
4.to Mecca,to expose that God is not restricted to any direction.
He did not go there to worship.Anyway after reading this text of Charitrano one will belive in going to learn Mantra from anybody.So purpose of Charitar is done.”
This statement of learning plan is more jokes than Mr. Bean. What plan? Why does Guru need to learn plans? Doesn’t Guru know anything? Isn’t Guru sumruth (all powerful?). If it wasn’t to learn mantar, then why was it given importance? When did this happen? What is charitrano? Is it an Italian word? What is purpose of this chariter? Give money to a prostitute? Grab beards of innocent people? Beat up innocent people?

“Akal ill reborn you as a Hindu and then you will speak lies as per your faith.In Charitars 21 to 23rd it is not at all written.And do tell otherwise where it is written?”
Did I say that 60 coins is written in chariters 21-23? It is written in chariter 16. RSS and derawalas are hindufied and make a living from lies. The number of lies aren’t even countable. Another lie is made to cover up previous one. Wise people are the ones who accept mistakes and move on. As long there is corruption in the mind, the person can never be true to Guru. If the person can’t be true to Guru, the person can’t be true to Akaal thus the person can’t get liberation.

“That lady tried to spread disinfo about lord.Lord preempted this by saying that his stuff is lost and any Sikh who retrive it will get no death coming near to him.That may mean teqaching of Weapoanry or Gurmat teaching.It may not mean salvation as you write.”
Guru Sahib gave Gurmat and weapon training to all Sikhs regardless of anything. Weapon training doesn’t protect anyone from death. Gurmat does however. Kaal means time or death. Both of which can’t be God. God is beyond both and is thus Akaal.

“No Sikhs,who got hold of Lady had along side bought the items as proof of her stealing from Lord.Do not tell lies.Lord ordered them to do so.That happened when lord came to know from Sikhs about her having a defomation campaign.”
Where is the lie? What was so special about those shoes and shawl that Guru Ji wanted to end someone’s cycle of birth and death for that shawl and that pair of shoes? When the woman was brought, weren’t the items brought with her? This is what the chariter says. Raja told the followers to find the culprit and it says that the followers couldn’t resist and told who it was. There are two points to note here:

If the raja knew, then why didn’t the raja just tell the followers to retrieve it from the place?
Since the raja knew, why did the raja ask lie? What was the need to lie here?
 
“do yuo know that Guru used to give medicine via Bhai Ghannaya to people who were injuiered even from opponent side.So you can ask how and why for that also?Hard eaerned mony of Sikhs been givne to those who came to kill Sikhs?”
What about Gurus putting gold in arrow so that kins to victum of that arrow get his funral done by that Gold.”
Giving medicine to serve humanity is different from giving money to prostitutes. Wasn’t noup kuar rich anyways? Why was money given to her? A lot of the soldiers who came to fight Guru Ji didn’t fight because they wanted to fight but because it was their duty. Guru Ji attached the gold so the sanskar could be done properly. Sanskars were mostly done by undertakers who had no relations to the army guys. Mughals left their dead bodies to rot. Undertaker needs to feed family too so Guru Ji gave it as a pay for hard work. These aren’t Singhs mentioned in tria chariters who are shows as stupid and dumb and dysfunctional. This is Babbars Akalis here who use the brain to prevent munmutt from coming into Sikhi.

“When she was indoctrionated( into good faith),as in inscentive,for doing good even to bad, Lord gave him expenditure of six month packed.”
What good faith was she trained into? Prostitute never agreed and raja just ran while she was drugged up. As for Noup Kuar, she agreed not to fool around with Guru but what about the others? Wasn’t Noup Kuar already rich? What was the need to give her money? All it does is promotes lusty ladies to use Guru Ghur was a place of money collection.

“Is there no verse in Guru Granth Sahib,which is in past tense?And should same logic of your be applied over there? Whichy tense is this?”
Tukhs related to Guru Hargobind Sahib are past tense because it is an event of the past. I am not talking about the event but the location and Guru. It says there was a raja. There was a place called Anadpur (meaning after the destruction). You can’t even type proper English and are from Bihar. What would you know about Punjab and tenses and Gurmukhi? All you do is make person attacks and try to act clever.
Gurbani says “Sahas Sianpaa Lukh Hoahey Taa Ik Naa Chullay Naal”
So leave the cleverness and realize the truth.

“If I and me work here then why are they not working in 71st Charitar or say discourse over as in 21st one?
Have you got something or not?
All bani is work of Akal and there is no pattern of first,secod or third being fixed.”
What is the post about here? Is it about the use of third person and first person? This is because the tria chariters are flawed. The writers are inconsistent and don’t even know what they are talking about. You can ask the sodak committee about this. They are the ones who mixed up the writings of the poets.

“Why there is third person over here?
Ang 1165 and 1166”
*sultaan poochhai sun bay naamaa.*
_The Sultan said, "Listen, Naam Dayv:_
*daykh-a-u raam tumHaaray kaamaa. ||1|| *
_let me see the actions of your Lord."||1||_
*naamaa sultaanay baaDhilaa. *
_The Sultan arrested Naam Dayv,_
*daykh-a-u tayraa har beethulaa. ||1|| rahaa-o. *
_and said, "Let me see your Beloved Lord."||1||Pause||_
*bismil ga-oo dayh jeevaa-ay. *
_Bring this dead cow back to life._
*naatar gardan maara-o thaaN-ay. ||2|| *
_Otherwise, I shall cut off your head here and now."||2||_
*baadisaah aisee ki-o ho-ay. *
_Naam Dayv answered, "O king, how can this happen?_
*bismil kee-aa na jeevai ko-ay. ||3||*
_No one can bring the dead back to life. ||3||_
This is not third person. It is still first person. Gurmukhi understanding is needed to realize that this is not third person.

“Are you made or fool or too much clever who tells so much of lies?
Das gives word to word tranalation of Charectors 21,22,23 and 71 and there term Rai is used and not Raja,where is term Raj used other that and that also for Guru?Tell it?
And Rai means Lord and not the King.So term Rai is used for Akal.Ham Ghar Ram Rai..
Mere Ram Rai.” 
This is again more jokes than Mr. Bean. How did Rai become Akaal? Akaal Purakh came into body and was participating in tria chariters? Weird. I request Gurbani tukhs must not be misused to confuse and act smart with those who don’t know much about Gurmat Gyan. Those who do will not be fooled. Even if the word Rai is translated as Gobind Rai, it is still the same situation and has same meaning. Do chariter followers know what Akaal means? Akaal can’t have chariters and can’t be physical. Proper aarth of mool mantar must be learnt.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“So Akal can not be termed as Rai.Wait.
You want to question that Sixth Master gave Guruship to his grand son with namr Har Rai.Was not name of Tenth Master also Gobind Rai, Before he became Singh?
So who so ever gave surname Rai,to Gurus,were not OK as per you”
Where did I say it was not okay to have Rai as a last name? Once again this has nothing to do with Akaal. Looks like tria chariter promoters are losing it.

“You are lier.Sikhs on order of Lord borugght the thief lady with items which were as per lord were stolen.
Sikhs got hold of a lady,who was wofe of wealthy and who was accused of stealing the stuff of the lord.”
Once again, there is no lie as I made my intention clear. Items were with the lady. They were brought back with her when she was brought to Rai (raja) as per the story. Why was she accused of stealing when she didn’t? Sikhs are free to make false accusations to people on something they didn’t do and defame them? I ask the admin, is it okay to launch direct personal attacks on people? Guru did it in Dasam Granth so can we do on your website too? Guru Sahib said something and did something. Weird!

“Lord in the story did not Go to women,But was cold by man called Magan(agent of Lady).Had Lord was easy to go to Lady she should have come her self calling him in night.Lord Saw lady only after he entered the camp.and became thoughtfull.”
Magan as per the story is a Sikh of Guru. He lied to Guru? Is the story saying that Sikhs have been cheating with Guru since Guru Ji’s times? Gangu wasn’t Sikh so he didn’t belong but what about Magan? What punishment was he given? He was reason for all the trouble. A sikh had not shame in lying to Guru? Didn’t Guru know the Sikh is lying? Didn’t the Guru think before agreeing to go to learn mantar at night? Once again, why was Magan linking Guru to a woman wanting to fulfill lust? If Guru was to help the lady get to right path, then why didn’t the Guru just go to her? What was the need for Magan? Why was he surprised to see the woman then? Think about it. There is still time for tria chariter followers to join the Panthic side and realize the truth but it looks like that time is running out.

“No it is written that people came,who were followers of lady.Lord held her brother,made him uncontious with muthahiri,If you want to have taste of it,Das can help you.And then by that time Lord’s Sikh took her borther to jail or Lord.Lord reached back to his home safely.”
I already discussed this before. Don’t want to waste time saying the same thing again. What does or mean? Is there confusion? If the person debating is confused then why is the person debating? Are threats being made here? If yes, they don’t bother me. In one ear and out the other.

“As you blames other for that,may be you are such type o prostitues visiters obsessed by *****s.She is writan as wife of rich man and who call her protitute?Strange?”
How hard is to pick up a newspaper and see the kartoots (misdeeds) of so called Sants and/or Brahmgyanis. How many times are they exposed? Someone who has worked at Akaal Takht and read complaints of innocent girls would know how bad these tria charier promoters are. Girls are constantly raped and molested. Even young boys aren’t spared. Why do these guys have so much lust? One reason, Dasam Granth promoters.

“”Aren’t you disrespecting Guru Ji in countless ways by saying these chariters are written by Guru Ji?””
“People disrecpect Akal by un having faith and spreading lies about Charectors.”
So it is okay to disrespect Guru Ji by linking him to tria chariters which are written by raam, shyam, soom and kal? This is also a copyright violation of those poets and their descendents can take the chariter promoters to courts. Two wrongs don’t make a right. Most people are naastiks due to literature like tria chariters.

“Do you knw that there are mnay names for Guru Granth Sahib.
Adi Granth.Darbar Sahib,Guru Granth Saib,Adi Guru Darbar.
One version is refere by Gyani Gyan Singh JI as one of Tenth Master.So as per your logic some one can talk ill of our Eternal Guru.”
Adi Granth was name before GuruShip and Guru Granth Sahib is the current name. Adi Guru Darbar doesn’t make sense and is made up by Dasam Granth and sarbloh granth chelas to promote their 2 granths. It is also called Dasam Paatshah Kaa Granth because final changes were done by 10th paatshah. This is flawed logic because names weren’t changed. They were just used to describe Baba ji.

“Das wil give you thre versions of Guru Granth Sahib JI.
1.Mithi Beerh(of Kartarpur Sahib)
2.Khari or Bhai Bannu Wali Beerh(of Kanpur)
3.Damdami Beerh(our present Guru).”
So Bhai Mani Singh version is only respected copy of Dasham Granth Sahib.”

Kartarpuri Bir doesn’t have Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji’s bani and isn’t GuruShip holder. Khari Beer was rejected right away and has nothing to do with Gurbani. Gurbani is the same in that bir also. It is just that some things are added to that Bir, which aren’t correct. Bhai Mani Singh Bir doesn’t have a lot of the things you promote. It isn’t authentic either. Therefore, there are issues. It wasn’t called Dasam Granth. If you look at old ones, it says bachitter natak granth and not Dasam Granth.

“This is rather as good news if it is true.So far Kala Afghana Sahib used to say that writer himself can not write his own name at start like Guru Gobind Singh Ji can not write Sri Mukhwak Patshahi Dasvin ,but some other could write that.So you are removing that error.”
Guru Gobind Singh Ji didn’t write Dasam Granth. The writers put Mukhwak Paatshahi 10 say that this is written by Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Have you ever read Malcolm? Read it and you will be clear about Dasam Granth.

“Tommorow you will ask that why did not Mata Gujri’s Sacrifise not mentioned by Guru.What about Bhai Vachitar Singh? Das told your stone mind that peer Budhu Shah had casulities and true Army man prefer to talk more of harm to foe then talking about csaulity on own side.”
Yea, why weren’t they mentioned? Why was Sangho Shah mentioned? Why was Kirpal Dass Udasi mentioned? Why was arrow piercing mentioned? There is just one reason why Peer Ji isn’t mentioned and that is because he was Muslim. This casualty statement doesn’t hold much weight because in Khalsa Panth, dying for good cause is the best. Peer Buddu Shah wasn’t Shaheed anyways. So he was still alive. It is very easy to label others stone mind or whatever. Khalsa army was always different from other armies. Others can’t be compared to Khalsa. Singhs never did exercise or parade. Sikh history is all about sacrifices and greatness of them. What is greater than Peer Buddu Shah coming to fight? It is an honor and not disrespect.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“Would you like to discuss a lot about harms evil govt did to our Gurudwara,Kala Afghan Sahib did talk such things when he says that Water of Amritsar can not be Amrit as mnay Singhs dead body were afloat in that,after opratio blue star.”
I would discuss but not in this thread. Don’t take this thread off topic.

“It is done at Chavanis of Nihungs,Taksal and Hajuris but there also,there are very few who can understand the stuff and can even pronouce what is written in there.
There are mnay verse in Darbar Sahib,of which,it is not easy to explain and only expert can do.There is one verse of St. Kabeer ,which talks of death of many after one dies.Not all can do Katha or explantion.”
Nihungs are just a bunch of criminals and don’t have a clue what they are talking about. Most of them are from criminal backgrounds and became nihungs to escape police. If you don’t believe me, then check their records. Professionals trained can do katha of hard verses also. Taksal doesn’t allow bibis to Mehta Chownk to get santhya of Dasam Granth from what I checked last time. Don’t know about now. Nihungs are the same people who say Sikhs can shave hair around private parts and say it is okay to take drugs. They also don’t mind sex with others. They basically do all the kurehits except hahal. Hajur and Patna has hindu maryada anyways and are under control of RSS. You can talk about Taksal in the Taksal thread.

“They are read and read in other countires also”
They might be read in front of men only but not in Sangat with everyone sitting there. How come they aren’t read at Akaal Takht or Darbar Sahib?

“Stoop lying and spreadin false propoganda.They are there and then read and soon you will have their online Path also avialble. It is taken.you do not know,that’s the problem.”
We will see when the path comes online. There is no lying or false propaganda. Ask anyone who has gone to hajur or patna. Everyone knows what they do and how they do.

“By your logic explantion of evil at start of Japu Ji Sahib are more to encourage bad and we read bad in morning daily.”
Do you even know how hukamnama is taken? Do you know what that pauri means but this topic isn’t about aarth of Japuji Sahib so it shouldn’t be discussed here. Once again, false allegations are being made. Where did Japuji Sahib come from? Who is the low enough to compare Japuji Sahib to garbage like tria chariters.

 “”What is the purpose of tria chariters? Why were they written?””
“There are mnay reasons a few
1.To let Sikhs know that there could be sin benath pous looking Hindus or Muslims.
2.To send Decoded message which Sikh can only understand and non Sikhs should not even have imagination that it could be a work of Guru.”
Are all Sikhs good? Are all Hindus bad? Are all Muslims bad? Plus, what does it have to do with Muslims or Hindus? It is tria chariters. Not Muslim or Hindu chariters. Many stories are between Hindus and Muslims. What does that have to do with Sikhism? It has absolutely nothing to do with Gurmat. Not only that, a lot of the chariters aren’t tria chariters. Many are incomplete. The total isn’t 404 or 405 either as at many places, a chariter is divided into two small ones for no reason. Poet says this is the 16th story while the count says it is 17th. Looks like the writers and compilers didn’t know how to count. What does a brother and sister having sex got to do with Sikhism? How about mother and son or father and daughter having sex got to do with Sikhism? All these stories do is make social relationships questionable. This is part of a master plan and it links to 24th avtar of 24 avtars. This is to ruin the identity of Sikhs. These immoral stories have absolutely nothing to do with Sikhism and must be sent to trash or recycle bin as soon as possible.

““Why do they waste almost half of bachitter natak granth?””
“It is not a waste.”
How do the chariter promoters know that it is not a waste? How do chariters connect me to Akaal? The fact is that they don’t even connect me to Guru, forget about connecting to God. Tria chariters also put the character of women into question. Do the chariter followers question their own wives? My bad! Haha! They don’t get married and rely on women of others to fulfill their lust.

Gr kI nwir iqAwgY AMDw] pr nwrI isau GwlY DMDw]
Ghur Kee Naar Tiagai Undaa, Purr Narree Sei Ghaalai Dhundaa
The blind forsakes own wife and looks to indulge in wrong activity with other women. E.g. Predators like Maan Pehova, Shamsher Jagera and many others. This is also true or military guys e.g. from America, India, Pakistan and other countries.

To indulge in sexual activity with another’s wife is bujjar kurehit or cardinal wrong and the person no longer remains a Sikh. Same rule applies to the one who cuts hair or takes intoxicants or eats halal.

“”Are poet shyam, kal, saam soofi, and raam your Gurus?””
“Kal,Ram and Shyams are name for Akal and so is name Mahakal,This tells that this is work of Akal and not human.There is no other Guru but Akal.Where is Saam Soofi writtan? Saam has some meaning in Arebic and Sufi has some meaning in Farsi.”
How did poets become Akaal? Are the chariter followers thinking alright? Raam derived from Ramaya meaning absorbed everywhere is used for Raam. Not poet Raam. In Gurbani, there is no direct use of word Shyam to mean God. It has been “Syam Sundar” basically. Even if we accept Syam to mean God in Dasam Granth, the aarths of those lines won’t make sense as God doesn’t write poetry. God is Akaal and isn’t like Mahakal with physical characteristics. God also isn’t an alcohol drinker like Mahakal or followers of Mahakal. Tria chariters make it clear that a Sikh of Mahakal drinks liquor. The word poet comes before Syam, Raam, etc. many times. These will be proven later in a different article about the poets identifying themselves. These articles might take half a year to arrive due to busy schedule. No promises are being made here to have the articles up anytime soon.

““What if tria chariter are thrown in the garbage or burned? Is it paap?””
“If you want you can do it,In Gurmat,there is nothing Pap or Punya.Later on you can say that as Sinfull Raagmala is part of Darbar Sahib,whole should follow the same fate?”
I said tria chariters thrown in the garbage. Not everything in Dasam Granth. It shows the lack of faith in Guru and the motive is only to promote Dasam Granth and anything is acceptable to do so; even if it is attack on Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Raagmaala can be talked about in a separate Raagmaala thread. This is about Dasam Granth here. Lets put paap and punya aside. There is definitely wrong and right in Gurmat. If no, then there is no need for rehat or anything else. Why do RSS agents keep attacking Guru Granth Sahib Ji? They don’t want to use Guru Granth Sahib Ji because their mission is to promote Sarbloh Granth and Dasam Granth to the status of being Guru. These plans will not pass and will fail again like they failed at the start of early 20th century.

““Were Sikhs reading tria chariters before bachitter natak granth got created?””
“Were Sikhs reading Bani of Ninth Master when Fist Master complied Guru Granth Sahib Ji ?”
First master never compiled Guru Granth Sahib Ji. This is a lie. When 9th master was Guru, Sikhs read his bani and his bani is included in Guru Granth Sahib Ji so there is no issue. 9th master was 9th Nanak so his bani is same as that of Guru Nanak so this is just another attack on 10 Paatshahis and Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Tria chariters are no where close to being writings of Guru Sahib so then how can they be compared to beautiful Sloaks of 9th Nanak or beautiful Shabads of 9th Nanak. The 10th form of Nanak would not go against previous nine and change everything the first 9 Nanaks stood for. RSS promoters want Sikhs to believe that 10th Nanak was different from first 9.

“”Why do they say that even God is regretting after creating women?””
“Bidhna is Brahma and he wanted to marry own doughter.Brahma is not God.”
Brahma wanting to marry daughter has nothing to do with those tria chariters. Brahma (so called devta) didn’t make women either. God made women so unless the writer is promoting Hindu philosophy, Bidna meaning Vidaata meaning God is the creator of women. There is no question. Otherwise, what does a Brahma (devta) creating woman have to do with Gurmat? There was no need to write it there then. Sikhs don’t care what Brahma thought about women and didn’t have to be told every so often.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

““Why is the chariter count wrong and why is the shund count messed up?””
“It is done intentional and works on descreate structure with clar ways been told and not in continuiess fashion.We can say that Digital era strated much before Charels Babbage.”
Where did Charles Babbage come from? What does descreate mean? Is it discrete or desecrate? If it is desecrate then it means damage. Why would the structure be damaged? What was the need or use? If it means discrete, then this doesn’t make sense either. Discrete means distinct. Distinction is made where distinction is needed and when there is a distinction. There should be no distinction in tria chariters. It is very clear that the compilers messed up. All the person can see is are careless error because the people who put it together weren’t too good at math or didn’t care much as their motive was just to implement person agenda of fooling Sikhs. They thoughts Sikhs would always be uneducated and they would take advantage but they didn’t know their plans were going to fail right away. It wasn’t long after when Singh Sabha lehar started and they exposed the mahants and pujaris and the Sikhs started waking up. Now they are waking up again with Akaal kripa.

“”Why wasn't time used to write wiser things?””
“sometime we are unwise to recoganse something much wise then time and call it unwise.”
Whatever is not wise is not wise. Anything anti-Gurmat or anti-society can not be wise. Tria chariters must be taken care of to have a good and functional society. Tria chariters lead to massive moral corruption in people who follow them.

“”What was the need to describe sexual positions and use abusive/adult words?””
“Is Posture only means sexual postion or Asan word makes us arose then it is our own inner ******* mindset. Abuse and Adult sort of the things are made up by upper caste people,who look lower caste people using such language as bad.So such mindset is that of a Brahmin.”
What does the starred word mean? It has nothing to do with increasing lust as any normal person would see lust increase by reading chariters unless the person is impotent. Why do the saad babas have so much lust then if tria chariters have nothing to do with lust? There have been cases where the Dasam Granth pathis had wet kascheras after doing paths of tria chariters (the source is Dasam Granth Daa Likharee Kaun?). There is no caste system in European nations and North America. We have a rating system here. Whenever something has adult content, it is rated 18+. Tria chariters have no rating system.

““Why is there no rating on it? What if some 10 year old kid reads that ****?””
“Well if you come to India and stay in village or poor people.Mothers tells 6 year old child to take his cow near bull for let Sex happen.It is Urban and rich class or caste baseed inner ego which makes us think such things.Better is to ask some old person who has lived a life of poor and /or rural.Truth is naked and often bitter.”
I lived in a village so you don’t need to tell me about village and animals mating. No child is told to take cow or bull near anything. Older people take care of it. Maybe it happens in other states of India which are without morals anyways. Biharis are known to sell their daughters for 2000 rupees. Source? Noormehlee-aye Deeya Kartoota by Saroop Singh. This has nothing to do with caste system once again. When Bhagat Kabir Ji talked about circumcision, he said it would be cut by itself. He didn’t say what would be cut by itself. If it is alright to use these words then why didn’t Bhagat Kabeer Jee use it? Dasam Granth uses way more offensive words than that though. It also uses slang terms like “girl was banged hard” and “put the **** into my vagina”, etc. etc. I didn’t want to use these terms but I am only using them to write what tria chariters say. I would not be able to say these words in public if I am asked as these are so immoral. Khalsa has high morals so garbage like tria chariters has nothing to do with Khalsa. Rip it out of dasam granth and throw it in the garbage.

“”Are Dasam Granth promoters willing to read it with their family and relatives and others listening?””
“Das has talked about one episode with his mother where a lady breakes an egg on bed and misguides as men that this is seman.
further things also das talked.In Educated families,where no gender bia of mother and father is there,We can talk.”
Proof? Audio? How do we know it was mother and not someone else? Like I said, Biharis have been known to sell daughters so this isn’t hard to understand. I am talking about a normal person with morals. Was anyone else present? West is known to be corrupt. Even the people here refuse to talk these things with parents. India is going downhill when it comes to morals anyways.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 5, 2007)

“”Where has the sharam and dharam gone?””
“Sharam or shame is in hand of Akal.Dharam is to have rithiousness.So what is fuss about it.Brahmins have made them secreative.”
Where did Brahmans come from again? Shame is in the person’s hands. Actions show how much shame the person has.

“”"Munda Santokh Sharam Putt Jholee Dhiaan Kee Krai Bebhoot"””
“Here Saram can also means labour or kirat and other word is Uddam.”
Uddam has nothing to do with Sharam. Neither has kirat or hard work. Please learn proper aarth of Japuji Sahib. Missionary College is the best.

“”"Sharam Dharam Doaye Shup Khloaye Korr Firray Pardhaan Vay Laalo"””
“That is there to counter cruototion and injustice.”
Sharam is sharam. It doesn’t matter if it has to do with pornographic content or corruption anywhere else. All corruption is wrong. Tria chariters are moral corruption. TMC is what I like to call it. TMC = Total Moral Corruption. Guru Sahib Ji wasn’t morally corrupt. Guru Sahib never went to prostitutes to fix them up in history if you ever know. Guru Ji went to magicians, sadhus, yogis, etc. but never went to prostitutes to fix them up. Why? Not the right place and fixing them up isn’t important either as they are unlikely to fix up 100%. Why does Guru Ji talk about prostitutes in Guru Granth Sahib Ji? Guru Ji shows that if people as low as prostitutes can fix up and lead to better life then so can normal people in society. People had an insecure feeling that they are bad and can’t live a better life. This is also true with many people these days. From talking to people, a lot of them just don’t have the inner strength but do want to be GurSikhs. Tria chariters preach the opposite.

“”Has the word lund or land been used in Guru Granth Sahib Ji?””
“did not word Bhug(vagina) and Jon(Yoni again Vagina) used in Guru Granth Sahib?If female Organs can be talked about then why not male one?Did world Khalsa Panth used?Did Pahil used?Did Singh as surname or Kaur used as Surname?What about 5ks?”
I already mentioned Bhagat Kabir Ji’s Shabad. If someone think he/she is smarter than Bhagat Kabir Ji, then that is their issue to take care of. It has nothing to do with me. Not only that, I already mentioned how far the tria chariters go. Lund or laand is slang term and is not appropriate. There are other better ways to say it. Bhug isn’t a slang term. If slang term was used then it could be understood. Live in Punjab and promote tria chariters in a village and see what the person gets. If the villagers don’t make to taste chata, then the tria chariter promoters can come and talk to me.

Khalsa is used in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Some kakkars are mentioned directly and some are mentioned indirectly though depending on how a person looks at it. Amrit is also mentioned in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Singh and Kaur were implemented in 1699 and so was Khanday Kee Pahul. Don’t tell me that people didn’t have lunds or lands before. It has to do with time period and other reasons than morality. If someone wants to attack fundamental practices of Sikhs because they aren’t mentioned in Guru Granth Sahib Ji, then that is the person’s issue. Khanday Ke Pahul and 5 kakkars aren’t mentioned in Dasam Granth either. Neither does it tell Sikhs men to have Singh as last name or Sikhs women to have Kaur as last name.

“”If no, then why not?””
“If not then why not?”
This is what I want to know. From what I have learned from Gurmat, it isn’t appropriate.

“”Why is it used in Dasam Granth then?””
“why can not this be used?
Sikhi Rahit Maryada can come over here.Sarbloh is used in there which may not be before.”
I don’t want to get into Sarabloh debate as it isn’t related here. Dasam Granth doesn’t say to prepare Amrit in Sarabloh baata so I don’t know what the issue is. There is no reason to bring in off topic topics into this thread. Sarabloh also has nothing to do with morals.

To people claiming to be Sikhs who have even some love for Guru:
Don't let your soul (aatma) sleep, a sleeping soul dies. Don't let your self-esteem die, a person without Aankh is as good dead physically as spiritually.


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## amar_jkp (Jan 6, 2007)

Stop using word bihari, You can put your point without insulting others.
your type are responsible for bad immage of sikhs in purvanchal areas of bihar and U.P.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 6, 2007)

If someone promotes caste system and I promote nationality, then what is the big issue? It is still better than saying Guru Ji got fooled by prostitute or that Guru Ji told Sikhs to knock off turbans from heads of people and use as siropas and then sell the leftovers to make cash. If someone attacks Guru and then I try to convince and person but the person starts launching attacks on me. Ulta Chor Koatwal Ko Daantay! I didn't do personal insult like it was done to me.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 6, 2007)

If someone places hand on your dad's turban, are you going to stay quiet?
The person does direct attacks on me and says I go after prostitues and issues threats.
I said biharis like ashutosh. Is it wrong to confront Ashutosh and company?


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## Archived_member2 (Jan 6, 2007)

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakal!
Dear all and the experts on Dasam Granth Sahib Jee!

Having Satsang with people who understand Gurdev's writings well is pleasant. Some are specializing on chosen words while others are on the way to gain Ph.D. on a part of it.
My humble request is to start a chapter from the beginning. It may be Charitopaakhyaan.

Please give a sign of the Satsang spirit and we start with new heading. Welcome. 


Balbir Singh


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## amar_jkp (Jan 8, 2007)

Khalsa Fauj ji you are using word bihari just like hindus say you khalistanis sardars or antakwadi sardars. I am  not expert on dasam granth but what i can understad is that,there is nothing wrong in akal ustat,khalsa mahima etc.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 8, 2007)

How about poet shyam, ram, soom, kal and others? Is there anything wrong with them or not? Are those poets Guru?


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## amar_jkp (Jan 9, 2007)

Yes there is some confusion related these names. Just because of these names we cant reject whole dasam granth, tell me whats wrong in akal ustat khalsa mahima and jaffarnama.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 9, 2007)

I didn't say there is anything wrong with Akaal Ustat or Zafarnama. If you thought that, then my mistake.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 23, 2007)

Gurfateh 

Das was bust with some offline work so was awy,Akal thanks God so that Das can reply Bhai TKF.

Anyway Das is first tryting to conclude his article.

Gurfateh
So das first takes Into account of 5 things in 
Character 16 which some can say look similar to that of Guru.It is strange that our brothers with some racial Punjabi jattism tend to forget that Charectors are not eroticas.
So das will take care of first point
1.the first line.​​One bankof/near Satiluj,Happened to be a lord,living(and) having comforts.
For the wealth one Ramjani came to his place.1.
His place use to have wealth and one ramjani came there.1
For wealth one Ramjani came to that place.1.​​There are three interpretations of the second line and last one is remotest.Das reads hote(happened to be/use to be) and not Het(for) in version which das has.Maybe Translitration from Gurmukhi to Nagri has caused this mistake.​​Das will touch both the cases.
But better is to take the remotest case first.​​For the purpose of Mony only Ramjani came to that place.(in other two cases place is termed wealthy or king is termed wealthy and coming Ramjani is written.It is still not written that Ramjani came to place to have mony) .But if it is het,then she came to his place or that ploace to get wealth.​​Ramjani litraly means been born by God or delivered by God.As prostitutes may not know who there father is(if born from mother in same profession) so God only is her father.
Das looked if there could be some farsi conection as ram is used in farsi like Ramsar(a place on the bank of Caspian sea)Ramjanga(gun) but Jani may not have meaning as far as das is interested.Term zan is used for lady.​​So can the bank of Satiluj be Anandpur Sahib only?​​Answer is no.​​Satluj is river older then Himlayas and is trans himlayan river.It strats from tibbet ,moves into India wide Himachal(making U shaped valley in Himalaya) then enters Punjab plains and then enter Pakistan and further ahead making way for Indus.It moves more then 400 kilometers.(das can write whole geological story about relation Satluj had with Euraisa and Gandvanaland but all such is beyond the scope of this text.When writer use to write such things in Shri Dasham Granth Sahib Ji,then guys use to raise eybrow .When some one is blessed by Akal,the endless,the knowledge endless,then it is OK to not to put all info else point could be over shadowed.Das’s knowledge is anyway still not vey much)​​Say Bank of yamuna can be Paunta Sahib,Delhi,Mathura and up till Allahbad.Rai or lord is mentioned in first line but later on from 10,13,14 lines pair have term king also.And King is repeated again.​​There has been traditions in Hindus to have term rai added to them(Britshers use to tag their jackals as Rai Bahadur)Examples are Medini Rai(of Raisen,central India),Krishandev Raya,Achyut Raya(of Vijay Nagar,South India),Biji Rai(Last Hindu king of Sialkot).​​Muslims also held this title and das will give two on the either sides of Satluj.Rai Bular(in north west) and Rai Kala(in south),both have importance in Sikh history.
As we see from the case of Ranjha(Dido Queshi of Takhat Hazara),Muslim Rais also had interst in Yoga(as he become Yogi of Gorakhnath).Biji Rai also once became Muslim Nasha Shah but before defeat from Ghauri reverts to pagan faith.​​Also das would like to mention Naqshbandi,who are forefathers of present days wahabis. Their Shekh Ahmad was responsible for martyer dom of Fifth Master.They were at Sirhinds.They had whole system ini their language about various glands or Chakras as in yogis.In Pranayams nose is closed.Naqsh is nose and band is to close.​​We see that in 21st Charitar we are given under Eye peak and name Anandpur to exact location for the place.Same can be read at end of Ram Avtar,ie under the foot of eye peak,one the bank of Satiluj.​​But in last Charitar after date it is only mentioned that at the bank of Satiluj.In there also it may not mean that Guru write it at Anandpur Sahib,There also we should know that some other palce also clould be there on the bank of Satiluj where Guru eneded dialogue of Minster and Landowner/king .Guru did write at Paunta Sahib,He did write Jaffernama outside Anandpur Sahib and Sarbloh Granrth was all the more written after leaving Anandpur Sahib.​​There were many War which Guru faught with Hindu Kings,and while stalking them in hills or say near Kiratpur Sahib or otherwise also,why can not Guru also write outside Anandppur Sahib.Alexender use to write while on mission.Why can not Guru do this?​​


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 23, 2007)

Why
das wrote all is due to the fact that from first two lines Bank of Satiluj is written to be place where lrd was residing/living.And to that living place Ramjani came.Guru can have only Transit place on the bank of Satiluj but for Anandpur Sahib but had this been then whole detail should have been given as in other two cases.​​Before Ninth Master purchased lands from Hindu king to set up Ananadpur Sahib,then also Hindus were there and were ruling there and later they wanted this place back from Sikhs and that was reason of wars with them.​​Das also wants to say that even if we deem this place as Anandpur Sahib,then at one time Hindu Rai could be ruling before the Ninth Master.​​So Lord,who is later told to be king can not be Guru just by saying that lord,use to live on banks of Satluj is going to be Guru.​​Also in Anandpur Sahib,when Brahmins like Gangu,Pamma and Vedwa can come ,why can not a prostitute to have mony come?​​Prstitution is the oldest profesion as per communists ,they hypothecate that in primary communist stage there was no bond of marriage and man use to provide food and security to women for sex.Das will not justify whith such non sense things the prostitution,which is forbided to Sikhs(but were Sikhs only lving in Anandpur Sahib?There were mnay guys who flead,the area when prince attacked and he rather prosecuted them(Vachitar Natak))Such guys could have been prostitues potential clients if at al she could come there.​​But in Army,solider can be made careless and even sick by females. Honey trap can let the secret out.Vish Kanya or venomous lady could be a lady with sexually tranmitted decease and sent into enmy camp to let soldiers be unhealthy to fight.​​Sikhs are told to stay away from prostitute and adultery for such reason only and this at present times prevent STD and AIDS.​​But das only wanted to take dig at those guys who have hystriya for prostitutes.She due to porty or social background sells her flesh and gets money,she is in flesh trade.But are nit psudo Brahmins like three mentioned above at Anandpur Sahib worse then her,who bully and misguide innocent people and make their coughers fill.​​Anyway inspite of let mind move here there,still,we can not prove just by mention of bank of river,the place as Anandpur Sahib.While king lives there.​​End of question one.
Then let us move ahead with the story.
Chhjiaya was her name all world knew.Her was recoganises by all welwishers as Ladhiya(overt Chhjiya and covert Ladhiya).Who so ever men see her after coming.He became did became devoid of mind,speak and deeds after getting pleasure in heart.2.Dohra.
Examined the lord and was controlled by(the notion) that he does not happen to be in her control./She was controlled by Lord after examining her but she could not control her.(Second explanation is more traditional).(I Will) be slave of (your)slaves After (you make)bed beautiful.27.​​2.At your(place) people come from various directions.(their)Mind desires whichever thing/issue,(they) get the boom/blessing of that. What fault/disobidence is mine,(that) I do not get you.​​Well over here if we see the mythology and history there are many kings who ha miraculous powers.Say in pagan Indian side we have Adi sanakara as well as Matsendra nath entering the body of king and ruling.Then King Vikram had an aide called Baital(Rudra Kinker) and had miraculous powers.King Brithhari later became the great Nath Yogi.King Bhoja had legend of 32 puppet throne.And last person in this line is Lord Krishna. 
In Muslims and other semtic faiths.We have Moses as king and with miraculous powers.Noah also had great miracle of boat attached.Then Rsool(SWAS) also has miraculous power as well as fact that he was king.While Hazrat Aurangzeb(RA) also said to have mirculuos powers(which is told lower then that of Guru,in Sau Sakhi).
Then if we see the boom also in physical sense.Then husband is called Bar/var or boom for bride.
When giving of stuff is concerned we have king Harishchandra(who donated all his kingdom and family and self),king shivi(who donated his body),​
​Kng Karna(who gave his golden tooth on the deathbed,sorry,while dying in the battle field).King Harshavardhan,who use to donae his cloaths also on Kumbh Mela.In Islamic history we have Example of Hatim Bin Tayee,Prince of Yeman.Who was called Sakhi Hatim.One Sultan of Delhi Sultanate was also once termed as second Hatim.​​With so much example we can not say,this person is going to be a Sikh Guru at all. And we see the taste to learn miracles but no miracle but trick of character is shown.To get rid of the lady.
3.Arhil.Then lord came to house/home,he did such pledge.By good attempt I have protected Dharama/faith/duty.Country(to) Country,(I will) spread the glory of self lord/god.I will never again see other’s wife/lady or other lady.49.​​Can this glory spreading be something to do with Sikhism’s preaching?​​No.​​Was not Aurangzeb(RA) also spreading his Allah’s faith?
In Hindus,showing glory of self lord is more to show their demigods large Temples etc.It is more self ego satisfaction.Due to these large temples did only Turks brooke them and looted them.Sikhs should also learn the lesson and do not apply too much of gold on palanquins or Gurudwaras.Such things did not occur at Guru’s time.
In Himachal,we have Kangbra Devi,Then Kullus has Raghunath deity.We have Chamunda in Mysore.Rana Sanga,Rana Kumbha made other great temples.Ahilya Bai Holker made temples in Allahbad and Gujrat.In Jaipur some temple is to do with deity from east India,kachhwasa brought.Amer fort is named after Amera devi.Ranchor is deity of south Rajasthan and Gujarat.
So spreading the glory of self lord is more in context of yogi or pro nath king for some deity of nath yoga say bhole nath(nath panth declined due idol coiimg in them later else it is more Anti idols.Idol worship of Bhole Nath or Bhairow Nath is more in line when das sees picture and idols or our Gurus in Hindu Temples.Such things need to be discarded as should we do not do the same idol like behaviour with Darbar Sahib.).​​4.There are similar situations in 16 and 21,22,23 and if later is from Guru then former can be also the same.
Even in 21,22 and 23 may not have happened with Guru.But with self example some views were given.
Then in case of two stories difference as follows
1 in 16th one lady has different name and is ramjani and not the wife of rich.​​Das can give mansy such differences but will rather give whole 16 charectors story word to word later.​​Just a briefe account.
A lady who has two name and is prostitute comes to a kings place.For getting mony.She is liked by many,it is in her in intro .But she could not win king,she does occult but fails.She takes an attire of Yogi and comes to king.King thinks to learn some occult from him(who is her).He sends his agent to him(her).She acts well like yogi and tells that by blessing of Gorakh(shiva), she can teach.Agent goes to king and tell him and he comes at mid night,as yogi has told.​​Yogi tells king to bring sura(an ayur vedic medicine with alchohal content and also abused by addicts,liquer is called Madira),lamp and other things (to be used in occult).Yogi wants all others to leave.King abides.
In seclusion yogi tells the king that he will be female and then they will earn consumption(have intercourse).Then after this miracle,occult will be thought.
King refuses telling teacher is like mother or father depending upon gender. He tells to serve them rather.​


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 23, 2007)

te and wants him making her bed beautiful.She tells a good lot of her internal state of mind,also tells about kings potency also.She praises him to be generous or miraculous and requests him to come on her.​​He tells her that he came to learn occult while she has other intention.He says that his dharm does not allow this(celibacy is more in Nath yoga and those who deem Rama as ideal such guys give Ramas staying aloof with other ladies who wanted to marry him or perhaps want to share him from Sita.Examples are Sarop Nakha,Naga Pricess(Ahiravana episode) and Vaishnavi Devi(whose Temple of Vaishnau Devi is near Jammu)(First one is negative while toher two are in positive light)). 
She made various charectors(assuming other roles or character then own one).She tried occult onto him.Then she shouted thief.People came,and She told them,she only had a dream.Then she again threatened,him of getting him bounded.​​Then lord made thought as such,by palying some character,let met get out of here and Mantra(occult) he came to learn here,has its essence in this escape only.
If I run,then honur will lgo and if do consumption(of sex) then Dharama will go.Both are difficult choise and may creator be helpful.I any son will be born then she will be joker/entertainer and if girl then She will be prostitute.(over here it more a sort of racial ego of rulers of that time,while mnay rulers had their sons and doughter going such works due to their misdeeds)He also thought again the two ways and harm from both.
He told her,that she is beutifull and he was regretting to refuse her.​​He asks her to bring intoxicants and after using them ,they will have bhoga(utilization of sex).She bbecame happy and asked for all such things and gets it prepaired.
Then lord thought for that day lesson of Mantra is to not recite her(ie sleep with her).I will intoxicate her,put her on bed(let her be asleep) and will run away givng her 60 coins..
Then there is message within whole of this charitar.
Dohara.Do not know love but appreance of money.Scorpia,snake and prostitute,tell? Are whose friend?.43.​​He kept her giving intoxicants and kept pretending love to her,till she was overcome by intoxication.When she was asleep on bed,Happened by giving her sixty coins he took path of run.(no where das could read that sixty coins were left on her head’s side on bed)..​​Then another message and belive it that it is still the part of present day curiculla of a spy training.
Who does benfit/profit/hit to you,you do not do to that person.
Who showers pleasures to you,to that do not shower.
Of whose mind intention(bat) you can not get.
Do not show the secret of self mind to that(let it) happen.47.
Lord ran intoxicating lady and came setting in home and no one saw him.​​(From here das will put four lines and last two lines of that put das also in delima for some time and das overcame this with three solutions)So take it as point 5.
Arhil.Then lord,after coing to home did so,such a pledge. By Good attempt now I have protected my faith/dharma.Country to country I will spread the glory of my Lord.I will never ever again see the other lady.49.Dohra..That ought from that day covers in my heart.From that day,(I) do not see other’s wife ever.50.1..
So das will explain 4 and 5 point in single.​​Let us see fifth one first.
Das thinks a missionary and with Brahmin conspiracy theory that,poision is been given wrapped in suger.Last line makes agenda of 405 Character visible,ie to pain Guru in bad light and also misguides Sikhs off the teaching of Guru Granth Sahib.​​Das is feeling very tense and weak like missionary feels.mind is full of regret and mourning.
It appears that narrator or writer is said to be the king as last line is in first person.(in Salok Mahal Ninth there are verse about Bal Chhutkio Bandhan Pare Kachh Hu Na hote Upaye.. then next verse comes to mind Bal hova Bandhan Chhute….)
So there persons can be speakers of last two lines.​1. The King​
2. The minister who says story to king​
3. The writer who is Guru
Case 1 is most valid.As in four lines before 50 ie 49th verse has second line with Kings saying in first person.Bhale Jatan So Rakh Dharam Ab Mai Liyo.By good attempt I protected by dharma now.
Let us see the whole last block again.
Arhil.Then lord,after coing to home did so, such a pledge. By Good attempt now I have protected my faith/dharma.Country to country I will spread the glory of my Lord.I will never ever again see the other lady.49.Dohra..That ought from that day covers in my heart.From that day,(I) do not see other’s wife ever.50.1..
One pledge was made after coming to slef home.it was to spread glory of self lord and to not to see other lady or may be other’s lady.That could mean celibacy in case other lady while rama like attitude in case it is other’s lady.
That oought from that day covers my heart.
Here king could be saying still but after that day.By this narrator wants to say that thereafter king kept on saying this,after that episode.Other then that day,rather for ever.
Next could be the minster ie case 2.
Minister says that that ought of king covers his heart(he rembers it thoroughly) and and from that day he does not see else’s lady.Here that day means the day king did pledge,it is in heart of minister also.
Case 3 could be from the day King made pledge,it is in heart of Guru also.​
​But one thing comes that here case is of avoiding Prostitue and why are people taking pledge to not to see elses lady.
Prostitue is also elses lady.And taking inspiration from non Sikh for good is OK.Weather it is mythological or true.Are not inspiration of Dhru and Pralad is there in Darbar Sahib?
Comong to point 4 about similarity in cases.
Both are not the deto.To point each and evry differnace is beyond the scope and wolrd to world translaton will help in there.
Some examples in similarity in history.
Alam and Ghanand both were poet and had a muslim girlfriend .
Rasol(swas) and Moses both were prophet and king.
Story of Manu and Noah are similar(boat in flood).
Killing of young by king is similar in case of Lord Jesus and Lord Krishna and leaving to safer area from birth place is also similar.
Prophet of Islam made some forecaste.First master also made(abour Sher Shah).
Bhagat Namdev turned temple so First Master turned Qibla.
Sheikh Salim Chisti blessed Akber with son,Baba Budha blessed Fifth Master with son.
Both in case of Sixth Master and in case of Lord Krishan,there were attempts on life in young age.
List can move further.Some can be true and some can be myth but similar things do happen.​​So the thing could be a case study of Hindu king(in 16 character),who is famous for generoussity and is fond of learning occult and miracle.He is in suop and how does he handles.
Leson from story.
1.do not go to yogis and do not have interest to learn mantras etc.practicle expiriace In lifes are real mantras.
2.occult is useless(she fails to influence the king by occult twice it is written).
3.Narrater tells and king also finds that prostitute had no love but wanted money so no need to love her.(das thinks that as per reformative principle of Gurmat,if Prostitue loves some one and both want to marry,it is OK(as she may be given a chance to live weded life out of hell,Hindus may not agree to such things) but love should be not between humans but with Akal.
4.Do not get overwhelmed by a person as he starts to gives you benefit(this is the way by which agents are recruited in spies)/do not do anything with those benefits.Nor should we get showered by pleasure a person who is showering pleasure onto us.Of that person whoses things in mind we self can not get,we should not give secret of self mind to that person.​​Main story seems to be ended in 46th verses,47th has message and last three are just covering up of meaasage .Pledge by king etc. also can act over cover up to the message.
Character before it has15.264. at end before to be continued while one succeeding it has17.341,while this has 16.314.​Any opposer will say not fit to Gurbani and fails here as Guru can not do mistake.Had they


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 23, 2007)

seen Akal in all and had broad mind and not the narrow mind and with Akal blessing they could have seen the code hidden in this message.
Reverse 314 we get 413.
Bt here first 3 tell last three verse as a cover up and middle 1 is 47th versee and main meassage and 4 is first letter of reamiaing 46 verses. 
On internet also in OSI model we use some keys to crypt the data and ps 2nd or 3rd decrypt the same.It is in perhaps second or thierd layer.We keep on changing the key else hackers can recoganse the pattern and create the problem for us.
Guru one with timeless had such qaulifiactions.
But 46 lines also had some more things about Hindu king when we say that he left some mony.Hindus sometime act like fool due to racial ego.As Prthivraj left Ghauri ,who later came and killed him.It is same line that he did fulfil the wish of mony of prostitute for which she was asking him to have sleep with her.This can be otherwise tactical appeasement.
When we compare this with block of 21,22,and 23,we are told that how could a person,better then Hindu act in such circumstances.
Shias often cry Ya Hussain Hum NA huye,ie had we been at that time when Hazrat Hussain(AS for Shias and RA for Sunnis and Das) were martyered .
Did not Dalla Brara also told Guru,that had his menin Anandpur Sahib,then things were in Gurus favoer and Guru shows him the mind and not the might which matters ith the braver of Vir Singh And Dhir Singh from Ranrittas.
Entering into positon is different,handling is different and acting with lady is different.
Two more points to be added before conclusions.
5.Can Sikh use drugs or alchohal against the enemy as king did to prostitute.
We see that in Punjab GOI or RSS is blamed to spread drug to ruin the Sikh youth(Hindus also more from lower caste are addicted in there).
Opium was used by Britshers in China to ruin that nation,leading to opium war.
Pakistan pumps opium etc in India along with pornography.
Doubt about Shre Dasham Granth also are there imaginary Brahmin want to encourage drugs in us.
So das finds OK to use sward against the foe.As Guru tells us bit does not tell us to use against the self.So to get info from foe side,if we use alchohal as trap for person on their side das does not find the fault.
We may talk anything but when Sikh state will come ,we will use such things.In Islam wine is tabbo but,there ISI may use intoxicants against the {censored}.They may even use sex.Even if we do not use,we should know their ways to defend ourself.
Another point.Who could be the reciver of such meassages.
Since the time of Ninth Master,semi Muslim Jatt Tribals in Malwas were on way to Gurmat.Some were on the governments pay role.Like Chaudhari Shammir. So in such cases like to press Sikhs,Governement who was otherwise hard was to be soft with these tribes.
They were warned,that government should not be trusted.Das was today reading Ganda Singh’s book of Huqamanammahs(page 168,169). We have one letter to Miharchand,Peshkar KHUFIYE.
Khufiya in Urdu means intelligence.In Farsi under covers are termed a poshide. Date of that letter is 6.2.1702A.D.(UK style date in dd.mm.yyyy.)
So this is proof of inteliigence service of the Guru.
Lastly in conclusion das request the people who tend to talk a lot about scinces in Gurmat that plotics,diplomacy,inteliigence and human bevoius etc are all scinses.And you all want to give credit of this to a Brahmin.And not Guru.Why?
For scince objective reporting is must and why should we be subjective like protestants,Arya Samajis etc.?​ 






1​


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 23, 2007)

*



Note: It is poet soom sofi, not poet saam sofi. I apologize for the error. Sorry for the mistake.

Click to expand...

* 
*Give refreance where is that mention.Soom mean inocent and Soofi is claer.*




> “So das does the work by mercy of Bhagaouti.,who is Mahakal and who is Kalaka and who is Akal.
> Chariter 20 78
> You have drugged your self rather in ego and fear of Hindus.
> It is from 21st,22nd and 23rd Chaectors.”
> I don’t fear hindus. Why would I fear hindus? I fear Guru and Akaal and I fear the unseen soti (stick) of Akaal. Do you? Anyone saying tria chariters (koke shaster / kaama sutra / kaam shaster) isn’t Sikh and doesn’t fear Akaal at all. Not only that, in 1973, Akaal Takht made it clear that tria chariters isn’t work of Guru Gobind Singh Ji. This was before the derawaala/rss influence on Akaal Takht. All day you talk about drugs and sexual stories and promote them yet you think you are preaching Gurmat. Wake up!


 
Bhai issue is not resolved and ask the present Jathedar.Give proof of your claim then just accusing.

Thniking of Hindus,you think that they can do harm to you.For das they stand no where in front of Khalsa,they only need our help as they are very weak,due to thier on problems.



> That chariter 20 and 78 thing is not related to anoop kuar story. That is some code I use to find some things. It has nothing to do with noop kuar.


 
you gave that number.Did not you.



> Kal can’t = Akaal. These are opposite words. Just Mahakaal is just bigger kaal and can’t be Akaal. Even though poets shyam, raam and soom sufi think so along with poet kal.


 
so Ajay and Jay are oppsite.Jay or vijay means victroius.Ajay mean can not be won.

Kal mean death or time to all and Akal means on that no time can affect.




> Ashutosh is also bihari and he acts holy too but he has been exposed.


Do you know that he can not preach in Bihar.

why?Why he has some power in Punaj,due to Jatts.




> RSS agents promote caste system and divide people into caste system.


 
RSS are bunch of idiots but caste system is there in fake akalis also.



> Vijaydeep, didn’t you make fun of juts on msn when you talked to me? You thought I believed in caste system but I didn’t.


 
No that was not the reason.Jaats did not allow a god lots of Dalits under Baba Sahib to be Sikh.They still have covert racial attitude.For your info ancestors of Das are from Hariana migrated to Bihar.Gotra of Father of Das is Virk/Solanki and we have family realtions with jaats.Some so called Sikhs are jatts and not Sikh and worthy to be made fun of.



> Sikhs don’t believe in caste system, know this well. Tria chariters also divide people into caste and divides people. Anyone promoting it is a promoter of caste system. No wonder nihungs have different Amrit for people belonging to different castes. Damdami Taksal also followed this practice until Kartar Singh became their Jathaydar. However, from recent reports, Akhara pind still follows this and gives leftover Amrit to lower castes. This is direct violation of Guru’s maryada and is direct opposition of the most fundamental principles of Gurmat if not the fundamental principle.


 
Triya Chairitar use language of lower castes telling them to uproot currpt upper castes.And Singh did do this later.

Das will reply to you issue about Niuhngs after 26.01.07 or you visit Amrit Sanskar at Gurudwara Mata Sahib Devan.Hajur Sahib.



> “If Gangu can come there inpersonatiin as good cook then why canot otheer people come.But where is term Prostitute been writtan even once?
> Say if some lady tires to indulge in adulatry due to Pagan influence while entering as decent lady how can pure minded Sikhs imagine such thing.Just as they are not ******* like you.
> At start of 21 Charitar lady is termed as wife of wealthy.So as per your logic all wives of wealth are protiture including mother of das.Well are your father also wealthy?”
> Raamjani means prostitute (Chariter 16). How can pure Guru imagine being fooled by a prostitute?


 
Das only wanted to say that Prostitutes are better then people like Gangu,If you like him then it is your problem.Anyway 16 Charecter does not talk about Guru.





> “Na Oh Mrai Naa Thaagai Jaahay, Jin Kay Raam Vsai Mun Maahai”
> So Guru doesn’t get fooled.


 
This is out of context over here but Guru did try to be imperfect so that people may not start to worship him.Guru used term insect for himself.Previous Guru used term Dog for self(Term Dog was also refrewerd by Guru to non belivers of one God)If you want das can write.

Kukar Hau Begana Bhauka Is Tan Tahi.

Jaise Sukar Swan..(Salok Mahal Nauvan).



> What is the star for? What are you trying to call me? Are you losing it? Send that word to me in personal message. Why are you putting statements into my mouth? Where did I say all rich women are prostitutes? Are you going to make you case properly or just confuse people and bash them? What is protiture? Never heard of that word. Someone who can’t even type properly is here to debate on big issues. Why do you care if my father is wealthy? You want money to join the right side? Wives of wealth doesn’t make sense either. When did wealth start having wives? My father won’t give you a penny. He isn’t corrupt and doesn’t indulge in corruption. He doesn’t take anyone’s money and neither does he give money as bribes. He never did it and the whole area around my village knows and everyone respects my dad. Do you have any jealousy issues with my dad?


 
Yuo told Anup Kaur as Prostitue,while she is writtan as wife of Rich or wealthy.Ladhiya is the lady in question and from Charector 16.Read all the work and just not qoute wrongly translated.

Das only wanted to tell you that wife of wealthy does not mean prostitute.



> If you want to talk bachitter natak granth with him, send me you phone number. He will call you. Don’t blame me after that he was rude to you. He does have anger management problems. He can’t keep it under control. If you are brave, then postmail me your phone #. Next time have proper sentences and type properly or don’t post. Make your statements precise if you are so smart. I don’t like reading confusing words that don’t exist in the dictionary as I don’t like it and is a waste of time.


 
Das gives you his phone number here and then.0091-9891523837.

Das will not mid if your father abuses das.Das has got a good practise of having it from you.Anyway,if he can be not happy with Brahmanicals,how can not you say That Guru was Happy and did not exposed crroupted Brahmnaicals etc vide Triya Charitars.




> “There is no prositure but wife of rich who after entering Anandpur sahib wants to comit dualtray with Guru.If Pama or Parmanada can come in and think of wrong about Langer(as he finds its anti caste)and incite Hindu kings, so is not he more then lady trying to comit adultery.”
> Sexual positions are described in many other chariters. Chariter followers should first read history and then chariters? A lot of things would be clear. Someone probably read some tria chariters and had a wet kuschee after which the person didn’t read any more. This is a different situation. This has to do with character defamation (note the spelling) of Guru Ji and has nothing to do with opposition of langer or nagara or whatever you want to link to it. Anyone participating in defamation of Guru’s character is not only a Panth dokhi but is an enemy of society and is not even a human; forget about being a Sikh.


 
Bhai das has done some work on Brother Sumras work and will explain that what is diferant betwen errotic and wrong interpetaion.Asans are mnetioned.Do you want das to describe them as they are done in Errotica?


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 23, 2007)

“





> If Wahiguru is God and Bhauti is God then what why should not there be Manter in Gurmat.
> Wahiguru is Gurmanter,Then we have Mool Mantra and as per Bhai Daya Sngh JI Beej Mantra is Sat Sri Akal.
> In fact to utter disgusting false propogand by you.In 21st Character,Guru in order to get Mantra did Bhaguti Manana and not Mantra.That is a sort of request to Bhaguti.What is our Ardas?Prtham Bhagouti Simar Kai.”
> Bhai Daya Singh rehatnama is not even 50% correct. It has a lot of flaws just like the 4 vedas.


 
Prove it.



> Do you even know what character means? It is chariter, not character. Don’t invent your own new definitions of words.


 
Wow.So das is making something,which you did not know.

Das told you to learn the Language.Come and read dictories.Charitarwan or with Charitar is high charectered.While Chariter heen means chreacterless.

Das is sure that you do not know much about Sanskrit or Braj Bhasha so you say like that.Charitar Pakhans means,telling about Chreacters,which were heard.Akhyan is something seen.Good knows why dop you live in cocoon.Created by your self.Try to come out.



> Chundee Dee Vaar isn’t Gurbani either so I don’t know what you are on about. Didn’t you know already? Want to report me to Vedanti and get me summoned to Akaal Takht? Vedanti isn’t Akaal Takht jathaydaar, I don’t accept him as Jathaydaar or his buddies who issue hukamnamas against Panthic GurSikhs and give siropas to Panthic dushts.


 
So Jathedar who abides by you as someone did as you say against Dasham Granth is Ok and one who is not is Not OK.Very nice.In Match you can say change the ****** empire.This is hypocrcy.Das can say that then Jathedar is not acceptable to das,if at all he was there?Das will not say anyway.



> This isn’t false propaganda. I will translate chariter 16, 21, 22, 23 and post the real meaning without have corruption in mind to fool innocent GurSikhs. Why would the writer say Bhagauti? When Guru Ji left, Guru Ji said
> Pooja Akaal Dee and not pooja bhagauti dee.


 
Do and learn Braj before doing it.Das rembers your calling Taika as Taatta,that is good,thing and good knowledge of Gurmukhi.

Do you know what is Bhagwan?One male with Bhag ie source as Vagina.Akal is niether male not female so both Bhgwan and Bhagwati.Akal is Anam as all names are of Akal.

Das understands great sprituality you have,Das feels the pain of hell while replying to falsehood,yet das does this and will continue ,till you keep on bringing wrong things up here,for you and more for other Sangats,who could be misguided as you have been.



> It says there was a raja and uses third person. The quotes you posted have English translations which are not correct and it seems like it is 3rd person when it is Bhagat Namdev Ji talking about himself. There is no false propaganda; in fact, there is no propaganda at all. It is all about facts with me.


 

There are many verse in Guru Granth Sahib Ji,where Third person is used.As you talk about King,it is in 16 th Chartecter.




> “This shows you lack in vocabulary,Mantra also means plan.Mantrana means consultation.Mantiri is a consular and final draft is Matta.Have you not heard of Gurmata.”
> Lack of vocabulary? Hahaha! At least I don’t invent meanings. Hahaha! Why couldn’t the Guru consult with the jogi (woman) in Darbar? Why did it have to be at night? Maybe you didn’t know but the the jogi also says that with the blessing of Gorakhnaath, the raja won’t go empty handed. Therefore, mantar doesn’t mean consultation but the jantar mantar one. Then it says that the jogi asked raja to send out all the people in presence outside and bring dhoof (sandalwood wick?), deeva (wick lamp), chawal (rice), full (flowers) and good liquor. Then it says that the raja did as ordered. Would someone ever ask Guru to bring liquor when the Guru tells Sikh not to even think about drinking it? If this mantra wasn’t related to the tantar mantar one then what was the need for dhoof, deeva, rice and flowers? How stupid and low are the tria chariter promoters going to get to defame 10th Guru Nanak? I don’t know why these low life skunks are even sent to this planet. There is more to it which I won’t go through right now as the replies are going to be really long anyways. Related chariters will be talked about after. Only rare people have the bibek buddi to realize truth. Only those who really care about Panth and Guru get the real bibek budh. Not those who have personal agendas.


 
Das gave a refreance which had Mantar in Guru Granth Sahib Ji as plan.In Charitar 108 and 109 perhaps ,of Sasi and urbasi,term Mantra is there for plan.

You are mixing up 16th and 21th 22nd and 23rd. Mantra of 21 has been talked about.16th has nothing to do with Guru.



> “Man in Guru Granth Sahib there are 74 times term Mantra comes.
> Das brings in here only 30.”
> Posting unrelated Gurbani quotes and going off topic will not make the statements any more credible. I already proved in the previous post what the word mantra means in that situation.


 
Yuo have tried to say that Sikhs can not use term Mantra.And das showed,you.




> “When King Shiv Nabh send Harlots to Guru Nanak Dev Ji and he reformed them.Did not those Sri Lankend daughters of Guru had fearlessness beore meeting the Guru?
> What about 400 Hundred Pathans who diteched Guru after staying with him.did they not have fear?When Akal wants bad time for sometime or wants to teach that person a lesson.All fear of good is lost in that.Same is happening to you.”
> Guru Nanak Dev Ji reformed the dancers easily. It is said that the dancers stopped their misbehavior when they saw Guru Nanak’s. Why didn’t Guru Gobind Singh Ji use the same power to make the prostitute get to the right path? Those pathans weren’t Sikh and were after the money only. When the pathans were gone, they were gone. There should have been fear of God which they didn’t have. Here, it should have been fear of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s shasters. Pathans thought hill rajas would back them up and they would win but they didn’t know how strong the Sikh army was. Too bad they lost. Why are you personally attacking me again? If you want to indulge in personal attacks, come back on msn like last time.


 
Read the Charitar 21st,22nd and 23rd.Reform is there.

Coming to pathans,They lived with Guru for long time and did not know the power of Guru?Why ?Was Guru secrative?No they know the power but lust or greeds makes a person blind and that person looses discreetion.


Das still thinks that yuorself feel you as an entity and are yet to be one with universe,where you will find your ego ending and only Akal being there.Then das will ask you how do you understand Dasham Granth Sahib.

Yes an agent of RSS appeals to you to at least one day read all of the Sukhmani Sahib and with Teeka.Yuo will understand the truth.





> On msn you initially said that poet raam, shyam, etc. were names pen names of Guru Ji but when I said it is hindu thing, you backtracked by saying that no, this is what some people say. This is how much truth you have. Looks like the bad times for Dasam Granth chelas are coming, won’t be long before they are kicked out of Gurudwaras and sent packing to their real locations, bollywood, or Hollywood, or some other {censored} khana place because Dasam Granth promoters are nothing but a bunch of kanjars.


 
Yuo are aware that who has been kicked out.Kala Afghana Sahib,Ghugga Sahib.If you give your address,your own people will kick you.

When did das tell you by the way that Guru had any pen names?

Just in your imgination.Here as per Budhadal,Das thought that Ram and Siam etc are Darbari Kavis(poets of Guru) initaly.Das verfied this from a book fr45om Dr Sahib Singh Ji.Das futher did the reserach and found that this was based upon the name Ram and Siam in Dasham Granth Sahib(from the missioanries of Shahbad Markanda).Das doubted that and resloived that they are name of Akal,As Gobind is.

You are mistakinf someone else with das.We have only talked about an year ago and das never said anything about pen names of Guru.Das did write his views in Gursikhijeevan.com on this issuem,that they are name of God.

Anyway again das has seen urge to kick.Das can only say that this weakens you further in the eyes of Sangat,being uncivilsed and full of jattism.Not Sikhism.



> “Did not Aurangzeb Had guts to ask Guru to convert to Islam.Sinner is also powerfull and viturus is power full when he defeats sinner.And you know that she was not successsfull.”
> Aurangzeb never even talked to Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji, he was in south. Do you even know history? She was successful. She wanted money and she got the 60 coins+. At the start of the chariter it clearly says what the motive of the woman was. Chariter followes should read the chariters before they debate on them. Looks like the chariter followers only read the posted quotes and make up garbage to justify they are Gurmat. Gurmat is so cheap that any garbage can be linked to my Guru. Gurmat is priceless but what would a sarkaree agent know about it?


 
So Auranga and his men never told Guru to convert.OK,Sis Ganj Sahib is fake and Bhai Mati Das Chowk is fake.And fake are sacrfise of threes Sikhs who were killed brutallyto make Guru afraid.It is matter of research that Auranga was in south or not.give refreance please.

Then,you gave refreance for Anup Kaur and now you go for Ladhiya.In fact Anup Kaur is the word which never appaered in 16th,21th,22nd and 23rd chrecters)



> “Why did not Guru knew Gangu Pandit?Guru here also knew about her but whated to make a lesson for us.
> Guru knew everything then why did he had faithn in false outght of cow and Kuran by Hindus and Muslimm indavders respectively?
> He knew but he had to work Kautak.(acts to teach Sikhs lesson on world).”
> Gangu was just a cook and he betrayed the Sahibzadas, Mata Ji and Guru Ghur. Guru Sahib knew it and it doesn’t harm the image of Guru Ji. It doesn’t defame Guru Ji but it promoted the greatness of Guru Ji and the sahibzadas and mata ji. It set an example for Sikhs to keep their Khalsa spirits. It was the Shaheedi of Sahibzadas and Guru Ji which enraged the Sikhs to destroy Sihund and take charge.


 
So later when Khalsa attacked Village of Gangu and village of Jani Khan and Mani Khan to avenge,they did not act as per Gurmat.What a logic.


Then further,Guru went in South and did not kill Vazir Khan,It was greatness of Khalsa.Sends Banda before Ghurra Khan(as per Sau Sakhi,relative of Painda Khan) stabbed him.All glory of Khalsa.

It is more to do with political wisdom and using the best of oppwertuntiy then trying to bound Guru with ideology.

If as you say foe were let off(you said that in Khalsa spirit) then reformed lady will not be left off and rewarded(21st,22nd and 23rd Chreacter).



> It wasn’t hanuman chalisa or 24 avtar as RSS agents say. Guru Hargobind Singh Ji started the singing of Dhadi Vars to instill bir russ into Sikhs. Garbage like 24 avtars isn’t needed. That is work of poet Shyam anyways. As the opening of it stated “Burnutt Shyam Juthaa Mutt Bhaa-ee” meaning “Shyam states narrates the stories according to his knowledge/understanding.”


 
When das talked to you about Hinduism,yuo were fond of talking.Yuo said hindusim is mess.Das can say that person who has messed up mind is Hindu.

So dear Hindu lover.See one thing.RSS never talked about any Hanuman Chalisa,rather it is not a Hindu text(it is in Bhojpuri and Sanskrit guys may not like it).

Coming to Chaubees Avtar.

They are told to be fake.

And what starts 24 Avtars have a look.


ਮੁਖ ਭਾਗ 7
मुख भाग 7
CHAPTER 7

ਚੌਬੀਸ ਅਉਤਾਰ
चौबीस अउतार
CHAUBIS AVTAR (Twenty-Four Gods)

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫ਼ਤਹ ॥
वाहिगुरू जी की फ़तह ॥
The Lord is one and the Victory is of the Lord.

ਭਾਗ
भाग
SECTION

ਅਥ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨਾ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਇੱਕੀਸਮੋ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਕਥਨੰ ॥
अथ क्रिशना अवतार इकीसमो अवतार कथनं ॥
Now begins the description of KRISHNA INCARNATION, the twenty-first incarnation.

ਚੌਪਈ ॥
चौपई ॥
CHAUPAI

ਅਬ ਬਰਣੋ ਕਿਸ਼ਨਾ ਅਵਤਾਰੂ ॥ ਜੈਸ ਭਾਂਤ ਬਰੁ ਧਰਯੋ ਮੁਰਾਰੂ ॥
अब बरणो किशना अवतारू ॥ जैस भांत बरु धरयो मुरारू ॥
No I describe the Krishna incarnation as to how he assumed the physical form;

ਪਰਮ ਪਾਪ ਤੇ ਭੂਮ ਡਰਾਨੀ ॥ ਡਗਮਗਾਤ ਬਿਧ ਤੀਰ ਸਿਧਾਨੀ ॥੧॥
परम पाप ते भूम डरानी ॥ डगमगात बिध तीर सिधानी ॥१॥
The earth, with unsteady gait, reached near the Lord.1.
ਚੌਪਈ ॥
चौपई ॥
CHAUPAI

ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਗਯੋ ਛੀਰ ਨਿਧ ਜਹਾਂ ॥ ਕਾਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਇਸਥਿਤ ਥੇ ਤਹਾਂ ॥
ब्रहमा गयो छीर निध जहां ॥ काल पुरख इसथित थे तहां ॥
Amidst the milk-ocean, where the Immanent Lord was seated, Brahma reached there;

ਕਹਯੋ ਬਿਸ਼ਨ ਕਹ ਨਿਕਟ ਬੁਲਾਈ ॥ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਧਰੋ ਤੁਮ ਜਾਈ ॥੨॥
कहयो बिशन कह निकट बुलाई ॥ क्रिशन अवतार धरो तुम जाई ॥२॥
The Lord called Vishnu near Him and said, "You go to the earth and assume the form of Krishna incarnation.2.

ਦੋਹਰਾ ॥
दोहरा ॥
DOHRA

ਕਾਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਕੇ ਬਚਨ ਤੇ ਸੰਤਨ ਹੇਤ ਸਹਾਇ ॥ ਮਥਰਾ ਮੰਡਲ ਕੇ ਬਿਖੈ ਜਨਮ ਧਰਯੋ ਹਰਿ ਰਾਇ ॥੩॥
काल पुरख के बचन ते संतन हेत सहाइ ॥ मथरा मंडल के बिखै जनम धरयो हरि राइ ॥३॥
Vishnu took birth in Mathura area for the welfare of saints, on receiving the orders of the Loard.3.


So stop telling lies you either hear or cook.

Coming to Dhadi Vars.

Are you aware that Dhadis also sing Sarbloh Bani.

Then fuirther to it.

Why did not Sixth Master gave Sikhs the surname Singh or Kaur?\

why did not Term Khalsa was used?

Why not Amrit of Khanda started?

You need to know that Sixth Master fought Three or four Wars but all were in defeance.

Tenth Master war did have offence like expeditoon to Nadaun or Rescue mission of Hoshiyarpur.

You have defenisve mind but Dasham Granth is full of offense to non Sikhs in wrong work and some Sikhs are also targetted(Charecter 49).

Do you know that Sixth Master shifted the base form Amritsar Sahib to Kiratpur Sahib.Why?To make a base for future Guru.

Why did Sixth Master wrote any of his own Veer Ras Bani? and Why Baba Tyagmal later called Guru Tegh Bahdur Sahib ,had Bairagmai Bani(verse full of detachment)?

Becasue he wanted to make Sikhs loose all attachments and then get ready for offensive.

As per Bhagu's book,intialy Sikhs were not ready for offensive,Tenth Guru understood,this due to Sanitly attitude,due to Amrit of foot.Amrit of Sabre was made and Chandi Di var is said to sung over there.Sikhs started to fight among each other after taking that.So mother Sahib Devan put some sweet cakes or Patasha,so that Sikhs may also have some restrain.This is legend.Telling power of Sarbloh Bani.

Rember one thing,Das is sure that you have so far not learnt Shaster Vidiya.If you do not then as it happened to Ghugga Sahib.Due to fear of physical health,you may not be able to speak truth publicaly.Once you learn that,you will understand,what does Vars mean in Shaster Vidiya.

Kirpan became part of Kaker after Tenth Master,Yuo do not know how to use that.Yuo need to know,and later das will be happy if you stab das also.But learn this.And you will find the relavense of Beer Rasa,which you have thought off only and never used.



 




> The only lesson taught from tria chariters is women are evil and do bad things and should not be trusted. Sikhs had already learned not to get into other women by Guru Nanak and Bhai Gurdass’s vars make it clear


 

This means that Triya Charitar are as per confirimirty with Bani already sent?

Anyway what was the need for Ninth Master to write his Bani if All was completed by the Time of Fifth Master?

. 





> Don’t tell me tria chariters give better lesson the Guru Granth Sahib Ji. There is also something called Sikh rehat maryada which tells Sikhs what to do and what not to do.


 
Das Sikh Rahit Maryada tells us about our foes like Dwij Varg ie Kshtriya,Brahmin, Vaishya,who can inflict harm onto us?

Does that expose thier follies behind the name of faith?

By the way Muslims are also targeted.





> Character defamation can’t be accepted at kautak and neither can be {censored} poetry. If someone doesn’t believe me, just look at the situation of saad babas. They promote Dasam Granth and are the biggest kanjars and kaamis. Their bhoras aren’t made for bhugtee but to drag girls there and rape them. Don’t get mad at me and harass me, just read the newspapers and the person would understand.


 
Main thing is the way you are targetting Sadh over here,in the same way did Guru targetted Yogis,Qazis etc vide Triya Charitar.

Differance is that he was offensive and your self his son are defensive.No need to be self consius.Thinks of enemy in front of you and get over it.

Yuo enmy makes you ponder on yourself and you are busy with self and,that by the way ends you.

Yuor and das's foe is just the same.But you want to end das first then your foe.

Das will take care of foe.In that time if you kill das,there will be mnay more das's from the blood of das.


----------



## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 23, 2007)

Biggest foes are direct Guru Nindaks so they need to be handled first.
Guru Gobind Singh Ji didn't give new philosophy. It was the same as that of Guru Nanak Dev Ji. Poets have identified themselves and that is enough for me. Sikhs were already keeping the rehats. Guru Sahib just finalized them. Sikhs were carrying Kirpans since time of Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji. Maybe you don't know but Guru Sahib only defended. Saving people from looters or saving daughters from devils is defending, not offending.
If someone reads all the charters with open mind, the person know what is work of which poet.
There is nothing to decode in shund #s. It is a mess up by uneducated people.

Guru Sahib never read Chandi Di Var for Bir russ as it wasn't needed. Neither is it needed now. Guru Sahib gave Dhadi Vars to get bir russ. Some dhadis do sing chandi di var but it isn't Gurmat. Number of dasam granth promoters is decreasing daily. If you don't believe me, then see for yourself. Other than the 10-15 sell out scholars. No other scholar accepts it.
Also, Vijaydeep, you aren't the only scholar of Braaj or Sanskrit. Get rid of your ego and stop attacking missionaries.
It was missionaries who kicked people like narianu out of Darbar Sahib. It was missionaries who launched and won the Morchas.
Did your derawalas win any morcha they launched?
They failed in all of them. Why? Because of dasam granth.


----------



## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 23, 2007)

*Side* *Note*: We must know that the writer when referring to the king near Satluj river, is directing the talk towards Guru Gobind Singh Ji. It is further made clear when it says that followers from all over the places came and received boons. Not only that, it also talks about the king being young and a religious leader. There should be no doubt that it is directed towards Guru Gobind Singh Ji.
*Chariter 16*
*Dohra*
Near the Satluj River, a king lived happily. A prostitute arrived in the city to make money. 1.
*Investigation*: Anandpur was newly established and was under control of Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Sikhs mostly lived there so it is hard to believe that a prostitute would have customers in Anandpur Sahib. Is this not an attack on character of Sikhs?
*Arill*
Everyone knew her as Shujeeya but her lovers referred to her as Ludeeya. Every man who saw her, became attracted to her and received pleasure in the heart. 2.
*Investigation*: Who were her lovers? Were they Sikhs? The writer fails to make it clear. Did the Sikhs also become attracted to her and visited her? Is this not an attack on character of Sikhs?
*Dohra*
She was attracted towards the king but she could not convince him. She thought about ideas to meet the king. 3.
(She thought) He doesn’t for love me so what should be done? He doesn’t come to my house and neither does he call me to his house). 4.
Some way has to be found to meet him fast. She thought that maybe he could be won over through jantars and mantars. 5.
She was exhausted trying jantars and mnatars but he king didn’t visit her. Then she plotted a ploy to allure the king. 6.
She dressed in orange clothing which the Yogis wear and bowed to the king when entering the king’s court. 7.
*Investigation*: Did the prostitute not know where she was going? Did she think that the Guru would fall for her? Is this not an attack on Guru Sahib? Is this not questioning the character of Guru Sahib? Then the writer says that she tries jantars and mantars. Maybe the writer didn’t know but Gurmat doesn’t agree to performing mantars. It is strictly against Gurmat. The writer again fails to mention that mantars are against Gurmat. Also Guru Ji was so unaware that he could not tell the difference between a woman dressed as a yogi and a man dressed as a yogi? Is this not an attack on the greatness of Guru Gobind Singh Ji?
*Arill*
Seeing the Yogi, the king was impressed internally and thought about receiving some mantars from the yogi. King called a messenger, told him what to say and sent him to the Yogi (prostitute) so he the king could learn the skill of mantars. 8.
*Investigation*: Once again, the writer makes Guru Gobind Singh Ji as a king searching for mantars. Someone could say that the mantars here don’t mean the magic spells but it means consultation or virtues. Even if that point is accepted, it still doesn’t make it correct as there is no reason to learn virtues from a yogi or have consultation with yogis on Panthic or even personal matters. Guru is the one who teaches others, not the other way around. However, the mantars here mean magic spells. This will be proven later in the chariter. Is this not slandering Guru Gobind Singh Ji? Could someone promoting this garbage be considered a Sikh of Guru Nanak or Guru Gobind Singh Ji? Is there any shame left?
*Chaupai*
King’s servant went to the Yogi. Whatever the king had said, the servant repeated to the Yogi. Servant asked the Yogi to give some mantars to the king and to please complete this task for his boss (king). 9.
*Investigation*: So Guru was sending his servants to make appointments to learn mantars from yogis? Why was Guru Sahib so desperate to learn mantars when they are not even as per Gurmat? Guru Sahib said something and did something?
*Dohra*
The yogi opened his/her eyes after 3 hours and told the servant to bring the king to her/his house if the king wanted to learn virtues. 10.
Bring him to me at midnight. With Gorakh’s blessing, the king will not go back empty handed. 11.
*Investigation*: Why did the yogi have her/his eyes closed for 3 hours? Closing eyes is also against Gurmat. Gurbani calls it hypocrisy and the writer again fails to mention this. The writer then says with Gorakh’s blessings; here Gorakh means Gorakh Naath the yogi. Gurmat only says to worship Akaal and look for help from Akaal. Not some deities or humans or saints, no matter how great they are. This is evidenced in the concept of ‘_Pooja Akaal_ _Kee’_ meaning worship of God. God is worshipped by following Gurbani. Gorakh Naath was the founder of the yogi sect of Hinduism. Was Gorakh Nath greater than Guru Nanak that the 10th Nanak had to go to a follower of Gorakh to learn virtues? Guru Nanak proved the path of yogis wrong as evidenced in ‘_Sidh Gost_’ written in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Tria Chariter promoters say that those questioning Tria Chariters are questioning Guru and Gurbani. After reading this verse, it should clear on who is questioning Guru and Gurbani.
*Chaupai*
The servant relayed the message back to the king and woke him up at midnight. He took the king to the yogi’s house. Upon seeing the king, the yogi felt great pleasure. 12.
*Investigation*: Who cares if the yogi felt pleasure or not. What does it have to do with Gurmat?
*Dohra*
Yogi asked the king to send all the people away from the site and call for sandalwood sticks, wick lamp, rice, flowers and good liquor. 13.
The king did as asked and told the people to go away. He also received the sandalwood sticks, wick lamp, rice, flowers and good liquor. 14.
Then the king sent all of his people away and stayed there pleasurably to learn the mantar. 15.
*Investigation*: What does liquor have to do with virtues and what do others items have to do with learning virtues? Items such as wick lamps, sandalwood, rice, flowers, etc. are used in learning mantars (magic spells) and not when learning virtues. Therefore, it should be clear that the mantars here mean magic spells which are against fundamentals of Gurmat. Once again the writer tries to make Guru Gobind Singh Ji look like a person who doesn’t know much about his surroundings. This is a direct attack on Guru Gobind Singh Ji.
*Chaupai*
When the king was alone, the yogi said that I will show you magic now and will teach you the mantar later. 16.
*Investigation*: Gurmat also doesn’t accept showing off of magic powers. Once again, the writer fails to mention that this is against Gurmat.
*Dohra*
From male, I will become a female, and then I will become a male again. Being a male, I will teach you mantar and being a female, I will have sex with you. 17.
*Investigation*: There should be no confusion here as this is not magic but a fraud. There is nothing special in looking like a woman and then looking like a man. Only a confused person would want to look like the opposite gender. Example, those who shave hair are usually confused as they want to cut hair and look more like females than males.
*King Said:*
The male who gives mantar is like a father and woman who gives mantar is like a mother. They are to be served and are not be had sexual intercourse with. 18.
*Investigation*: These statements which seem like the writer is promoting Gurmat are just sugar-coating on poison. Don’t be fooled by these.
*Arill*
Guru has to be served for mamy years and then after trying hard, the mantar has to be received. Therefore, it is proper to bow to Guru. Hey witty! Then tell me why should sex be had with him/her? 19.
*Investigation*: So suddenly the yogi becomes Guru of Guru Gobind Singh Ji? Where are the brains of promoters of this slandering of Guru Gobind Singh Ji? Do these people have mental problems? Is their mission to promote these yogis or other anti-Gurmat paths as better than the path of Guru Nanak? Who are the real slanderers of Guru? Promoters of such stories or the ones who oppose these?
*Chaupai*
Then the yogi said that I performed his clever act to meet you. Now have sex with me my beloved. Now get on my bed. 20.
*Investigation*: Did the woman think that Guru Sahib was so easily going to get on her bed and have sex with her?
*Dohra*
My body has been thirsting to meet you and my body parts have become weak. Hey beloved! Come and accommodate yourself on my bed and make love with me today. 21.
If you try to run away then I will get you caught as a thief and if you let me go, I will speak foul to you. Otherwise, have sex with me without a thought. 22.
When a woman, filled with lust, comes to the one who she loves and if the loved one lets her go without fulfilling her desire, that person shall be thrown in deep hell. 23.
If a woman’s body is filled with lust but a man refuses to fulfill her desires, he should be thrown into the deep pit of hell. 24.
*Investigation*: So people of Anandpur had the character of Guru Sahib in question that they would believe a prostitute and accept Guru Ji as a thief? Guru Ji wasn’t like a lot of the Gurudwara committee members or granthis who steal money from Gurudwaras. Did the prostitute seriously think that her threats and tactics were going to work? What are the threats of being thrown in hell to Guru? Even Sikhs don’t care about hell or heaven so then why would Guru believe in it? Gurmat rejects the hells and heavens after death. Writer again fails to preach Gurmat and keeps promoting Sikhs and their Guru as followers of Hindu philosophy.
*Arill*
Creator has given me birth in the house of a prostitute. I took the appearance of a Yogi to meet you. Now quickly place yourself on my bed. I will live as your slave. Don’t make me more anxious. 25.
*Investigation*: So is it Guru’s fault that she is born in a prostitute’s house? She didn’t have to be a prostitute. What is the purpose of writing that the appearance of yogi was only taken to meet the king? Also Guru Sahib didn’t look for slaves. Guru Sahib freed the people from slavery; not made them slaves.
*Dohra*
So what if you are smart and are young adult. I have been pierced by separation from you so don’t leave my desire unfilled. 26.
*Investigation*: It looks like the woman is lecturing Guru on what to do rather than Guru Sahib lecturing her on what is right and what is wrong.
*Arill*
Don’t waste the time anymore. I am under control of lust. I am drowned in lust up to my head. Don’t let me off with sexual intercourse and don’t have ego due to my desire like black clouded night. 27.
People come to you from all over the places and receive the boons which they wish for. What wrong have I done that I can not have you? I will be the slave of your slaves. Proceed to my bed. 28.
The king said that he came to learn mantars and that she played this act. Why should I have sexual intercourse with you? I am really scared of falling from my faith. 29.
*Investigation*: Then the prostitute accuses Guru Sahib of having ego because he didn’t agree to her wishes according to the story. Is it ego to keep moral code of conduct and refuse to participate it morally corrupt acts? So Guru Sahib refused to have sex because of fear of falling from faith and nothing to do with morals and shame? If Guru Sahib wasn’t the Guru of Sikhs, he would have agreed to the prostitute and participated in sexual activity? How low are the Tria Chariter promoters going to fall morally? Don’t these people fear God when they slander Guru by linking such garbage to Guru Sahib?
*Chaupai*
That woman tried persuasion through many ways. She tried many opinions and persuasions. She tried many jantars and mantars. However, she could not persuade the king into her hands. 30.
*Investigation*: Mantars don’t work on Gursikhs so forget about trying them on Guru. Shows the lack of knowledge the writer has.
*Arill*
She went into the veranda and started shouting “thief” “thief”. She tried to scare the king to meet him. She came back to him and said to listen to her. She said that the king can either have sex with her or she will get him tied up. 31.
Hearing “thief” “thief”, people came to the location. Woman told the people that she started talking while in her sleep. When the people were gone, she held the hand of the king. She told the king to have sexual intercourse with or her face being tied up. 32.
*Investigation*: It says the king’s hand was held by her. Didn’t the king snap his hand away from her? Guru Sahib didn’t mind prostitutes holding his hand? Isn’t this an attack on character of Guru Sahib?
*Dohra*
Then the king thought in his mind that the concept of mantars is to put on an act and run away. 33.
If I run, I lose honor. If I have sexual intercourse, I fall from religion. Due to both of these issues, the situation has become very hard to handle. May God protect me now. 34.
Then king thought that if a son is born, he will become a pimp and if a daughter is born, she will be a prostitute. By having sexual intercourse, religion is lost and by running, I will be tied up. 35.
*Investigation*: Does the verse talking about having pimp or prostitute as child according to Gurmat? Does this mean Guru Sahib would have fulfilled her wish had it not been the fear of child being born as prostitute or pimp? Is this not a direct attack on character of Guru Sahib?
*Chaupai*
King said, “hey beloved! Listen to me. I was just checking you devotion towards me. Whoever finds a beautiful woman like you and lets her go, is a big imbecile. 36.
*Investigation*: The woman keeps calling Guru Sahib as beloved in a *******ed way and Guru Sahib doesn’t say a word to stop her? How low the chariter promoters going to go to link this garbage to Guru Sahib? Would Guru Sahib ever say that the one who lets go of a beautiful woman is an idiot? When are these enemies of Guru and Guru’s Panth going to stop attacking Guru and Gurmat?
*Dohra*
If a beautiful woman like you is received, anyone who thinks about forsaking her, his having birth is shameful. 37.
Get a large amount of poppy husk, cannabis, and opium quickly. Being happy from the heart, feed me cannabis. 38.
You drink a lot of liquor and feed me cannabis. I will have sexual intercourse with you for 12 hours. 39.
*Investigation*: So all those who follow Gurmat had no point in being born? Is this not a direct attack on Gurmat? Is this what the naked legs ones read and promote as Gurmat? Would Guru Sahib ever order drugs? Would Guru Sahib ever tell a woman who doesn’t belong to him that he would have sex with her for 12 hours? Are these stories the reasons why they are often caught in sex scandals or rapes? Can these people ever be considered Sikhs? According to the rehat maryada, they can not be. This is the reason why they reject the rehat maryada and make their own maraydas. Who are the real enemies of Guru? Those who promote garbage like this or the ones who oppose it?
*Chaupai*
Without knowing, she became joyful after listening to these words. She could not tell between fact and falseness. Being really happy in the heart, she ordered the drugs the king had ordered. 40.
*Investigation*: The writer seems to have a grudge against women. Maybe his wife ran away or performed one the tricks on someone else. What is so great about fooling women? Is this Gurmat?
*Dohra*
Poppy husk, cannabis, opium and deep grinded cannabis and liquor prepared seven times were brought. 41.
*Investigation*: Isn’t this verse promoting drugs? Not once have drugs been denounced in the chariter. Would Guru Sahib not say how bad drugs are? Shows that this isn’t work of Guru Sahib.
*Arill*
Then the king thought in the mind. Today I will not have sex with her. This is the wisdom from the mantar. I will make her really high on drugs and lie her down on the bed and will run away saving my religion. I will give her 60 coins before going. 42.
*Investigation*: What did the king mean by not today? King was planning to indulge in sexual activity some other time? What were the 60 coins going to be given for? Was the prostitute a great preacher of Gurmat? Did she invent a special device to help people succeed in day to day activities? Does it mean it is good to give prostitutes money and make them happy? How low are the Panth enemies going to go to promote this garbage? Can these people ever be called Sikhs?
*Dohra*
She does not understand love. She only cares about money. Are scorpions, snakes and prostitutes ever friends of anyone? 43.
Increasing pleasure, the king made her drink a lot of liquor and to run away, he made her lofty and got her to sleep on the bed. 44.
The king fed her liquor with his own hands and through this act, drugged her up and made her sleep on the bed. 45.
*Investigation*: So Guru Sahib filled glasses of liquor with his own hands and got her to drink it with his own hands? Can anyone ever think of Guru Sahib filling glasses of liquor and putting them to the mouth of a woman? Is this Gurmat?
*Arill*
King filled glasses and fed her with his hands. He showed a lot of love towards the prostitute. When she got high and went to sleep, the king placed 60 coins there and ran away. 46.
If a woman loves you, do not love her. If she becomes intoxicated in you sweetness, do not ruin yourself in her sweetness. If you can not understand the feelings of a woman, make sure she doesn’t know the thought of your heart. 47.
*Investigation*: Why are the same lines being repeated again and again? It seems like the writer was also under influence of drugs while composing this garbage. When he says not to love woman, which woman is he talking about? Does it include the wife? Is it doesn’t then why isn’t it made clear? If it does include the wife, then how can 2 bodies function as one if there is no trust? Is this Gurmat philosophy?
*Dohra*
Making the woman unconscious (with drugs) and giving her 60 coins, the king ran away. He reached home and no one saw him coming. 48.
*Investigation*: So the king did indeed run away? If no one saw him coming home, then how did the writer know? The writer is none other than poet Raam. Is poet Raam the Guru of these chariter promoters? Those who do accept that these are writings of poets and say these are accepted writings, do they even know what Gurmat is? Also, who accepted these writings? Is mahant narainu and company or is it is children of narainu (also known as modern mahants)? So if someone wanted to make money, just act as a prostitute and try to lure Guru of Sikhs. Those who sell their souls to RSS are no better than prostitutes like Shujeeya.
*Arill*
Then the king came home and made a vow that he saved his faith this time with some good tricks. He vowed that he would now spread the greatness of his God throughout many countries and states. He also vowed not to look at other women. 49.
*Investigation*: Does this verse mean Guru Sahib wasn’t telling people about God or spreading greatness of God before? Does this mean Guru Sahib used to check out women before this incidence? How low are the chariter promoters going to get? How far will they go to ruin the image of great Guru Sahib? Is there no shame or religious conduct left? 
*Dohra*
The lesson from that day is in my heart. Since that day, I have not been looking at other women. 50.
*Investigation*: Once again, does this mean Guru Sahib used to look at women in a sexual way before this incidence? How low are the promoters of such garbage going to go? D they fear God or Guru? Do they have no shame insulting Guru who sacrificed everything for them? Do they have no shame defaming the Guru, due to whom they have huge bellies and make a living? How far will they go to ruin the image of great Guru Sahib? Is there no shame or religious conduct left? Will anyone take action? If you care and love Guru, then spread this article to everyone you know. Otherwise, you can join the chariter promoters and become an enemy of Guru. So it is up to you to decide on which side to take. Which one will you take? Will you spread this article to everyone you know who claims to be a Sikh?

Some lines such as “sandalwood, wick lamp, rice, flowers and good liquor was brought” are repeated again and again. This shows that the writer wasn’t in the right state of mind when writing these chariters. This turns out to be more of a male chariter rather than a female chariter. Also, not to forget, in the end, the prostitute wins as her motive to collect money was also fulfilled. This is a direct attack towards Guru Gobind Singh Ji. No Sikh of Guru Nanak will tolerate this and can never accept this litter as Gurbani.

Chariter 16 translation and analysis completed!

Please kindly forgive any mistakes and provide any suggestions.

Harmanjit Singh​mannharm66@hotmail.com​


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## sahilmakkar1983 (Jan 24, 2007)

GuruFateh

Ya its true, that SGGS is singing the praises of SATNAM
but it also says that SATNAM is not SATNAM but SATNAM is unspoken(AJAPA) word
ਘਰ  ਮਹਿ  ਘਰੁ  ਦੇਖਾਇ  ਦੇਇ  ਸੋ  ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ  ਪੁਰਖੁ  ਸੁਜਾਣੁ  ॥ 
 घर महि घरु देखाइ देइ सो सतिगुरु पुरखु सुजाणु ॥ 
 ghar meh ghar daykhaa-ay day-ay so satgur purakh sujaan. 
 The True Guru is the All-knowing Primal Being; He shows us our true home within the home of the self. 

 ਪੰਚ  ਸਬਦ  ਧੁਨਿਕਾਰ  ਧੁਨਿ  ਤਹ  ਬਾਜੈ  ਸਬਦੁ  ਨੀਸਾਣੁ  ॥ 
 पंच सबद धुनिकार धुनि तह बाजै सबदु नीसाणु ॥ 
 panch sabad Dhunikaar Dhun tah baajai sabad neesaan. 
 The Panch Shabad, the Five Primal Sounds, resonate and resound within; the insignia of the Shabad is revealed there, vibrating gloriously. 

 ਦੀਪ  ਲੋਅ  ਪਾਤਾਲ  ਤਹ  ਖੰਡ  ਮੰਡਲ  ਹੈਰਾਨੁ  ॥ 
 दीप लोअ पाताल तह खंड मंडल हैरानु ॥ 
 deep lo-a paataal tah khand mandal hairaan. 
 Worlds and realms, nether regions, solar systems and galaxies are wondrously revealed. 

 ਤਾਰ  ਘੋਰ  ਬਾਜਿੰਤ੍ਰ  ਤਹ  ਸਾਚਿ  ਤਖਤਿ  ਸੁਲਤਾਨੁ  ॥ 
 तार घोर बाजिंत्र तह साचि तखति सुलतानु ॥ 
 taar ghor baajintar tah saach takhat sultaan. 
 The strings and the harps vibrate and resound; the true throne of the Lord is there. 

 ਸੁਖਮਨ  ਕੈ  ਘਰਿ  ਰਾਗੁ  ਸੁਨਿ  ਸੁੰਨਿ  ਮੰਡਲਿ  ਲਿਵ  ਲਾਇ  ॥ 
 सुखमन कै घरि रागु सुनि सुंनि मंडलि लिव लाइ ॥ 
 sukhman kai ghar raag sun sunn mandal liv laa-ay. 
 Listen to the music of the home of the heart - Sukhmani, peace of mind. Lovingly tune in to His state of celestial ecstasy. 

 ਅਕਥ  ਕਥਾ  ਬੀਚਾਰੀਐ  ਮਨਸਾ  ਮਨਹਿ  ਸਮਾਇ  ॥ 
 अकथ कथा बीचारीऐ मनसा मनहि समाइ ॥ 
 akath kathaa beechaaree-ai mansaa maneh samaa-ay. 
 Contemplate the Unspoken Speech, and the desires of the mind are dissolved. 

 ਉਲਟਿ  ਕਮਲੁ  ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ  ਭਰਿਆ  ਇਹੁ  ਮਨੁ  ਕਤਹੁ  ਨ  ਜਾਇ  ॥ 
 उलटि कमलु अम्रिति भरिआ इहु मनु कतहु न जाइ ॥ 
 ulat kamal amrit bhari-aa ih man katahu na jaa-ay. 
 The heart-lotus is turned upside-down, and is filled with Ambrosial Nectar. This mind does not go out; it does not get distracted. 

 ਅਜਪਾ  ਜਾਪੁ  ਨ  ਵੀਸਰੈ  ਆਦਿ  ਜੁਗਾਦਿ  ਸਮਾਇ  ॥ 
 अजपा जापु न वीसरै आदि जुगादि समाइ ॥ 
 ajpaa jaap na veesrai aad jugaad samaa-ay. 
 It does not forget the Chant which is chanted without chanting; it is immersed in the Primal Lord God of the ages. 

 ਸਭਿ  ਸਖੀਆ  ਪੰਚੇ  ਮਿਲੇ  ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ  ਨਿਜ  ਘਰਿ  ਵਾਸੁ  ॥ 
 सभि सखीआ पंचे मिले गुरमुखि निज घरि वासु ॥ 
 sabh sakhee-aa panchay milay gurmukh nij ghar vaas. 
 All the sister-companions are blessed with the five virtues. The Gurmukhs dwell in the home of the self deep within. 

 ਸਬਦੁ  ਖੋਜਿ  ਇਹੁ  ਘਰੁ  ਲਹੈ  ਨਾਨਕੁ  ਤਾ  ਕਾ  ਦਾਸੁ  ॥੧॥ 
 सबदु खोजि इहु घरु लहै नानकु ता का दासु ॥१॥ 
 sabad khoj ih ghar lahai naanak taa kaa daas. ||1|| 
 Nanak is the slave of that one who seeks the Shabad and finds this home within. ||1|| 

Please read the meaning of the lines
clearly stating that the master , guru is that who can show u the GOD within u
and ORANGE highlighted in b/w is clearly stating that NAAM is AJAPA
SATNAM is AJAPA

SVJKK SVJKF


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> *Side* *Note*: We must know that the writer when referring to the king near Satluj river, is directing the talk towards Guru Gobind Singh Ji. It is further made clear when it says that followers from all over the places came and received boons. Not only that, it also talks about the king being young and a religious leader. There should be no doubt that it is directed towards Guru Gobind Singh Ji.
> *Chariter 16*
> *Dohra*
> Near the Satluj River, a king lived happily. A prostitute arrived in the city to make money. 1.
> ...


 
das has given the things which tells tha where are you going wrong.

Read them again only first post is reposted. and rest read from above again.

Gurfateh 

Das was bust with some offline work so was awy,Akal thanks God so that Das can reply Bhai TKF.

Anyway Das is first tryting to conclude his article.


Gurfateh
So das first takes Into account of 5 things in 
Character 16 which some can say look similar to that of Guru.It is strange that our brothers with some racial Punjabi jattism tend to forget that Charectors are not eroticas.
So das will take care of first point
1.the first line.​One bankof/near Satiluj,Happened to be a lord,living(and) having comforts.
For the wealth one Ramjani came to his place.1.
His place use to have wealth and one ramjani came there.1
For wealth one Ramjani came to that place.1.​There are three interpretations of the second line and last one is remotest.Das reads hote(happened to be/use to be) and not Het(for) in version which das has.Maybe Translitration from Gurmukhi to Nagri has caused this mistake.​​Das will touch both the cases.
But better is to take the remotest case first.​For the purpose of Mony only Ramjani came to that place.(in other two cases place is termed wealthy or king is termed wealthy and coming Ramjani is written.It is still not written that Ramjani came to place to have mony) .But if it is het,then she came to his place or that ploace to get wealth.​Ramjani litraly means been born by God or delivered by God.As prostitutes may not know who there father is(if born from mother in same profession) so God only is her father.
Das looked if there could be some farsi conection as ram is used in farsi like Ramsar(a place on the bank of Caspian sea)Ramjanga(gun) but Jani may not have meaning as far as das is interested.Term zan is used for lady.​So can the bank of Satiluj be Anandpur Sahib only?​Answer is no.​Satluj is river older then Himlayas and is trans himlayan river.It strats from tibbet ,moves into India wide Himachal(making U shaped valley in Himalaya) then enters Punjab plains and then enter Pakistan and further ahead making way for Indus.It moves more then 400 kilometers.(das can write whole geological story about relation Satluj had with Euraisa and Gandvanaland but all such is beyond the scope of this text.When writer use to write such things in Shri Dasham Granth Sahib Ji,then guys use to raise eybrow .When some one is blessed by Akal,the endless,the knowledge endless,then it is OK to not to put all info else point could be over shadowed.Das’s knowledge is anyway still not vey much)​Say Bank of yamuna can be Paunta Sahib,Delhi,Mathura and up till Allahbad.Rai or lord is mentioned in first line but later on from 10,13,14 lines pair have term king also.And King is repeated again.​There has been traditions in Hindus to have term rai added to them(Britshers use to tag their jackals as Rai Bahadur)Examples are Medini Rai(of Raisen,central India),Krishandev Raya,Achyut Raya(of Vijay Nagar,South India),Biji Rai(Last Hindu king of Sialkot).​Muslims also held this title and das will give two on the either sides of Satluj.Rai Bular(in north west) and Rai Kala(in south),both have importance in Sikh history.
As we see from the case of Ranjha(Dido Queshi of Takhat Hazara),Muslim Rais also had interst in Yoga(as he become Yogi of Gorakhnath).Biji Rai also once became Muslim Nasha Shah but before defeat from Ghauri reverts to pagan faith.​Also das would like to mention Naqshbandi,who are forefathers of present days wahabis. Their Shekh Ahmad was responsible for martyer dom of Fifth Master.They were at Sirhinds.They had whole system ini their language about various glands or Chakras as in yogis.In Pranayams nose is closed.Naqsh is nose and band is to close.​We see that in 21st Charitar we are given under Eye peak and name Anandpur to exact location for the place.Same can be read at end of Ram Avtar,ie under the foot of eye peak,one the bank of Satiluj.​But in last Charitar after date it is only mentioned that at the bank of Satiluj.In there also it may not mean that Guru write it at Anandpur Sahib,There also we should know that some other palce also clould be there on the bank of Satiluj where Guru eneded dialogue of Minster and Landowner/king .Guru did write at Paunta Sahib,He did write Jaffernama outside Anandpur Sahib and Sarbloh Granrth was all the more written after leaving Anandpur Sahib.​There were many War which Guru faught with Hindu Kings,and while stalking them in hills or say near Kiratpur Sahib or otherwise also,why can not Guru also write outside Anandppur Sahib.Alexender use to write while on mission.Why can not Guru do this?​


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## sahilmakkar1983 (Jan 24, 2007)

GuruFateh,

 Ya its true, that SGGS is singing the praises of SATNAM
 but it also says that SATNAM is not SATNAM but SATNAM is unspoken(AJAPA) word
ਘਰ  ਮਹਿ  ਘਰੁ  ਦੇਖਾਇ  ਦੇਇ  ਸੋ  ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ  ਪੁਰਖੁ  ਸੁਜਾਣੁ  ॥ 
 घर महि घरु देखाइ देइ सो सतिगुरु पुरखु सुजाणु ॥ 
 ghar meh ghar daykhaa-ay day-ay so satgur purakh sujaan. 
 The True Guru is the All-knowing Primal Being; He shows us our true home within the home of the self. 

 ਪੰਚ  ਸਬਦ  ਧੁਨਿਕਾਰ  ਧੁਨਿ  ਤਹ  ਬਾਜੈ  ਸਬਦੁ  ਨੀਸਾਣੁ  ॥ 
 पंच सबद धुनिकार धुनि तह बाजै सबदु नीसाणु ॥ 
 panch sabad Dhunikaar Dhun tah baajai sabad neesaan. 
 The Panch Shabad, the Five Primal Sounds, resonate and resound within; the insignia of the Shabad is revealed there, vibrating gloriously. 

 ਦੀਪ  ਲੋਅ  ਪਾਤਾਲ  ਤਹ  ਖੰਡ  ਮੰਡਲ  ਹੈਰਾਨੁ  ॥ 
 दीप लोअ पाताल तह खंड मंडल हैरानु ॥ 
 deep lo-a paataal tah khand mandal hairaan. 
 Worlds and realms, nether regions, solar systems and galaxies are wondrously revealed. 

 ਤਾਰ  ਘੋਰ  ਬਾਜਿੰਤ੍ਰ  ਤਹ  ਸਾਚਿ  ਤਖਤਿ  ਸੁਲਤਾਨੁ  ॥ 
 तार घोर बाजिंत्र तह साचि तखति सुलतानु ॥ 
 taar ghor baajintar tah saach takhat sultaan. 
 The strings and the harps vibrate and resound; the true throne of the Lord is there. 

 ਸੁਖਮਨ  ਕੈ  ਘਰਿ  ਰਾਗੁ  ਸੁਨਿ  ਸੁੰਨਿ  ਮੰਡਲਿ  ਲਿਵ  ਲਾਇ  ॥ 
 सुखमन कै घरि रागु सुनि सुंनि मंडलि लिव लाइ ॥ 
 sukhman kai ghar raag sun sunn mandal liv laa-ay. 
 Listen to the music of the home of the heart - Sukhmani, peace of mind. Lovingly tune in to His state of celestial ecstasy. 

 ਅਕਥ  ਕਥਾ  ਬੀਚਾਰੀਐ  ਮਨਸਾ  ਮਨਹਿ  ਸਮਾਇ  ॥ 
 अकथ कथा बीचारीऐ मनसा मनहि समाइ ॥ 
 akath kathaa beechaaree-ai mansaa maneh samaa-ay. 
 Contemplate the Unspoken Speech, and the desires of the mind are dissolved. 

 ਉਲਟਿ  ਕਮਲੁ  ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ  ਭਰਿਆ  ਇਹੁ  ਮਨੁ  ਕਤਹੁ  ਨ  ਜਾਇ  ॥ 
 उलटि कमलु अम्रिति भरिआ इहु मनु कतहु न जाइ ॥ 
 ulat kamal amrit bhari-aa ih man katahu na jaa-ay. 
 The heart-lotus is turned upside-down, and is filled with Ambrosial Nectar. This mind does not go out; it does not get distracted. 

 ਅਜਪਾ  ਜਾਪੁ  ਨ  ਵੀਸਰੈ  ਆਦਿ  ਜੁਗਾਦਿ  ਸਮਾਇ  ॥ 
 अजपा जापु न वीसरै आदि जुगादि समाइ ॥ 
 ajpaa jaap na veesrai aad jugaad samaa-ay. 
 It does not forget the Chant which is chanted without chanting; it is immersed in the Primal Lord God of the ages. 

 ਸਭਿ  ਸਖੀਆ  ਪੰਚੇ  ਮਿਲੇ  ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ  ਨਿਜ  ਘਰਿ  ਵਾਸੁ  ॥ 
 सभि सखीआ पंचे मिले गुरमुखि निज घरि वासु ॥ 
 sabh sakhee-aa panchay milay gurmukh nij ghar vaas. 
 All the sister-companions are blessed with the five virtues. The Gurmukhs dwell in the home of the self deep within. 

 ਸਬਦੁ  ਖੋਜਿ  ਇਹੁ  ਘਰੁ  ਲਹੈ  ਨਾਨਕੁ  ਤਾ  ਕਾ  ਦਾਸੁ  ॥੧॥ 
 सबदु खोजि इहु घरु लहै नानकु ता का दासु ॥१॥ 
 sabad khoj ih ghar lahai naanak taa kaa daas. ||1|| 
 Nanak is the slave of that one who seeks the Shabad and finds this home within. ||1|| 

 Please read the meaning of the lines
 clearly stating that the master , guru is that who can show u the GOD within u
 and ORANGE highlighted in b/w is clearly stating that NAAM is AJAPA
SATNAM is AJAPA

SVJKK SVJKF


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh



> Biggest foes are direct Guru Nindaks so they need to be handled first.


 
They have to be handled with iron fist,but do you have that. ?


> Guru Gobind Singh Ji didn't give new philosophy. It was the same as that of Guru Nanak Dev Ji.


 
Then why Singh and Why Khalsa?for you Palace and foundation is same,it can be for you but not for all.


> Poets have identified themselves and that is enough for me.


 
so in Guru Granth Sahib Ji,when word Nanak Does not come in verse,you may not follw that?And if it is conspiracy of hindus or Brahmins then why should poets give thier names? 


> Sikhs were already keeping the rehats.


 
Do you know that there was case in Delhi court when higher castes refused to take Sabres Amrit as they find it unfit to share with lower caste.Guru sent message favouring the lower castes.





> Guru Sahib just finalized them. Sikhs were carrying Kirpans since time of Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji. Maybe you don't know but Guru Sahib only defended. Saving people from looters or saving daughters from devils is defending, not offending.


 
In War of Nadaun,guru took prememptive actions and so was the war of Haoshiyarpur.

Karni Nammah tells Raj Karega Khalsa only after Tenth Master.

Kirpan was sorry Khanda was there with First Master also(can be seen at Patna Sahib muesium) But he did not make an Army for fight Baber,He first made people arise.Final is differant from intial.
If someone reads all the charters with open mind, the person know what is work of which poet.


> There is nothing to decode in shund #s. It is a mess up by uneducated people.


 
Thats the mani messed up things in narrow mind.

what you call uneducated people due to class or caste bias are lower caste wyou are been arose to revolt by Guru.


> Guru Sahib never read Chandi Di Var for Bir russ as it wasn't needed. Neither is it needed now.


 
Prove it.

Old book from Bhangus says somtething else.

do not go Army,but learn Gatka and real one.When you get the cut on the neck,das has one on wrist.Then you will be able to know what is imporatnce of Chandi Di Var or Ugradanti.Das is sure that you do not know any.


> Guru Sahib gave Dhadi Vars to get bir russ. Some dhadis do sing chandi di var but it isn't Gurmat.


Prove this.

Anyway in war we do not have to take Dhadis in Battle fied.We had Drums or Nagras in past.But presently at Hola or Gatka,we have dhols.And in real war time.We need Kanth Bani of Tenth Master,rather unto Tenth Master.




> Number of dasam granth promoters is decreasing daily. If you don't believe me, then see for yourself. Other than the 10-15 sell out scholars. No other scholar accepts it.


 
So if RSS says to you that Sikhs are cutting thier hairs and becoming Hindu day by day,so we should act like sheep.

This also is your false Propoganda.

All real scholars respect truth and do not lie being cought in web of idelogy.


> Also, Vijaydeep, you aren't the only scholar of Braaj or Sanskrit. Get rid of your ego and stop attacking missionaries.


 
Das has no ego.But are you an able scholar of Punjabi,which is relavent to Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

Das has sense of belonging to Missioaries.Das does not slanders but brings out thier weakness so that,they rectify the mistake.

did not das talked about some matters of indifferance with AKJ,Nihungs or Taksal.Read all the posts of das,and you will find.

Das wants missionries to think and do postive,motre time of them is spent in condeming Sants and Brahmins,while Sants are getting popular.

Supporters of missionaries are getting less.

Das has discussed this issue while talking about work of Bhia Sumra.


> It was missionaries who kicked people like narianu out of Darbar Sahib. It was missionaries who launched and won the Morchas.
> Did your derawalas win any morcha they launched?
> They failed in all of them. Why? Because of dasam granth.


 
Was Maula Singh a missionary?Was Akali Kaur Singh a missionary?Was Baba Kaladhair a missionary?Was AKJ or Taksal guy missioary?Was Kartar Singh Jhaber a missionry?

They were Panthic.


Where have Dra Wallha failed? and how das is Dear Wall? and why due to Dasham Granth?Elaborate?90% plus guuys have not read,some like you have only read punjabi translations.

So called scholars of Sanskrit or Braj have learnt this languae for Academic,thing,not thier mother tongue or LAnguage of thier use.Braj Das can speak a little having a house in Braj Area.Sanskrit das used as language of worship when being a Hindu.

By the way one questioon for you.Which language is used the most in Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

more from privous posts

Gurfateh




> “There is pricess in Bharatpur and MP of BJP called Krishendra Kaur.Kaur is word related to work and non Sikhs also use that.Term Koer and not Kaur is writtan for Anup Koer.But for you Tainka and Tatta are one and the same.”
> What is pricess? I can’t find that word in dictionary. Did the writer mean prices? Doesn’t make sense. Tainka is t and tuttaa is q. Someone who doesn’t know how to properly read Punjabi or understand Punjabi (self admitted) is teaching me how to read Punjabi. Now biharis are going to teach Punjabis how to read Punjabi. What is the world coming to? I didn’t say there aren’t other kaurs. Where did I say other people can’t be kaurs? However, how do you know that the person isn’t trying to defame the Sikh Kaurs?


Term is princess.Thats Ok

Tutta is differant from Tatta it is U and A thing.

Das can understand Lehanda Punjabi as his maternal sides si of Punjabis.Doabi type thing is diffcult.

Das writes a dhola for you.

Balura Katura Sheen Akhaye
Sardul Dehendya Sahika Jaye.

Jus tot let you know that das knows some dialect of Lehnda punjabi.First Master had Bani in this dialect unto him.


Bihari ,Punjabi,Jaat/Teli or Jatt does not matter for a Baptised Sikh as we are told that our Birth place in Anadpur Sahib.

In India,Punjabi is more an abuse refering to Lalas,who are blood suckers and Sirdar JI is title for Sikhs and it is with respect.

Das will touch Kaur issue in next para.
“





> Are you awawe that there is place near Vaishnu Devi called Adi Kuwari and in south as Kanya Kumari.Kumari means doughter.”
> What is awawe? I have never seen that word in dictionary either. Kuare kuAir does mean kumari also but in Punjab people don’t have names like that. Kaur also means princess. So the lady can be a Sikh girl in chariters 21-23 but who knows what poet the poet means. It is not like the poet was a Sikh. Raam, Shyam, Kal or Soom aren’t Sikhs. Do you think I care about your vaishnu devi? She is just mythical like 24 avtar.


 

In Punjab and further north ,Hindus do have such name.Grand mother of Das had name Kailash Kumari.

Das put refreance for just to tell yuo about Hindu name north of Punjab.

Akal is not only Sikh but Guru also and Ram,Siam are names of the name.All names are of Akal.



> “No even a single time term came Anup Kaur.Term is noop Ku-ari to be pronounced as Noop Kuwari.”
> True that it doesn’t come as Anoop Kaur but it is not Noop Ku-ari either. It is Noop Kuar. It is very important to learn to pronounce Gumukhi. Learning the alphabet isn’t good enough to pronounce Punjabi words.
> Kuare kuAir does have 2 meanings:
> 
> ...


 
Is the language Punajbi over there?Is that not Braj?

do you know that hindu,Hindi etc are not Hindi words so are Punjab and Punjabis are Punjabis words,Can you tell me how?

Let us see your language skills.

Dictionary is  of Punjabi,the way it may not have terms of Sanskrit and farsi of Gurbani,so does it will not have meaning of Braj.

Das Gives you Gurmukhi scripts for Both Kaur and ku-ari and let see which is meant by Hindu and which is meant by a Sikh.


for you this can be same as you want this

ਕੌਰ  and ਕੁਅਰਿ but are you sure that this ku-ari is not used for other Hindus in same text only?Ku ar is used and Ku ari is also used.Read the Chairters which Bhai Sumra has pointed.Yuo will find some gudance over there.



> > “But if a prostitute also becomes Amritdhari we have no problem.
> > Did not term prostitue come in Guru Granth Sahib?
> > Have look.Guru ranth Sahib Ji talked of reforming them too.”
> > I don’t accept prostitutes becoming Amritdhari. This is too much. Prostitute must live a good life as juttee jqI sutte for like 10-15 years before she can be called Amritdhari. Here I mean juttee jqI according to Gurmat and not according to brahmnical philosophy. When did I say Guru Granth Sahib Ji doesn’t talk about reforming bad people? RSS agents should be reformed too. So should be tria chariter followers. However, some pass the line and are too far to be reformed. Where did I say that the term prostitute doesn’t come in Guru Granth Sahib Ji? People should respect Guru Granth Sahib Ji and shouldn’t say “Guru ranth Sahib Ji”. Thirty points aren’t needed to prove a point. For me, one Gurbani tukh is enough. Proves that there is no need for tria chariters and there is no way it could have been written by Guru Ji, especially when the poets clearly identify themselves. I will post quotes later. Remind me if I don’t as I have a fairly busy schedule.
> ...





> > “Another non snese thing.
> > Listen son
> > You are helping your hindu family.Hindus can have name Anup Kumari(this not even a single time comes in any Charitar).
> > Why das says that you help hindus.Since times before Muslims came Hindus have tradtions of prostitues.They were refered as Ganika,Veshya etc.And such names are used in Guru Granth Sahib.There is mention of one Urdu name called {censored} also but in Punjabi that is meant by widow.
> ...


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh




> “There is pricess in Bharatpur and MP of BJP called Krishendra Kaur.Kaur is word related to work and non Sikhs also use that.Term Koer and not Kaur is writtan for Anup Koer.But for you Tainka and Tatta are one and the same.”
> What is pricess? I can’t find that word in dictionary. Did the writer mean prices? Doesn’t make sense. Tainka is t and tuttaa is q. Someone who doesn’t know how to properly read Punjabi or understand Punjabi (self admitted) is teaching me how to read Punjabi. Now biharis are going to teach Punjabis how to read Punjabi. What is the world coming to? I didn’t say there aren’t other kaurs. Where did I say other people can’t be kaurs? However, how do you know that the person isn’t trying to defame the Sikh Kaurs?


Term is princess.Thats Ok

Tutta is differant from Tatta it is U and A thing.

Das can understand Lehanda Punjabi as his maternal sides si of Punjabis.Doabi type thing is diffcult.

Das writes a dhola for you.

Balura Katura Sheen Akhaye
Sardul Dehendya Sahika Jaye.

Jus tot let you know that das knows some dialect of Lehnda punjabi.First Master had Bani in this dialect unto him.


Bihari ,Punjabi,Jaat/Teli or Jatt does not matter for a Baptised Sikh as we are told that our Birth place in Anadpur Sahib.

In India,Punjabi is more an abuse refering to Lalas,who are blood suckers and Sirdar JI is title for Sikhs and it is with respect.

Das will touch Kaur issue in next para.
“





> Are you awawe that there is place near Vaishnu Devi called Adi Kuwari and in south as Kanya Kumari.Kumari means doughter.”
> What is awawe? I have never seen that word in dictionary either. Kuare kuAir does mean kumari also but in Punjab people don’t have names like that. Kaur also means princess. So the lady can be a Sikh girl in chariters 21-23 but who knows what poet the poet means. It is not like the poet was a Sikh. Raam, Shyam, Kal or Soom aren’t Sikhs. Do you think I care about your vaishnu devi? She is just mythical like 24 avtar.


 

In Punjab and further north ,Hindus do have such name.Grand mother of Das had name Kailash Kumari.

Das put refreance for just to tell yuo about Hindu name north of Punjab.

Akal is not only Sikh but Guru also and Ram,Siam are names of the name.All names are of Akal.



> “No even a single time term came Anup Kaur.Term is noop Ku-ari to be pronounced as Noop Kuwari.”
> True that it doesn’t come as Anoop Kaur but it is not Noop Ku-ari either. It is Noop Kuar. It is very important to learn to pronounce Gumukhi. Learning the alphabet isn’t good enough to pronounce Punjabi words.
> Kuare kuAir does have 2 meanings:
> 
> ...


 
Is the language Punajbi over there?Is that not Braj?

do you know that hindu,Hindi etc are not Hindi words so are Punjab and Punjabis are Punjabis words,Can you tell me how?

Let us see your language skills.

Dictionary is  of Punjabi,the way it may not have terms of Sanskrit and farsi of Gurbani,so does it will not have meaning of Braj.

Das Gives you Gurmukhi scripts for Both Kaur and ku-ari and let see which is meant by Hindu and which is meant by a Sikh.


for you this can be same as you want this

ਕੌਰ  and ਕੁਅਰਿ but are you sure that this ku-ari is not used for other Hindus in same text only?Ku ar is used and Ku ari is also used.Read the Chairters which Bhai Sumra has pointed.Yuo will find some gudance over there.



> > “But if a prostitute also becomes Amritdhari we have no problem.
> > Did not term prostitue come in Guru Granth Sahib?
> > Have look.Guru ranth Sahib Ji talked of reforming them too.”
> > I don’t accept prostitutes becoming Amritdhari. This is too much. Prostitute must live a good life as juttee jqI sutte for like 10-15 years before she can be called Amritdhari. Here I mean juttee jqI according to Gurmat and not according to brahmnical philosophy. When did I say Guru Granth Sahib Ji doesn’t talk about reforming bad people? RSS agents should be reformed too. So should be tria chariter followers. However, some pass the line and are too far to be reformed. Where did I say that the term prostitute doesn’t come in Guru Granth Sahib Ji? People should respect Guru Granth Sahib Ji and shouldn’t say “Guru ranth Sahib Ji”. Thirty points aren’t needed to prove a point. For me, one Gurbani tukh is enough. Proves that there is no need for tria chariters and there is no way it could have been written by Guru Ji, especially when the poets clearly identify themselves. I will post quotes later. Remind me if I don’t as I have a fairly busy schedule.
> ...





> > “Another non snese thing.
> > Listen son
> > You are helping your hindu family.Hindus can have name Anup Kumari(this not even a single time comes in any Charitar).
> > Why das says that you help hindus.Since times before Muslims came Hindus have tradtions of prostitues.They were refered as Ganika,Veshya etc.And such names are used in Guru Granth Sahib.There is mention of one Urdu name called {censored} also but in Punjabi that is meant by widow.
> ...


----------



## sahilmakkar1983 (Jan 24, 2007)

GuruFateh,

 Ya its true, that SGGS is singing the praises of SATNAM
 but it also says that SATNAM is not SATNAM but SATNAM is unspoken(AJAPA) word
ਘਰ  ਮਹਿ  ਘਰੁ  ਦੇਖਾਇ  ਦੇਇ  ਸੋ  ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ  ਪੁਰਖੁ  ਸੁਜਾਣੁ  ॥ 
 घर महि घरु देखाइ देइ सो सतिगुरु पुरखु सुजाणु ॥ 
 ghar meh ghar daykhaa-ay day-ay so satgur purakh sujaan. 
 The True Guru is the All-knowing Primal Being; He shows us our true home within the home of the self. 

 ਪੰਚ  ਸਬਦ  ਧੁਨਿਕਾਰ  ਧੁਨਿ  ਤਹ  ਬਾਜੈ  ਸਬਦੁ  ਨੀਸਾਣੁ  ॥ 
 पंच सबद धुनिकार धुनि तह बाजै सबदु नीसाणु ॥ 
 panch sabad Dhunikaar Dhun tah baajai sabad neesaan. 
 The Panch Shabad, the Five Primal Sounds, resonate and resound within; the insignia of the Shabad is revealed there, vibrating gloriously. 

 ਦੀਪ  ਲੋਅ  ਪਾਤਾਲ  ਤਹ  ਖੰਡ  ਮੰਡਲ  ਹੈਰਾਨੁ  ॥ 
 दीप लोअ पाताल तह खंड मंडल हैरानु ॥ 
 deep lo-a paataal tah khand mandal hairaan. 
 Worlds and realms, nether regions, solar systems and galaxies are wondrously revealed. 

 ਤਾਰ  ਘੋਰ  ਬਾਜਿੰਤ੍ਰ  ਤਹ  ਸਾਚਿ  ਤਖਤਿ  ਸੁਲਤਾਨੁ  ॥ 
 तार घोर बाजिंत्र तह साचि तखति सुलतानु ॥ 
 taar ghor baajintar tah saach takhat sultaan. 
 The strings and the harps vibrate and resound; the true throne of the Lord is there. 

 ਸੁਖਮਨ  ਕੈ  ਘਰਿ  ਰਾਗੁ  ਸੁਨਿ  ਸੁੰਨਿ  ਮੰਡਲਿ  ਲਿਵ  ਲਾਇ  ॥ 
 सुखमन कै घरि रागु सुनि सुंनि मंडलि लिव लाइ ॥ 
 sukhman kai ghar raag sun sunn mandal liv laa-ay. 
 Listen to the music of the home of the heart - Sukhmani, peace of mind. Lovingly tune in to His state of celestial ecstasy. 

 ਅਕਥ  ਕਥਾ  ਬੀਚਾਰੀਐ  ਮਨਸਾ  ਮਨਹਿ  ਸਮਾਇ  ॥ 
 अकथ कथा बीचारीऐ मनसा मनहि समाइ ॥ 
 akath kathaa beechaaree-ai mansaa maneh samaa-ay. 
 Contemplate the Unspoken Speech, and the desires of the mind are dissolved. 

 ਉਲਟਿ  ਕਮਲੁ  ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ  ਭਰਿਆ  ਇਹੁ  ਮਨੁ  ਕਤਹੁ  ਨ  ਜਾਇ  ॥ 
 उलटि कमलु अम्रिति भरिआ इहु मनु कतहु न जाइ ॥ 
 ulat kamal amrit bhari-aa ih man katahu na jaa-ay. 
 The heart-lotus is turned upside-down, and is filled with Ambrosial Nectar. This mind does not go out; it does not get distracted. 

 ਅਜਪਾ  ਜਾਪੁ  ਨ  ਵੀਸਰੈ  ਆਦਿ  ਜੁਗਾਦਿ  ਸਮਾਇ  ॥ 
 अजपा जापु न वीसरै आदि जुगादि समाइ ॥ 
 ajpaa jaap na veesrai aad jugaad samaa-ay. 
 It does not forget the Chant which is chanted without chanting; it is immersed in the Primal Lord God of the ages. 

 ਸਭਿ  ਸਖੀਆ  ਪੰਚੇ  ਮਿਲੇ  ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ  ਨਿਜ  ਘਰਿ  ਵਾਸੁ  ॥ 
 सभि सखीआ पंचे मिले गुरमुखि निज घरि वासु ॥ 
 sabh sakhee-aa panchay milay gurmukh nij ghar vaas. 
 All the sister-companions are blessed with the five virtues. The Gurmukhs dwell in the home of the self deep within. 

 ਸਬਦੁ  ਖੋਜਿ  ਇਹੁ  ਘਰੁ  ਲਹੈ  ਨਾਨਕੁ  ਤਾ  ਕਾ  ਦਾਸੁ  ॥੧॥ 
 सबदु खोजि इहु घरु लहै नानकु ता का दासु ॥१॥ 
 sabad khoj ih ghar lahai naanak taa kaa daas. ||1|| 
 Nanak is the slave of that one who seeks the Shabad and finds this home within. ||1|| 

 Please read the meaning of the lines
 clearly stating that the master , guru is that who can show u the GOD within u
 and ORANGE highlighted in b/w is clearly stating that NAAM is AJAPA
SATNAM is AJAPA

SVJKK SVJKF


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh




> “It is not Jesus like thing where body is worshipped.The Guru when is seen is seen in all and is not in one body but in all bodies.”
> Where is the quote where I said to worship the body? Am I worshipping the body or are those who say chariters are bani just because it says Paatshai 10 at the start. How hard is it to write Paatshahi 10 at the start of a book? Poets raam, shyam, kal and soom identify themselves and say we are the ones writing these then how does it come to be Guru Gobind Singh Ji?


 
Patshahi 10 means unto that lord.Why should poets let themselves be recoganuised as Hindus had it be a ploy of Hindus to absorb Sikhi?

You said as per qoute seeing that.Seeing Akal is all reforms and that also by mercy of Akal.
body of Guru is Panth Khalsa.

Raam,Shyam and Kaal are name of of Akal.give refreance to Charitar where Soom Sufi is writtan?





> “First rectify the figure.It is one by 125000 and you talk of 100000 so you are 25000 less.
> so yuo wanted Guru to show miracle.Had he jhas to show,he would have done it in while staying at Chamkaur Garhi.”
> That number is wrong too. 20,000 per month = 120,000 for 6 months. Guru Sahib doesn’t show miracles as they aren’t Gurmat but Guru still is the knower of all. Why would Guru go to place where his integrity would be attacked? Doesn’t make sense and as for miracle, making 40 fight against countless is a miracle. Escaping alive from the fortress while the attackers were challenged to catch Guru Ji was a miracle which people and cult followers fail to realize.


 
what you call a miracle is stratigic planing you will never be able to understand.yuo said Sikh eqaul to 100000,das is aware 125000.And you talk about end of 23rd Charecter.Das thinks it is due to lack of intellect and not intentional.

why should Guru leave Anandpur Sahib,while he knew that oughts of cow and Holy Kuran be not takne care off?to expose the hypocracy in the faiths of those guys.

yuo need to know how did flags and cloaths were hung on the bushes in Muktsar and how toreches were put and Peer e Hind mi Ravad was sadi to confuse.

Then there were tow gujjers,who wanted to tell police about Guru in Machiwara and Guru had to kill them.

Lord going to noop Ku ari is just stroy been told to us,how we actult act in real situaltions then longing for miracles.





> “Once Gurus camp was looted,And Sikhs asked him why this Bhana Happned?
> Guru said 'that there is a power bigger then him and that controls all'.That defeat was way to let people know that not to worship Guru but Akal.”
> When did I say worship Guru? This thread isn’t about Sakhis. Akaal is above all and no one needs to tell me that.


 
So RSS or ****** Hindutva things or Sants you curse have no control over Akal.Surrender self to Akal,saying,your likings are felt sweet(unto Fifth Master).





> “But you may make an idol of Guru or treat Guru Granth Sahib Ji as idol whithout knowing Akal.Guru did say in Vachitar Natak that people trying to call him Primal god will go to hell.”
> Those who just read Guru Granth Sahib Ji without understanding are doing idol worship. Bachitter natak isn’t Gurbani either. Document on this will come later. Bachitter natak is also full of flaws. E.g. No mention of Peer Buddu Shah but mention of Sango Shah, Peer Buddu Shah wasn’t martyred in the battle. He was given a lot of respect by Guru Ji and Guru Ji asked what he wished for and he was given what he wished for.


 
Das told you and will repeat that Peer Ji were called as complained about 400 out 500 Pathans he recomended to serve Guru ditched.So for that reason he is not mentioned.why Sahzadas coming and not harming Guru and Harming deseters is writtan?

Anyway wihtout self underrstanding Guru Granth Sahib and going after wrong interpetaion of them is idol worshpping also.





> “But in story it is written that there in that place Lord was alone(he went there to meet Magan but a lady was there,Who said that if Lord does not commit Adultary,she will kill him or will shout.In both case there was to be charctor assination.In former case Lord did not want to kill a lonely lady,In second case ,it happened that she shouted and lord grabed her brother and befooled her followers who thought him to be a Thief.And her brother went to jail and Lord reached back safe and sound”
> How was the lady going to kill Guru?


 
Chrecter assination and  if needed it could be just a threat.And more for one,who does not attack lady and nif he does so then charecter is in trouble.




> Guru Ji could have taken away whatever she wanted to use to kill him. Guru Ji didn’t have to kill her. Did she have some automatic gun which she was going to use to kill Guru?


 
The person over there is  lord.Do you know that if Lady was touched physiocaly to grab back her weapons and her followers around,she could have rather accused the lord of trying to pare her.



> Why was Guru fooling people? It says raja grabbed the beard of her brother, why is that part being skipped? It also says the turban was grabbed off from the brother’s head. Why was this poor guy put in trouble and shamed? Is this what the Guru did to others?


 
Her borther was one of the attacker and he was rather taken care off.

and what about Gurus taking guise of Peer of Uchch or say Saying Peer of India going after putting of the toruches?Was Guru fooling people or usinf strtegy?what about loads full of filth sent in carts as wealth and fooling Rajputs and Mughals?



> So Guru acted as a thug?


 

Strategists.

And you are Fauj or Army by name,you do not understand.



> What happened to the teachings that never grab a person’s turban even if the person is enemy. Even the Sikhs in old times never attacked a turban or beard of a pathan or mughal who was fighting them.


 
Where is this writtan?give proof.

do you know that Charhat Singh(Grand father of Ranjit Singh) and Sukha Singh Meerankotiye  took the helmet of Pathans plus thier other things and used them against Pathans only?(Panth Prakash by Rattan Singh Bhangu).

In Shaster Vidiya we are told to attack face and hit the head.Yuo do not know the Davs(style also).



> Guru forgot his own teaching?


Waht teaching?
give them from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.



> Where did the woman suddenly get sewaks with weapons?


 
she had rich person,so,she had her bodies gurads or followers.



> Was she a leader of a group?


 
No gruop was at her serivce.



> Woman had her brother in town but where was her husband?


Not mentioned in the text and question is irreleveant but she had a husband,who was rich.There his role ends.



> Didn’t the servants know who Guru Gobind Singh Ji was?


 

As she came from outside,her servents were new.(Read line 5)





> Even the enemies respected character of Sikhs and had to call Sikhs lions to show respect. In tria chariters, their Guru’s character is put in question in a city established by Guru Tegh Bahadur and nourished by Guru Gobind Singh Ji.


It is your biased opinion,which thinks so.



> How many servants did she have? 3? 5? Were they hard to handle for Guru Ji? There are more flaws they will be talked about later with translations of these chariters.


 
there can be 10 also.Thing was that,Lord should not have let him be connected to her in any way and let the charecter assination be prevented to let Praching be done flawless.And that is been told by whole truth.And see the 22nd and 23rd.she could not succed.
so so far no flaws.






> “Wait there man it seems that you are paranoid and *******ed.Term Pani Pamri is written that means rich footwear.Term Panhi comes only when that lady is summoned in the court.And Panhi means blanket.As we have to fight and run both footwears like Chappel and blanket are not handy.As you may never have fought and if you want you can wear them and see how good could you fight ,Lord,when lady shouted, leaft shoe and blanket and them made her brother get cought by her own men.It was only after when Lord refuse to commit Adultary then she wanted to trap lord,then in order to face dangers handly did lord removed hindrances.
> did not Guru use to put gold in arrow to kill enemy so that with mony of that arrow enmy fmaily can get funaral done?”
> What is that word which has been starred? Can it be post mailed or emailed to me?


 
Das did not right any derogotry thing as such.Has there been something,das is sorry.Anyway das read your views about das.And das thanks you also for that.

Reason.It proves that you acted same as Guru acted against Hindus or Muslims,who were making fun of Sikhs(Suraj Prakash).

Das knew that you used term Lundee etc. and das lied that.Realy.



> Khalsa Gujjay, Lundee Buchee like Vijee Bhujjay
> Bunjdee Noo Rah Naa Lubbay, Bhuj Bhuj Kundeya Wich Bujjay
> Guru Kalgidhar Day Mun Noo Bhaavai
> Nihaal Ho Jaavay
> ...


 
http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-media-watch/14729-taksal-a-critical-analysis-3.html

What you said was said by your father and father of Das against Anti Sikhs.

Das hopes Lundee over here is very good things and correctly taken from Dasham Granth Sahib as an abuse to Anti Sikh.You have proven Das's theory OK.

some more abuses please and thanks in advance. 



> It is not pani (water), it is pnee (footwear). Paamree is blanket.


 
did das wrote anything about water?Yuo want some water?Pan means gold or wealth in Sanskrit and Pani means wealthy or rich or expennsive.Pamre means lowest thing from pamar means lower.That is shoe as worn at bottam.




> There was no running in this chariter. It says it was forgotten. When did Guru start forgetting? Last time I read Guru Granth Sahib Ji, it said that Guru and Kartar don’t make mistakes. When the brother was already labeled as the thief and sent to jail, then what was the need to run?


 
Fast movement occured before brother was sent to jail.Read the Chracter care full Oh Dear.





> Who was going to fight? Why were those items taken to woman if they weren’t to be used? Guru made mistake?


 
shoe were to be worn but delicate and ex*****ive shoes are not good to t\be used in fight.




> “It is state of seeing Akal in all and not the seeig of Phyiscal body.Do not you think that Baba Maan Singh Of Pehva saw and read Guru Granth Sahib?”
> Mann Pehova doesn’t sing Gurbani. He sings kuchee bani and loots people. He doesn’t even follow Guru Granth Sahib Ji it is same and never reading. He doesn’t even follow the first concept which is kirat kurna. Not only that, his rapes are the result of tria chariters. He read most of the tricks in Dasam Granth. He isn’t the only one. More saad baabas are exposed daily and some went unexposed but Akaal knows all.


 
He does more Path of Guru Granth Sahib Ji,But by seeing the Guru,things do not happen,will of Guru is needed.





> “How dare did a prostitute threaten Guru Ji?
> Did not Hindu Kings and Moghuls also threatened Guru and they were worse then prostitues.
> Did not Sodi of Kartarpur said bad words for Guru.What about Brahmins of Kurukshetras?They also said wrong things to Guru?
> Anyone who is to go for wrong time gets non sense mind and say wrong things to Guru like you are doing.”
> Hindu rajas and mughals had armies, weapons and cannons. They didn’t threaten Guru Ji face to face. They talked smack in the back just like general from Delhi. These guys don’t even have the guts to come in front of Guru face to face and lay a challenge.


 
Person dealing with prostitue was not Guru.but lady can defame Guru,as some has deefamed Kala Afghana Sahib.

phorum - message board



> This is case of Sexual Assult by kala Afgana on defendant Karanjit Bhullar
> dated 28th Feburary 1992:
> 1) Kala Afgana was 68 year old in 1988 where he sexually assualted Mrs Bhullar 35 year old female at Gurudwara Topaz st (canada) where he was a granthi. His wife and Daughter were on gurudwara premesis.
> 2)kicked out by gurudwara comittee after tape recording of kala Afgan by mrs Bhullar.
> 3) Court awarded 5000.00 dollar damages to Mrs Bhullar and threw out case of counter suit of defamation of cahracter of kala afgana.


 



> She wasn’t a soldier. If it was a soldier, then it is a different situation as fighting skills drive ego to the top. What did a prostitute have to back her up? What fighting skills did she have?


 
Person with prostitue was not Guru.Even lord is Pakhyan or some stroy been told in  other Chapters.Like Ninth Master gave his slelf expirances.Das has talked about them in thread about 21st,22nd and 23rd Charectors. 



> Sodis were again family members of Guru and were descendents of Guru family and did have firepower.


 
No Sodi like Gulab Rai is said to have fire power.Dheermal had and It was Ninth Master who let him off,after gun shot fired at Guru.



> Brahmans were high in number but they were shamed and accepted their faults. I like to hear facts


 
Very nice.

Did Pamma and Gangu accepted thier defeat.At one place you give fear of RSS the front of Brahmnical agency,who is after us before RSS was made.And you say that they are sorry.If they are soory then why are you showing thier  evil desig to us?

and another fact you gave,Brahmins were large in number?Presently Thrre upper castesd are abou 14% percent in India.Brahmins are no where majority and never they have been.

yuo come here and see,then just making castle in air.These are facts.




> . Those who follow and promote tria chariters are in their bad times and don’t realize the truth. They are lost and guided by maya.


 
Is Maya an indepeandat entity like Satan?And does anything else other then akal exists.Das told you before,Like evenlgists,Maya is takne as Satan by you.

Das is in good time and feeling happy to answer your flase propganda.



> Their personal agendas and motives will only ruin their reputation and tria chariters will never ever be accepted as work of Guru Gobind Singh Ji because it isn’t.


 
Well as you see that case of Kala Afghan Sahib above.He is true in many things yet his reputation is being ruined.Slanderers do slander,Dog barks and Elephant move ahead.This is not for you but for those who slander our respected Kala Afghana Sahib.But is at all it is Salnder only.Prove this that this is not the Bani of Tenth Master.If you say that there was no Guruship given to Scripture as Nirkairs say,then Panth will not accept this.


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Ek Onakar Wahiguru Ji Ki Fateh




> “Lord went to know about Plan and he knew that Magan a man will be there,who came on behest of lady.
> Even if we deem it spell,Going of lord was more in line of First Maste goig to
> 1.Haridwar to expose superstition
> 2.To Kalijug Panda to remove myth about miracle he was showing.
> ...


 
So Guru did not learn Arbic and Farsi with Qazi,who later helped Guru in Uch Da Peer episode.Sikhism tells us to learn and Guru can not learn more.Guru is All powerfull and that is Akal.Physical body eats food.This is personal worshipping.

There is not prositute in 21st,22nd and 23rd and there is no Guru in 16th.Yuo are mixing up.



> Latter three shows how should Sikh react in unforseen circumstances and former one showed how Hindu coulkd have acted.
> “Akal ill reborn you as a Hindu and then you will speak lies as per your faith.In Charitars 21 to 23rd it is not at all written.And do tell otherwise where it is written?”
> Did I say that 60 coins is written in chariters 21-23? It is written in chariter 16. RSS and derawalas are hindufied and make a living from lies. The number of lies aren’t even countable.


 
why did you give 20 over there?

so mistake.

In last post you said Brahmins are defeated and now you talk of RSS.And Dearwalas as thier Agents.

Anyway lies are exposed and it they will be done further.



> Another lie is made to cover up previous one. Wise people are the ones who accept mistakes and move on. As long there is corruption in the mind, the person can never be true to Guru. If the person can’t be true to Guru, the person can’t be true to Akaal thus the person can’t get liberation.


 

Jis Hath jor Kar Vekhai Soi Nanak Uttam Neech Na Koi.Truthfull and flase are are done and made by Akal.

Das has shown that you agree that it is in there in your mind.which has come out.Yuo told some lies and then das exposed them and you are now covering them up.



> also, where did a prostitute get the name Kaur? Was she Amritdhari?


 
http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/sikh-sikhi-sikhism/5797-explain-this-in-dasam-granth-11.html

there is no Kaur but noop ku-ari and in thse 21st,22nd and 23rd Chreacters there is no prostitue but wife of rich is writtan.

who is lieing?

 



> “That lady tried to spread disinfo about lord.Lord preempted this by saying that his stuff is lost and any Sikh who retrive it will get no death coming near to him.That may mean teqaching of Weapoanry or Gurmat teaching.It may not mean salvation as you write.”
> Guru Sahib gave Gurmat and weapon training to all Sikhs regardless of anything. Weapon training doesn’t protect anyone from death. Gurmat does however. Kaal means time or death. Both of which can’t be God. God is beyond both and is thus Akaal.


 
so god can not be death to foe.In fact who else is death and birth for all.Who makes you born and who bring dead to you.no Angel but only and one and only Akal.This thing each Sikh should know.




> “No Sikhs,who got hold of Lady had along side bought the items as proof of her stealing from Lord.Do not tell lies.Lord ordered them to do so.That happened when lord came to know from Sikhs about her having a defomation campaign.”
> Where is the lie? What was so special about those shoes and shawl that Guru Ji wanted to end someone’s cycle of birth and death for that shawl and that pair of shoes? When the woman was brought, weren’t the items brought with her? This is what the chariter says. Raja told the followers to find the culprit and it says that the followers couldn’t resist and told who it was. There are two points to note here:
> 
> If the raja knew, then why didn’t the raja just tell the followers to retrieve it from the place?
> Since the raja knew, why did the raja ask lie? What was the need to lie here?


 
Read line 2 of 23rd Chrecter.she started the disinfo campagin after getting angery.and then did lord tell his followers the fact that his things are stolen,Anyway when Guru Sahiban knew that there is no demigod of Death like Yama and they do mention them in Gurbani,do they lie?Das will talk about Brahma later.

with items of Lord lady was psreading lies as you do with this pius text.(Das is aware that one vice of anger will take over you after reading this term).So strategically,it was made to nip the evilinbud.




> “do yuo know that Guru used to give medicine via Bhai Ghannaya to people who were injuiered even from opponent side.So you can ask how and why for that also?Hard eaerned mony of Sikhs been givne to those who came to kill Sikhs?”
> What about Gurus putting gold in arrow so that kins to victum of that arrow get his funral done by that Gold.”
> Giving medicine to serve humanity is different from giving money to prostitutes.


 
in 16th Charecter Prostitue is mentioned.

And King is not Guru.




> Wasn’t noup kuar rich anyways?


 
she was wife of Rich



> Why was money given to her?


 
Father does bless his doughter with gift.

Yuo say that Guru followed Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

But you missed this verse.

Ang 1381 and 1382
ਫਰੀਦਾ ਬੁਰੇ ਦਾ ਭਲਾ ਕਰਿ ਗੁਸਾ ਮਨਿ ਨ ਹਢਾਇ ॥ 
फरीदा बुरे दा भला करि गुसा मनि न हढाइ ॥ 
fareedaa buray daa bhalaa kar gusaa man na hadhaa-ay. 
Fareed, answer evil with goodness; do not fill your mind with anger. 
ਦੇਹੀ ਰੋਗੁ ਨ ਲਗਈ ਪਲੈ ਸਭੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਪਾਇ ॥੭੮॥ 
देही रोगु न लगई पलै सभु किछु पाइ ॥७८॥ 
dayhee rog na lag-ee palai sabh kichh paa-ay. ||78|| 
Your body shall not suffer from any disease, and you shall obtain everything. ||78|| 






> A lot of the soldiers who came to fight Guru Ji didn’t fight because they wanted to fight but because it was their duty.


But all were not like that,What about Pathans we have talked about.Then there is an instance of Brars having trouble with pays as er Sau Sakhi and htier leaders sets a good examles of Sikh.



> Guru Ji attached the gold so the sanskar could be done properly. Sanskars were mostly done by undertakers who had no relations to the army guys.


so as per you no person died got creation by thier relatives.give refreance about this imagination.



> Mughals left their dead bodies to rot. Undertaker needs to feed family too so Guru Ji gave it as a pay for hard work.


 
good stroy but from where you took it or just developped.

Could not Guru Ji give them salary based upon work they do?

By the way this means that they got the mony only from enemies killed by Guru and not from other Sikhs or they only did cremations of those guys who were killed by Guru and left other to rot?

By the way how did they recoganise that which person is actualy killed by Guru?

By the way Guru left Anandpur Sahib,Chamkaur Sahib,Muktsar Sahib,where where these undertakers?

In your imagination?

There is no mentioned but your imgination.Das is sorry but over here also there is something racial.There is one caste in Hindus called Dom or Chandal,who are professional of such work.

Yuo have conceptulised such arrangement by Guru.Very nice.And you call das as agenets of RSS,.Irony.




> These aren’t Singhs mentioned in tria chariters who are shows as stupid and dumb and dysfunctional. This is Babbars Akalis here who use the brain to prevent munmutt from coming into Sikhi.


 
there is one stroy das saw and that is about 49 th Charecter.Person is Barber(do you know who they are?They cut hairs?for last 9 years Das has not gone to them and das hopes that your family to come does not go to them either.).

Lady over there is Nandmati.As per your defination of Singh,can a Singh have wife without name Kaur?And her husband like parasite use to lie inactice in Gurus place. 



> “When she was indoctrionated( into good faith),as in inscentive,for doing good even to bad, Lord gave him expenditure of six month packed.”
> What good faith was she trained into? Prostitute never agreed and raja just ran while she was drugged up.


16th Chrecter does not has Guru.



> As for Noup Kuar, she agreed not to fool around with Guru but what about the others?


 
Did you not read that she was Nehuriye(consuled/indoctrined) by lord.Which other are you talking about?



> Wasn’t Noup Kuar already rich?


 
she was wife of rich.




> What was the need to give her money?


 
This is repeat of question das has answered above




> All it does is promotes lusty ladies to use Guru Ghur was a place of money collection.


So as per This Langer should be place as medium for lazies having a good life.why do you forget warning being made to her.Her brother beaten.She her self was taken into custody.no one could dare do such things again.See was shown death very near and then pardoned.Read the 23rd Charitar correctly.Das has done its word by word tranlations.




> “Is there no verse in Guru Granth Sahib,which is in past tense?And should same logic of your be applied over there? Whichy tense is this?”
> Tukhs related to Guru Hargobind Sahib are past tense because it is an event of the past. I am not talking about the event but the location and Guru. It says there was a raja.


 
raja was talked about in 16th Charitar.



> There was a place called Anadpur (meaning after the destruction). You can’t even type proper English and are from Bihar. What would you know about Punjab and tenses and Gurmukhi?


 
does Anad mean after destruction?Das rectfy it to Anandpur And Thanks but this shows your great knowledge,Anad is one who is without Adi or start.Un born Akal.

Das is nearer to Punjab then you and Gurmukhi does not means Punjabi.

It is more punjbaism,which trys Gurmat,to be realted to Punjab.

Guru also lived in Bihar for good time anyway.



> All you do is make person attacks and try to act clever.
> Gurbani says “Sahas Sianpaa Lukh Hoahey Taa Ik Naa Chullay Naal”
> So leave the cleverness and realize the truth.


 
Let Akal decide.




> “If I and me work here then why are they not working in 71st Charitar or say discourse over as in 21st one?
> Have you got something or not?
> All bani is work of Akal and there is no pattern of first,secod or third being fixed.”
> What is the post about here? Is it about the use of third person and first person? This is because the tria chariters are flawed. The writers are inconsistent and don’t even know what they are talking about. You can ask the sodak committee about this. They are the ones who mixed up the writings of the poets.


 
Das gave them from Darbar Sahib and all Guru Granth Sahib Ji as is from Akal,so reciver Nanak over there was more a second or third person.If you think in that line that Guru Granth Sahib Ji are also not poetray but word of God,then only you will understand,.

Bring Sodak committe to das and das with do Sodh(improvement) to them.It is thier mind messed up while poet is also trying to make non Sikhs been Seen as messed up.A True non sikh will be messed up and call it messed up and it is proven over here.




> “Why there is third person over here?
> Ang 1165 and 1166”
> *sultaan poochhai sun bay naamaa.*
> _The Sultan said, "Listen, Naam Dayv:_
> ...


 
Das asks you to bring out term King or Raja in Charecters 21st22nd and 23rd,term Rai is there.Yuor making fun does not make the point weak else Brahmins and Muslims have been making fun of Sikhs.Sikhs get more powerfull by someone making wrong to them.

why are Gurbani Tuks been misused?Does not Akal is ultimate Lord.Gobind Rai mean Lord who is source/seed of  Sesnse.Go does not means cow and Bind does not means semen.Go is Senses and Bind is seed.
Then you want to explain Arth of Mool Mantra to das.

yuo have Said that there is no Mantras in Sikhs did not you?and Bhai Daya Singh Rahit Nammah is not correct?

As per you Akal does not comes in physical form.

Great are your teachers of Sikhism and Great is Sikh like you.Das actuly is bowing his head to you in front of moniter.

Akal is Ajoni,it is not a negatvie term.Akal is Nirankar it is also not the Negtive terms.Gurmat is psitive while we thiink negative.

Ajoni means not restrcited one Joni or Birth but in all.Niranakar means not in one form but in all forms.

Das first talk logic with you.

If some thing exists or some entity exists,it should have some location also,which is phyiscal.But Akal has all locations.Does all phyiscal locations have one thing and that is Akal.

If Akal has no location at all then Akal does not exists and that is Nastik and non belving things.

so

As per Gurmat have a look.

ਪੰਨਾ 48, ਸਤਰ 12http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=48&punjabi=t&id=1965
ਜਲਿ ਥਲਿ ਮਹੀਅਲਿ ਪੂਰਿਆ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਆਪਣੀ ਨਦਰਿ ਨਿਹਾਲਿ ॥੨॥
जलि थलि महीअलि पूरिआ प्रभु आपणी नदरि निहालि ॥२॥
jal thal mahee-al poori-aa parabh aapnee nadar nihaal. ||2||
God is pervading the water, the land and the sky; He sees all with His Glance of Grace. ||2||
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salokਪੰਨਾ 64, ਸਤਰ 9http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=64&punjabi=t&id=2604
ਨਾਨਕੁ ਵਖਾਣੈ ਬੇਨਤੀ ਜਲਿ ਥਲਿ ਮਹੀਅਲਿ ਸੋਇ ॥੫॥
नानकु वखाणै बेनती जलि थलि महीअलि सोइ ॥५॥
naanak vakhaanai bayntee jal thal mahee-al so-ay. ||5||
Nanak offers this prayer to the One who pervades the water, the land and the air. ||5||
ਮਃ 1   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 79, ਸਤਰ 11http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=79&punjabi=t&id=3177
ਜਲਿ ਥਲਿ ਪੂਰਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਬਨਵਾਰੀ ਘਟਿ ਘਟਿ ਨਦਰਿ ਨਿਹਾਲੇ ॥
जलि थलि पूरि रहिआ बनवारी घटि घटि नदरि निहाले ॥
jal thal poor rahi-aa banvaaree ghat ghat nadar nihaalay.
He is totally pervading the water and the land; He is the Lord of the World-forest. Behold Him in exaltation in each and every heart.
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 89, ਸਤਰ 15http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=89&punjabi=t&id=3592
ਹਰਿ ਜਲਿ ਥਲਿ ਮਹੀਅਲਿ ਭਰਪੂਰਿ ਦੂਜਾ ਨਾਹਿ ਕੋਇ ॥
हरि जलि थलि महीअलि भरपूरि दूजा नाहि कोइ ॥
har jal thal mahee-al bharpoor doojaa naahi ko-ay.
The Lord pervades and permeates the water, the land and the sky; there is no other at all.
ਮਃ 4   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 103, ਸਤਰ 9http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=103&punjabi=t&id=4141
ਜਲ ਥਲ ਨੀਰਿ ਭਰੇ ਸਰ ਸੁਭਰ ਬਿਰਥਾ ਕੋਇ ਨ ਜਾਏ ਜੀਉ ॥੨॥
जल थल नीरि भरे सर सुभर बिरथा कोइ न जाए जीउ ॥२॥
jal thal neer bharay sar subhar birthaa ko-ay na jaa-ay jee-o. ||2||
The sea, the dry land, and the lakes are filled with the Water of the Lord's Name; no place is left empty. ||2||
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Does a place is left where Akal is not there.Are not Earth,Water and space physical,Akal is in Matter Brahm and Akal is beyond also Prabrahma.

God knows what you were thinking and what you think.But Das is sorry for you.


Maybe Das is not born as Sikh but das sees God in all as God told vide this verse.
ਪੰਨਾ 922, ਸਤਰ 6
ਏਹੁ ਵਿਸੁ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ਤੁਮ ਦੇਖਦੇ ਏਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਕਾ ਰੂਪੁ ਹੈ ਹਰਿ ਰੂਪੁ ਨਦਰੀ ਆਇਆ ॥
एहु विसु संसारु तुम देखदे एहु हरि का रूपु है हरि रूपु नदरी आइआ ॥
ayhu vis sansaar tum daykh-day ayhu har kaa roop hai har roop nadree aa-i-aa.
This whole world which you see is the image of the Lord; only the image of the Lord is seen.
ਮਃ 3   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

Before calling that God,yuor God,know about that.

[/SIZE]


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh




> “So Akal can not be termed as Rai.Wait.
> You want to question that Sixth Master gave Guruship to his grand son with namr Har Rai.Was not name of Tenth Master also Gobind Rai, Before he became Singh?
> So who so ever gave surname Rai,to Gurus,were not OK as per you”
> Where did I say it was not okay to have Rai as a last name? Once again this has nothing to do with Akaal. Looks like tria chariter promoters are losing it.


 
In your dreams they are lost but come out of it and face the truth.Yuo have not got the thing.Lord does not always mean King.Pray to Akal,to let you have more brain.And let Akal also make you understand,that things which you take as against you are rather for you.





> “You are lier.Sikhs on order of Lord borugght the thief lady with items which were as per lord were stolen.
> Sikhs got hold of a lady,who was wofe of wealthy and who was accused of stealing the stuff of the lord.”
> Once again, there is no lie as I made my intention clear. Items were with the lady. They were brought back with her when she was brought to Rai (raja) as per the story. Why was she accused of stealing when she didn’t? Sikhs are free to make false accusations to people on something they didn’t do and defame them? I ask the admin, is it okay to launch direct personal attacks on people? Guru did it in Dasam Granth so can we do on your website too? Guru Sahib said something and did something. Weird!


It is in you imgainnation that Guru,did something wrong.Das shown you the lies above and proved them also.

she was trying to steal the honour of Lord and Lord prevented her.





> “Lord in the story did not Go to women,But was cold by man called Magan(agent of Lady).Had Lord was easy to go to Lady she should have come her self calling him in night.Lord Saw lady only after he entered the camp.and became thoughtfull.”
> Magan as per the story is a Sikh of Guru. He lied to Guru?


 
who told you.

It is writtan that Magan was her Das.And you call him Sikh very nice.Lack of linguisitc skills.Wirk hard.



> Is the story saying that Sikhs have been cheating with Guru since Guru Ji’s times?


 
Magan was not Sikh but you want to make him so.



> Gangu wasn’t Sikh so he didn’t belong but what about Magan? What punishment was he given? He was reason for all the trouble. A sikh had not shame in lying to Guru? Didn’t Guru know the Sikh is lying?


 

Read 6 and 7 verses of the 21st Chrecter.


anyway if das is not mistakne Gurra Khan,who stabbed Guru was from family of Painda Khan.





> Didn’t the Guru think before agreeing to go to learn mantar at night?


Lord has no fear to maove anywhere as Lord is confidant.



> Once again, why was Magan linking Guru to a woman wanting to fulfill lust?


Magan was told to be given mony by lady.A sort of bonus to her servent.




> If Guru was to help the lady get to right path, then why didn’t the Guru just go to her?


 
Lord reformed wrong girl in conditions which were grave for normal humans.till they do not understand Braoda minded apporach of Gurmat.



> What was the need for Magan?


 
Lady had her as her servent.



> Why was he surprised to see the woman then? Think about it.


 
Vide lord Guru is telling us to counter the unforseen surprsing situations.

Anyway do you know Pakhyan means some thing heard of and those stroies are told.Have you herd people telling stroies in Present Tense and Those stroies which are heard as wiht First Person?



> There is still time for tria chariter followers to join the Panthic side and realize the truth but it looks like that time is running out.


 
showing panic state of mind.Sikhs are happy where Guru kept them.Fake Sikhs are already out of Faith.



> “No it is written that people came,who were followers of lady.Lord held her brother,made him uncontious with muthahiri,If you want to have taste of it,Das can help you.And then by that time Lord’s Sikh took her borther to jail or Lord.Lord reached back to his home safely.”
> I already discussed this before. Don’t want to waste time saying the same thing again. What does or mean? Is there confusion? If the person debating is confused then why is the person debating? Are threats being made here? If yes, they don’t bother me. In one ear and out the other.


 
Das answered you before and das could not under stand where threats are been made.Warning and Threateing are done in preivous para.time is running out by creating panic.first doing some fualt and then accusing other,While Akal brings out the true Charecter of a person.a person who is of some type,thinks other also of the same.





> “As you blames other for that,may be you are such type o prostitues visiters obsessed by *****s.She is writan as wife of rich man and who call her protitute?Strange?”
> How hard is to pick up a newspaper and see the kartoots (misdeeds) of so called Sants and/or Brahmgyanis. How many times are they exposed? Someone who has worked at Akaal Takht and read complaints of innocent girls would know how bad these tria charier promoters are. Girls are constantly raped and molested. Even young boys aren’t spared. Why do these guys have so much lust? One reason, Dasam Granth promoters.
> 
> “”Aren’t you disrespecting Guru Ji in countless ways by saying these chariters are written by Guru Ji?””


 
Wait a minute Das gave something about our Great Kala Afghana Sahib Ji.He is not the promoter,if you know.


Come and stop this sorry state.Or is this your imagination.Recently a person who was called Sirdar Monider Singh Pander was cought raping boys and girls and killing.He did not read Dasham Granth.

Anyway by one person being Singh surname does not make all Sikhs guilty.Racial minded people do generalisations.


Like you are exposing Sadhs,does Dasham Granth exposes Yogis,Qazi etc of that time.

By the way do not Sadhs etc. read Guru Granth Sahib?And does Bani of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is weak that they are carried away by  so called sins you attribute to Dasham Granth.You want to prove this.



> OK but prove this.
> “People disrecpect Akal by un having faith and spreading lies about Charectors.”
> So it is okay to disrespect Guru Ji by linking him to tria chariters which are written by raam, shyam, soom and kal?


Guru Ji who write all the Gurbani including Triya Chairtars you bash without valid reason is Akal and that has all names and Ram,Syam are name of the same.Das will repeat as much as you write about poets.




> This is also a copyright violation of those poets and their descendents can take the chariter promoters to courts. Two wrongs don’t make a right. Most people are naastiks due to literature like tria chariters.


 
Brng the decendents of God,whole universe is the Decedent of God.

How manay Nastiks have read them.Prove this then just making wild comment.

Das has seen very Good preception of our god Akal in you and your prception with Gurbani 's context has been rpven as wrong.






> “Do you knw that there are mnay names for Guru Granth Sahib.
> Adi Granth.Darbar Sahib,Guru Granth Saib,Adi Guru Darbar.
> One version is refere by Gyani Gyan Singh JI as one of Tenth Master.So as per your logic some one can talk ill of our Eternal Guru.”
> Adi Granth was name before GuruShip and Guru Granth Sahib is the current name. Adi Guru Darbar doesn’t make sense and is made up by Dasam Granth and sarbloh granth chelas to promote their 2 granths. It is also called Dasam Paatshah Kaa Granth because final changes were done by 10th paatshah. This is flawed logic because names weren’t changed. They were just used to describe Baba ji.


 

In one book by Gyani Gyan Singh Ji,Damdami Beerhs version which was takne as per him taken to Kabul was termed as origeonal one Comiled by Guru.

why is not Kartarpuri Beerh Called Pancham Pitah ka Granth.You need to have sense first.

It is not floawed logic as there you have yourself agreeed that name were changed.It is your biased denial of logic.Do not we call Guru Granth Sahib also as Darbar Sahib.





> “Das wil give you thre versions of Guru Granth Sahib JI.
> 1.Mithi Beerh(of Kartarpur Sahib)
> 2.Khari or Bhai Bannu Wali Beerh(of Kanpur)
> 3.Damdami Beerh(our present Guru).”
> ...


 
But as you said that does all have the same Bani.

Asper you Adi Granth was not not the Guru till Bani of Ninth Master added and Guruship was given.But is not that the older version of same Damdami Beerh.tommow,you say that Damdai Beerh is not authantic due to Raagmala or Bhagat Bani,that does not mean it is.Prove it,then just by making staements.

If you see old version wait,how many versions have you seen and give list of them.

Or are you only saying what you read from Ambala Sahib 's book.

Only Term Granth is also given and that is For Guru Granth Sahib Ji and they hold Guruship since the time Fifth Master made Baba Budha the Granthi and First wak was takne Santa De Karaj Ap Khaloa,Har Kamm Karamwan Ayaya Ram.

In Sidh Gost,we have Guru saying Sabad is Guru.But have you read that?

And do you still follow what Gyani  Gyan Singh wrote.He wrote separate standards for lower castes also.Das hopes that you do not follow castes.





> “This is rather as good news if it is true.So far Kala Afghana Sahib used to say that writer himself can not write his own name at start like Guru Gobind Singh Ji can not write Sri Mukhwak Patshahi Dasvin ,but some other could write that.So you are removing that error.”
> Guru Gobind Singh Ji didn’t write Dasam Granth. The writers put Mukhwak Paatshahi 10 say that this is written by Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Have you ever read Malcolm? Read it and you will be clear about Dasam Granth.


 
So as per you a Non Sikh is better authority to decide about us.OK

Yuo can tommorow say that writer just put Mahal 4 onto the verse which you do not like.

Like the one below.

Ang 606




ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮਹਲਾ ੪ ॥ 
सोरठि महला ४ ॥ 
sorath mehlaa 4. 
Sorat'h, Fourth Mehl: 

ਆਪੇ ਸੇਵਾ ਲਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਆਪੇ ਭਗਤਿ ਉਮਾਹਾ ॥ 
आपे सेवा लाइदा पिआरा आपे भगति उमाहा ॥ 
aapay sayvaa laa-idaa pi-aaraa aapay bhagat omaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself commits some to His service; He Himself blesses them with the joy of devotional worship. 

ਆਪੇ ਗੁਣ ਗਾਵਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਆਪੇ ਸਬਦਿ ਸਮਾਹਾ ॥ 
आपे गुण गावाइदा पिआरा आपे सबदि समाहा ॥ 
aapay gun gaavaa-idaa pi-aaraa aapay sabad samaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself causes us to sing His Glorious Praises; He Himself is absorbed in the Word of His Shabad. 

ਆਪੇ ਲੇਖਣਿ ਆਪਿ ਲਿਖਾਰੀ ਆਪੇ ਲੇਖੁ ਲਿਖਾਹਾ ॥੧॥ 
आपे लेखणि आपि लिखारी आपे लेखु लिखाहा ॥१॥ 
aapay laykhan aap likhaaree aapay laykh likhaahaa. ||1|| 
He Himself is the pen, and He Himself is the scribe; He Himself inscribes His inscription. ||1|| 

ਮੇਰੇ ਮਨ ਜਪਿ ਰਾਮ ਨਾਮੁ ਓਮਾਹਾ ॥ 
मेरे मन जपि राम नामु ओमाहा ॥ 
mayray man jap raam naam omaahaa. 
O my mind, joyfully chant the Name of the Lord. 

ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਅਨਦੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਵਡਭਾਗੀ ਲੈ ਗੁਰਿ ਪੂਰੈ ਹਰਿ ਲਾਹਾ ॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
अनदिनु अनदु होवै वडभागी लै गुरि पूरै हरि लाहा ॥ रहाउ ॥ 
an-din anad hovai vadbhaagee lai gur poorai har laahaa. rahaa-o. 
Those very fortunate ones are in ecstasy night and day; through the Perfect Guru, they obtain the profit of the Lord's Name. ||Pause|| 

ਆਪੇ ਗੋਪੀ ਕਾਨੁ ਹੈ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਬਨਿ ਆਪੇ ਗਊ ਚਰਾਹਾ ॥ 
आपे गोपी कानु है पिआरा बनि आपे गऊ चराहा ॥ 
aapay gopee kaan hai pi-aaraa ban aapay ga-oo charaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself is the milk-maid and Krishna; He Himself herds the cows in the woods. 

ਆਪੇ ਸਾਵਲ ਸੁੰਦਰਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਆਪੇ ਵੰਸੁ ਵਜਾਹਾ ॥ 
आपे सावल सुंदरा पिआरा आपे वंसु वजाहा ॥ 
aapay saaval sundraa pi-aaraa aapay vans vajaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself is the blue-skinned, handsome one; He Himself plays on His flute. 

ਕੁਵਲੀਆ ਪੀੜੁ ਆਪਿ ਮਰਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਕਰਿ ਬਾਲਕ ਰੂਪਿ ਪਚਾਹਾ ॥੨॥ 
कुवलीआ पीड़ु आपि मराइदा पिआरा करि बालक रूपि पचाहा ॥२॥ 
kuvlee-aa peerh aap maraa-idaa pi-aaraa kar baalak roop pachaahaa. ||2|| 
The Beloved Himself took the form of a child, and destroyed Kuwalia-peer, the mad elephant. ||2|| 

ਆਪਿ ਅਖਾੜਾ ਪਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਕਰਿ ਵੇਖੈ ਆਪਿ ਚੋਜਾਹਾ ॥ 
आपि अखाड़ा पाइदा पिआरा करि वेखै आपि चोजाहा ॥ 
aap akhaarhaa paa-idaa pi-aaraa kar vaykhai aap chojaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself sets the stage; He performs the plays, and He Himself watches them. 

ਕਰਿ ਬਾਲਕ ਰੂਪ ਉਪਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਚੰਡੂਰੁ ਕੰਸੁ ਕੇਸੁ ਮਾਰਾਹਾ ॥ 
करि बालक रूप उपाइदा पिआरा चंडूरु कंसु केसु माराहा ॥ 
kar baalak roop upaa-idaa pi-aaraa chandoor kans kays maaraahaa. 
The Beloved Himself assumed the form of the child, and killed the demons Chandoor, Kansa and Kaysee. 

ਆਪੇ ਹੀ ਬਲੁ ਆਪਿ ਹੈ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਬਲੁ ਭੰਨੈ ਮੂਰਖ ਮੁਗਧਾਹਾ ॥੩॥ 
आपे ही बलु आपि है पिआरा बलु भंनै मूरख मुगधाहा ॥३॥ 
aapay hee bal aap hai pi-aaraa bal bhannai moorakh mugDhaahaa. ||3|| 
The Beloved Himself, by Himself, is the embodiment of power; He shatters the power of the fools and idiots. ||3||
ਸਭੁ ਆਪੇ ਜਗਤੁ ਉਪਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਵਸਿ ਆਪੇ ਜੁਗਤਿ ਹਥਾਹਾ ॥ 
सभु आपे जगतु उपाइदा पिआरा वसि आपे जुगति हथाहा ॥ 
sabh aapay jagat upaa-idaa pi-aaraa vas aapay jugat hathaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself created the whole world. In His hands He holds the power of the ages. 



ang 607
ਗਲਿ ਜੇਵੜੀ ਆਪੇ ਪਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਜਿਉ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਖਿੰਚੈ ਤਿਉ ਜਾਹਾ ॥ 
गलि जेवड़ी आपे पाइदा पिआरा जिउ प्रभु खिंचै तिउ जाहा ॥ 
gal jayvrhee aapay paa-idaa pi-aaraa ji-o parabh khinchai ti-o jaahaa. 
The Beloved Himself puts the chains around their necks; as God pulls them, must they go. 

ਜੋ ਗਰਬੈ ਸੋ ਪਚਸੀ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਜਪਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਭਗਤਿ ਸਮਾਹਾ ॥੪॥੬॥ 
जो गरबै सो पचसी पिआरे जपि नानक भगति समाहा ॥४॥६॥ 
jo garbai so pachsee pi-aaray jap naanak bhagat samaahaa. ||4||6|| 
Whoever harbors pride shall be destroyed, O Beloved; meditating on the Lord, Nanak is absorbed in devotional worship. ||4||6|| 





> “Tommorow you will ask that why did not Mata Gujri’s Sacrifise not mentioned by Guru.What about Bhai Vachitar Singh? Das told your stone mind that peer Budhu Shah had casulities and true Army man prefer to talk more of harm to foe then talking about csaulity on own side.”
> Yea, why weren’t they mentioned? Why was Sangho Shah mentioned?


Crated trouble for invading Hindus



> Why was Kirpal Dass Udasi mentioned?


non Sikh also fought with Anti Sikhs




> Why was arrow piercing mentioned?


To invoke against the foe.



> There is just one reason why Peer Ji isn’t mentioned and that is because he was Muslim.


Then why Sahibzada is mentioned in postive term at last part not doing any harm to Guru and attacking deserters.And why did hindu Rajput Jujhar is writtan to attack?why is hindu King of Garhwal is told to be attacking?



> This casualty statement doesn’t hold much weight because in Khalsa Panth, dying for good cause is the best. Peer Buddu Shah wasn’t Shaheed anyways. So he was still alive.


But his relative were dead.




> It is very easy to label others stone mind or whatever. Khalsa army was always different from other armies. Others can’t be compared to Khalsa. Singhs never did exercise or parade.


 
Another imaginations.OK do ot do parade and Do not do exscseise(At that time Shaster Vidya and Hola Mahala are also false)And Attack India.

Yuo will have the taste of your utopia.



> Sikh history is all about sacrifices and greatness of them. What is greater than Peer Buddu Shah coming to fight? It is an honor and not disrespect


 
Was he a Sikh?As per Das yes but as per you no.

Should not this thing also be mentioned over there that,Pathans been kept by him ditched so Guru send him complained.Anyway is ditching givne over there?

And Peer Ji werre also killed later by bigot Muslims(they have faith in Allah similar to your 'faith' in Akal) and they killed Peer Ji and Banda avenged.

yuo can never be convinsed untill you are given some more info about what is Akal?


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh




> “Would you like to discuss a lot about harms evil govt did to our Gurudwara,Kala Afghan Sahib did talk such things when he says that Water of Amritsar can not be Amrit as mnay Singhs dead body were afloat in that,after opratio blue star.”
> I would discuss but not in this thread. Don’t take this thread off topic.


No this shows that for you Eleventh Guru as per you Guru Granth Sahib Ji,who is our eternal Guru,is different from Ten Masters.




> “It is done at Chavanis of Nihungs,Taksal and Hajuris but there also,there are very few who can understand the stuff and can even pronouce what is written in there.
> There are mnay verse in Darbar Sahib,of which,it is not easy to explain and only expert can do.There is one verse of St. Kabeer ,which talks of death of many after one dies.Not all can do Katha or explantion.”
> Nihungs are just a bunch of criminals and don’t have a clue what they are talking about. Most of them are from criminal backgrounds and became nihungs to escape police.


 
There are mnay Niuhngs who are rather givne ranks in police.

Say if one missioanry does something wrong and all are deemed as bad by you.

There are people,who come as guise of Sikhs but are Pakistanis and do act of sabotage,are they not OK.

You need to have clue about them.



> If you don’t believe me, then check their records. Professionals trained can do katha of hard verses also.



There are very few guys who can sing or understand the language.give the records or about there where abouts?


Katha of Dasham Granth is online also and if you want,das will try to bring that.And Path also.



> Taksal doesn’t allow bibis to Mehta Chownk to get santhya of Dasam Granth from what I checked last time




Taksal does not allows lady in many other works like becoming five Beloved.do they let ladies do Santhiya or Guru Granth Sahib,das is not sure as das was one to demanda a separate convent or Taksal for Ladies.

Well will you anyway allow a common Collage for male and female missioaries where they live togather and both sides are unmarried.Regimentaion is done and that also means that in Gurudwaras,separte sitting for male and female sometimes so that mishaps may not happen.Taksal young man take bath in open or togather.Grils can not do company.



> Don’t know about now. Nihungs are the same people who say Sikhs can shave hair around private parts and say it is okay to take drugs. They also don’t mind sex with others. They basically do all the kurehits except hahal. Hajur and Patna has hindu maryada anyways and are under control of RSS. You can talk about Taksal in the Taksal thread.



give proof about shaving private part by Sikhs,did not das told you sleeping with {censored} means cutting the hairs of private pats and person is thrown out.

In Fights and only in Fights some of them take cannabis as pain killer.Well when you ever be in war and Docter gives pain killer to you,if you are hit with bullet or byenate.It is not Kurehit.Some Sikhs also take drugs,there was a missioanry cought takeing liquer.

who told you that they do not mind haivg sex with others?

Or just saying what you want to say?


By the way Is Thre Takhats in Punjab free from RSS control.Is not Badal Dal rules SGPC.

and give proof for RSS control.

bihar is ruled by Secular JD(U) and in past RJD was ruling.both are Anti RSS,Even being part of NDA,JD(U) hates RSS so wins MUslims vote.

In Nanded,Late Pramode Mahajan of BJP threatened to withdrw some faciltiy to Takhats,Takhats made BJP(Political front of Congress) loose the elections.

Just yuo want to blame,you do so.

Das can be a party of those guyus from Sant Samaj,who call your type of a guys as Agents of Governemnt of India,who want to confuse Sikhs,as Nirankaris did in past.

But das has faith in you as in other tow Takhats.

Panth does not has to run by your wits but by Gurbani.





> “They are read and read in other countires also”
> They might be read in front of men only but not in Sangat with everyone sitting there. How come they aren’t read at Akaal Takht or Darbar Sahib?




They have read them in public and Ba Fazle Akal,Das is happy to tell you that soon they will be read again in Akal Takhat,you just wait.and time is running,do what you deem fit to stop that.





> “Stoop lying and spreadin false propoganda.They are there and then read and soon you will have their online Path also avialble. It is taken.you do not know,that’s the problem.”
> We will see when the path comes online. There is no lying or false propaganda. Ask anyone who has gone to hajur or patna. Everyone knows what they do and how they do.



Das has been to both the places so does das said this.Have you been?

Home towen of Das is few hundred Kilometers ahead of Takhat Shir Harmandir Ji.





> “By your logic explantion of evil at start of Japu Ji Sahib are more to encourage bad and we read bad in morning daily.”
> Do you even know how hukamnama is taken? Do you know what that pauri means but this topic isn’t about aarth of Japuji Sahib so it shouldn’t be discussed here. Once again, false allegations are being made. Where did Japuji Sahib come from? Who is the low enough to compare Japuji Sahib to garbage like tria chariters.



it is in your mind that you term Bani onto Tenth Master as Garbage but without proving it.Anyway das has takne Huqamanammah mnay times.That tells about Evil and being done with will of Akal.why should not it be done.whats the Problem?

Are you afraid to understand the Guru Granth Sahib Ji ocrrectly.





> “”What is the purpose of tria chariters? Why were they written?””
> “There are mnay reasons a few
> 1.To let Sikhs know that there could be sin benath pous looking Hindus or Muslims.
> 2.To send Decoded message which Sikh can only understand and non Sikhs should not even have imagination that it could be a work of Guru.”
> Are all Sikhs good?


 
All thse who are actuly Sikhof Akal and follow Akal.



> Are all Hindus bad?


Those who talk of miracle and exploit the lower caste and preach Hindusim are very Bad.And you are doing thier advocacy.



> Are all Muslims bad?


 

Those who exploits lower castes and non Muslims are Bad.



> Plus, what does it have to do with Muslims or Hindus?



Then why you crib to much about RSS.We have to make them Sikh and expose thier hypocracy,Panth is preaching and missioanry faith and not like one who lives in narrow minded cocoons.



> It is tria chariters. Not Muslim or Hindu chariters. Many stories are between Hindus and Muslims. What does that have to do with Sikhism?



They are telling us about truth behinds our rivals,who we will be soon subjecting.


what did making fun Panda do with Sikhism,so why was it done in Guru Granth Sahib Ji?Boy what a great logic.


Ang 1289

ਮਃ ੧ ॥ 
मः १ ॥ 
mehlaa 1. 
First Mehl: 

ਮਾਸੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਰਿ ਮੂਰਖੁ ਝਗੜੇ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਜਾਣੈ ॥ 
मासु मासु करि मूरखु झगड़े गिआनु धिआनु नही जाणै ॥ 
maas maas kar moorakh jhagrhay gi-aan Dhi-aan nahee jaanai. 
The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom. 

ਕਉਣੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਉਣੁ ਸਾਗੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਕਿਸੁ ਮਹਿ ਪਾਪ ਸਮਾਣੇ ॥ 
कउणु मासु कउणु सागु कहावै किसु महि पाप समाणे ॥ 
ka-un maas ka-un saag kahaavai kis meh paap samaanay. 
What is called meat, and what is called green vegetables? What leads to sin? 

ਗੈਂਡਾ ਮਾਰਿ ਹੋਮ ਜਗ ਕੀਏ ਦੇਵਤਿਆ ਕੀ ਬਾਣੇ ॥ 
गैंडा मारि होम जग कीए देवतिआ की बाणे ॥ 
gaiNdaa maar hom jag kee-ay dayviti-aa kee baanay. 
It was the habit of the gods to kill the rhinoceros, and make a feast of the burnt offering. 

ਮਾਸੁ ਛੋਡਿ ਬੈਸਿ ਨਕੁ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਮਾਣਸ ਖਾਣੇ ॥ 
मासु छोडि बैसि नकु पकड़हि राती माणस खाणे ॥ 
maas chhod bais nak pakrheh raatee maanas khaanay. 
Those who renounce meat, and hold their noses when sitting near it, devour men at night. 

ਫੜੁ ਕਰਿ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਨੋ ਦਿਖਲਾਵਹਿ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਸੂਝੈ ॥ 
फड़ु करि लोकां नो दिखलावहि गिआनु धिआनु नही सूझै ॥ 
farh kar lokaaN no dikhlaavahi gi-aan Dhi-aan nahee soojhai. 
They practice hypocrisy, and make a show before other people, but they do not understand anything about meditation or spiritual wisdom. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਧੇ ਸਿਉ ਕਿਆ ਕਹੀਐ ਕਹੈ ਨ ਕਹਿਆ ਬੂਝੈ ॥ 
नानक अंधे सिउ किआ कहीऐ कहै न कहिआ बूझै ॥ 
naanak anDhay si-o ki-aa kahee-ai kahai na kahi-aa boojhai. 
O Nanak, what can be said to the blind people? They cannot answer, or even understand what is said. 

ਅੰਧਾ ਸੋਇ ਜਿ ਅੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਵੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਰਿਦੈ ਸਿ ਲੋਚਨ ਨਾਹੀ ॥ 
अंधा सोइ जि अंधु कमावै तिसु रिदै सि लोचन नाही ॥ 
anDhaa so-ay je anDh kamaavai tis ridai se lochan naahee. 
They alone are blind, who act blindly. They have no eyes in their hearts. 

ਮਾਤ ਪਿਤਾ ਕੀ ਰਕਤੁ ਨਿਪੰਨੇ ਮਛੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਨ ਖਾਂਹੀ ॥ 
मात पिता की रकतु निपंने मछी मासु न खांही ॥ 
maat pitaa kee rakat nipannay machhee maas na khaaNhee. 
They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers, but they do not eat fish or meat. 

Ang 1290

ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖੈ ਜਾਂ ਨਿਸਿ ਮੇਲਾ ਓਥੈ ਮੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਹੀ ॥ 
इसत्री पुरखै जां निसि मेला ओथै मंधु कमाही ॥ 
istaree purkhai jaaN nis maylaa othai manDh kamaahee. 
But when men and women meet in the night, they come together in the flesh. 

ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
मासहु निमे मासहु जमे हम मासै के भांडे ॥ 
maasahu nimmay maasahu jammay ham maasai kay bhaaNday. 
In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. 

ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
गिआनु धिआनु कछु सूझै नाही चतुरु कहावै पांडे ॥ 
gi-aan Dhi-aan kachh soojhai naahee chatur kahaavai paaNday. 
You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. 

ਬਾਹਰ ਕਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਮੰਦਾ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਘਰ ਕਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਚੰਗੇਰਾ ॥ 
बाहर का मासु मंदा सुआमी घर का मासु चंगेरा ॥ 
baahar kaa maas mandaa su-aamee ghar kaa maas changayraa. 
O master, you believe that flesh on the outside is bad, but the flesh of those in your own home is good. 

ਜੀਅ ਜੰਤ ਸਭਿ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਹੋਏ ਜੀਇ ਲਇਆ ਵਾਸੇਰਾ ॥ 
जीअ जंत सभि मासहु होए जीइ लइआ वासेरा ॥ 
jee-a jant sabh maasahu ho-ay jee-ay la-i-aa vaasayraa. 
All beings and creatures are flesh; the soul has taken up its home in the flesh. 

ਅਭਖੁ ਭਖਹਿ ਭਖੁ ਤਜਿ ਛੋਡਹਿ ਅੰਧੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਜਿਨ ਕੇਰਾ ॥ 
अभखु भखहि भखु तजि छोडहि अंधु गुरू जिन केरा ॥ 
abhakh bhakheh bhakh taj chhodeh anDh guroo jin kayraa. 
They eat the uneatable; they reject and abandon what they could eat. They have a teacher who is blind. 

ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
मासहु निमे मासहु जमे हम मासै के भांडे ॥ 
maasahu nimmay maasahu jammay ham maasai kay bhaaNday. 
In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. 

ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
गिआनु धिआनु कछु सूझै नाही चतुरु कहावै पांडे ॥ 
gi-aan Dhi-aan kachh soojhai naahee chatur kahaavai paaNday. 
You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. 

ਮਾਸੁ ਪੁਰਾਣੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਤੇਬਂ​*ੀ ਚਹੁ ਜੁਗਿ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਮਾਣਾ ॥ 
मासु पुराणी मासु कतेबीं चहु जुगि मासु कमाणा ॥ 
maas puraanee maas kaytaabeeN chahu jug maas kamaanaa. 
Meat is allowed in the Puraanas, meat is allowed in the Bible and the Koran. Throughout the four ages, meat has been used. 

ਜਜਿ ਕਾਜਿ ਵੀਆਹਿ ਸੁਹਾਵੈ ਓਥੈ ਮਾਸੁ ਸਮਾਣਾ ॥ 
जजि काजि वीआहि सुहावै ओथै मासु समाणा ॥ 
jaj kaaj vee-aahi suhaavai othai maas samaanaa. 
It is featured in sacred feasts and marriage festivities; meat is used in them. 

ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖ ਨਿਪਜਹਿ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹ ਸੁਲਤਾਨਾਂ ॥ 
इसत्री पुरख निपजहि मासहु पातिसाह सुलतानां ॥ 
istaree purakh nipjahi maasahu paatisaah sultaanaaN. 
Women, men, kings and emperors originate from meat. 

ਜੇ ਓਇ ਦਿਸਹਿ ਨਰਕਿ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਤਾਂ ਉਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਕਾ ਦਾਨੁ ਨ ਲੈਣਾ ॥ 
जे ओइ दिसहि नरकि जांदे तां उन्ह का दानु न लैणा ॥ 
jay o-ay diseh narak jaaNday taaN unH kaa daan na lainaa. 
If you see them going to hell, then do not accept charitable gifts from them. 

ਦੇਂਦਾ ਨਰਕਿ ਸੁਰਗਿ ਲੈਦੇ ਦੇਖਹੁ ਏਹੁ ਧਿਙਾਣਾ ॥ 
देंदा नरकि सुरगि लैदे देखहु एहु धिङाणा ॥ 
dayNdaa narak surag laiday daykhhu ayhu Dhinyaanaa. 
The giver goes to hell, while the receiver goes to heaven - look at this injustice. 

ਆਪਿ ਨ ਬੂਝੈ ਲੋਕ ਬੁਝਾਏ ਪਾਂਡੇ ਖਰਾ ਸਿਆਣਾ ॥ 
आपि न बूझै लोक बुझाए पांडे खरा सिआणा ॥ 
aap na boojhai lok bujhaa-ay paaNday kharaa si-aanaa. 
You do not understand your own self, but you preach to other people. O Pandit, you are very wise indeed. 

ਪਾਂਡੇ ਤੂ ਜਾਣੈ ਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਿਥਹੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਉਪੰਨਾ ॥ 
पांडे तू जाणै ही नाही किथहु मासु उपंना ॥ 
paaNday too jaanai hee naahee kithhu maas upannaa. 
O Pandit, you do not know where meat originated. 

ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਅੰਨੁ ਕਮਾਦੁ ਕਪਾਹਾਂ ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣੁ ਗੰਨਾ ॥ 
तोइअहु अंनु कमादु कपाहां तोइअहु त्रिभवणु गंना ॥ 
to-i-ahu ann kamaad kapaahaaN to-i-ahu taribhavan gannaa. 
Corn, sugar cane and cotton are produced from water. The three worlds came from water. 

ਤੋਆ ਆਖੈ ਹਉ ਬਹੁ ਬਿਧਿ ਹਛਾ ਤੋਐ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਬਿਕਾਰਾ ॥ 
तोआ आखै हउ बहु बिधि हछा तोऐ बहुतु बिकारा ॥ 
to-aa aakhai ha-o baho biDh hachhaa toai bahut bikaaraa. 
Water says, "I am good in many ways." But water takes many forms. 

ਏਤੇ ਰਸ ਛੋਡਿ ਹੋਵੈ ਸੰਨਿਆਸੀ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਕਹੈ ਵਿਚਾਰਾ ॥੨॥ 
एते रस छोडि होवै संनिआसी नानकु कहै विचारा ॥२॥ 
aytay ras chhod hovai sani-aasee naanak kahai vichaaraa. ||2|| 
Forsaking these delicacies, one becomes a true Sannyaasee, a detached hermit. Nanak reflects and speaks. ||2|| 
We are told about our potential enimies(As Sipahi of Sant Siphai concept) and we are also told about our Potential subjects as per Miri(Administrationaal) concept of Miri Piri concept.



> It has absolutely nothing to do with Gurmat. Not only that, a lot of the chariters aren’t tria chariters.



There are male Charecers also and so it is called Charitro Pakhyan.

Descriptions of Charecters as per what is herd.akhyan is what is seen.


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh




> “Would you like to discuss a lot about harms evil govt did to our Gurudwara,Kala Afghan Sahib did talk such things when he says that Water of Amritsar can not be Amrit as mnay Singhs dead body were afloat in that,after opratio blue star.”
> I would discuss but not in this thread. Don’t take this thread off topic.


No this shows that for you Eleventh Guru as per you Guru Granth Sahib Ji,who is our eternal Guru,is different from Ten Masters.




> “It is done at Chavanis of Nihungs,Taksal and Hajuris but there also,there are very few who can understand the stuff and can even pronouce what is written in there.
> There are mnay verse in Darbar Sahib,of which,it is not easy to explain and only expert can do.There is one verse of St. Kabeer ,which talks of death of many after one dies.Not all can do Katha or explantion.”
> Nihungs are just a bunch of criminals and don’t have a clue what they are talking about. Most of them are from criminal backgrounds and became nihungs to escape police.


 
There are mnay Niuhngs who are rather givne ranks in police.

Say if one missioanry does something wrong and all are deemed as bad by you.

There are people,who come as guise of Sikhs but are Pakistanis and do act of sabotage,are they not OK.

You need to have clue about them.



> If you don’t believe me, then check their records. Professionals trained can do katha of hard verses also.



There are very few guys who can sing or understand the language.give the records or about there where abouts?


Katha of Dasham Granth is online also and if you want,das will try to bring that.And Path also.



> Taksal doesn’t allow bibis to Mehta Chownk to get santhya of Dasam Granth from what I checked last time




Taksal does not allows lady in many other works like becoming five Beloved.do they let ladies do Santhiya or Guru Granth Sahib,das is not sure as das was one to demanda a separate convent or Taksal for Ladies.

Well will you anyway allow a common Collage for male and female missioaries where they live togather and both sides are unmarried.Regimentaion is done and that also means that in Gurudwaras,separte sitting for male and female sometimes so that mishaps may not happen.Taksal young man take bath in open or togather.Grils can not do company.



> Don’t know about now. Nihungs are the same people who say Sikhs can shave hair around private parts and say it is okay to take drugs. They also don’t mind sex with others. They basically do all the kurehits except hahal. Hajur and Patna has hindu maryada anyways and are under control of RSS. You can talk about Taksal in the Taksal thread.



give proof about shaving private part by Sikhs,did not das told you sleeping with {censored} means cutting the hairs of private pats and person is thrown out.

In Fights and only in Fights some of them take cannabis as pain killer.Well when you ever be in war and Docter gives pain killer to you,if you are hit with bullet or byenate.It is not Kurehit.Some Sikhs also take drugs,there was a missioanry cought takeing liquer.

who told you that they do not mind haivg sex with others?

Or just saying what you want to say?


By the way Is Thre Takhats in Punjab free from RSS control.Is not Badal Dal rules SGPC.

and give proof for RSS control.

bihar is ruled by Secular JD(U) and in past RJD was ruling.both are Anti RSS,Even being part of NDA,JD(U) hates RSS so wins MUslims vote.

In Nanded,Late Pramode Mahajan of BJP threatened to withdrw some faciltiy to Takhats,Takhats made BJP(Political front of Congress) loose the elections.

Just yuo want to blame,you do so.

Das can be a party of those guyus from Sant Samaj,who call your type of a guys as Agents of Governemnt of India,who want to confuse Sikhs,as Nirankaris did in past.

But das has faith in you as in other tow Takhats.

Panth does not has to run by your wits but by Gurbani.





> “They are read and read in other countires also”
> They might be read in front of men only but not in Sangat with everyone sitting there. How come they aren’t read at Akaal Takht or Darbar Sahib?




They have read them in public and Ba Fazle Akal,Das is happy to tell you that soon they will be read again in Akal Takhat,you just wait.and time is running,do what you deem fit to stop that.





> “Stoop lying and spreadin false propoganda.They are there and then read and soon you will have their online Path also avialble. It is taken.you do not know,that’s the problem.”
> We will see when the path comes online. There is no lying or false propaganda. Ask anyone who has gone to hajur or patna. Everyone knows what they do and how they do.



Das has been to both the places so does das said this.Have you been?

Home towen of Das is few hundred Kilometers ahead of Takhat Shir Harmandir Ji.





> “By your logic explantion of evil at start of Japu Ji Sahib are more to encourage bad and we read bad in morning daily.”
> Do you even know how hukamnama is taken? Do you know what that pauri means but this topic isn’t about aarth of Japuji Sahib so it shouldn’t be discussed here. Once again, false allegations are being made. Where did Japuji Sahib come from? Who is the low enough to compare Japuji Sahib to garbage like tria chariters.



it is in your mind that you term Bani onto Tenth Master as Garbage but without proving it.Anyway das has takne Huqamanammah mnay times.That tells about Evil and being done with will of Akal.why should not it be done.whats the Problem?

Are you afraid to understand the Guru Granth Sahib Ji ocrrectly.





> “”What is the purpose of tria chariters? Why were they written?””
> “There are mnay reasons a few
> 1.To let Sikhs know that there could be sin benath pous looking Hindus or Muslims.
> 2.To send Decoded message which Sikh can only understand and non Sikhs should not even have imagination that it could be a work of Guru.”
> Are all Sikhs good?


 
All thse who are actuly Sikhof Akal and follow Akal.



> Are all Hindus bad?


Those who talk of miracle and exploit the lower caste and preach Hindusim are very Bad.And you are doing thier advocacy.



> Are all Muslims bad?


 

Those who exploits lower castes and non Muslims are Bad.



> Plus, what does it have to do with Muslims or Hindus?



Then why you crib to much about RSS.We have to make them Sikh and expose thier hypocracy,Panth is preaching and missioanry faith and not like one who lives in narrow minded cocoons.



> It is tria chariters. Not Muslim or Hindu chariters. Many stories are between Hindus and Muslims. What does that have to do with Sikhism?



They are telling us about truth behinds our rivals,who we will be soon subjecting.


what did making fun Panda do with Sikhism,so why was it done in Guru Granth Sahib Ji?Boy what a great logic.


Ang 1289

ਮਃ ੧ ॥ 
मः १ ॥ 
mehlaa 1. 
First Mehl: 

ਮਾਸੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਰਿ ਮੂਰਖੁ ਝਗੜੇ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਜਾਣੈ ॥ 
मासु मासु करि मूरखु झगड़े गिआनु धिआनु नही जाणै ॥ 
maas maas kar moorakh jhagrhay gi-aan Dhi-aan nahee jaanai. 
The fools argue about flesh and meat, but they know nothing about meditation and spiritual wisdom. 

ਕਉਣੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਉਣੁ ਸਾਗੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਕਿਸੁ ਮਹਿ ਪਾਪ ਸਮਾਣੇ ॥ 
कउणु मासु कउणु सागु कहावै किसु महि पाप समाणे ॥ 
ka-un maas ka-un saag kahaavai kis meh paap samaanay. 
What is called meat, and what is called green vegetables? What leads to sin? 

ਗੈਂਡਾ ਮਾਰਿ ਹੋਮ ਜਗ ਕੀਏ ਦੇਵਤਿਆ ਕੀ ਬਾਣੇ ॥ 
गैंडा मारि होम जग कीए देवतिआ की बाणे ॥ 
gaiNdaa maar hom jag kee-ay dayviti-aa kee baanay. 
It was the habit of the gods to kill the rhinoceros, and make a feast of the burnt offering. 

ਮਾਸੁ ਛੋਡਿ ਬੈਸਿ ਨਕੁ ਪਕੜਹਿ ਰਾਤੀ ਮਾਣਸ ਖਾਣੇ ॥ 
मासु छोडि बैसि नकु पकड़हि राती माणस खाणे ॥ 
maas chhod bais nak pakrheh raatee maanas khaanay. 
Those who renounce meat, and hold their noses when sitting near it, devour men at night. 

ਫੜੁ ਕਰਿ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਨੋ ਦਿਖਲਾਵਹਿ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਸੂਝੈ ॥ 
फड़ु करि लोकां नो दिखलावहि गिआनु धिआनु नही सूझै ॥ 
farh kar lokaaN no dikhlaavahi gi-aan Dhi-aan nahee soojhai. 
They practice hypocrisy, and make a show before other people, but they do not understand anything about meditation or spiritual wisdom. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਧੇ ਸਿਉ ਕਿਆ ਕਹੀਐ ਕਹੈ ਨ ਕਹਿਆ ਬੂਝੈ ॥ 
नानक अंधे सिउ किआ कहीऐ कहै न कहिआ बूझै ॥ 
naanak anDhay si-o ki-aa kahee-ai kahai na kahi-aa boojhai. 
O Nanak, what can be said to the blind people? They cannot answer, or even understand what is said. 

ਅੰਧਾ ਸੋਇ ਜਿ ਅੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਵੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਰਿਦੈ ਸਿ ਲੋਚਨ ਨਾਹੀ ॥ 
अंधा सोइ जि अंधु कमावै तिसु रिदै सि लोचन नाही ॥ 
anDhaa so-ay je anDh kamaavai tis ridai se lochan naahee. 
They alone are blind, who act blindly. They have no eyes in their hearts. 

ਮਾਤ ਪਿਤਾ ਕੀ ਰਕਤੁ ਨਿਪੰਨੇ ਮਛੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਨ ਖਾਂਹੀ ॥ 
मात पिता की रकतु निपंने मछी मासु न खांही ॥ 
maat pitaa kee rakat nipannay machhee maas na khaaNhee. 
They are produced from the blood of their mothers and fathers, but they do not eat fish or meat. 

Ang 1290

ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖੈ ਜਾਂ ਨਿਸਿ ਮੇਲਾ ਓਥੈ ਮੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਹੀ ॥ 
इसत्री पुरखै जां निसि मेला ओथै मंधु कमाही ॥ 
istaree purkhai jaaN nis maylaa othai manDh kamaahee. 
But when men and women meet in the night, they come together in the flesh. 

ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
मासहु निमे मासहु जमे हम मासै के भांडे ॥ 
maasahu nimmay maasahu jammay ham maasai kay bhaaNday. 
In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. 

ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
गिआनु धिआनु कछु सूझै नाही चतुरु कहावै पांडे ॥ 
gi-aan Dhi-aan kachh soojhai naahee chatur kahaavai paaNday. 
You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. 

ਬਾਹਰ ਕਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਮੰਦਾ ਸੁਆਮੀ ਘਰ ਕਾ ਮਾਸੁ ਚੰਗੇਰਾ ॥ 
बाहर का मासु मंदा सुआमी घर का मासु चंगेरा ॥ 
baahar kaa maas mandaa su-aamee ghar kaa maas changayraa. 
O master, you believe that flesh on the outside is bad, but the flesh of those in your own home is good. 

ਜੀਅ ਜੰਤ ਸਭਿ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਹੋਏ ਜੀਇ ਲਇਆ ਵਾਸੇਰਾ ॥ 
जीअ जंत सभि मासहु होए जीइ लइआ वासेरा ॥ 
jee-a jant sabh maasahu ho-ay jee-ay la-i-aa vaasayraa. 
All beings and creatures are flesh; the soul has taken up its home in the flesh. 

ਅਭਖੁ ਭਖਹਿ ਭਖੁ ਤਜਿ ਛੋਡਹਿ ਅੰਧੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਜਿਨ ਕੇਰਾ ॥ 
अभखु भखहि भखु तजि छोडहि अंधु गुरू जिन केरा ॥ 
abhakh bhakheh bhakh taj chhodeh anDh guroo jin kayraa. 
They eat the uneatable; they reject and abandon what they could eat. They have a teacher who is blind. 

ਮਾਸਹੁ ਨਿੰਮੇ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਜੰਮੇ ਹਮ ਮਾਸੈ ਕੇ ਭਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
मासहु निमे मासहु जमे हम मासै के भांडे ॥ 
maasahu nimmay maasahu jammay ham maasai kay bhaaNday. 
In the flesh we are conceived, and in the flesh we are born; we are vessels of flesh. 

ਗਿਆਨੁ ਧਿਆਨੁ ਕਛੁ ਸੂਝੈ ਨਾਹੀ ਚਤੁਰੁ ਕਹਾਵੈ ਪਾਂਡੇ ॥ 
गिआनु धिआनु कछु सूझै नाही चतुरु कहावै पांडे ॥ 
gi-aan Dhi-aan kachh soojhai naahee chatur kahaavai paaNday. 
You know nothing of spiritual wisdom and meditation, even though you call yourself clever, O religious scholar. 

ਮਾਸੁ ਪੁਰਾਣੀ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਤੇਬਂ​*ੀ ਚਹੁ ਜੁਗਿ ਮਾਸੁ ਕਮਾਣਾ ॥ 
मासु पुराणी मासु कतेबीं चहु जुगि मासु कमाणा ॥ 
maas puraanee maas kaytaabeeN chahu jug maas kamaanaa. 
Meat is allowed in the Puraanas, meat is allowed in the Bible and the Koran. Throughout the four ages, meat has been used. 

ਜਜਿ ਕਾਜਿ ਵੀਆਹਿ ਸੁਹਾਵੈ ਓਥੈ ਮਾਸੁ ਸਮਾਣਾ ॥ 
जजि काजि वीआहि सुहावै ओथै मासु समाणा ॥ 
jaj kaaj vee-aahi suhaavai othai maas samaanaa. 
It is featured in sacred feasts and marriage festivities; meat is used in them. 

ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਪੁਰਖ ਨਿਪਜਹਿ ਮਾਸਹੁ ਪਾਤਿਸਾਹ ਸੁਲਤਾਨਾਂ ॥ 
इसत्री पुरख निपजहि मासहु पातिसाह सुलतानां ॥ 
istaree purakh nipjahi maasahu paatisaah sultaanaaN. 
Women, men, kings and emperors originate from meat. 

ਜੇ ਓਇ ਦਿਸਹਿ ਨਰਕਿ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਤਾਂ ਉਨ੍ਹ੍ਹ ਕਾ ਦਾਨੁ ਨ ਲੈਣਾ ॥ 
जे ओइ दिसहि नरकि जांदे तां उन्ह का दानु न लैणा ॥ 
jay o-ay diseh narak jaaNday taaN unH kaa daan na lainaa. 
If you see them going to hell, then do not accept charitable gifts from them. 

ਦੇਂਦਾ ਨਰਕਿ ਸੁਰਗਿ ਲੈਦੇ ਦੇਖਹੁ ਏਹੁ ਧਿਙਾਣਾ ॥ 
देंदा नरकि सुरगि लैदे देखहु एहु धिङाणा ॥ 
dayNdaa narak surag laiday daykhhu ayhu Dhinyaanaa. 
The giver goes to hell, while the receiver goes to heaven - look at this injustice. 

ਆਪਿ ਨ ਬੂਝੈ ਲੋਕ ਬੁਝਾਏ ਪਾਂਡੇ ਖਰਾ ਸਿਆਣਾ ॥ 
आपि न बूझै लोक बुझाए पांडे खरा सिआणा ॥ 
aap na boojhai lok bujhaa-ay paaNday kharaa si-aanaa. 
You do not understand your own self, but you preach to other people. O Pandit, you are very wise indeed. 

ਪਾਂਡੇ ਤੂ ਜਾਣੈ ਹੀ ਨਾਹੀ ਕਿਥਹੁ ਮਾਸੁ ਉਪੰਨਾ ॥ 
पांडे तू जाणै ही नाही किथहु मासु उपंना ॥ 
paaNday too jaanai hee naahee kithhu maas upannaa. 
O Pandit, you do not know where meat originated. 

ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਅੰਨੁ ਕਮਾਦੁ ਕਪਾਹਾਂ ਤੋਇਅਹੁ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣੁ ਗੰਨਾ ॥ 
तोइअहु अंनु कमादु कपाहां तोइअहु त्रिभवणु गंना ॥ 
to-i-ahu ann kamaad kapaahaaN to-i-ahu taribhavan gannaa. 
Corn, sugar cane and cotton are produced from water. The three worlds came from water. 

ਤੋਆ ਆਖੈ ਹਉ ਬਹੁ ਬਿਧਿ ਹਛਾ ਤੋਐ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਬਿਕਾਰਾ ॥ 
तोआ आखै हउ बहु बिधि हछा तोऐ बहुतु बिकारा ॥ 
to-aa aakhai ha-o baho biDh hachhaa toai bahut bikaaraa. 
Water says, "I am good in many ways." But water takes many forms. 

ਏਤੇ ਰਸ ਛੋਡਿ ਹੋਵੈ ਸੰਨਿਆਸੀ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਕਹੈ ਵਿਚਾਰਾ ॥੨॥ 
एते रस छोडि होवै संनिआसी नानकु कहै विचारा ॥२॥ 
aytay ras chhod hovai sani-aasee naanak kahai vichaaraa. ||2|| 
Forsaking these delicacies, one becomes a true Sannyaasee, a detached hermit. Nanak reflects and speaks. ||2|| 
We are told about our potential enimies(As Sipahi of Sant Siphai concept) and we are also told about our Potential subjects as per Miri(Administrationaal) concept of Miri Piri concept.



> It has absolutely nothing to do with Gurmat. Not only that, a lot of the chariters aren’t tria chariters.



There are male Charecers also and so it is called Charitro Pakhyan.

Descriptions of Charecters as per what is herd.akhyan is what is seen.



> Many are incomplete.



that you feel and give the referance and das will tell yuo thier completeness.




> The total isn’t 404 or 405 either as at many places, a chariter is divided into two small ones for no reason.



There are valid reasons.

and that is to do with encoding of meaasges and non Sikh doe snot understand that.And non Sikh over here also question this.




> Poet says this is the 16th story while the count says it is 17th. Looks like the writers and compilers didn’t know how to count.



give line or verse number in 17th Charecter first and then say and do not tell lies.

Das will elaborate that thence.As others have not read so you try to befool others.Yuo talk about stroy of Moghuls lady are not you?Help da to find such thing in borht 17 or 16th one.And if you could not then you lie and another proof here.


Rember one thing had this been then there was a reason,but prove it is?



> What does a brother and sister having sex got to do with Sikhism? How about mother and son or father and daughter having sex got to do with Sikhism? All these stories do is make social relationships questionable



give referance where you found that?

And Sikhs have to know what all things do happen inh non Sikhs.Brother and Sister Sex is valid in Islam(Hazrat Adam(AS) had say Son 1 marrying the doughter 2 and son 2 marrying doughter 3)So if we are told about that,if at all what is wrong?

should we keep our eyes close to sin then why sin is been told sorry evil is being told on Ang 4.to make us more contious.In Story of Lot(AS) Father and doughter sex is there in Holy Bible.
. 





> This is part of a master plan and it links to 24th avtar of 24 avtars. This is to ruin the identity of Sikhs. These immoral stories have absolutely nothing to do with Sikhism and must be sent to trash or recycle bin as soon as possible.




From where 24 Avtars come over here?From your mind.Anyway 24 Avtars tells that they(24 Avtars) are nothing in front of Akal.Regarding identity of Sikhs,better be Sikh first before taling about idenetity of Sikhs.

Again restroriing to Jingoism based upon lies.Very nice.




> ““Why do they waste almost half of bachitter natak granth?””
> “It is not a waste.”
> How do the chariter promoters know that it is not a waste? How do chariters connect me to Akaal?


 
Let you know that Akal is there in Evil so no hate to anyone.No Duja Bhav or sense of any thing secod or other then akal exists.do you know Akal even by not understanding Charitro Pakhyan by the way?



> The fact is that they don’t even connect me to Guru, forget about connecting to God.



Thinking your self,Guru and Akal as three is proof of Bhau Duja in you.Rather All is Akal.And you claim to be a true Sikh,strange!



> Tria chariters also put the character of women into question. Do the chariter followers question their own wives?



There are many Charecters which praise the female like the one,who died fighting for thier Husbands or one who got Samba Ji cought.

and are not Men also targeted?

Are Wives of Chartro Pakhyan been mentioend over there?



> My bad! Haha! They don’t get married and rely on women of others to fulfill their lust.



It is writtan that mnay Hindus had such life and no need to think them to be OK.




> Gr kI nwir iqAwgY AMDw] pr nwrI isau GwlY DMDw]
> Ghur Kee Naar Tiagai Undaa, Purr Narree Sei Ghaalai Dhundaa
> The blind forsakes own wife and looks to indulge in wrong activity with other women. E.g. Predators like Maan Pehova, Shamsher Jagera and many others. This is also true or military guys e.g. from America, India, Pakistan and other countries.




So if Truth is Described vide Charitro Pakhyan as yuo gave referance,this is Not OK.

ang 1164
ਘਰ ਕੀ ਨਾਰਿ ਤਿਆਗੈ ਅੰਧਾ ॥ 
घर की नारि तिआगै अंधा ॥ 
ghar kee naar ti-aagai anDhaa. 
The blind fool abandons the wife of his own home, 

Ang 1165
ਪਰ ਨਾਰੀ ਸਿਉ ਘਾਲੈ ਧੰਧਾ ॥ 
पर नारी सिउ घालै धंधा ॥ 
par naaree si-o ghaalai DhanDhaa. 
and has an affair with another woman. 

ਜੈਸੇ ਸਿੰਬਲੁ ਦੇਖਿ ਸੂਆ ਬਿਗਸਾਨਾ ॥ 
जैसे सि्मबलु देखि सूआ बिगसाना ॥ 
jaisay simbal daykh soo-aa bigsaanaa. 
He is like the parrot, who is pleased to see the simbal tree; 

ਅੰਤ ਕੀ ਬਾਰ ਮੂਆ ਲਪਟਾਨਾ ॥੧॥ 
अंत की बार मूआ लपटाना ॥१॥ 
ant kee baar moo-aa laptaanaa. ||1|| 
but in the end, he dies, stuck to it. ||1|| 


yuor logic over here make objective observation as endrosement.



> To indulge in sexual activity with another’s wife is bujjar kurehit or cardinal wrong and the person no longer remains a Sikh. Same rule applies to the one who cuts hair or takes intoxicants or eats halal.


Did you read this or were you told while you undergo baptism.

Taking about Adultray by non Sikhs neither make quotes From Darbar Sahib invalid (as from above)nor they make Chartro Pakhyan Anti Gurmat.





> “”Are poet shyam, kal, saam soofi, and raam your Gurus?””
> “Kal,Ram and Shyams are name for Akal and so is name Mahakal,This tells that this is work of Akal and not human.There is no other Guru but Akal.Where is Saam Soofi writtan? Saam has some meaning in Arebic and Sufi has some meaning in Farsi.”
> How did poets become Akaal?


 
No Akal is the poet



> Are the chariter followers thinking alright? Raam derived from Ramaya meaning absorbed everywhere is used for Raam. Not poet Raam.



One who is absorbed in all is poet.



> In Gurbani, there is no direct use of word Shyam to mean God. It has been “Syam Sundar” basically.


Primal dark and beutifull.



> Even if we accept Syam to mean God in Dasam Granth, the aarths of those lines won’t make sense as God doesn’t write poetry



They make sense to sensibale but not to the senseless.

. 





> God is Akaal and isn’t like Mahakal with physical characteristics. God also isn’t an alcohol drinker like Mahakal or followers of Mahakal


So Mahakal beyond time that entty can not be timeless.Very nice.Child have a look on the fact that Akal is in all so no just one physical but all phyical things,So Nirgun(wihtout a Single attribute) as SarGuna(With all attributes).

Where is Mahakal said to be drinking wine is been told?Tell first and then das will explain where you are wrong.

But in wine and in Drinker and everwhere other then that.no one else but Akal lives.

Prove that follower of Akal is Alcohal drinker.Das does not drink.And his god has Attribute of Mahakal.
. 





> Tria chariters make it clear that a Sikh of Mahakal drinks liquor


. 

Prove this.shre this with us.



> The word poet comes before Syam, Raam, etc. many times. These will be proven later in a different article about the poets identifying themselves.


Das repeats the question that if they had to entrapt Sikhs,then why should they idenitfy themselves?

What an absurd logic.Prove first that they are human poets and not Attribute of Akal. 



> These articles might take half a year to arrive due to busy schedule. No promises are being made here to have the articles up anytime soon.



Das will be waiting for you and ruining your hard work as ordanised by Akal.






> ““What if tria chariter are thrown in the garbage or burned? Is it paap?””
> “If you want you can do it,In Gurmat,there is nothing Pap or Punya.Later on you can say that as Sinfull Raagmala is part of Darbar Sahib,whole should follow the same fate?”
> I said tria chariters thrown in the garbage. Not everything in Dasam Granth. It shows the lack of faith in Guru and the motive is only to promote Dasam Granth and anything is acceptable to do so; even if it is attack on Guru Granth Sahib Ji.


Misinterpetaions of gurbani are biggest wrong,but can you think that anyone can attack Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

and does All things in Triya Chairtar including our Chaupyee Hamri Karo Hath De Racha as per you not OK?yuo have attacked Amrit Sanskar.And SGPC Rahit Maryada and further you will do this.


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

> Raagmaala can be talked about in a separate Raagmaala thread. This is about Dasam Granth here




Its opposition also has fear behind it.But anyting canbe expected from person full of fear.





> Lets put paap and punya aside. There is definitely wrong and right in Gurmat. If no, then there is no need for rehat or anything else.


It is not us who follow Rahit,it is Akal,who wants us to follow the same.

See Ang 1.

Page 1, Line 7
ਹੁਕਮੀ ਹੋਵਨਿ ਆਕਾਰ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਨ ਕਹਿਆ ਜਾਈ ॥
हुकमी होवनि आकार हुकमु न कहिआ जाई ॥
hukmee hovan aakaar hukam na kahi-aa jaa-ee.
By His Command, bodies are created; His Command cannot be described.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 1, Line 8
ਹੁਕਮੀ ਹੋਵਨਿ ਜੀਅ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥
हुकमी होवनि जीअ हुकमि मिलै वडिआई ॥
hukmee hovan jee-a hukam milai vadi-aa-ee.
By His Command, souls come into being; by His Command, glory and greatness are obtained.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 8
ਹੁਕਮੀ ਉਤਮੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਲਿਖਿ ਦੁਖ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਈਅਹਿ ॥
हुकमी उतमु नीचु हुकमि लिखि दुख सुख पाईअहि ॥
hukmee utam neech hukam likh dukh sukh paa-ee-ah.
By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 9
ਇਕਨਾ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ ਇਕਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥
इकना हुकमी बखसीस इकि हुकमी सदा भवाईअहि ॥
iknaa hukmee bakhsees ik hukmee sadaa bhavaa-ee-ah.
Some, by His Command, are blessed and forgiven; others, by His Command, wander aimlessly forever.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 9
ਹੁਕਮੈ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਸਭੁ ਕੋ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਹੁਕਮ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥
हुकमै अंदरि सभु को बाहरि हुकम न कोइ ॥
hukmai andar sabh ko baahar hukam na ko-ay.
Everyone is subject to His Command; no one is beyond His Command.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 10
ਨਾਨਕ ਹੁਕਮੈ ਜੇ ਬੁਝੈ ਤ ਹਉਮੈ ਕਹੈ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥੨॥
नानक हुकमै जे बुझै त हउमै कहै न कोइ ॥२॥
naanak hukmai jay bujhai ta ha-umai kahai na ko-ay. ||2||
O Nanak, one who understands His Command, does not speak in ego. ||2||
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE][/SIZE]
Do yuo rread this daily and qouting this is an offense?

why is no Rahit been given in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and why is there in Dasham Granth?why are we Told about Guru Panth,Guru Granth and Trai Mudra in Sarbloh Granth?



> Why do RSS agents keep attacking Guru Granth Sahib Ji? They don’t want to use Guru Granth Sahib Ji because their mission is to promote Sarbloh Granth and Dasam Granth to the status of being Guru. These plans will not pass and will fail again like they failed at the start of early 20th century.



why do not agent of kaliyug and as per Sants GOI keep on telling false lies over the Bani of Tenth Master?

when did anyone talked giving Status of Bade Baba Ji(we call Guru Granth Sahib Ji in this way in Bihar) to any other text?Or just trying to put self fears beening blamed unto one who never thought of that?

wolrd is aware that who was defeated in earyly 20th Century and still is getting defeated.

Narakdharis,Bhasauris,Kala Afghana Ji,Ghugga Ji and so on and so forth.




> ““Were Sikhs reading tria chariters before bachitter natak granth got created?””
> “Were Sikhs reading Bani of Ninth Master when Fist Master complied Guru Granth Sahib Ji ?”
> First master never compiled Guru Granth Sahib Ji. This is a lie. When 9th master was Guru, Sikhs read his bani and his bani is included in Guru Granth Sahib Ji so there is no issue.


 
Das is sorry and rectfy this as Fifth Master.

Bani inclusion by Ninth Master is a proof that Bani was yet to come.If it can come to Ninth then why can not it come to Tenth?

And do you know that other then Ninth Master Bani there are some more extra verse which were not in Kartarpuri Beerh but are in Damdami Beerh(as Taksal has told).Better is to read the book about Kartarpuri Beerh by Bhai Jodh Singh Ji.



> 9th master was 9th Nanak so his bani is same as that of Guru Nanak so this is just another attack on 10 Paatshahis and Guru Granth Sahib Ji.



Guru Granth Sahib Ji are perfect and no one can attack them,in perfect guys due to lack in faith think about attacks.so Bani of Tenth Master is not Eqaul to First Master?



> Tria chariters are no where close to being writings of Guru Sahib so then how can they be compared to beautiful Sloaks of 9th Nanak or beautiful Shabads of 9th Nanak.



There is comparision.Some wrong things are been told about and das gave them and will give again.

Ang632and 633
ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮਹਲਾ ੯ ॥ 
सोरठि महला ९ ॥ 
sorath mehlaa 9. 
Sorat'h, Ninth Mehl: 

ਮਾਈ ਮੈ ਕਿਹਿ ਬਿਧਿ ਲਖਉ ਗੁਸਾਈ ॥ 
माई मै किहि बिधि लखउ गुसाई ॥ 
maa-ee mai kihi biDh lakha-o gusaa-ee. 
O mother, how can I see the Lord of the world? 

ਮਹਾ ਮੋਹ ਅਗਿਆਨਿ ਤਿਮਰਿ ਮੋ ਮਨੁ ਰਹਿਓ ਉਰਝਾਈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
महा मोह अगिआनि तिमरि मो मनु रहिओ उरझाई ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
mahaa moh agi-aan timar mo man rahi-o urjhaa-ee. ||1|| rahaa-o. 
In the utter darkness of emotional attachment and spiritual ignorance, my mind remains entangled. ||1||Pause|| 

ਸਗਲ ਜਨਮ ਭਰਮ ਹੀ ਭਰਮ ਖੋਇਓ ਨਹ ਅਸਥਿਰੁ ਮਤਿ ਪਾਈ ॥ 
सगल जनम भरम ही भरम खोइओ नह असथिरु मति पाई ॥ 
sagal janam bharam hee bharam kho-i-o nah asthir mat paa-ee. 
Deluded by doubt, I have wasted my whole life; I have not obtained a stable intellect. 

ਬਿਖਿਆਸਕਤ ਰਹਿਓ ਨਿਸ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਨਹ ਛੂਟੀ ਅਧਮਾਈ ॥੧॥ 
बिखिआसकत रहिओ निस बासुर नह छूटी अधमाई ॥१॥ 
bikhi-aaskat rahi-o nis baasur nah chhootee aDhmaa-ee. ||1|| 
I remain under the influence of corrupting sins, night and day, and I have not renounced wickedness. ||1|| 

ਸਾਧਸੰਗੁ ਕਬਹੂ ਨਹੀ ਕੀਨਾ ਨਹ ਕੀਰਤਿ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਗਾਈ ॥ 
साधसंगु कबहू नही कीना नह कीरति प्रभ गाई ॥ 
saaDhsang kabhoo nahee keenaa nah keerat parabh gaa-ee. 
I never joined the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, and I did not sing the Kirtan of God's Praises. 

ਜਨ ਨਾਨਕ ਮੈ ਨਾਹਿ ਕੋਊ ਗੁਨੁ ਰਾਖਿ ਲੇਹੁ ਸਰਨਾਈ ॥੨॥੬॥ 
जन नानक मै नाहि कोऊ गुनु राखि लेहु सरनाई ॥२॥६॥ 
jan naanak mai naahi ko-oo gun raakh layho sarnaa-ee. ||2||6|| 
O servant Nanak, I have no virtues at all; keep me in Your Sanctuary, Lord. ||2||6|| 

ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮਹਲਾ ੯ ॥ 
सोरठि महला ९ ॥ 
sorath mehlaa 9. 
Sorat'h, Ninth Mehl: 

ਮਾਈ ਮਨੁ ਮੇਰੋ ਬਸਿ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ 
माई मनु मेरो बसि नाहि ॥ 
maa-ee man mayro bas naahi. 
O mother, my mind is out of control. 

ਨਿਸ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਬਿਖਿਅਨ ਕਉ ਧਾਵਤ ਕਿਹਿ ਬਿਧਿ ਰੋਕਉ ਤਾਹਿ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
निस बासुर बिखिअन कउ धावत किहि बिधि रोकउ ताहि ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
nis baasur bikhi-an ka-o Dhaavat kihi biDh roka-o taahi. ||1|| rahaa-o. 
Night and day, it runs after sin and corruption. How can I restrain it? ||1||Pause|| 

ਬੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਕੇ ਮਤ ਸੁਨਿ ਨਿਮਖ ਨ ਹੀਏ ਬਸਾਵੈ ॥ 
बेद पुरान सिम्रिति के मत सुनि निमख न हीए बसावै ॥ 
bayd puraan simrit kay mat sun nimakh na hee-ay basaavai. 
He listens to the teachings of the Vedas, the Puraanas and the Simritees, but he does not enshrine them in his heart, even for an instant. 

ਪਰ ਧਨ ਪਰ ਦਾਰਾ ਸਿਉ ਰਚਿਓ ਬਿਰਥਾ ਜਨਮੁ ਸਿਰਾਵੈ ॥੧॥ 
पर धन पर दारा सिउ रचिओ बिरथा जनमु सिरावै ॥१॥ 
par Dhan par daaraa si-o rachi-o birthaa janam siraavai. ||1|| 
Engrossed in the wealth and women of others, his life passes away uselessly. ||1|| 

ਮਦਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਕੈ ਭਇਓ ਬਾਵਰੋ ਸੂਝਤ ਨਹ ਕਛੁ ਗਿਆਨਾ ॥ 
मदि माइआ कै भइओ बावरो सूझत नह कछु गिआना ॥ 
mad maa-i-aa kai bha-i-o baavro soojhat nah kachh gi-aanaa. 
He has gone insane with the wine of Maya, and does not understand even a bit of spiritual wisdom. 

ਘਟ ਹੀ ਭੀਤਰਿ ਬਸਤ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਤਾ ਕੋ ਮਰਮੁ ਨ ਜਾਨਾ ॥੨॥ 
घट ही भीतरि बसत निरंजनु ता को मरमु न जाना ॥२॥ 
ghat hee bheetar basat niranjan taa ko maram na jaanaa. ||2|| 
Deep within his heart, the Immaculate Lord dwells, but he does not know this secret. ||2|| 
ਜਬ ਹੀ ਸਰਨਿ ਸਾਧ ਕੀ ਆਇਓ ਦੁਰਮਤਿ ਸਗਲ ਬਿਨਾਸੀ ॥ 
जब ही सरनि साध की आइओ दुरमति सगल बिनासी ॥ 
jab hee saran saaDh kee aa-i-o durmat sagal binaasee. 
When I came to the Sanctuary of the Holy Saints, all my evil-mindedness was dispelled. 

ਤਬ ਨਾਨਕ ਚੇਤਿਓ ਚਿੰਤਾਮਨਿ ਕਾਟੀ ਜਮ ਕੀ ਫਾਸੀ ॥੩॥੭॥ 
तब नानक चेतिओ चिंतामनि काटी जम की फासी ॥३॥७॥ 
tab naanak chayti-o chintaaman kaatee jam kee faasee. ||3||7|| 
Then, O Nanak, I remembered the Chintaamani, the jewel which fulfills all desires, and the noose of Death was snapped. ||3||7|| 


so Guru gives self examples so that let peple be off the wrong things,while he has not done any such things.

Read them or you want to use logic you use at Triya Charitars over here?

Page 1186, Line 13
ਮਨੁ ਮੇਰੋ ਧਾਵਨ ਤੇ ਛੂਟਿਓ ਕਰਿ ਬੈਠੋ ਬਿਸਰਾਮੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
मनु मेरो धावन ते छूटिओ करि बैठो बिसरामु ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
man mayro Dhaavan tay chhooti-o kar baitho bisraam. ||1|| rahaa-o.
My mind has stopped its wanderings, and now, it has come to rest. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Teg Bahadur* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1186, Line 16
ਤ੍ਰਿਸਨਾ ਸਕਲ ਬਿਨਾਸੀ ਮਨ ਤੇ ਨਿਜ ਸੁਖ ਮਾਹਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥੨॥
त्रिसना सकल बिनासी मन ते निज सुख माहि समाइआ ॥२॥
tarisnaa sakal binaasee man tay nij sukh maahi samaa-i-aa. ||2||
My mind was rid of all its desires, and I was absorbed in the peace of my own inner being. ||2||
*Guru Teg Bahadur* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1428, Line 5
ਜਤਨ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਮੈ ਕਰਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਮਿਟਿਓ ਨ ਮਨ ਕੋ ਮਾਨੁ ॥
जतन बहुतु मै करि रहिओ मिटिओ न मन को मानु ॥
jatan bahut mai kar rahi-o miti-o na man ko maan.
I have tried so many things, but the pride of my mind has not been dispelled.
*Guru Teg Bahadur* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Das is not giveing the whole verse.Message is clear.




> The 10th form of Nanak would not go against previous nine and change everything the first 9 Nanaks stood for. RSS promoters want Sikhs to believe that 10th Nanak was different from first 9.



Again RSS.


Das thinks you love them a Lot,Yuo remind Das again agani of such thing while Das always thinks of Akal.

Probelme is with those so called Sikhs who do not understand the idealogy of Sabad Guru and of Guru Granth Sahib Ji and who was in all Ten Nanaks and so do they try to find contradictions.Das has seen how good you know Akal,who was in Ten forsm and still is in Two more forms of Guru Panth and Guru Granth.




> “”Why do they say that even God is regretting after creating women?””
> “Bidhna is Brahma and he wanted to marry own doughter.Brahma is not God.”
> Brahma wanting to marry daughter has nothing to do with those tria chariters. Brahma (so called devta) didn’t make women either.


 
He gave birth to his mythalogical doughter Sarswati or Brahmani and he wanted to marry her after lovong her.

but did Brahma entered lotus or was he bron out of lotus?



Then why such things are there in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.?

Page 227, Line 2
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲੁ ਪਇਆਲਿ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ॥
ब्रहम कमलु पइआलि न पाइआ ॥
barahm kamal pa-i-aal na paa-i-aa.
Brahma entered the lotus, and searched the nether regions, but he did not find the end of it.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 350, Line 17
ਨਾਲਿ ਕੁਟੰਬੁ ਸਾਥਿ ਵਰਦਾਤਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਭਾਲਣ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਗਇਆ ॥
नालि कुट्मबु साथि वरदाता ब्रहमा भालण स्रिसटि गइआ ॥
naal kutamb saath vardaataa barahmaa bhaalan sarisat ga-i-aa.
Brahma, the bestower of blessings, entered the stem of the lotus, with his relatives, to find the extent of the universe.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 489, Line 8
ਨਾਭਿ ਕਮਲ ਤੇ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਉਪਜੇ ਬੇਦ ਪੜਹਿ ਮੁਖਿ ਕੰਠਿ ਸਵਾਰਿ ॥
नाभि कमल ते ब्रहमा उपजे बेद पड़हि मुखि कंठि सवारि ॥
naabh kamal tay barahmaa upjay bayd parheh mukh kanth savaar.
From the lotus of Vishnu's navel, Brahma was born; He chanted the Vedas with a melodious voice.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1237, Line 17
ਨਾਭਿ ਵਸਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੈ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਜਾਣਿਆ ॥
नाभि वसत ब्रहमै अंतु न जाणिआ ॥
naabh vasat barahmai ant na jaani-aa.
Brahma, in the lotus of the navel, does not know the limits of God.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1309, Line 7
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲ ਪੁਤੁ ਮੀਨ ਬਿਆਸਾ ਤਪੁ ਤਾਪਨ ਪੂਜ ਕਰਾਵੈਗੋ ॥
ब्रहम कमल पुतु मीन बिआसा तपु तापन पूज करावैगो ॥
barahm kamal put meen bi-aasaa tap taapan pooj karaavaigo.
Brahma, the son of the lotus, and Vyaas, the son of the fish, practiced austere penance and were worshipped.
*Guru Ram Das* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]




> God made women so unless the writer is promoting Hindu philosophy,



Writer is making fun of Hindu Demigod and you want to make him God.





> > Bidna meaning Vidaata meaning God is the creator of women.



So in Charitar 10,when urbasi moves it is writtan that bidhai made 4 faces,is this God?

for you Mahakal can not be God as that as per you drink wine and as per you four faced Brahma is God.


Purakh Bidhata is Akal ie Complete creater of destny and decideds what one has to do.

Brhama as he wrote Vedas is teremed even Vidhata and informally Vidhnana.

In one vers it is followed by Shiva also getting trouble with lady(Uma) and in orther verse next line tells that Crerater is only capable to understand Lady.

If you do not know then there is no need to make such thing which is not existing.

Sikh is one who is ready learn.



> There is no question. Otherwise, what does a Brahma (devta) creating woman have to do with Gurmat? There was no need to write it there then. Sikhs don’t care what Brahma thought about women and didn’t have to be told every so often.


Neither Brahma cam eout of lotus.
there is an issue that is 

to prove as writtan in Guru Granth Sahibh Ji.

ਪੰਨਾ 129, ਸਤਰ 8
ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਾ ਮੂਲੁ ਹੈ ਮਾਇਆ ॥
देवी देवा मूलु है माइआ ॥
dayvee dayvaa mool hai maa-i-aa.
The source, the root, of the gods and goddesses is Maya.
ਮਃ 3 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

ਪੰਨਾ 227, ਸਤਰ 4
ਮਾਇਆ ਮੋਹੇ ਦੇਵੀ ਸਭਿ ਦੇਵਾ ॥
माइआ मोहे देवी सभि देवा ॥
maa-i-aa mohay dayvee sabh dayvaa.
All the gods and goddesses are enticed by Maya.
ਮਃ 1 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 258, ਸਤਰ 14
ਭਰਮੇ ਸੁਰਿ ਨਰ ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਾ ॥
भरमे सुरि नर देवी देवा ॥
bharmay sur nar dayvee dayvaa.
The angelic beings, goddesses and gods are deluded by doubt.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Das hopes yuo will understand that this thing is proven ver there.

Guru mat did care for Hindus who deem such person as Vidhata and Gurmat does wants those Hindus to come to Gurmat.

and they will one day all be Sikh and you will not be able to prevent them either.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

> Raagmaala can be talked about in a separate Raagmaala thread. This is about Dasam Granth here




Its opposition also has fear behind it.But anyting canbe expected from person full of fear.





> Lets put paap and punya aside. There is definitely wrong and right in Gurmat. If no, then there is no need for rehat or anything else.


It is not us who follow Rahit,it is Akal,who wants us to follow the same.

See Ang 1.

Page 1, Line 7
ਹੁਕਮੀ ਹੋਵਨਿ ਆਕਾਰ ਹੁਕਮੁ ਨ ਕਹਿਆ ਜਾਈ ॥
हुकमी होवनि आकार हुकमु न कहिआ जाई ॥
hukmee hovan aakaar hukam na kahi-aa jaa-ee.
By His Command, bodies are created; His Command cannot be described.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/SalokPage 1, Line 8
ਹੁਕਮੀ ਹੋਵਨਿ ਜੀਅ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਮਿਲੈ ਵਡਿਆਈ ॥
हुकमी होवनि जीअ हुकमि मिलै वडिआई ॥
hukmee hovan jee-a hukam milai vadi-aa-ee.
By His Command, souls come into being; by His Command, glory and greatness are obtained.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 8
ਹੁਕਮੀ ਉਤਮੁ ਨੀਚੁ ਹੁਕਮਿ ਲਿਖਿ ਦੁਖ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਈਅਹਿ ॥
हुकमी उतमु नीचु हुकमि लिखि दुख सुख पाईअहि ॥
hukmee utam neech hukam likh dukh sukh paa-ee-ah.
By His Command, some are high and some are low; by His Written Command, pain and pleasure are obtained.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 9
ਇਕਨਾ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ ਇਕਿ ਹੁਕਮੀ ਸਦਾ ਭਵਾਈਅਹਿ ॥
इकना हुकमी बखसीस इकि हुकमी सदा भवाईअहि ॥
iknaa hukmee bakhsees ik hukmee sadaa bhavaa-ee-ah.
Some, by His Command, are blessed and forgiven; others, by His Command, wander aimlessly forever.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 9
ਹੁਕਮੈ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਸਭੁ ਕੋ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਹੁਕਮ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥
हुकमै अंदरि सभु को बाहरि हुकम न कोइ ॥
hukmai andar sabh ko baahar hukam na ko-ay.
Everyone is subject to His Command; no one is beyond His Command.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1, Line 10
ਨਾਨਕ ਹੁਕਮੈ ਜੇ ਬੁਝੈ ਤ ਹਉਮੈ ਕਹੈ ਨ ਕੋਇ ॥੨॥
नानक हुकमै जे बुझै त हउमै कहै न कोइ ॥२॥
naanak hukmai jay bujhai ta ha-umai kahai na ko-ay. ||2||
O Nanak, one who understands His Command, does not speak in ego. ||2||
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE][/SIZE]
Do yuo rread this daily and qouting this is an offense?

why is no Rahit been given in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and why is there in Dasham Granth?why are we Told about Guru Panth,Guru Granth and Trai Mudra in Sarbloh Granth?



> Why do RSS agents keep attacking Guru Granth Sahib Ji? They don’t want to use Guru Granth Sahib Ji because their mission is to promote Sarbloh Granth and Dasam Granth to the status of being Guru. These plans will not pass and will fail again like they failed at the start of early 20th century.



why do not agent of kaliyug and as per Sants GOI keep on telling false lies over the Bani of Tenth Master?

when did anyone talked giving Status of Bade Baba Ji(we call Guru Granth Sahib Ji in this way in Bihar) to any other text?Or just trying to put self fears beening blamed unto one who never thought of that?

wolrd is aware that who was defeated in earyly 20th Century and still is getting defeated.

Narakdharis,Bhasauris,Kala Afghana Ji,Ghugga Ji and so on and so forth.




> ““Were Sikhs reading tria chariters before bachitter natak granth got created?””
> “Were Sikhs reading Bani of Ninth Master when Fist Master complied Guru Granth Sahib Ji ?”
> First master never compiled Guru Granth Sahib Ji. This is a lie. When 9th master was Guru, Sikhs read his bani and his bani is included in Guru Granth Sahib Ji so there is no issue.


 
Das is sorry and rectfy this as Fifth Master.

Bani inclusion by Ninth Master is a proof that Bani was yet to come.If it can come to Ninth then why can not it come to Tenth?

And do you know that other then Ninth Master Bani there are some more extra verse which were not in Kartarpuri Beerh but are in Damdami Beerh(as Taksal has told).Better is to read the book about Kartarpuri Beerh by Bhai Jodh Singh Ji.



> 9th master was 9th Nanak so his bani is same as that of Guru Nanak so this is just another attack on 10 Paatshahis and Guru Granth Sahib Ji.



Guru Granth Sahib Ji are perfect and no one can attack them,in perfect guys due to lack in faith think about attacks.so Bani of Tenth Master is not Eqaul to First Master?


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

> Tria chariters are no where close to being writings of Guru Sahib so then how can they be compared to beautiful Sloaks of 9th Nanak or beautiful Shabads of 9th Nanak.



There is comparision.Some wrong things are been told about and das gave them and will give again.

Ang632and 633
ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮਹਲਾ ੯ ॥ 
सोरठि महला ९ ॥ 
sorath mehlaa 9. 
Sorat'h, Ninth Mehl: 

ਮਾਈ ਮੈ ਕਿਹਿ ਬਿਧਿ ਲਖਉ ਗੁਸਾਈ ॥ 
माई मै किहि बिधि लखउ गुसाई ॥ 
maa-ee mai kihi biDh lakha-o gusaa-ee. 
O mother, how can I see the Lord of the world? 

ਮਹਾ ਮੋਹ ਅਗਿਆਨਿ ਤਿਮਰਿ ਮੋ ਮਨੁ ਰਹਿਓ ਉਰਝਾਈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
महा मोह अगिआनि तिमरि मो मनु रहिओ उरझाई ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
mahaa moh agi-aan timar mo man rahi-o urjhaa-ee. ||1|| rahaa-o. 
In the utter darkness of emotional attachment and spiritual ignorance, my mind remains entangled. ||1||Pause|| 

ਸਗਲ ਜਨਮ ਭਰਮ ਹੀ ਭਰਮ ਖੋਇਓ ਨਹ ਅਸਥਿਰੁ ਮਤਿ ਪਾਈ ॥ 
सगल जनम भरम ही भरम खोइओ नह असथिरु मति पाई ॥ 
sagal janam bharam hee bharam kho-i-o nah asthir mat paa-ee. 
Deluded by doubt, I have wasted my whole life; I have not obtained a stable intellect. 

ਬਿਖਿਆਸਕਤ ਰਹਿਓ ਨਿਸ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਨਹ ਛੂਟੀ ਅਧਮਾਈ ॥੧॥ 
बिखिआसकत रहिओ निस बासुर नह छूटी अधमाई ॥१॥ 
bikhi-aaskat rahi-o nis baasur nah chhootee aDhmaa-ee. ||1|| 
I remain under the influence of corrupting sins, night and day, and I have not renounced wickedness. ||1|| 

ਸਾਧਸੰਗੁ ਕਬਹੂ ਨਹੀ ਕੀਨਾ ਨਹ ਕੀਰਤਿ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਗਾਈ ॥ 
साधसंगु कबहू नही कीना नह कीरति प्रभ गाई ॥ 
saaDhsang kabhoo nahee keenaa nah keerat parabh gaa-ee. 
I never joined the Saadh Sangat, the Company of the Holy, and I did not sing the Kirtan of God's Praises. 

ਜਨ ਨਾਨਕ ਮੈ ਨਾਹਿ ਕੋਊ ਗੁਨੁ ਰਾਖਿ ਲੇਹੁ ਸਰਨਾਈ ॥੨॥੬॥ 
जन नानक मै नाहि कोऊ गुनु राखि लेहु सरनाई ॥२॥६॥ 
jan naanak mai naahi ko-oo gun raakh layho sarnaa-ee. ||2||6|| 
O servant Nanak, I have no virtues at all; keep me in Your Sanctuary, Lord. ||2||6|| 

ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮਹਲਾ ੯ ॥ 
सोरठि महला ९ ॥ 
sorath mehlaa 9. 
Sorat'h, Ninth Mehl: 

ਮਾਈ ਮਨੁ ਮੇਰੋ ਬਸਿ ਨਾਹਿ ॥ 
माई मनु मेरो बसि नाहि ॥ 
maa-ee man mayro bas naahi. 
O mother, my mind is out of control. 

ਨਿਸ ਬਾਸੁਰ ਬਿਖਿਅਨ ਕਉ ਧਾਵਤ ਕਿਹਿ ਬਿਧਿ ਰੋਕਉ ਤਾਹਿ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
निस बासुर बिखिअन कउ धावत किहि बिधि रोकउ ताहि ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
nis baasur bikhi-an ka-o Dhaavat kihi biDh roka-o taahi. ||1|| rahaa-o. 
Night and day, it runs after sin and corruption. How can I restrain it? ||1||Pause|| 

ਬੇਦ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਕੇ ਮਤ ਸੁਨਿ ਨਿਮਖ ਨ ਹੀਏ ਬਸਾਵੈ ॥ 
बेद पुरान सिम्रिति के मत सुनि निमख न हीए बसावै ॥ 
bayd puraan simrit kay mat sun nimakh na hee-ay basaavai. 
He listens to the teachings of the Vedas, the Puraanas and the Simritees, but he does not enshrine them in his heart, even for an instant. 

ਪਰ ਧਨ ਪਰ ਦਾਰਾ ਸਿਉ ਰਚਿਓ ਬਿਰਥਾ ਜਨਮੁ ਸਿਰਾਵੈ ॥੧॥ 
पर धन पर दारा सिउ रचिओ बिरथा जनमु सिरावै ॥१॥ 
par Dhan par daaraa si-o rachi-o birthaa janam siraavai. ||1|| 
Engrossed in the wealth and women of others, his life passes away uselessly. ||1|| 

ਮਦਿ ਮਾਇਆ ਕੈ ਭਇਓ ਬਾਵਰੋ ਸੂਝਤ ਨਹ ਕਛੁ ਗਿਆਨਾ ॥ 
मदि माइआ कै भइओ बावरो सूझत नह कछु गिआना ॥ 
mad maa-i-aa kai bha-i-o baavro soojhat nah kachh gi-aanaa. 
He has gone insane with the wine of Maya, and does not understand even a bit of spiritual wisdom. 

ਘਟ ਹੀ ਭੀਤਰਿ ਬਸਤ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਤਾ ਕੋ ਮਰਮੁ ਨ ਜਾਨਾ ॥੨॥ 
घट ही भीतरि बसत निरंजनु ता को मरमु न जाना ॥२॥ 
ghat hee bheetar basat niranjan taa ko maram na jaanaa. ||2|| 
Deep within his heart, the Immaculate Lord dwells, but he does not know this secret. ||2|| 
ਜਬ ਹੀ ਸਰਨਿ ਸਾਧ ਕੀ ਆਇਓ ਦੁਰਮਤਿ ਸਗਲ ਬਿਨਾਸੀ ॥ 
जब ही सरनि साध की आइओ दुरमति सगल बिनासी ॥ 
jab hee saran saaDh kee aa-i-o durmat sagal binaasee. 
When I came to the Sanctuary of the Holy Saints, all my evil-mindedness was dispelled. 

ਤਬ ਨਾਨਕ ਚੇਤਿਓ ਚਿੰਤਾਮਨਿ ਕਾਟੀ ਜਮ ਕੀ ਫਾਸੀ ॥੩॥੭॥ 
तब नानक चेतिओ चिंतामनि काटी जम की फासी ॥३॥७॥ 
tab naanak chayti-o chintaaman kaatee jam kee faasee. ||3||7|| 
Then, O Nanak, I remembered the Chintaamani, the jewel which fulfills all desires, and the noose of Death was snapped. ||3||7|| 


so Guru gives self examples so that let peple be off the wrong things,while he has not done any such things.

Read them or you want to use logic you use at Triya Charitars over here?

Page 1186, Line 13
ਮਨੁ ਮੇਰੋ ਧਾਵਨ ਤੇ ਛੂਟਿਓ ਕਰਿ ਬੈਠੋ ਬਿਸਰਾਮੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
मनु मेरो धावन ते छूटिओ करि बैठो बिसरामु ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
man mayro Dhaavan tay chhooti-o kar baitho bisraam. ||1|| rahaa-o.
My mind has stopped its wanderings, and now, it has come to rest. ||1||Pause||
*Guru Teg Bahadur* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1186, Line 16
ਤ੍ਰਿਸਨਾ ਸਕਲ ਬਿਨਾਸੀ ਮਨ ਤੇ ਨਿਜ ਸੁਖ ਮਾਹਿ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥੨॥
त्रिसना सकल बिनासी मन ते निज सुख माहि समाइआ ॥२॥
tarisnaa sakal binaasee man tay nij sukh maahi samaa-i-aa. ||2||
My mind was rid of all its desires, and I was absorbed in the peace of my own inner being. ||2||
*Guru Teg Bahadur* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1428, Line 5
ਜਤਨ ਬਹੁਤੁ ਮੈ ਕਰਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਮਿਟਿਓ ਨ ਮਨ ਕੋ ਮਾਨੁ ॥
जतन बहुतु मै करि रहिओ मिटिओ न मन को मानु ॥
jatan bahut mai kar rahi-o miti-o na man ko maan.
I have tried so many things, but the pride of my mind has not been dispelled.
*Guru Teg Bahadur* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Das is not giveing the whole verse.Message is clear.




> The 10th form of Nanak would not go against previous nine and change everything the first 9 Nanaks stood for. RSS promoters want Sikhs to believe that 10th Nanak was different from first 9.



Again RSS.


Das thinks you love them a Lot,Yuo remind Das again agani of such thing while Das always thinks of Akal.

Probelme is with those so called Sikhs who do not understand the idealogy of Sabad Guru and of Guru Granth Sahib Ji and who was in all Ten Nanaks and so do they try to find contradictions.Das has seen how good you know Akal,who was in Ten forsm and still is in Two more forms of Guru Panth and Guru Granth.




> “”Why do they say that even God is regretting after creating women?””
> “Bidhna is Brahma and he wanted to marry own doughter.Brahma is not God.”
> Brahma wanting to marry daughter has nothing to do with those tria chariters. Brahma (so called devta) didn’t make women either.


 
He gave birth to his mythalogical doughter Sarswati or Brahmani and he wanted to marry her after lovong her.

but did Brahma entered lotus or was he bron out of lotus?



Then why such things are there in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.?

Page 227, Line 2
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲੁ ਪਇਆਲਿ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ॥
ब्रहम कमलु पइआलि न पाइआ ॥
barahm kamal pa-i-aal na paa-i-aa.
Brahma entered the lotus, and searched the nether regions, but he did not find the end of it.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 350, Line 17
ਨਾਲਿ ਕੁਟੰਬੁ ਸਾਥਿ ਵਰਦਾਤਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਭਾਲਣ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਗਇਆ ॥
नालि कुट्मबु साथि वरदाता ब्रहमा भालण स्रिसटि गइआ ॥
naal kutamb saath vardaataa barahmaa bhaalan sarisat ga-i-aa.
Brahma, the bestower of blessings, entered the stem of the lotus, with his relatives, to find the extent of the universe.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 489, Line 8
ਨਾਭਿ ਕਮਲ ਤੇ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਉਪਜੇ ਬੇਦ ਪੜਹਿ ਮੁਖਿ ਕੰਠਿ ਸਵਾਰਿ ॥
नाभि कमल ते ब्रहमा उपजे बेद पड़हि मुखि कंठि सवारि ॥
naabh kamal tay barahmaa upjay bayd parheh mukh kanth savaar.
From the lotus of Vishnu's navel, Brahma was born; He chanted the Vedas with a melodious voice.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1237, Line 17
ਨਾਭਿ ਵਸਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮੈ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਜਾਣਿਆ ॥
नाभि वसत ब्रहमै अंतु न जाणिआ ॥
naabh vasat barahmai ant na jaani-aa.
Brahma, in the lotus of the navel, does not know the limits of God.
*Guru Nanak Dev* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1309, Line 7
ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਕਮਲ ਪੁਤੁ ਮੀਨ ਬਿਆਸਾ ਤਪੁ ਤਾਪਨ ਪੂਜ ਕਰਾਵੈਗੋ ॥
ब्रहम कमल पुतु मीन बिआसा तपु तापन पूज करावैगो ॥
barahm kamal put meen bi-aasaa tap taapan pooj karaavaigo.
Brahma, the son of the lotus, and Vyaas, the son of the fish, practiced austere penance and were worshipped.
*Guru Ram Das* - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]




> God made women so unless the writer is promoting Hindu philosophy,



Writer is making fun of Hindu Demigod and you want to make him God.





> > Bidna meaning Vidaata meaning God is the creator of women.



So in Charitar 10,when urbasi moves it is writtan that bidhai made 4 faces,is this God?

for you Mahakal can not be God as that as per you drink wine and as per you four faced Brahma is God.


Purakh Bidhata is Akal ie Complete creater of destny and decideds what one has to do.

Brhama as he wrote Vedas is teremed even Vidhata and informally Vidhnana.

In one vers it is followed by Shiva also getting trouble with lady(Uma) and in orther verse next line tells that Crerater is only capable to understand Lady.

If you do not know then there is no need to make such thing which is not existing.

Sikh is one who is ready learn.



> There is no question. Otherwise, what does a Brahma (devta) creating woman have to do with Gurmat? There was no need to write it there then. Sikhs don’t care what Brahma thought about women and didn’t have to be told every so often.


Neither Brahma cam eout of lotus.
there is an issue that is 

to prove as writtan in Guru Granth Sahibh Ji.

ਪੰਨਾ 129, ਸਤਰ 8
ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਾ ਮੂਲੁ ਹੈ ਮਾਇਆ ॥
देवी देवा मूलु है माइआ ॥
dayvee dayvaa mool hai maa-i-aa.
The source, the root, of the gods and goddesses is Maya.
ਮਃ 3 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

ਪੰਨਾ 227, ਸਤਰ 4
ਮਾਇਆ ਮੋਹੇ ਦੇਵੀ ਸਭਿ ਦੇਵਾ ॥
माइआ मोहे देवी सभि देवा ॥
maa-i-aa mohay dayvee sabh dayvaa.
All the gods and goddesses are enticed by Maya.
ਮਃ 1 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 258, ਸਤਰ 14
ਭਰਮੇ ਸੁਰਿ ਨਰ ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਾ ॥
भरमे सुरि नर देवी देवा ॥
bharmay sur nar dayvee dayvaa.
The angelic beings, goddesses and gods are deluded by doubt.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Das hopes yuo will understand that this thing is proven ver there.

Guru mat did care for Hindus who deem such person as Vidhata and Gurmat does wants those Hindus to come to Gurmat.

and they will one day all be Sikh and you will not be able to prevent them either.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

> The Khalsa Fauj said:
> 
> 
> > ““Why is the chariter count wrong and why is the shund count messed up?””
> ...





OK you come to Das place and das will show you his birth certificate and if yuo still not belife das will get the DNA tested.

Anyway das's mother is Punjabi.And do you know that there are some call girls in Delhi who are from Punjab,We rounded them up.So should das use your critirya to paint all Punjabis as immoral.

Best would be when you come and when you see.


Das das told before,Yuo imgine a utopia of Punjabi culture,which is not on the grounds and then you say that Guru used to live like a Punjabi and that also who is in west.As India is bad and Wait Punjab is not India but is PAonta Sahib,Patna Sahib or Hajur sahib or Delhi,Bhghuar or Kurukshetra Punjab?

As per your views Guru had his childhood with evil people and at evil place.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh


> The Khalsa Fauj said:
> 
> 
> > “”Where has the sharam and dharam gone?””
> ...


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh


> The Khalsa Fauj said:
> 
> 
> > “”Where has the sharam and dharam gone?””
> ...




yuo take the meaning wrongly.Sarbloh over here is name of Akal and Sarbloh Granth Talks about Trai Mudra.
Sikh Rahit Maryada is the last part of Dasham Granth which is in Farsi and not the sgpc one,which also you do not follow as yuo oppse Troya Chairtar while sgpc Maryada has Chaupyee Sahib as part of Rahras Sahib and also Amrit Sanskar(Hamri Karo Hath De Rachha,(Charecter 405)),.

Listen,true Sikh does not has own spirit(which you call soul which is more refere to Akal in all).

Yuor panic button due to your own weakness due to not understand your God does not effect to the faithfull.People who are surrendered to Guru have nothing left of thier own.


Das has posted relpies to all of your points but so far could not see them over here.

Das will come back after 3.2.7 and look more from you about falsehood.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jan 24, 2007)

Gurfateh




> If someone promotes caste system and I promote nationality, then what is the big issue?


 
If some exposes Casrte system,then regialism is encuraged.Very nice,if some one cuts his hair ,other should cut his hair,what a great logic?

There are mnay Sikhs who are more Punjabi and jatts then being Sikh and what Gurmat to fit in thier agenda.If they are exposed then,person doing so is blamed to encouraged caste.Good.Under the cover of Sikhs do not have caste,Caste based guys bring thier pagan culture.



> It is still better than saying Guru Ji got fooled by prostitute or that Guru Ji told Sikhs to knock off turbans from heads of people and use as siropas and then sell the leftovers to make cash. If someone attacks Guru and then I try to convince and person but the person starts launching attacks on me


 

Over this issue evil people did not alloweed Sikhs to have nay thing.to tell them that Sikhs are the Kings,Sikhs showed them the power.No Guru in 16th Chrecter with prostitute.. 





> Ulta Chor Koatwal Ko Daantay! I didn't do personal insult like it was done to me.


 

So dear Kotwal wal Ji ,it is there that your ego was hurt as falsehood sperad by you is beng exposed.

But Kotwal is one who keeps tap on wrong things.Das has done the same and chor is scolding the das. 



> If someone places hand on your dad's turban, are you going to stay quiet?


 
so you think that Guru your Dad's repect can be challeged by anyone.Is Guru weak as per you and you are the one to fight for Guru,Guru dependent upon you?



> The person does direct attacks on me and says I go after prostitues and issues threats.
> I said biharis like ashutosh. Is it wrong to confront Ashutosh and company


 

Who started accusition of being working on the behest of RSS or GOI?And what did das told you?Speak what yuo can speak in public as in public due to fear of your own pro Khalistanis you will not be able to do anything.

It was suggestion but as your mind is fearfull you looked it as threatAkal created das to kill yuor false ideology.And das is on the job.and more offline knowdays.








> How about poet shyam, ram, soom, kal and others? Is there anything wrong with them or not? Are those poets Guru?


All are attribute of Akal.

​



> I didn't say there is anything wrong with Akaal Ustat or Zafarnama. If you thought that, then my mistake


do yuo know that there are verse in Akal Ustat which say Kahon Bed Bani Kahin Kok Ko Kahani Kahon Raja Kahon Rani Kahin Naar Ke Prahar Ho.Somewehre voice of scripture,where voice of erotica,smewhere King,somewhere queen somewhere (you Akal) are types of women.


do you know that Akal Ustat as addres Akal as trmpler of Demon Mahishsur?

Jaffernammah has Farsi Version of Triya Charitars as Chapters or Hiqayats.

Shuma ****ar Na Dani Hindi Chara Shuma Farsi Ro Fahmidi.

Understand what das worte in Farsi for you.Just like that keep one talking falsehood,did not you tell that All Akal Ustat is also not OK.Slowly after Triya Chairtar you will get get Sikhs off the Japu Sahib and let them be cowards and deserters like your self.
Yuom do your Job and Das is asinged job by Akal to keep a tab on you.

Frkra Na Bikoon.Bande Pus E Tan E.


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## badmash (Jan 28, 2007)

Wow! You folks are on a truly elevated level.
Why don't you guys start a Sikh missionary or philosophical society? I mean for real, I am not joking. Your command of the scripture and your interest, and cerebrocity on this is striking. Leaves me far, far behind. Seriously, if you have this much interest in Sikhi, you could do great service to the quom by taking it to a higher level, i.e. debates, publications, etc.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 30, 2007)

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/attac...-singh-screw-husband-and-take-his-brother.jpg

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/attac...ervations-over-two-topics-singh-400-shyam.jpg

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/attac...ns-over-two-topics-singh-donate-your-wife.jpg


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Jan 30, 2007)

Here are some more chariters to read and think.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Feb 5, 2007)

iek idn BWg, imqR qy leI .. (cirqR 325, 1281)
posq sihq, APIm cVHweI ..
bhu riq1 krI, n bIrj igrweI ..
AwT2 phr lig, kuAir bjweI4 .. 10.. 
sB inis 5 nwir, Bog jb pwXo ..
bhu Awsn6 kir, hrK7 bFwXo .. 11..
8dÍY Gitkw, jo Bog krq nr .. 
qw9 pr rIJq, nwir bhuq kr.. 
cwir10 phr, jo kyl kmwvY 12 .. 
so ikauN n iqRX ko13, icq curwvY .. 12.. 
rYin14 skl iqn, qruin15 bjweI16 .. 
Bwiq Bwiq ky, swQ hMFweI17 .. 
Awsn kry, qruin bhu hwrw .. 
cuMbnwid20, nK18 Gwq19 Apwrw .. 13 .. 
1. Kyh Kwx dI ikRXw 2. 24 GMitAw qk 3. kuAwrI kuVI 4. nwl Bog kIqw 5. rwq 6. kwm ikRXw dy Awsn 7. KuSI 8. do GVIAW (pOxy ku GMty dw smw) 9. Aijhy purK 10. 12 GMitAw qk 11. kwm kRIVw 12. kry 13. iesqRI 14. rwq 15. jvwn iesqRI 16. nwl Bog kIqw 17. Bog kIqw 18. nhuM, nwKUn 19. mwrny 20. cuMmx Awidk


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Feb 5, 2007)

*Anti-Sikhism*​*Charnjit Singh Bal*​At the advent of Guru Nanak Sahib in 1469 AD inter-Faith rivalry and hostility between the India’s two predominant religions, Hinduism and Islam, were rampant. Both religions claimed to be holier than the other. The Muslim Invaders called the Hindus Infidels and the Hindus called the Muslims Unholy. The sanctimonious clergies and holy quacks of both religions incited religious in-tolerance and hatred in their respective flocks towards the rival Faith. However both Muslims and Hindus indulged in pagan taboos, superstitions, barbaric human and animal sacrifices Idolatry, and blind faith rituals. The reformist Guru Nanak initiated a unique faith, Sikhism that primarily inspires spiritual enlightenment and prohibits futile ritualism and pagan religious practices.
To propagate his religion that blends Monotheism with Pragmatism, Humanism, Liberalism and Pluralism, he embarked upon four odysseys traveling on foot all over the Indian Sub-Continent and Middle East during fifteenth and sixteenth centuries. During his travels the Guru Nanak Sahib collected the Scriptures of medieval pious Hindu and Muslim venerated Sages who subscribed to his religious concepts. Guru Arjun Sahib compiled the scriptures of the preceding Sikh Gurus and Guru Nanak Sahib’s collections in the Guru Granth Sahib that exemplifies universality of the Sikhism’s illuminating Message. However the progressive Sikhism encountered regressions, dissentions, cultism sectarianism and factionalism from the Gurus’ own kith and kin, opportunistic Sikhs and cultist guru pretenders.
Guru Nanak Sahib’s elder son Sri Chand, discontented because the Guru Sahib selected Bhai Lehna Ji on merit for the august seat of Sikh Guru, founded his own un-Sikh ascetic sect. Motivated by jealousy for the same reason Guru Angud Sahib’s Son Daatu kicked Guru Amar Das Sahib and tried to set a parallel Guru-ship that eventually failed.
Guru Arjun Dev Sahib’s older brother Prithi Chand driven by envy swindled the tithe and other offerings meant for the Guru from the Sikh devotees.
Guru Har Rai Sahib’s elder son Ram Rai being deprived of the Guru-ship, for having cringed and distorted a verse of Gurbani to appease the Mogul Emperor Aurangzeb, started his own sect.
Dhir Mal, another pretender to the august seat of Sikh Guru instigated Massund Shinha to murder his uncle Guru Teg Bahadur Sahib. Shinha fired on Guru Sahib, wounded the Guru and looted Guru Sahib’s belongings including the original copy of Guru Granth Sahib.
The Massunds (Sikh Apostles) became arrogant, corrupt and started to embezzle tithes that were meant to preach and promote Sikhism. Guru Gobind Singh discontinued the practice of appointing Massunds.
Discerning Sagely the probable future abuse of the August seat of the Guru by the likes of Dattuji, Prithi Chand, Ram Rai and Dhirmal, Guru Gobind Singh decreed, "All Sikhs to regard the Granth Sahib as their perpetual (spiritual) Guru" which is consistent with the Sikhism’s fundamental tenet, "Word is Guru, Guru is word." The Guru Sahib mandated the collective Sikh Panth (Nation) to administer the temporal Authority of Sikhism democratically. Unfortunately for the Sikhism and Sikh Community, neither that decree nor the noble message of the Sikhism has deterred some opportunists from misusing and abusing the Sikh religion for the self-serving ambitions.
Radhaswami, Nirankari, Namdhari, Nanaksari cultist Gurus and Tuksaals (standardized study of Sikh Theology Institutions) have customized and commercialized the Sikh religion and set up their own Fiefdoms. Even some main stream Sikh leaders and preachers who are devoid of the essence of Sikhism’s progressive philosophy and illuminating Gurbani (Sikh scriptures) keep misleading the Sikh community back to the era of darkness from which the Gurus tried to extricate the Sikhs.
From mid eighteenth century till nineteen-twenties, a span of a century and a half, the Sikh Nation was engaged in Life and death struggle against the Muslim and Christian Colonialism, Imperialism and Jihads/Crusades. During these crucial times the Nirmlas, Mahants and Poojaris who had the control of the Sikh Gurdwaras (Temples) introduced Idol worship, ritualism, superstition and taboos into the into Sikhism. They embezzled donations and funds, held endowment lands titles in their names and lived a life of sin and perversion in the Gurdwaras.
The Hindu mythology oriented anonymous or pseudonymous (imposter) Sikh writers and Pundits cunningly adulterated Sikh History and Philosophy with mythology, wizardry and witchcraft. These writers, products of Hindu religious institutions, wrote the so-called Granths with ulterior motives to obliterate unique Sikh identity and assimilate progressive monotheistic Sikhism that promotes spiritual enlightenment into primitive Hinduism that fosters polytheism, idolatry, dogmatic ritualism, blind faith taboos, superstitions and prejudices.
One such Granth, ‘Gurblas Patshahi 6’, written by an anonymous writer, edited by the Sikh leader Joginder Singh Vedanti (one who practices Hindu Vedanta) and Dr. Amarjit Singh and sponsored by the thirteen so-called elite Sikh scholars and leaders was recently published by the S. G. P C. Due to the overwhelming criticism from the Sikh Intelligentsia and writers that Granth has been taken off the market but there are many more of that type in circulation. A so-called Dassam Granth, compilation of many scripts by anonymous writers but mischievously purported and propagated to be the Scriptures by Guru Gobind Singh Sahib contains fiction, mythology, wizardry and explicit eroticism.
The proponents and propagators of this dubious literature have succeeded to a large extent in their sinister plot in beguiling Sikh majority and contaminating the Sikh History and quintessential philosophy with mythology, dogmatism, polytheism, wizardry witchcraft, eroticism, etc. Whereas the majority of innocent Sikh’s inability to grasp the Sikhism’s essential message is a simple failure on their part, the role of the numerous cultist Guru pretenders, half literate preachers, self-serving main stream Sikh leaders which propagate such blasphemous literature as integral part of Sikh history and philosophy is much more detrimental.
Consequently the practice of Sikhism, a pragmatic faith of knowledge is replete with blind faith, prejudices, dogmatic rituals, Idolatry, pagan taboos and superstitions. Sikh religious services and ceremonies are performed at the Sikh Gurdwaras (temples) at a price commensurate with the Sikh’s perceptual devotion and ability to pay to invoke God’s benedictions and Guru’s blessings. The international Sikh community has been fragmented into numerous sects, cults and antagonistic factions.
The genuine Sikh Scholars have refuted with convincing arguments the compatibility of the mythical, wizardly and erotic contents of these Granths’ with the illuminating philosophy of the Guru Granth Sahib’s quintessential Gurbani. They have also revealed that the anonymous, pseudonym and quasi-Sikh writers wrote these so-called Granths with ulterior motives. But instead of acclaiming and honoring them, the half literate opportunistic Sikh Leaders who have had strangle-hold on Sikh Nation, have criticized, bullied and ostracized them and banned their books.
One of the most prominent Sikh Scholars ever Bhai Kahn Singh writes, "the earlier and contemporary writers of our Faith have written numerous books on (Sikh) history, code and conventions according to their beliefs and mental tendencies. These books are both beneficial and harmful i.e. the subject matter compatible with essential message of Sikh Gurus’ edification is beneficial otherwise it is harmful."
"The in-depth study of these Granths gives the impression that the poets of our Faith have blundered in copying the authors of religious books of other Faiths. They have bundled and dyed the social, political and religious principles in the religious color. It is all the more saddening that there are very few analytical minded Sikh scholars seeking the truth. In fact the opponents, those who call the rational minded writers and speakers agnostics, are in majority."
Rattan Singh Jaggi who did an in-depth review of the Dassam Granth writes, "The subject matter in the Chritro Pakhyan is so erotic and its language is so sexually explicit that in some places it surpasses even the (Hindu) Koke Shastra or Kama Shastra (Erotica Manual)"
Prof. Harinder Singh Mehboob writes, "The devious activity of contaminating the Granths and attributing the heretical writings to the Sikh Gurus has often been perpetrated repeatedly. This insidious activity has been pursued at the instigation of the mischievous and jealous people (inimical to Sikhism)."
Prominent Sikh academician Pr. Harbhajan Singh in his Punjabi book ‘Selected Articles on Dassam Granth’ writes, "In their wild flights of fancy both authors, (Bhai Santokh Singh of Suraj Prakash and the dubious writer of Dassam Granth’s Bachitir Natak) left no deficiency in fabricating blatant Gossips and mythical Fantasies."
*Prof. Gurmukh Singh’s Ex-communication*
The ex-communication of a true Sikh, Prof. Gurmukh Singh is an epitome (prime example) of abuse of illicit power by a bunch of self-serving religious leaders. At the time of his ex-communication Prof. Gurmukh Singh, one of pioneer founders of the reformist Sikh movement Singh Sabha, was actively pursuing his goal to establish the first Khalsa College at Amritsar. The band of pretenders to the Sikh spiritual and temporal Authority not only ex-communicated Prof. Gurmukh Singh but also incited the Sikh community not to render him financial help to carry out his missionary work and the noble cause of founding the Khalsa College.
In 1883 Akal Takht head Granthi Bedi Khem Singh proclaimed himself as the Sikh Guru. Aided and abetted by his cohorts, Rajah Bikram Singh of Fridkote, Mahants , Pujaris and other Guru pretenders, he ex-communicated a genuine Sikh scholar and missionary Prof. Gurmukh Singh who criticized him for the un-Sikh act in 1887. They harassed and hounded Giani Dit Singh who dared to condemn their anti-Sikhism activity and canvass support for Prof. Gurmukh Singh to an early grave.
The un-Sikh activities of Khem Singh Bedi and his cohorts are indicative of the sly religious leaders’ ability to manipulate repressive proceedings against a devout religious person. Some of the unjust accusations leveled against Prof. Gurmukh Singh who dedicated his life to the noble causes of reforming the Sikhism’s management and preaching system and eradication of wide spread illiteracy among the community were:-
1) He does not revere the Sikh Gurus’ descents, (pretenders to Sikh Guru-ship).
2) Twenty pictures of Avtars (Hindu Mythical god incarnates), were burned during a convention of Lahore Singh Sabha (Forum) to refute their existence.
3) A Hindu convert to Islam was baptized as a Singh by the Lahore Singh Sabha.
4) In an article published in the Khalsa Newspaper he wrote, "Worship of weapons in the Sikh Gurdwaras is copy of Hindu ritual that is against Guru’s edification."
To an intelligent student of Sikh theology it is clear the ex-communication of Prof. Gurmukh Singh was a case of blatant abuse of illicit spiritual and temporal authority and the heretics punishing the pious Sikh. Prof. Manjit Singh revoked this dictatorial edict in 1995 and acclaimed Prof. Gurmukh Singh as a true Sikh.
*Giani Bhag Singh’s ex-communication*
The ex-communication of Giani Bhag Singh exemplifies how the conniving religious leaders wield the authority to destroy those who dare to dissent. Giani Bhag Singh’s Book ‘Dassam Granth Nirnay’ (critique) was published in 1976. The book publication caused great deal of controversy amongst the Sikh community. During this period of controversy Giani Bhag Singh and Giani Sant Singh Muskeen were in Indore on lecture tours. As usual at one place when asked Muskeen told congregation that Akhand Path is compatible with the Guru’s edification while at another he said it is not. And when Giani Bhag Singh mentioned about these contradictions Muskeen was naturally resentful.
During his lectures at Rajauri Gardens’ Gurudwara, Delhi, Muskeen quoted some verses from the Dassam Granth’s spurious scriptures. Some young Sikhs argued with Muskeen and told him that the verses he had quoted were not that of Guru Gobind Singh Sahib. Although the young Sikhs were absolutely right, Muskeen adamantly refused to concede that he was wrong. Next day they had some scripts from Dassam Granth printed and asked Muskeen to preach the scripts to the Sikh congregation. Muskeen refused and accused Giani Bhag Singh of sending the thugs (young Sikhs) to insult him.
Muskeen approached his friend Golden Temple Head Granthi, Giani Chet Singh. Both Muskeen and Chet Singh instigated Akal Takht Jathedar Giani Sadhu Singh Bhaura (from my village Bhaura) to issue Hokum-nama (edict) to ex-communicate Giani Bhag Singh. However in view of the controversy amongst Sikh community the S. G. P. C. decided to call an ad-hoc advisory committee meeting that was chaired by Giani Sadhu Singh. When at this meeting the research Sikh Historian Shamsher Singh Ashoke who had also written a critical review on Dassam Granth tried to express his views, he was shouted down by the prejudiced members.
When Pr. Harbhajan Singh asked all the 15 members at the meeting, if anyone had studied the Dassam Granth analytically, their silence conveyed the negative reply. And he asked them, (1) if the Dassam Granth’s authenticity controversy wasn’t as old as the Granth itself? (2) Didn’t the Akal Takht Jathedar and Granthi Singh Sahiban reply in June 1973 through Assistant Sec. S. Gurbakhsh Singh to Santokh of Chandigarh that Chritro Pakhyan is not Guru Gobind Singh’s work? (3) Aren’t we, the high-ranking Sikh personalities, too eager to condemn a pious person without his representation?
Note:- In a reply No. 36672 dated 3rd August 1973 to S Santokh Singh (Chandigarh) the religious preaching sub-Committee of S. G. P .C. wrote, "In regard to your inquiry of 6th July 1973 the views of Singh Sahiban of Derbar Sahib and Akal Takht Jathedar are being sent to you. "Chritro Pakhyan in the Dassam Granth is not Guru Gobind Singh’s Scriptures. These are copies of the primitive Hindu mythical tales." Signed, Gurbakhsh Singh, Assistant Secretary, Religious Preaching Committee, Shrimoni G. P. Committee, Amritsar.
Pr. Harbhajan Singh’s wisdom prevailed in drafting and passing two resolutions unanimously, (1) Giani Bhag Singh should have presented his side of the case in detail to the Panth instead of two-line comment. (2) Since with time the issue is getting serious, this committee humbly requests the S. G .P. C. to institute a sub-committee of prominent Sikh Scholars to authenticate the Dassam Granth’s scripts that are compatible with the Guru Granth Sahib’s philosophy and Guru’s Ideals. No punishment was considered appropriate for Giani Bhag Singh.
Despite these unanimous consensus that were reached at the meeting Giani Bhag Singh was ex-communicated on 5th July 1977 in a mystifying manner. The same bunch of Singh-Sahiban (Giani Bhaura, Giani Chet Singh and Giani Kirpal Singh) who said that Chritro Pakhyan wasn’t Guru Gobind Singh’s Work and were also star participants at the meeting to adjudge Giani Bhag Singh, ex-communicated him.
The concerned Sikh Scholars Pr. Harbhajan Singh, Giani Surjit Singh, Bhai Milap Singh and Amar Singh conferred with each other to have the edict issue redressed. Bhai Amar Singh Aligarh, who knew Jathedar Bhaura when he was a Granthi, convinced him of his folly. Jathedar Bhaura agreed to rescind the edict. Bhai Amar Singh, Giani Surjit Singh and S. Milap Singh were to accompany Giani Bhag Singh to Akal Takht to have the edict rescinded.
Muskeen who came to know about this visit, cunningly took Giani Bhag Singh to Akal Takht himself at his own expense. Jathedar Bhaura had a paper with a text, "Giani Bhag Singh has apologized regarding Ardas (Sikh Litany) and Chaupie (a lyrical supplication from Dassam Granth)" typed in advance. When it was given to old and feeble Giani Bhag Singh to sign, he accidentally dropped his reading glasses. Both Bhaura and Muskeen said, leave the glasses; don’t you trust us? They practically tricked Giani Bhag Singh into signing the apology that he deeply regretted. He told Giani Surjit Singh with tears in his eyes that Muskeen had tricked him.
Jathedar Aroor Singh declared Kamagata Maru returnees from Canada in 1915 as un-Sikhs at the behest of the British Government of India; and awarded Gen. Dyre who massacred hundreds of Sikhs, Hindus and Muslims on 1919 Vaisakhi day in the Jallianwala Baug, with a Saropa (the Sikh scarf of honour).
During the reign of Maharaja Ranjit Singh Sikhism was sacrificed at the altar of Secularism. Although he built many Sikh Gurdwaras and allotted endowed lands to these Gurdwaras, no real attempts were made to counter the corruptive influences of the sly Brahmins, impostor Sikh Gurus, zealous Hindu and Muslim clerics and holy quacks. The Maharaja’s folly to trust and appoint the Hindu Dogra brothers Dhyan Singh and Gulaub Singh and brothers Teja Singh and Lall Singh from U. P. to the elite posts proved to be fatal for the Sikh Raj. Soon after the Maharaja’s death in 1839, treachery and intrigues of these traitors enabled the British to occupy Punjab. As usual the ‘Holier than Thou’ Christian Missionaries who without fail followed the Christian Conquistadors (Conquerors), spread their proselytizing (conversionary) tentacles in Punjab and built the Missionary Network.
The Muslim and the Christian imperialists made two pronged intrusions into Sikhism. On one hand they un-leashed brute power of imperialism especially the Muslims who butchered children in front of the mothers to force conversion to Islam. On the other hand they enticed potential converts with endowment lands and elite posts. Then there were the Christian Missionaries and Muslim Quazis, and holy men/quacks to convert the weaklings, impoverished and the naïve.
Note:- Although hunted and massacred on the genocidal scale, the eighteenth and nineteenth Century Sikhs resisted the Muslim and Christian onslaughts valiantly.
However the Hindus deprived of political powers for nearly a thousand years used insidious means to either obliterate the progressive Sikhism’s unique identity and swallow it into Hinduism or proclaim it as a sect of Hinduism. With the downfall of the ruling Muslims who called the Hindus as Kaffirs (Pagans) and considered converting them to Islam as a benevolent act, the ultra Hindu fundamentalists were emboldened. Whereas in the past they targeted Sikhism covertly, now started to malign the Sikh Gurus and Sikhism openly.
Acting on the Hindu cultist Vivaka Nanda’s devious advice, "If you want to root out a religion, cast doubts about the historical facts of its founders", Daya Nand the founder of radical Arya Samaj (Aryan Social Order) launched vicious attacks on the Sikh Gurus and Sikhism. He denigrated Guru Nanak Sahib with remarks, "Ideals of Nanak Ji were noble but he was illiterate; why would he otherwise write Sanskrit word nirbhya as nirbhow? Since he (Guru Nanak Ji) had some ego, he must have resorted to some deceit for the sake of his conceit."
That Daya Nand was an ignorant Charlatan is evident from the fact that Guru Nanak Sahib wrote, preached and sang his Scriptural compositions in the colloquial language of the people of Punjab, Punjabi that was in use before Guru Nanak’s time. Venerated Muslim Sage Sheik Freed who lived couple centuries (1173-1266 AD) before Guru Nanak wrote Scriptures in Punjabi. Guru Nanak Sahib collected and Guru Arjan Sahib compiled these Scriptures in the Guru Granth Sahib.
Like all impostors Daya Nand was a liar, duplicitous and cunning. Giani Dit Singh, his contemporary writes, "Once during his discourse at Brahm Smaj Temple he stated that the Sun orbits around the Earth and supported his statement with quotes from the Vedas. However later at the residence when a companion Saien Das told him that since today’s advanced Astronomy confirms that the Earth orbits around the Sun, people will not think highly of Vedas. Daya Nand said that he should have been told me earlier; now I will refute the statement tomorrow.
Next day he contradicted his own statement by saying, "Yesterday when I said that the Sun orbits around the Earth, that is the assertion of the adversaries. That is how they interpret the concepts of Vedas. Actually these concepts confirm that the Sun doesn’t orbit around the earth, but the Earth orbits around the Sun."
The Rashtrya Svayam Savek Sang (R. S. S.), a radical Hindu fundamentalist organization sprouted eight decades ago. Its strategy is more insidious. To obliterate the unique Sikh identity and proclaim Sikhism as a sect of Hinduism, R .S. S. is promoting and preaching the so-called Granths written by dubious Scholars. The subject matter of these Granths is contaminated with Hindu mythology, polytheism, wizardry Idolatry, blind faith ritualism, eroticism, etc. that are totally contrary to the Monotheistic, pragmatic and spiritually illuminating doctrines of the Guru Granth Sahib’s quintessential Gurbani.
In a clandestine move the Hindu R. S. S. has spawned an ill-conceived organization called Rashtrya Sikh Sangat that has same initials as the promiscuous mother organization to beguile the gullible Sikhs and non-Sikhs. The discerning Sikhs Scholars and Intelligentsia contend that the cagey Hindu R. S. S. has created Rashtrya Sikh Sangat and filled its ranks with the mercenary Hindus and naïve Sikhs to boost its efforts to propagate distorted facts from Sikh History and misinterpretations of the selected verses from the Guru Granth Sahib’s Gurbani.
Some misguided or naive Sikhs, zealous Hindus and mercenaries are helping R. S. S in its deviant designs. Because the concerned Sikh Scholars and intelligentsia challenge the deceitful agenda of the R. S. S., a Sikh lawyer Gurcharanjit Singh Lamba characterizes the call of Institute of Sikh Studies to reject the Dassam Granth, "irrational, motivated and sacrilege." And a self-beatified Sikh Saint (also known as Serkari Saadh) Virsa Singh of Delhi is distributing translations of Dassam Granth.
The R. S. S. president Mr. Sudershan claims, "The Sikhs were created to defend Hindu Faith from the tyranny of the Mogul Rulers; and the two Hundred and fifty thousand Sikhs killed during the (1717-1799 AD) extreme Mogul tyranny were originally Hindus who made supreme sacrifices to defend the Hindu Faith."
One wonders why didn’t these original Hindus make supreme sacrifices to defend Hinduism when the tyrannical Muslim Rulers forcibly converted enormous number of Hindus to Islam? And why didn’t the original Hindus make supreme sacrifices when Mohamed Bin-Kasam, who was by the Khalifa of Baghdad, conquered India’s principality of Sindh in the eighth century with just 700 hundred men?
Mehmood Gaznavi advanced all the way to Hinduism’s most sacred shrine Som Nath, smashed the Idols, looted gold doors with gold inlay and took away Hindu women as concubines and slaves?
If the Hindus were capable of making supreme sacrifices why was India slave to the Muslim invaders for seven centuries until the three hundred year old Sikh panth dealt fatal blows to the tyrannical Mogul Rule in the late seventeen and early eighteen centuries when Himalayan Hindu Principalities were banding with the Moguls. The Sikhs that constitute two percent of the total population of India’s predominantly Hindu society made eighty percent of the sacrifices to oust the British imperialists that ruled India for two centuries and Sikh Homeland, Punjab, for one century
Only an ignorant or insidious can proclaim the Sikhs, who came from all castes and creeds to adopt Sikhism by choice, original Hindus. A man of Mr. Sudershan’s credentials can be called ignorant.
The origin of Sikhism was motivated by the noble concepts of universal religious freedom and socio-cultural Liberalism. Ever since its inception the Sikhism has espoused and made supreme sacrifices for these noble causes The authentic Sikh History is witness to the valiant acts of defiance of the Sikh Gurus, Muslim and Hindu holy Sages (co-authors of Guru Granth Sahib) and numerous Sikh Martyrs for these noble causes. Conversely the Sikhism would have defended the Muslims’ right to religious freedom under tyrannical Hindu Rulers.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Feb 5, 2007)

*cirqRo pKXwn dSmyS bwxI nhI​isMG swihwbwn dw Pqvw: cUMik pMQ iv`c swry "dsm gRMQ" nUM gurU jI dI ikRq mMnx Aqy n mMnx vwly, do vIcwrW dy lok hn. ies leI smyN smyN AYsy SMky SRo: gu: pRbMDk kmytI,AMimRqsr, AQvw aus vloN in~Xq Dwrimk slwhkwr kmytI pws swmwDwn leI AwauNdy rihMdy hn. iek vwr imqI 6[7[73 nUM cMfIgV "rwj krygw Kwlsw" Aqy "cirqRo pKXwn" vwry p`uC pu`jI. jQydwr sRI Akwl qKq swihb Aqy sRI drbwr swihb, sRI AMimRqsr dy hYf gRMQI swihbwn ny iehnW pu`CW dw jo au~qr id`qw, aus dI nkl hyTW hwjr hY:-
​ÃÄvwihhurU jI kI Pqh]
dPqr-SRomxI gurdAwrw pRbMDk kmytI, qyjw isMG smuMdrI hwl, sRI AMimRqsr nM: 36672 3/4-8-73,
sR: sMqoK isMG
kwtyj, loAr mwl, kswaulI ( ihR )
pRXojn: Dwrimk puC sbMDI
sRI mwn jI,
Awp jI dI p`qrkw imqI 6-7-73 dy sbMD ivc isMG swihbwn, sRI drbwr swihb Aqy jQydwr swihb sRI Akwl qKq swihb, sRI AMimRqsr jI dI rwey hyT ilKy Anuswr Awp jI nUM ByjI jWdI hY:-
1[ "rwj krygw Kwlsw" jo sRI Akwl qKq swihb Aqy hor gurduAwirAW iv`c piVHAw jWdw hY, ieh gurmiq dy AnukUl hY, ikauNik dohry pVHny pMQk PYslw hY. ies PYsly qy SMkw nhIN krnI cwhIdI.
2[ "cirqRo pKXwn" jo dsm gRMQ iv`c hn, ieh "dSmyS bwxI" nhIN. ieh purwqn ihMdU imiQhwsk swKISW dw auqwrw hY.
SuB icMqk,
shI-mIq sk`qr
( gurbKS isMG )
Drm pRcwr kmytI, SRomxI gurduAwrw pRbMDk kmytI sRI AMimRqsr.
*


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Feb 6, 2007)

E)Presently Published Dasam Granth  which came in print since 1902 based on Sodhak Committee Report (1895-1897)after looking into 32 dasam granth Birs.

Credentials of various members of this committee. (They were not scholars but British cronies selected by Gurmat Granth Pracharak Sabha controlled by Vihiria Faction amrtsar singh sabha group.They were not selcted by SIKH PANTH because  Lahore Singh Sabha With 118 were opposed to it and never recognised this Granth.EVEN SRM and 1925 Gurudwara act did not accpt this Granth.



•        Members of Sodhak Committee 
•          Mana Singh Hakim, known for correct recitation 
•         Bhai Narain Singh, Teacher 
•         Bhai Thakar Singh, Clerk Municipal Committee 
•         Bhai Hajura Singh, Secretary Lakar Mandi (wood market)
•          Dharam Singh, Famous for Chhabil Sewa (providing sweet water)
•          Bhai Sant Singh, Gurmukhi Teacher
•          Bhai Darbara Singh with education of Giani
•          Jaidial Singh, Middle pass 
•          Gurdial Singh, Gurmukh Person 
•          Kishan Singh Ji, Rice Dealer 
•          Naran Singh, Thakur Singh Rice Dealer, 
Makhan Singh Sweet Maker 

By Jasbir Singh Mann


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Feb 9, 2007)

http://www.singhsabhacanada.com/Video/Misc/DasamGranth/Part1.wmv

http://www.singhsabhacanada.com/Video/Misc/DasamGranth/Part2.wmv


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh

Das is sory for absensec as das was and still in porcces of clearing M Phil computer sinces.


so das starts

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/attac...-singh-screw-husband-and-take-his-brother.jpg

Charecter 166.

A Hindu upper caste ki8ng of Gujrat.Who tneds to speak to much of faith is befooled by the wife and her paramour.Paramour acts as son and but is in real paramour.

Further shame unto them is by the fact the king belives in yogis becoming Hyeayna.

It is for us to understand the upper castes stogees of Mughals and oppresers of outacstes hindus. and librate outcastres by our faith.

In Punjabi language it is there that attempt to defame Guru,while Guru is upto exposes suppresing rulers.
Charecter 167,

hindu King of Bareli of UP(near Jungles of Bans) killed by cruopt wife and self brother.Innner weakness of the rulers and we need to overcome them. whats wrong here?


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/attac...ervations-over-two-topics-singh-400-shyam.jpg
Ang 718


ਸੰਤਾਂ ਮਧੇ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਆਛੈ ਗੋਕਲ ਮਧੇ ਸਿਆਮ ਗੋ ॥ 
संतां मधे गोबिंदु आछै गोकल मधे सिआम गो ॥ 
Sanṯāŉ maḏẖė gobinḏ ācẖẖai gokal maḏẖė si&shy;ām go. 
The Lord of the Universe, Govind, is within His Saints; Krishna, Shyaam, is in Gokal. 

ਨਾਮੇ ਮਧੇ ਰਾਮੁ ਆਛੈ ਰਾਮ ਸਿਆਮ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਗੋ ॥੪॥੩॥ 
नामे मधे रामु आछै राम सिआम गोबिंद गो ॥४॥३॥ 
Nāmė maḏẖė rām ācẖẖai rām si&shy;ām gobinḏ go. ||4||3|| 
The Lord, Raam, is in Naam Dayv. So here they are: Raam, Shyaam, Govind. ||4||3|| 


Brother Charecter 400

Talkis about illict realtionship between princess and Teli(mony lender boy).In  indian rulers and monylenders are the wrost oppressor.

In thier faimly with parents are fooled by princess.she makes at virutal  trick by plan(mantra) that people precives here dying after klilling a Pandit.But she elopes.

Syam is name of God who writes from with in Guru.

Guru did not had ego or self brain as you and i have that brain was universal brain of the brain of God.Unlimited unlike us.


ਪੰਨਾ 485, ਸਤਰ 2
ਸਭੁ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਹੈ ਸਭੁ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਹੈ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਬਿਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਕੋਈ ॥
सभु गोबिंदु है सभु गोबिंदु है गोबिंद बिनु नही कोई ॥
Sabẖ gobinḏ hai sabẖ gobinḏ hai gobinḏ bin nahī ko&shy;ī.
God is everything, God is everything. Without God, there is nothing at all.
ਭਗਤ ਨਾਮਦੇਵ ਜੀ   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

Das hopes at least know yourself have understod what ageant of RSS das trys to convey.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/hard-...wrong-doubts-about-bani-onto-6.html#post50834

Charecter 339

Here a king is befooled by queens who dresses up like Shiava and let foolish king deem her as shiva and do as he(she) wants.

This is not a other then telling us how shiva worshippers are fool.

Chreacter 340.

Here a lady befools a person by pumping him as for great donater.While getting doantion she takes her mony leaves him along.that person is deemed as jarh.Bhali burhi Jarh Kachho na Chini..9..

So that person is beheld as poor and nothing else.so no encouragement.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh
Here are some more chariters to read and think
--------
Chreacter 14 and 15 and what does it  means.

At start of 15th Chreacter it is told that by now 14th story is been told why? as First Chreacter is of Chandi and not the dialogue between King and Minister.More study is needed over here.
Chrecter. 14 tels of immoral queen befooling men.We draw the thing that we get mnay dimensions of looses with such lady as there also she is befooling the paramour.(along side the husband).

Next in 15th charecter

asdas told before also.It has been told that Sati lady(who burns with the husband) may not be sati(truthfull).In Chreactero fPngal Devi again Satism is opposed.

In 16th again das wrote this beofre also.Bank of Satiluj does not make place as Ananadpur Sahib.

when Guru write a lot about crupt pagan socity it is also telling us to purfy the potemtial converts lest they bring thier pagan things.

Many sants as uit has been told above are of such type only.
Chreacter 48
Talks about foolishness of Jehangeer,who is in fact main culprit for Shahhedi of Fifth Master.

Jodhbai saves him but and maid of Nurjahan makes him afraid that same lady who kills lion can kill King also.So is such king unable to defend self from lion and afraid of queen is at all worthy to rule.?
Charecter 49 of the Barber Lady(as her caste is given so she is yet to be Sikh or Khalsa).Barber who cuts hairs and there is another Chreacyter anti to them.

Here a person or husband of  her acts like parasite in the place of Guru and lies idle.In such situation immoral wife encourges him to be like that.
Chreacter 50

Over here and King acts like a puppet in hand of Queen,who finds the paramour.Her maids befoolthat king.bout such fools we have last two couplets.

That king who acts as showy(Glitering) and does have faith in wife.On tanging with other man that wife destrorys him..12..Never give your secret(mind) but make all as your own.Then only al are won and state is run getting pleasure..13..1..

Das  can only say that if some one has some expirance in offical secrets or secret services,they may understand that what we do toady was said tby Guru much before.

Lets wait for Sikh rule and then we see such things successful.
Chreacter 388.

Here it has been told that immoral queen kills foolish king and his yogi Gurus. and makes a stroy of supestion and miralce about thier salvaged and later replaces her paramour and same king with young body.

It is anti to mrialce showing etc..


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## kds1980 (Jul 31, 2007)

Welcome back vijaydeep singh ji.One of the most knowledgable person of spn.I am very happy to see you back on this site.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> iek idn BWg, imqR qy leI .. (cirqR 325, 1281)
> posq sihq, APIm cVHweI ..
> bhu riq1 krI, n bIrj igrweI ..
> AwT2 phr lig, kuAir bjweI4 .. 10..
> ...


 

Chreacter 325

There has been reason for explictdefiantioan over here.

There is chrecter of of princess who before marrige sleeps whith lover and then she again marries him.Then after his vigur is finshed she has many paramours,With one Virah rai she does commit adultary as discribed abouve..

while they were busy Birahnatt her husband comes and and she hangs him till dath.Then she tells all kings and subject that in name of Shiva and Veda and her Sati(Truthfull ness) she will bring her husband back to life.

She locks here inside and again indulges in immoral acts and foolish subjects and king of Shiva wiorship thinks that she is worshipping shiva.

She burys here husband and brings the paramour as same husband blessed by Shiva with youth.

Simple case of truth behinds the blessing by Shiva etc.

Presently many Dera dars may have such things within them.

usage of drugs take person more for lust.It is told in obejctive way and we are not encourgaed but are told truth about our rivals and no such convert is welomce in us.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh


> *Anti-Sikhism*​
> 
> *Charnjit Singh Bal*​​


 

*at a time person can have one father.*​ 


*So if das writes his name as vijaydeep Singh virk then it may means that realtionship both with Guru Gobind Singh and Jathera Virk Vardhan.*​ 


*As per S. Rawail Singh himslef and ex jat like das jattism is great danger.*​ 


*Better to have name Charnjeet Bal or Charnjeet Singh.*​ 


*List of jatts anti to panth.*​ 



*Handaliyas,Akal das nirnajani,Sahib rai Sandhu,Karma Chhina,Rama Randhwaa.*​ 


*Presently Radhswamis of Beas,Narender Grewal,Ram Raheem of Sirsa etc.*​ 


*good for Panth have been ex jaats.*​ 


*Like*

*Bhai Bala(Ex Sandhu),Baba Budha(Ex Randhawa).Bhai Dharam Singh(Ex Jawanda)Nwab Kapur Singh and Kirora Singh(ex virk like das), And Bhai Randheer Singh(ex Basant Singh grewal) and Sant Ji (Ex Berar).*​





Gurfateh



> At the advent of Guru Nanak Sahib in 1469 AD inter-Faith rivalry and hostility between the India’s two predominant religions, Hinduism and Islam, were rampant. Both religions claimed to be holier than the other. The Muslim Invaders called the Hindus Infidels and the Hindus called the Muslims Unholy. The sanctimonious clergies and holy quacks of both religions incited religious in-tolerance and hatred in their respective flocks towards the rival Faith. However both Muslims and Hindus indulged in pagan taboos, superstitions, barbaric human and animal sacrifices Idolatry, and blind faith rituals


There has been no faith like Hinduism.Better is to call pagan indians and Islam

coming to pagan things some mann gotra jatt claim to be from jattas or locks of shiva so they kept uncut hair.

Some intellectual can tommrow claim pagan things in faith as oppose to keeping uncut hairs.

Gurfateh


> . The reformist Guru Nanak initiated a unique faith, Sikhism that primarily inspires spiritual enlightenment and prohibits futile ritualism and pagan religious practices.To propagate his religion that blends Monotheism with Pragmatism, Humanism, Liberalism and Pluralism, he embarked upon four odysseys traveling on foot all over the Indian Sub-Continent and Middle East during fifteenth and sixteenth centuries. During his travels the Guru Nanak Sahib collected the Scriptures of medieval pious Hindu and Muslim venerated Sages who subscribed to his religious concepts. Guru Arjun Sahib compiled the scriptures of the preceding Sikh Gurus and Guru Nanak Sahib’s collections in the Guru Granth Sahib that exemplifies universality of the Sikhism’s illuminating Message. However the progressive Sikhism encountered regressions, dissentions, cultism sectarianism and factionalism from the Gurus’ own kith and kin, opportunistic Sikhs and cultist guru pretenders.


 
main probelm is coming of new converts with pagan influence.what you call ritualism say like 5keys or 5 tabbos in us make us desicplined to live the life practically.


> Guru Nanak Sahib’s elder son Sri Chand, discontented because the Guru Sahib selected Bhai Lehna Ji on merit for the august seat of Sikh Guru, founded his own un-Sikh ascetic sect. Motivated by jealousy for the same reason Guru Angud Sahib’s Son Daatu kicked Guru Amar Das Sahib and tried to set a parallel Guru-ship that eventually failed.Guru Arjun Dev Sahib’s older brother Prithi Chand driven by envy swindled the tithe and other offerings meant for the Guru from the Sikh devotees.Guru Har Rai Sahib’s elder son Ram Rai being deprived of the Guru-ship, for having cringed and distorted a verse of Gurbani to appease the Mogul Emperor Aurangzeb, started his own sect.Dhir Mal, another pretender to the august seat of Sikh Guru instigated Massund Shinha to murder his uncle Guru Teg Bahadur Sahib. Shinha fired on Guru Sahib, wounded the Guru and looted Guru Sahib’s belongings including the original copy of Guru Granth Sahib.The Massunds (Sikh Apostles) became arrogant, corrupt and started to embezzle tithes that were meant to preach and promote Sikhism. Guru Gobind Singh discontinued the practice of appointing Massunds.


 
We have been since pastsuccesfully overcoming such attempts against us by foolproof arrangement by Guru.



Gurfateh



> Discerning Sagely the probable future abuse of the August seat of the Guru by the likes of Dattuji, Prithi Chand, Ram Rai and Dhirmal, Guru Gobind Singh decreed, "All Sikhs to regard the Granth Sahib as their perpetual (spiritual) Guru" which is consistent with the Sikhism’s fundamental tenet, "Word is Guru, Guru is word." The Guru Sahib mandated the collective Sikh Panth (Nation) to administer the temporal Authority of Sikhism democratically. Unfortunately for the Sikhism and Sikh Community, neither that decree nor the noble message of the Sikhism has deterred some opportunists from misusing and abusing


 

Calling the faith as nation is like understanding ourself like that of Hindus who are nation based faith.Our faith is universal and big thing which is forgottan over here is the fact that the Guruship was already given to the Panth when Tenth Master took baptism from the Sikhs.


ਪੰਨਾ 444, ਸਤਰ 8
ਗੁਰੂ ਸਿਖੁ ਸਿਖੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਹੈ ਏਕੋ ਗੁਰ ਉਪਦੇਸੁ ਚਲਾਏ ॥
गुरू सिखु सिखु गुरू है एको गुर उपदेसु चलाए ॥
Gurū sikẖ sikẖ gurū hai ėko gur upḏės cẖalā&shy;ė.
The Guru's Sikh, and the Sikh's Guru, are one and the same; both spread the Guru's Teachings.
ਮਃ 4 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

other proofs are Gurbani by Bhai Mardana,Baba Sunder,Satta Ji and Balwand Ji and Bhatts Sahibs.All made contribution vide bani.They wre one with Guru.

Gurfateh



> the Sikh religion for the self-serving ambitions.Radhaswami, Nirankari, Namdhari, Nanaksari cultist Gurus and Tuksaals (standardized study of Sikh Theology Institutions) have customized and commercialized the Sikh religion and set up their own Fiefdoms. Even some main stream Sikh leaders and preachers who are devoid of the essence of Sikhism’s progressive philosophy and illuminating Gurbani (Sikh scriptures) keep misleading the Sikh community back to the era of darkness from which the Gurus tried to extricate the Sikhs.


 
why is not Panch Khalsa Diwan not mentioned here?

And why Maan singh Nirankaris then keeps on putting his noon sense things in spokesman?

Gurfateh


> From mid eighteenth century till nineteen-twenties, a span of a century and a half, the Sikh Nation was engaged in Life and death struggle against the Muslim and Christian Colonialism, Imperialism and Jihads/Crusades. During these crucial times the Nirmlas, Mahants and Poojaris who had the control of the Sikh Gurdwaras (Temples) introduced Idol worship, ritualism, superstition and taboos into the into Sikhism. They embezzled donations and funds, held endowment lands titles in their names and lived a life of sin and perversion in the Gurdwaras.The Hindu mythology oriented anonymous or pseudonymous (imposter) Sikh writers and Pundits cunningly adulterated Sikh History and Philosophy with mythology, wizardry and witchcraft. These writers, products of Hindu religious institutions, wrote the so-called Granths with ulterior motives to obliterate unique Sikh identity and assimilate progressive monotheistic Sikhism that promotes spiritual enlightenment into primitive Hinduism that fosters polytheism, idolatry, dogmatic ritualism, blind faith taboos, superstitions and prejudices


 
Here it appears that writer wants to say that Guru was unable to create such a community of the people,who were unable to fend for themselves once guru went to Sachkhand or Guru's making Guru Granth Sahib as eteranl Guru did not work and Gurus foolproof arrangements to keep faith intact were a failure.

Panth waited that those guys who were sultanis during Muslim periods and took Sikh attire during Sikh rule and then created a protestant form to appease britishers.nice thing.

Gurfateh




> One such Granth, ‘Gurblas Patshahi 6’, written by an anonymous writer, edited by the Sikh leader Joginder Singh Vedanti (one who practices Hindu Vedanta) and Dr. Amarjit Singh and sponsored by the thirteen so-called elite Sikh scholars and leaders was recently published by the S. G. P C. Due to the overwhelming criticism from the Sikh Intelligentsia and writers that Granth has been taken off the market but there are many more of that type in circulation.


 
first thing is that Vedanta has nothing to do with hindu ie a natioanlity like Christianity has nothing to do with Britishness.

coming to the book.Das has one copy of it,where during some poxes ailment,we do not have Durga being worshipped as we were told in one forrum of taponban.com/

Gurfateh



> A so-called Dassam Granth, compilation of many scripts by anonymous writers but mischievously purported and propagated to be the Scriptures by Guru Gobind Singh Sahib contains fiction, mythology, wizardry and explicit eroticism.The proponents and propagators of this dubious literature have succeeded to a large extent in their sinister plot in beguiling Sikh majority and contaminating the Sikh History and quintessential philosophy with mythology, dogmatism, polytheism, wizardry witchcraft, eroticism, etc. Whereas the majority of innocent Sikh’s inability to grasp the Sikhism’s essential message is a simple failure on their part, the role of the numerous cultist Guru pretenders, half literate preachers, self-serving main stream Sikh leaders which propagate such blasphemous literature as integral part of Sikh history and philosophy is much more detrimental.


 
It has been told that any one who is not following the particular idelogy is a fool and is been befooled.And only few are realy intellgent.

Das would like to let there be some more lights over blames been done over writing as such attempts were made over Guru Granth Sahib Ji also by Bhasauris but by hard work it was overcome.

Anyway as an ex jaat das is aware that jaats are by blood hard working.But they have limit.

After baptism,when a person is no longer a jaat or teli or any racial ideot.We have no power of us and all power is of Akal.Who is limitless.

Gurfateh




> Consequently the practice of Sikhism, a pragmatic faith of knowledge is replete with blind faith, prejudices, dogmatic rituals, Idolatry, pagan taboos and superstitions. Sikh religious services and ceremonies are performed at the Sikh Gurdwaras (temples) at a price commensurate with the Sikh’s perceptual devotion and ability to pay to invoke God’s benedictions and Guru’s blessings. The international Sikh community has been fragmented into numerous sects, cults and antagonistic factions.


Again there has been attack on foolproofness of the Panth and there is an attempt to prove that Panth is waek to resists any such attacks



> The genuine Sikh Scholars have refuted with convincing arguments the compatibility of the mythical, wizardly and erotic contents of these Granths’ with the illuminating philosophy of the Guru Granth Sahib’s quintessential Gurbani. They have also revealed that the anonymous, pseudonym and quasi-Sikh writers wrote these so-called Granths with ulterior motives. But instead of acclaiming and honoring them, the half literate opportunistic Sikh Leaders who have had strangle-hold on Sikh Nation, have criticized, bullied and ostracized them and banned their books.


 
Again ego has been shown here to prove self as we only are ture and others are Bad,this is fundamentalsim.

Gurfateh



> One of the most prominent Sikh Scholars ever Bhai Kahn Singh writes, "the earlier and contemporary writers of our Faith have written numerous books on (Sikh) history, code and conventions according to their beliefs and mental tendencies. These books are both beneficial and harmful i.e. the subject matter compatible with essential message of Sikh Gurus’ edification is beneficial otherwise it is harmful.""The in-depth study of these Granths gives the impression that the poets of our Faith have blundered in copying the authors of religious books of other Faiths. They have bundled and dyed the social, political and religious principles in the religious color. It is all the more saddening that there are very few analytical minded Sikh scholars seeking the truth. In fact the opponents, those who call the rational minded writers and speakers agnostics, are in majority."


 
1.Same Nabah Sahib agree that Mehtab Singh stroy of not making many volume of the book after succeding in killing of Massa.
2.Same Nabha Sahib was found with weak side after Bhai Jodh Singh carried out correct study of Kartarpuri Beerh.

so no one is perfect.



> Rattan Singh Jaggi who did an in-depth review of the Dassam Granth writes, "The subject matter in the Chritro Pakhyan is so erotic and its language is so sexually explicit that in some places it surpasses even the (Hindu) Koke Shastra or Kama Shastra (Erotica Manual)"


 
This Jaggi Sahib have by now changed the side.After understanding the logic in differant way.


> Prof. Harinder Singh Mehboob writes, "The devious activity of contaminating the Granths and attributing the heretical writings to the Sikh Gurus has often been perpetrated repeatedly. This insidious activity has been pursued at the instigation of the mischievous and jealous people (inimical to Sikhism)."Prominent Sikh academician Pr. Harbhajan Singh in his Punjabi book ‘Selected Articles on Dassam Granth’ writes, "In their wild flights of fancy both authors, (Bhai Santokh Singh of Suraj Prakash and the dubious writer of Dassam Granth’s Bachitir Natak) left no deficiency in fabricating blatant Gossips and mythical Fantasies."


 
some time present day genuine schlors also try to twist the meanings off the context.so such problems arise.

Gurfateh



> The R. S. S. president Mr. Sudershan claims, "The Sikhs were created to defend Hindu Faith from the tyranny of the Mogul Rulers; and the two Hundred and fifty thousand Sikhs killed during the (1717-1799 AD) extreme Mogul tyranny were originally Hindus who made supreme sacrifices to defend the Hindu Faith."One wonders why didn’t these original Hindus make supreme sacrifices to defend Hinduism when the tyrannical Muslim Rulers forcibly converted enormous number of Hindus to Islam? And why didn’t the original Hindus make supreme sacrifices when Mohamed Bin-Kasam, who was by the Khalifa of Baghdad, conquered India’s principality of Sindh in the eighth century with just 700 hundred men?Mehmood Gaznavi advanced all the way to Hinduism’s most sacred shrine Som Nath, smashed the Idols, looted gold doors with gold inlay and took away Hindu women as concubines and slaves?If the Hindus were capable of making supreme sacrifices why was India slave to the Muslim invaders for seven centuries until the three hundred year old Sikh panth dealt fatal blows to the tyrannical Mogul Rule in the late seventeen and early eighteen centuries when Himalayan Hindu Principalities were banding with the Moguls. The Sikhs that constitute two percent of the total population of India’s predominantly Hindu society made eighty percent of the sacrifices to oust the British imperialists that ruled India for two centuries and Sikh Homeland, Punjab, for one centuryOnly an ignorant or insidious can proclaim the Sikhs, who came from all castes and creeds to adopt Sikhism by choice, original Hindus. A man of Mr. Sudershan’s credentials can be called ignorant.




Das is interested to know that what all people like mr Bal has done during Pujabi suba or Anti nirankari or Pro Khalistan movements or recent fight with Sirsa dera?

Das has seen one missionary in shape of vomiting and not eating meat das offered him,when in Area around the das was tense(there on 3 houses of Sikh we had 5 house of dera followers).

Das as per Nihung tradition sharppened his Saf jung and ate about a Kilo of meat and waited along side his Taksalis,Nanaksaris and Akhand Kirtani Jatha brethern.He had waited for figth which dear people did not pck up but missioanries also refuse to accompany them into a rally against dera.

Brave people indeed.Off course we were been told by RSS guys also that ion cae Dera guys pick up the fight they will also join fromm our side as Gurmeet since long and still each morning keeps on abusing Hinduism.


Reason for fear in missioarrie was due to the fact that they preach fear to others and feel happy to humliates others by their pen.But in war we have to make frineds to sclude the enemy and fight also.

Dhadi Vars only later tells the generations to come what we did.They are the singing of history we create.

Gurfateh



> The origin of Sikhism was motivated by the noble concepts of universal religious freedom and socio-cultural Liberalism. Ever since its inception the Sikhism has espoused and made supreme sacrifices for these noble causes The authentic Sikh History is witness to the valiant acts of defiance of the Sikh Gurus, Muslim and Hindu holy Sages (co-authors of Guru Granth Sahib) and numerous Sikh Martyrs for these noble causes. Conversely the Sikhism would have defended the Muslims’ right to religious freedom under tyrannical Hindu Rulers.​​​





condeming the fellow Sikhs at one side and claiming to libral is a hypocracy.​


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh



> *Prof. Gurmukh Singh’s Ex-communicationThe ex-communication of a true Sikh, Prof. Gurmukh Singh is an epitome (prime example) of abuse of illicit power by a bunch of self-serving religious leaders. At the time of his ex-communication Prof. Gurmukh Singh, one of pioneer founders of the reformist Sikh movement Singh Sabha, was actively pursuing his goal to establish the first Khalsa College at Amritsar. The band of pretenders to the Sikh spiritual and temporal Authority not only ex-communicated Prof. Gurmukh Singh but also incited the Sikh community not to render him financial help to carry out his missionary work and the noble cause of founding the Khalsa College.In 1883 Akal Takht head Granthi Bedi Khem Singh proclaimed himself as the Sikh Guru. Aided and abetted by his cohorts, Rajah Bikram Singh of Fridkote, Mahants , Pujaris and other Guru pretenders, he ex-communicated a genuine Sikh scholar and missionary Prof. Gurmukh Singh who criticized him for the un-Sikh act in 1887. They harassed and hounded Giani Dit Singh who dared to condemn their anti-Sikhism activity and canvass support for Prof. Gurmukh Singh to an early grave.The un-Sikh activities of Khem Singh Bedi and his cohorts are indicative of the sly religious leaders’ ability to manipulate repressive proceedings against a devout religious person. Some of the unjust accusations leveled against Prof. Gurmukh Singh who dedicated his life to the noble causes of reforming the Sikhism’s management and preaching system and eradication of wide spread illiteracy among the community were:-1) He does not revere the Sikh Gurus’ descents, (pretenders to Sikh Guru-ship).2) Twenty pictures of Avtars (Hindu Mythical god incarnates), were burned during a convention of Lahore Singh Sabha (Forum) to refute their existence.3) A Hindu convert to Islam was baptized as a Singh by the Lahore Singh Sabha.4) In an article published in the Khalsa Newspaper he wrote, "Worship of weapons in the Sikh Gurdwaras is copy of Hindu ritual that is against Guru’s edification."To an intelligent student of Sikh theology it is clear the ex-communication of Prof. Gurmukh Singh was a case of blatant abuse of illicit spiritual and temporal authority and the heretics punishing the pious Sikh. Prof. Manjit Singh revoked this dictatorial edict in 1995 and acclaimed Prof. Gurmukh Singh as a true Sikh*


 

*Some things*
*1.Prof. did take help of the Britishers.*
*2.Prof did take help of that person who betrayed the Sikhs in anglo Sikh wars.*
*3.As per book by sikh missioanry collage of Singh Sabh Lahir Prof Gurumukh singh had a soft corner for Jatt'Sikhs'.*

*4.Khem Singh never claimed to be Guru rahter he was interested for speacial roght for being guru Ansh this is worng but he did participated in conpiracy to restore Punjab to Daleep Singh.*

Gurfateh
*



Giani Bhag Singh’s ex-communicationThe ex-communication of Giani Bhag Singh exemplifies how the conniving religious leaders wield the authority to destroy those who dare to dissent. Giani Bhag Singh’s Book ‘Dassam Granth Nirnay’ (critique) was published in 1976. The book publication caused great deal of controversy amongst the Sikh community. During this period of controversy Giani Bhag Singh and Giani Sant Singh Muskeen were in Indore on lecture tours. As usual at one place when asked Muskeen told congregation that Akhand Path is compatible with the Guru’s edification while at another he said it is not. And when Giani Bhag Singh mentioned about these contradictions Muskeen was naturally resentful.During his lectures at Rajauri Gardens’ Gurudwara, Delhi, Muskeen quoted some verses from the Dassam Granth’s spurious scriptures. Some young Sikhs argued with Muskeen and told him that the verses he had quoted were not that of Guru Gobind Singh Sahib. Although the young Sikhs were absolutely right, Muskeen adamantly refused to concede that he was wrong. Next day they had some scripts from Dassam Granth printed and asked Muskeen to preach the scripts to the Sikh congregation. Muskeen refused and accused Giani Bhag Singh of sending the thugs (young Sikhs) to insult him.Muskeen approached his friend Golden Temple Head Granthi, Giani Chet Singh. Both Muskeen and Chet Singh instigated Akal Takht Jathedar Giani Sadhu Singh Bhaura (from my village Bhaura) to issue Hokum-nama (edict) to ex-communicate Giani Bhag Singh. However in view of the controversy amongst Sikh community the S. G. P. C. decided to call an ad-hoc advisory committee meeting that was chaired by Giani Sadhu Singh. When at this meeting the research Sikh Historian Shamsher Singh Ashoke who had also written a critical review on Dassam Granth tried to express his views, he was shouted down by the prejudiced members.When Pr. Harbhajan Singh asked all the 15 members at the meeting, if anyone had studied the Dassam Granth analytically, their silence conveyed the negative reply. And he asked them, (1) if the Dassam Granth’s authenticity controversy wasn’t as old as the Granth itself? (2) Didn’t the Akal Takht Jathedar and Granthi Singh Sahiban reply in June 1973 through Assistant Sec. S. Gurbakhsh Singh to Santokh of Chandigarh that Chritro Pakhyan is not Guru Gobind Singh’s work? (3) Aren’t we, the high-ranking Sikh personalities, too eager to condemn a pious person without his representation?Note:- In a reply No. 36672 dated 3rd August 1973 to S Santokh Singh (Chandigarh) the religious preaching sub-Committee of S. G. P .C. wrote, "In regard to your inquiry of 6th July 1973 the views of Singh Sahiban of Derbar Sahib and Akal Takht Jathedar are being sent to you. "Chritro Pakhyan in the Dassam Granth is not Guru Gobind Singh’s Scriptures. These are copies of the primitive Hindu mythical tales." Signed, Gurbakhsh Singh, Assistant Secretary, Religious Preaching Committee, Shrimoni G. P. Committee, Amritsar.Pr. Harbhajan Singh’s wisdom prevailed in drafting and passing two resolutions unanimously, (1) Giani Bhag Singh should have presented his side of the case in detail to the Panth instead of two-line comment. (2) Since with time the issue is getting serious, this committee humbly requests the S. G .P. C. to institute a sub-committee of prominent Sikh Scholars to authenticate the Dassam Granth’s scripts that are compatible with the Guru Granth Sahib’s philosophy and Guru’s Ideals. No punishment was considered appropriate for Giani Bhag Singh.Despite these unanimous consensus that were reached at the meeting Giani Bhag Singh was ex-communicated on 5th July 1977 in a mystifying manner. The same bunch of Singh-Sahiban (Giani Bhaura, Giani Chet Singh and Giani Kirpal Singh) who said that Chritro Pakhyan wasn’t Guru Gobind Singh’s Work and were also star participants at the meeting to adjudge Giani Bhag Singh, ex-communicated him.The concerned Sikh Scholars Pr. Harbhajan Singh, Giani Surjit Singh, Bhai Milap Singh and Amar Singh conferred with each other to have the edict issue redressed. Bhai Amar Singh Aligarh, who knew Jathedar Bhaura when he was a Granthi, convinced him of his folly. Jathedar Bhaura agreed to rescind the edict. Bhai Amar Singh, Giani Surjit Singh and S. Milap Singh were to accompany Giani Bhag Singh to Akal Takht to have the edict rescinded.Muskeen who came to know about this visit, cunningly took Giani Bhag Singh to Akal Takht himself at his own expense. Jathedar Bhaura had a paper with a text, "Giani Bhag Singh has apologized regarding Ardas (Sikh Litany) and Chaupie (a lyrical supplication from Dassam Granth)" typed in advance. When it was given to old and feeble Giani Bhag Singh to sign, he accidentally dropped his reading glasses. Both Bhaura and Muskeen said, leave the glasses; don’t you trust us? They practically tricked Giani Bhag Singh into signing the apology that he deeply regretted. He told Giani Surjit Singh with tears in his eyes that Muskeen had tricked him.

Click to expand...

* 
*good stroy by the imaginatioon of the jatt.*

*But three very contradictory point.*

*1.A letter saying that some part is not gurbani and from the office beaerer deeming to be from whole institution.*
*2.Same institution throws off a person who repeats what is there in part 1 so this prooves that part one was not agreed upon by whole instition.*
*3.So far das was told by doughter of Gyani Dhyan Singh of village Khambra(Near Jallendher) who was freined of Gyani Bhag Singh Ji. that Akal Takaht htmeself has tended an apology to Gyani Bhag Singh.But here a person who is tormented and cheated by some guys in past on breaking of glass again gets cheated and and that person is getting cheated who has exposed 'cheating' being done to the Panth for last hundereds of year wide book.*

*Gyani Sahib,who was such a scholar who ca he be cheated?why did not he go for glass he drooped or to get a new glass?*


*Anyway some history of this person.*

*He was Anti Sikh and Anti Hindu Aryaa Samaji named Bhagmal.In past he did worte some work to prove Bagauti means universal power.*

*Gurmat is oppsed of 6 Darshans.*

ਪੰਨਾ 67, ਸਤਰ 16ਖਟੁ ਦਰਸਨ ਜੋਗੀ ਸੰਨਿਆਸੀ ਬਿਨੁ ਗੁਰ ਭਰਮਿ ਭੁਲਾਏ ॥खटु दरसन जोगी संनिआसी बिनु गुर भरमि भुलाए ॥Kẖat ḏarsan jogī sani&shy;āsī bin gur bẖaram bẖulā&shy;ė.The followers of the six different life-styles and world-views, the Yogis and the Sanyaasees have gone astray in doubt without the Guru.ਮਃ 3 - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok

one of that Darshan is Nayik Darsham or Justice philosophy based upon logic.

who gave this Great Gyani the authroty to use logic or one of the Darshan unot Gurmat?

In Arya Samaj all that is Puranic(having influnece of Dravid demi gods) is sin compared to pure Aryan(vedas).

Dravids etc are uncivlied or Anaryas.Thrtre language thier demigods are hated a lot.

When Guru called these out castes,the single most majorty of India,telling thier demi gods and acts of them are acts of Akal.And Telling them about foly of thier oppresser for ages.Arya Samajis can object but we have nothing to do with four Aryan Varnas etc.

his Dasham Granth Niranai is full of imposing Aryan thing over Sikhs and trying to prove that Guru did nothing to assimaled people enslaved for ages.


Gurfateh




> Jathedar Aroor Singh declared Kamagata Maru returnees from Canada in 1915 as un-Sikhs at the behest of the British Government of India; and awarded Gen. Dyre who massacred hundreds of Sikhs, Hindus and Muslims on 1919 Vaisakhi day in the Jallianwala Baug, with a Saropa (the Sikh scarf of honour).


 
During the time of emergency in India Akal Takhat and SGPC saved India from becoimng the fiefdom of Gandhi family.From that time onwards there were and are attempts by leftist(who were with the congress) and Congress to weakned us.



> During the reign of Maharaja Ranjit Singh Sikhism was sacrificed at the altar of Secularism. Although he built many Sikh Gurdwaras and allotted endowed lands to these Gurdwaras, no real attempts were made to counter the corruptive influences of the sly Brahmins, impostor Sikh Gurus, zealous Hindu and Muslim clerics and holy quacks.


 
That time nay imposters tooks attire of Sikhs,who later to side with govermnet under British rule went to protestant like form of Faith.


> The Maharaja’s folly to trust and appoint the Hindu Dogra brothers Dhyan Singh and Gulaub Singh and brothers Teja Singh and Lall Singh from U. P. to the elite posts proved to be fatal for the Sikh Raj. Soon after the Maharaja’s death in 1839, treachery and intrigues of these traitors enabled the British to occupy Punjab.


 
Das repeats that why did prof Gurmukh singh Ji took help of these two brothers native of UP?

Gurfateh


> As usual the ‘Holier than Thou’ Christian Missionaries who without fail followed the Christian Conquistadors (Conquerors), spread their proselytizing (conversionary) tentacles in Punjab and built the Missionary Network.The Muslim and the Christian imperialists made two pronged intrusions into Sikhism. On one hand they un-leashed brute power of imperialism especially the Muslims who butchered children in front of the mothers to force conversion to Islam. On the other hand they enticed potential converts with endowment lands and elite posts. Then there were the Christian Missionaries and Muslim Quazis, and holy men/quacks to convert the weaklings, impoverished and the naïve.Note:- Although hunted and massacred on the genocidal scale, the eighteenth and nineteenth Century Sikhs resisted the Muslim and Christian onslaughts valiantly.


 
Muslims used force while Chratians used allurements etc and not the force as been told.and we have saved ourself.

both the faiths are and were stronger then so called hinduism.



> Gurfateh
> .However the Hindus deprived of political powers for nearly a thousand years used insidious means to either obliterate the progressive Sikhism’s unique identity and swallow it into Hinduism or proclaim it as a sect of Hinduism. With the downfall of the ruling Muslims who called the Hindus as Kaffirs (Pagans) and considered converting them to Islam as a benevolent act, the ultra Hindu fundamentalists were emboldened. Whereas in the past they targeted Sikhism covertly, now started to malign the Sikh Gurus and Sikhism openly.Acting on the Hindu cultist Vivaka Nanda’s devious advice, "If you want to root out a religion, cast doubts about the historical facts of its founders",


 
1.there is no faith called hinduism
2.Swallowing traits of Hinduism were more work of Maculife who wanted to use Sikhs as tool to oppress Muslims and hindus after making them afarid.

3Vevkanand had hevan and hell differance from Swami daya Nanda.He was Vedantic and Daya nanada was Nyayik or logical.

4.Can you thinki that Bhag Singh ji could also be doing to us what Vivekananda told about Christians doing to Hindus.

Gurfateh



> Daya Nand the founder of radical Arya Samaj (Aryan Social Order) launched vicious attacks on the Sikh Gurus and Sikhism. He denigrated Guru Nanak Sahib with remarks, "Ideals of Nanak Ji were noble but he was illiterate; why would he otherwise write Sanskrit word nirbhya as nirbhow? Since he (Guru Nanak Ji) had some ego, he must have resorted to some deceit for the sake of his conceit."That Daya Nand was an ignorant Charlatan is evident from the fact that Guru Nanak Sahib wrote, preached and sang his Scriptural compositions in the colloquial language of the people of Punjab, Punjabi that was in use before Guru Nanak’s time. Venerated Muslim Sage Sheik Freed who lived couple centuries (1173-1266 AD) before Guru Nanak wrote Scriptures in Punjabi. Guru Nanak Sahib collected and Guru Arjan Sahib compiled these Scriptures in the Guru Granth Sahib.Like all impostors Daya Nand was a liar, duplicitous and cunning. Giani Dit Singh, his contemporary writes, "Once during his discourse at Brahm Smaj Temple he stated that the Sun orbits around the Earth and supported his statement with quotes from the Vedas. However later at the residence when a companion Saien Das told him that since today’s advanced Astronomy confirms that the Earth orbits around the Sun, people will not think highly of Vedas. Daya Nand said that he should have been told me earlier; now I will refute the statement tomorrow.Next day he contradicted his own statement by saying, "Yesterday when I said that the Sun orbits around the Earth, that is the assertion of the adversaries. That is how they interpret the concepts of Vedas. Actually these concepts confirm that the Sun doesn’t orbit around the earth, but the Earth orbits around the Sun."


 
Swami was called by Singh Sabha people to stop Christianity in Punjab.Although they(Singh Sabha) did prvented some young ones from becoing Christians.

Swami told outcastes that if they leave Gurmat and be Arya Samaji,thier tagg of out caste be off.He offered matrimonial alaince with upper caste converts of his cults with outcastes.This did not occur

So converts reverted back to main faith .

Presently moswt of thier Temples are locked and thier devotees in rest of the India also have reverted to pagan faith.Rest have become Nastik or nono belivers or leftists.

Same as mnay protestants have ********d thier churches in west.

If we follow thier model we may face the same.Up to you.

Like Dayanada said that Guru was not OK by not following Sanskrit/upper castes terminology,in the same by ex Arya Samaji Bhag Singh Said that Guru can not used dravidian terms or symbols of thier demi God.

both have been similar.

Gurfateh



> The Rashtrya Svayam Savek Sang (R. S. S.), a radical Hindu fundamentalist organization sprouted eight decades ago. Its strategy is more insidious. To obliterate the unique Sikh identity and proclaim Sikhism as a sect of Hinduism, R .S. S. is promoting and preaching the so-called Granths written by dubious Scholars. The subject matter of these Granths is contaminated with Hindu mythology, polytheism, wizardry Idolatry, blind faith ritualism, eroticism, etc. that are totally contrary to the Monotheistic, pragmatic and spiritually illuminating doctrines of the Guru Granth Sahib’s quintessential Gurbani.In a clandestine move the Hindu R. S. S. has spawned an ill-conceived organization called Rashtrya Sikh Sangat that has same initials as the promiscuous mother organization to beguile the gullible Sikhs and non-Sikhs. The discerning Sikhs Scholars and Intelligentsia contend that the cagey Hindu R. S. S. has created Rashtrya Sikh Sangat and filled its ranks with the mercenary Hindus and naïve Sikhs to boost its efforts to propagate distorted facts from Sikh History and misinterpretations of the selected verses from the Guru Granth Sahib’s Gurbani.


They are also using Guru Granth Sahib Ji and Sikh Rahit Maryada also.So does it make all that any way less.

hindus who due to thier own weakness are unable to stand by thier own are made such are powerfull force by you.Why?Are they paying you for letting them look ferocious to us or someone else is paying you for that so that we follow that some else?

all people who do not fit to your idealogy are naive and mercenary.good.what all is called fundameantlism?

Gurfateh

As per Rulda Singh Ji, Ujager Singh Ji etc. Rashriya Sikh Sangat has nothing to preach Hinduism to Sikh but to Preach Gurmat to Hindus.


Time will only tell how ture are they?



> Some misguided or naive Sikhs, zealous Hindus and mercenaries are helping R. S. S in its deviant designs. Because the concerned Sikh Scholars and intelligentsia challenge the deceitful agenda of the R. S. S., a Sikh lawyer Gurcharanjit Singh Lamba characterizes the call of Institute of Sikh Studies to reject the Dassam Granth, "irrational, motivated and sacrilege." And a self-beatified Sikh Saint (also known as Serkari Saadh) Virsa Singh of Delhi is distributing translations of Dassam Granth.


 
It is surprising that nirmalas,Baba Virsa Singh,Nihungs,Yogi Bhajan,Sant Singh Maskeen etc all are slandered by so called missionary,who have no record to bring new people into faith unlike the ones they slander.

As per them Guru did not bring new converts but rather spend thier whole life to refrom the Sikhs but from where did those Sikhs came?

They were converts and not from jatt families.

some even like das from jaat family but those jaats are or were or will be pagan.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh



The Khalsa Fauj said:


> *cirqRo pKXwn dSmyS bwxI nhI​
> isMG swihwbwn dw Pqvw: cUMik pMQ iv`c swry "dsm gRMQ" nUM gurU jI dI ikRq mMnx Aqy n mMnx vwly, do vIcwrW dy lok hn. ies leI smyN smyN AYsy SMky SRo: gu: pRbMDk kmytI,AMimRqsr, AQvw aus vloN in~Xq Dwrimk slwhkwr kmytI pws swmwDwn leI AwauNdy rihMdy hn. iek vwr imqI 6[7[73 nUM cMfIgV "rwj krygw Kwlsw" Aqy "cirqRo pKXwn" vwry p`uC pu`jI. jQydwr sRI Akwl qKq swihb Aqy sRI drbwr swihb, sRI AMimRqsr dy hYf gRMQI swihbwn ny iehnW pu`CW dw jo au~qr id`qw, aus dI nkl hyTW hwjr hY:-
> 
> ÃÄvwihhurU jI kI Pqh]
> ...


Das requests some one please translate what is there in Punjabi as fonts are not working on his PC.

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> E)Presently Published Dasam Granth which came in print since 1902 based on Sodhak Committee Report (1895-1897)after looking into 32 dasam granth Birs.
> 
> Credentials of various members of this committee. (They were not scholars but British cronies selected by Gurmat Granth Pracharak Sabha controlled by Vihiria Faction amrtsar singh sabha group.They were not selcted by SIKH PANTH because Lahore Singh Sabha With 118 were opposed to it and never recognised this Granth.EVEN SRM and 1925 Gurudwara act did not accpt this Granth.
> 
> ...


 
There had been attempts by Babu Teaj Singh ji of Bhasaur to bring an edited copy of Guru Granth Sahib Ji also.He is talked about with respect in Dasham Granth nirnai by Gyani Bhag Singh Ji.

anyway Lahore Singh Sabha also did took help from Britishers.

Gurfateh



The Khalsa Fauj said:


> http://www.singhsabhacanada.com/Video/Misc/DasamGranth/Part1.wmv
> 
> http://www.singhsabhacanada.com/Video/Misc/DasamGranth/Part2.wmv


 
Das is ready to talk any good person on this issue.

So far expiriance of das has showen that after2 minutes there are repeats of points.And often phone number of das is taken and das not provided thier own deatails.

why to fear a sinner like das?

what das is due to mercy of Guru Panth.


----------



## vijaydeep Singh (Jul 31, 2007)

Gurfateh

Some facts about weather Chariter is a negitive term?

It is been used for association with God.


See below.

ਪੰਨਾ 212, ਸਤਰ 9
ਗੀਤ ਚਰਿਤ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਕੇ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਵਾ ॥੨॥
गीत चरित प्रभ के गुन गावा ॥२॥
Gīṯ cẖariṯ parabẖ kė gun gāvā. ||2||
I sing the songs of God's glory, and His wondrous play. ||2||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 287, ਸਤਰ 18
ਅਪਨੇ ਚਰਿਤ ਪ੍ਰਭਿ ਆਪਿ ਬਨਾਏ ॥
अपने चरित प्रभि आपि बनाए ॥
Apnė cẖariṯ parabẖ āp banā&shy;ė.
God Himself sets His play in motion.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1207, ਸਤਰ 4
ਦੇਖਿ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਭਈ ਹਉ ਬਿਸਮਨਿ ਗੁਰਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਪੁਰਖਿ ਮਿਲਾਈ ॥
देखि चरित्र भई हउ बिसमनि गुरि सतिगुरि पुरखि मिलाई ॥
Ḏėkẖ cẖariṯar bẖa&shy;ī ha&shy;o bisman gur saṯgur purakẖ milā&shy;ī.
I am wonder-struck, gazing upon the wondrous play of God. The Guru, the True Guru, has led me to meet the Primal Lord.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1211, ਸਤਰ 14
ਏਕ ਨਿਮਖ ਓਪਾਇ ਸਮਾਵੈ ਦੇਖਿ ਚਰਿਤ ਮਨ ਮੋਹੰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
एक निमख ओपाइ समावै देखि चरित मन मोहं ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Ėk nimakẖ opā&shy;ė samāvai ḏėkẖ cẖariṯ man mohaŉ. ||1|| rahā&shy;o.
In an instant, He creates and destroys. Gazing upon His Wondrous Plays, my mind is fascinated. ||1||Pause||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1237, ਸਤਰ 5
ਦੇਖਿ ਚਰਿਤ ਨਾਨਕ ਮਨੁ ਮੋਹਿਓ ਪੂਛੈ ਦੀਨੁ ਮੇਰੋ ਠਾਕੁਰੁ ਕੈਸਾ ॥੩॥
देखि चरित नानक मनु मोहिओ पूछै दीनु मेरो ठाकुरु कैसा ॥३॥
Ḏėkẖ cẖariṯ Nānak man mohi&shy;o pūcẖẖai ḏīn mėro ṯẖākur kaisā. ||3||
Gazing upon His wondrous play, O Nanak, my mind is fascinated. I humbly ask, what is my Lord and Master like? ||3||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]


If we go by S Kala Afghana Ji and say that Chalitar a slang is bad then have a look.


ਪੰਨਾ 104, ਸਤਰ 9
ਚਲਿਤ ਤੁਮਾਰੇ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਦੇਖਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਭਏ ਨਿਹਾਲਾ ਜੀਉ ॥੪॥੨੬॥੩੩॥
चलित तुमारे प्रगट पिआरे देखि नानक भए निहाला जीउ ॥४॥२६॥३३॥
Cẖaliṯ ṯumārė pargat pi&shy;ārė ḏėkẖ Nānak bẖa&shy;ė nihālā jī&shy;o. ||4||26||33||
Your Playful Ways are revealed, O my Beloved. Beholding them, Nanak is enraptured. ||4||26||33||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 279, ਸਤਰ 8
ਅਪੁਨੇ ਚਲਿਤ ਆਪਿ ਕਰਣੈਹਾਰ ॥
अपुने चलित आपि करणैहार ॥
Apunė cẖaliṯ āp karṇaihār.
In His own play, He Himself is the Actor.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 281, ਸਤਰ 19
ਆਪਨ ਚਲਿਤੁ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਕਰੈ ॥
आपन चलितु आप ही करै ॥
Āpan cẖaliṯ āp hī karai.
He Himself stages His own drama.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 284, ਸਤਰ 9
ਨਾਨਾ ਚਲਿਤ ਕਰੇ ਖਿਨ ਮਾਹਿ ॥
नाना चलित करे खिन माहि ॥
Nānā cẖaliṯ karė kẖin māhi.
He performs His many plays in an instant.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 291, ਸਤਰ 4
ਆਪਨ ਚਲਿਤ ਆਪਿ ਕਰਨੈਹਾਰ ॥
आपन चलित आपि करनैहार ॥
Āpan cẖaliṯ āp karnaihār.
He Himself is the Performer in His own plays;
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 390, ਸਤਰ 8
ਦੇਖਿ ਚਲਿਤ ਮਨਿ ਭਏ ਦਿਲਾਸਾ ॥
देखि चलित मनि भए दिलासा ॥
Ḏėkẖ cẖaliṯ man bẖa&shy;ė ḏilāsā.
Gazing upon the wonder of Your play, my mind has become encouraged.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 988, ਸਤਰ 2
ਕਉਨੁ ਜਾਨੈ ਚਲਿਤ ਤੇਰੇ ਕਿਛੁ ਅੰਤੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਪਾਰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
कउनु जानै चलित तेरे किछु अंतु नाही पार ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Ka&shy;un jānai cẖaliṯ ṯėrė kicẖẖ anṯ nāhī pār. ||1|| rahā&shy;o.
Who knows Your wondrous plays? You have no end or limitation. ||1||Pause||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1156, ਸਤਰ 15
ਕੋਟਿ ਅਖਾਰੇ ਚਲਿਤ ਬਿਸਮਾਦ ॥
कोटि अखारे चलित बिसमाद ॥
Kot akẖārė cẖaliṯ bismāḏ.
His Wondrous Plays are enacted on millions of stages.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1351, ਸਤਰ 7
ਅਕੁਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਇਕੁ ਚਲਿਤੁ ਉਪਾਇਆ ॥
अकुल पुरख इकु चलितु उपाइआ ॥
Akul purakẖ ik cẖaliṯ upā&shy;i&shy;ā.
The Primal Being has no ancestry; He has staged this play.
ਭਗਤ ਨਾਮਦੇਵ ਜੀ - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Das would like to add as there is no word called Khalsa in Guru Granth Sahib and something more than them but not anti so we should see the Dasham Granth Sahib Ji.

One whole Chrecter is writtan where a lady makes fool of Bidhai/Brhama and he is writtan as Karta.

In one book by Kala Afghana Sahib das finds only two verse writtan about lady that lady made some trouble for Bidhna ,next talk about Rudra getting some negtive impact but last line they did not write where it is writtan that one creater who created lady can understand.It proves that Bidhna is not the creater.

Lastly were any Sikhs or Guru a chreacter in any Charitropkhyan.

Gurbani answer thats and that is the reason that why Guru wrote all.


ਦੀਨ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਤੇਰੀ ਟੇਕ ॥ 
दीन दुनीआ तेरी टेक ॥ 
Ḏīn ḏunī&shy;ā ṯėrī tėk. 
In this world and the next, I have Your Support. 

ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਰਵਿਆ ਸਾਹਿਬੁ ਏਕ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
सभ महि रविआ साहिबु एक ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
Sabẖ meh ravi&shy;ā sāhib ėk. ||1|| rahā&shy;o. 
The One Lord, our Lord and Master, is all-pervading. ||1||Pause|| 

If we precive the Tenth Master as body we may have doubt but his acts were the acts of universl soul.

Gurfateh

Some facts about weather Chariter is a negitive term?

It is been used for association with God.


See below.

ਪੰਨਾ 212, ਸਤਰ 9
ਗੀਤ ਚਰਿਤ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਕੇ ਗੁਨ ਗਾਵਾ ॥੨॥
गीत चरित प्रभ के गुन गावा ॥२॥
Gīṯ cẖariṯ parabẖ kė gun gāvā. ||2||
I sing the songs of God's glory, and His wondrous play. ||2||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 287, ਸਤਰ 18
ਅਪਨੇ ਚਰਿਤ ਪ੍ਰਭਿ ਆਪਿ ਬਨਾਏ ॥
अपने चरित प्रभि आपि बनाए ॥
Apnė cẖariṯ parabẖ āp banā&shy;ė.
God Himself sets His play in motion.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1207, ਸਤਰ 4
ਦੇਖਿ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਭਈ ਹਉ ਬਿਸਮਨਿ ਗੁਰਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਿ ਪੁਰਖਿ ਮਿਲਾਈ ॥
देखि चरित्र भई हउ बिसमनि गुरि सतिगुरि पुरखि मिलाई ॥
Ḏėkẖ cẖariṯar bẖa&shy;ī ha&shy;o bisman gur saṯgur purakẖ milā&shy;ī.
I am wonder-struck, gazing upon the wondrous play of God. The Guru, the True Guru, has led me to meet the Primal Lord.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1211, ਸਤਰ 14
ਏਕ ਨਿਮਖ ਓਪਾਇ ਸਮਾਵੈ ਦੇਖਿ ਚਰਿਤ ਮਨ ਮੋਹੰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
एक निमख ओपाइ समावै देखि चरित मन मोहं ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Ėk nimakẖ opā&shy;ė samāvai ḏėkẖ cẖariṯ man mohaŉ. ||1|| rahā&shy;o.
In an instant, He creates and destroys. Gazing upon His Wondrous Plays, my mind is fascinated. ||1||Pause||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1237, ਸਤਰ 5
ਦੇਖਿ ਚਰਿਤ ਨਾਨਕ ਮਨੁ ਮੋਹਿਓ ਪੂਛੈ ਦੀਨੁ ਮੇਰੋ ਠਾਕੁਰੁ ਕੈਸਾ ॥੩॥
देखि चरित नानक मनु मोहिओ पूछै दीनु मेरो ठाकुरु कैसा ॥३॥
Ḏėkẖ cẖariṯ Nānak man mohi&shy;o pūcẖẖai ḏīn mėro ṯẖākur kaisā. ||3||
Gazing upon His wondrous play, O Nanak, my mind is fascinated. I humbly ask, what is my Lord and Master like? ||3||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]


If we go by S Kala Afghana Ji and say that Chalitar a slang is bad then have a look.


ਪੰਨਾ 104, ਸਤਰ 9
ਚਲਿਤ ਤੁਮਾਰੇ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਦੇਖਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਭਏ ਨਿਹਾਲਾ ਜੀਉ ॥੪॥੨੬॥੩੩॥
चलित तुमारे प्रगट पिआरे देखि नानक भए निहाला जीउ ॥४॥२६॥३३॥
Cẖaliṯ ṯumārė pargat pi&shy;ārė ḏėkẖ Nānak bẖa&shy;ė nihālā jī&shy;o. ||4||26||33||
Your Playful Ways are revealed, O my Beloved. Beholding them, Nanak is enraptured. ||4||26||33||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 279, ਸਤਰ 8
ਅਪੁਨੇ ਚਲਿਤ ਆਪਿ ਕਰਣੈਹਾਰ ॥
अपुने चलित आपि करणैहार ॥
Apunė cẖaliṯ āp karṇaihār.
In His own play, He Himself is the Actor.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 281, ਸਤਰ 19
ਆਪਨ ਚਲਿਤੁ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਕਰੈ ॥
आपन चलितु आप ही करै ॥
Āpan cẖaliṯ āp hī karai.
He Himself stages His own drama.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 284, ਸਤਰ 9
ਨਾਨਾ ਚਲਿਤ ਕਰੇ ਖਿਨ ਮਾਹਿ ॥
नाना चलित करे खिन माहि ॥
Nānā cẖaliṯ karė kẖin māhi.
He performs His many plays in an instant.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 291, ਸਤਰ 4
ਆਪਨ ਚਲਿਤ ਆਪਿ ਕਰਨੈਹਾਰ ॥
आपन चलित आपि करनैहार ॥
Āpan cẖaliṯ āp karnaihār.
He Himself is the Performer in His own plays;
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 390, ਸਤਰ 8
ਦੇਖਿ ਚਲਿਤ ਮਨਿ ਭਏ ਦਿਲਾਸਾ ॥
देखि चलित मनि भए दिलासा ॥
Ḏėkẖ cẖaliṯ man bẖa&shy;ė ḏilāsā.
Gazing upon the wonder of Your play, my mind has become encouraged.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 988, ਸਤਰ 2
ਕਉਨੁ ਜਾਨੈ ਚਲਿਤ ਤੇਰੇ ਕਿਛੁ ਅੰਤੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਪਾਰ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥
कउनु जानै चलित तेरे किछु अंतु नाही पार ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥
Ka&shy;un jānai cẖaliṯ ṯėrė kicẖẖ anṯ nāhī pār. ||1|| rahā&shy;o.
Who knows Your wondrous plays? You have no end or limitation. ||1||Pause||
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1156, ਸਤਰ 15
ਕੋਟਿ ਅਖਾਰੇ ਚਲਿਤ ਬਿਸਮਾਦ ॥
कोटि अखारे चलित बिसमाद ॥
Kot akẖārė cẖaliṯ bismāḏ.
His Wondrous Plays are enacted on millions of stages.
ਮਃ 5 - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1351, ਸਤਰ 7
ਅਕੁਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਇਕੁ ਚਲਿਤੁ ਉਪਾਇਆ ॥
अकुल पुरख इकु चलितु उपाइआ ॥
Akul purakẖ ik cẖaliṯ upā&shy;i&shy;ā.
The Primal Being has no ancestry; He has staged this play.
ਭਗਤ ਨਾਮਦੇਵ ਜੀ - [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Das would like to add as there is no word called Khalsa in Guru Granth Sahib and something more than them but not anti so we should see the Dasham Granth Sahib Ji.

One whole Chrecter is writtan where a lady makes fool of Bidhai/Brhama and he is writtan as Karta.

In one book by Kala Afghana Sahib das finds only two verse writtan about lady that lady made some trouble for Bidhna ,next talk about Rudra getting some negtive impact but last line they did not write where it is writtan that one creater who created lady can understand.It proves that Bidhna is not the creater.

Lastly were any Sikhs or Guru a chreacter in any Charitropkhyan.

Gurbani answer thats and that is the reason that why Guru wrote all.


ਦੀਨ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਤੇਰੀ ਟੇਕ ॥ 
दीन दुनीआ तेरी टेक ॥ 
Ḏīn ḏunī&shy;ā ṯėrī tėk. 
In this world and the next, I have Your Support. 

ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਰਵਿਆ ਸਾਹਿਬੁ ਏਕ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ 
सभ महि रविआ साहिबु एक ॥१॥ रहाउ ॥ 
Sabẖ meh ravi&shy;ā sāhib ėk. ||1|| rahā&shy;o. 
The One Lord, our Lord and Master, is all-pervading. ||1||Pause|| 

If we precive the Tenth Master as body we may have doubt but his acts were the acts of universl soul.


----------



## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 7, 2007)

Why don't you just admit that you can't understand Gurmukhi? Otherwise. Gurakhar fonts aren't hard to find.


----------



## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 7, 2007)

Also, not all of dasam granth is braj basha so don't think you are scholar. In fact, it uses a lot of Punjabi words commonly used as poets were from Punjab area. So we can say that it is a mixture.


----------



## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 7, 2007)

Using Bal is wrong but how about using sodis and bedis? Isn't that caste system? You don't see sodis and bedis but you see randhawas and others.

Who said chariter is a bad term? What dasam granth says is bad. It says that the creator of universe doesn't know the inside of women.


----------



## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 7, 2007)

Also make this clear. If Raam is attribute of God then what does Kab Shyam or kib sXwm in Gurmukhi mean? Shows you got no clue about Viakaran. No wonder you do whatever aarth you want. So tell me what does poet Shyam mean. If you was to translate shyam as black, then tell me what does poet black mean? If you want to do aarth, tell me what was God doing writing chariters? Also, if God said those chariters, Guru Sahib would have respected it even more than Guru Granth Sahib Ji but there is no mention of Dasam Granth in Punjab before around the 1800s. Therefore, there is no doubt that poet shyam is poet, no doubt that poet raam is a poet, no doubt that poet kal is poet. No doubt that poet soom is poet.

I will post more later when I get time.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 7, 2007)

I didn't read all of your stuff about Charanjit SIngh Bal. Email him what you are saying about him. Don't talk nonsense behind someone's back. He will answer his own queries. I am not going to be lawyer for all writers and defend them but I will mention some things.

You doubt Guru more than anyone. I can tell from your writings. You have shanka om Pooraa Guru. You are saying that Guru wasn't able to make Sikhs strong enough to control Punjab. Sikhs stopped following Guru isn't fault of Guru. Sikhs were low in number and Sikhs were strong enough to hold off the Mughals and did establish a raaj but it was lost due to Dasam Granth and hindu practices introduced through it. Now Vijaydeep, with his RSS (Rastrya Sikh Sangat) and crew have only one motive and that is to slowly merge Sikhs back into Hindus or kill them slowly through literature such as dasam granth. You guys want to fool uneducated Sikhs to think that Dasam Granth is credible and then do proper arth of dasam granth and prove Sikhs to be hindus.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 7, 2007)

ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 1. 8
ਸੋਰਠ ਮ: 3 ਸ: ਗ: ਗ: ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ 646


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

ਜਸਬਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਖਾਲਸਾ​ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖਾਲਸਾ।।
ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ।। - ਪ੍ਰਵਾਨ ਹੋਵੇ ਜੀ।
ਅਤੀ ਨਿਮਰਤਾ ਸਹਿਤ ਬੇਨਤੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਝੂਠੁ ਨ ਬੋਲਿ ਪਾਡੇ ਸਚੁ ਕਹੀਐ।। ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦਾ ਲਿਖਾਰੀ ਕੌਣ? ਭਾਗ ਪਹਿਲਾ ਦਾ ਖਰੜਾ ਭੇਜ ਰਿਹਾ ਹਾਂ। ਮੈਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੇ ਪੰਨਾ 909 ਤੋਂ 1388 ਤੱਕ ਦੀ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਹੂ-ਬ-ਹੂ ਅਰਥ ਕੀਤੇ ਹਨ-ਕਈ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾਵਾਂ ਦੇ ਮੈਂ ਕੇਵਲ ਸਾਰ (Summary) ਲਿਖ ਕੇ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਦੇ ਅਕਾਰ ਨੂੰ ਸੀਮਤ ਰੱਖਣ ਦੀ ਕੋਸ਼ਿਸ ਕੀਤੀ ਹੈ। ਕਿਸੇ ਵੀ ਥਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਕਵਿ ਰਚਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਮੂਲ ਰੂਪ ਨੂੰ ਅੱਖੋਂ ਓਹਲੇ ਨਹੀਂ ਕੀਤਾ। ਮੈਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਰੂਪ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਅਥਵਾ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਗਿਆਨ ਦਾ ਓਟ ਆਸਰਾ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਸੱਚ ਸੱਚ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਹੈ। ਮੈਂ ਇੱਕ ਛੋਟੇ ਜਿਹੇ ਪਿੰਡ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਹਾਂ। ਵੱਡੇ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਬਹੁਤਾ ਪੜ੍ਹਿਆ ਨਹੀਂ ਹਾਂ। ਇੱਕ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਹੋਣ ਦੇ ਨਾਤੇ ਮੈਂ ਅਪਣੀ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਭਾਸ਼ਾ ਨੂੰ ਵਧੇਰੇ ਵਰਤਿਆ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਿ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਲੱਛੇਦਾਰ ਭਾਸ਼ਾ ਲਿਖਣੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਆਉਂਦੀ ਬਲਕਿ ਮੈਂ ਸਮਝਦਾ ਹਾਂ ਕਿ ਅੱਖਰ ਓਹ ਲਿਖੇ ਜਾਣ ਜੋ ਬਿਨਾ ਮਹਾਨ ਕੋਸ਼ ਚੁੱਕਿਆਂ ਸਮਝ ਆ ਜਾਣ। ਹੋ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਮੇਰੇ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਵਰਤੀ ਸਰਲ ਅਤੇ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਬੋਲੀ ਬਹੁਤਿਆਂ ਨੂੰ ਸੂਤ ਨਾ ਬੈਠੇ।
ਆਪ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਬਿਬੇਕ ਬੁੱਧੀ, ਦਲੇਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੱਚ ਬੋਲਣ ਦੀ ਤਾਕਤ ਦੇ ਹਰ ਥਾਂ ਚਰਚੇ ਹਨ। ਮੈਨੂੰ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਤੋਂ ਬੜੀ ਆਸ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਇਸ ਖਰੜੇ ਬਾਰੇ ਤੁਸੀਂ ਅਪਣੀ ਢੁਕਵੀਂ ਰਾਏ (ਵਿਚਾਰ) ਦੇ ਕੇ ਧੰਨਵਾਦੀ ਬਣਾਓਗੇ। ਜਿੱਥੇ ਕਿਤੇ ਸੁਧਾਈ ਦੀ ਲੋੜ ਹੈ, ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਤੋਂ ਮਿਲੀ ਸਹੀ ਸੇਧ ਨੂੰ ਪੱਲੇ ਬੰਨ੍ਹ ਕੇ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਜਾਏਗੀ। ਜੇਕਰ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਦੋ ਮਹੀਨੇ ਦੇ ਅੰਦਰ ਅੰਦਰ ਕੋਈ ਉੱਤਰ ਨਾ ਆਇਆ ਤਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਸਮਝ ਲਵਾਂਗਾ ਕਿ ਇਸ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਦੇ ਛਾਪਣ ਲਈ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਸਹਿਮਤੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਾ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਹੈ। ਗੁਰ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਦੇ ਚਰਨਾਂ ਦੀ ਧੂੜ ਲੋਚਦਾ ਦਾਸਨ ਦਾਸ;
ਜਸਬਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਖਾਲਸਾ
ਸੇਵਾਦਾਰ
ਲਾਲੋ ਫਾਉਂਡੇਸ਼ਨ
ਪਤਾ:
Jasbinder Singh Khalsa
Post Box # 50237
DUBAI (U.A.E.)
00971-50-4987344
*ਭੂਮਿਕਾ​*ਭਾਈ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਭਾਈ ਕਾਨ੍ਹ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾਭਾ ਅਪਣੀ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਗੁਰਮਤ ਮਾਰਤੰਡ ਭਾਗ ਪਹਿਲਾ ਦੀ ਭੂਮਿਕਾ ਵਿੱਚ ਲਿਖਦੇ ਹਨ:- ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਪੰਥੀ ਮੇਰੇ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਗੁਰ ਭਾਈਓ!
ਗੁਰੁ ਬਾਣੀ ਦੇ ਅਭਿਯਾਸੀ ਅਤੇ ਕਾਵਯ ਦੇ ਗਯਾਤਾ ਹਨ, ਉਹ ਬਿਨਾ ਕਠਨਾਈ ਸਮਝ ਲੈਂਦੇ ਹਨ ਕਿ ਇਹ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਹੈ, ਜਾਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਦਾ ਨਾਉਂ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਕਿਸੇ ਹੋਰ ਦੀ ਰਚੀ ਹੋਈ ਬਾਣੀ ਹੈ।
ਕਬਿੱਤ-ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ ਜੀ
ਜੈਸੇ ਅਨੁਚਰ ਨਰਪਤਿ ਕੀ ਪਛਾਨੈ ਭਾਖਾ, ਬੋਲਤ ਬਚਨ ਖਿਨ ਬੂਝੈ ਬਿਨ ਦੇਖ ਹੀ।
ਜੈਸੇ ਜੌਹਰੀ ਪਰਖ ਜਾਨਤ ਹੈ ਰਤਨ ਕੀ, ਦੇਖਤ ਹੀ ਕਹੈ ਖਰੋ ਖੋਟੋ ਰੂਪ ਰੇਖ ਹੀ।
ਖੀਰ ਨੀਰ ਕੋ ਨਿਬੇਰੋ ਕਰਿ ਜਾਨੈ ਹੰਸ, ਰਾਖੀਯੈ ਮਿਲਾਇ ਭਿੰਨ ਭਿੰਨ ਕੈ ਸਰੇਖ ਹੀ।
ਗੁਰ ਸਬਦ ਸੁਨਤ ਪਹਿਚਾਨੈ ਸਿਖ, ਆਨ ਬਾਨੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਤਮੀ ਨ ਗਨਤ ਹੈ ਲੇਖ ਹੀ। {੫੭੦}
ਸਾਡੇ ਮੱਤ ਦੇ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਅਤੇ ਨਵੇਂ ਲੇਖਕਾਂ ਨੇ ਅਪਣੀ ਅਪਣੀ ਬੁੱਧੀ ਅਤੇ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਯ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ, ਇਤਿਹਾਸ, ਰਹਿਤਨਾਮੇ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਸਕਾਰ ਵਿਧੀ ਆਦਿਕ ਅਨੇਕ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਰਚੇ ਹਨ। ਜਿਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਸਾਨੂੰ ਬੇਅੰਤ ਲਾਭ ਅਤੇ ਹਾਨੀ ਹੋ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ, ਅਰਥਾਤ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਵਾਕ ਲਾਭ ਅਤੇ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਵਿਰੁੱਧ ਹਾਨੀ ਦਾ ਕਾਰਣ ਬਣ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ। ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਾਂ ਦੇ ਡੂੰਘੇ ਖੋਜ ਤੋਂ ਪ੍ਰਤੀਤ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਸਾਡੇ ਮੱਤ ਦੇ ਕਵੀਆਂ ਨੇ ਅਨਯਮਤੀ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਕਾਰਾਂ ਦੀ ਨਕਲ ਕਰਦੇ ਹੋਏ ਇਹ ਭਾਰੀ ਭੁੱਲ ਕੀਤੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਸਮਾਜ, ਨੀਤੀ ਅਤੇ ਧਰਮ ਆਦਿਕ ਦੇ ਵਿਸ਼ਯ ਇਕੱਠੇ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਸਭ ਨੂੰ ਮਜ਼ਹਬੀ ਰੰਗਤ ਦੇ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਹੈ। ਬਿਨਾ ਛਾਣਬੀਣ ਕੀਤੇ ਅਨੇਕ ਪ੍ਰਸੰਗ ਐਸੇ ਲਿਖੇ ਹਨ, ਜੋ ਮੂਲੋਂ ਨਿਰਮੂਲ ਅਥਵਾ ਗੁਰਮਤ ਤੋਂ ਦੂਰ ਲੈ ਜਾਣ ਵਾਲੇ ਹਨ। ਇਸ ਪਰ ਵੀ ਭਾਰੀ ਹੋਰ ਖੇਦ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਸਾਡੀ ਕੌਮ ਵਿੱਚ ਪਰਮਾਰਥ ਗਯਾਤਾ, ਸਤਯ ਦੇ ਖੋਜੀ ਵਿਦਵਾਨ ਬਹੁਤ ਹੀ ਘੱਟ ਹਨ, ਸਗੋਂ ਖੋਜੀਆਂ ਦੇ ਵੈਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਯਥਾਰਥ ਲਿਖਣ ਜਾਂ ਕਹਿਣ ਵਾਲਿਆਂ ਨੂੰ ਨਾਸਤਿਕ ਆਖਣ ਵਾਲਿਆਂ ਦੀ ਗਿਣਤੀ ਬਹੁਤੀ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਸੁਭਾਵਕ ਗੱਲ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਜਦ ਅਸੀਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਮੱਤ ਦੇ ਪੁਸਤਕਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਦੇਖਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਤਾਂ ਮਨ ਭ੍ਰਮ ਚੱਕ੍ਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੈ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਅਤੇ ਸਾਨੂੰ ਇਹ ਨਿਰਣਾ ਕਰਨਾ ਔਖਾ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਦਾ ਸੱਚਾ ਉਪਦੇਸਕ ਕਿਹੜਾ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਹੈ ਪਰ ਜਦੋਂ ਅਸੀਂ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਸ਼ਕਤੀ ਤੋਂ ਕੰਮ ਲੈਂਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਅਤੇ ਜਿਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਈਸਾਈ, ਹਿੰਦੂ, ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ਆਦਿਕਾਂ ਨੇ ਅੰਜੀਲ, ਵੇਦ ਅਤੇ ਕੁਰਾਨ ਆਦਿਕ ਧਰਮ ਪੁਸਤਕਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਅਪਣੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਮੱਤ ਵਿੱਚ ਸ਼ਰੋਮਣੀ ਜਾਣ ਕੇ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਵਚਨਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਅਤੇ ਵਿਰੁੱਧ ਵਚਨਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਅਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਮੰਨਿਆ ਹੈ। ਉਸੇ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਾਂ ਦੀ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਮੁਖਵਾਕ ਬਾਣੀ ਦੀ ਕਸੌਟੀ ਨਾਲ ਸਭ ਸਿੱਖ ਮਤ ਦੇ ਪੁਸਤਕਾਂ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰੀਖਿਆ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦੇ ਨਿਯਮਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਵਿਰੁੱਧ ਵਚਨਾਂ ਦਾ ਤਯਾਗ ਅਤੇ ਅਨੁਕੂਲ ਵਚਨਾਂ ਦਾ ਗ੍ਰਹਿਣ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਾਂ, ਤਾਂ ਸਾਰੀਆਂ ਕਠਿਨਾਈਆਂ ਛਿਨ ਵਿੱਚ ਮਿਟ ਜਾਂਦੀਆਂ ਹਨ ਅਤੇ ਅਸੀਂ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਦਾ ਸਿੱਧਾ ਰਸਤਾ ਲੱਭ ਲੈਂਦੇ ਹਾਂ।
੧. ਇਸਲਾਮ ਦੀ ਤਾਲੀਮ:- “ਕੁਰਾਨ ਪਿੱਛੋਂ ਕਿਹੜੀ ਕਿਤਾਬ ਹੈ, ਜਿਸ ਉੱਪਰ ਲੋਕ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਾ ਕਰਨਗੇ? “
(ਕੁਰਾਨ, ਸੂਰਤ ੭੯, ਆਯਤ ੫੦)
“ਜੋ ਅੱਲਾ ਦੇ ਰਸੂਲ ਦੀਆਂ ਹੱਦਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਉਲੰਘੇਗਾ, ਉਹ ਨਿੱਤਯ ਰਹਿਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਅੱਗ ਵਿੱਚ ਪਾਇਆ ਜਾਊ। “
(ਕੁਰਾਨ, ਸੂਰਤ ੪, ਆਯਤ ੧੪)
“ਜੋ ਅੱਲਾ ਅਤੇ ਉਸ ਦੇ ਰਸੂਲ ਦੇ ਹੁਕਮ ਪਰ ਚੱਲਦੇ ਹਨ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਹਾਲ ਪਰ ਅੱਲਾ ਰਹਿਮ ਕਰੇਗਾ। “
(ਕੁਰਾਨ, ਸੂਰਤ ੯, ਆਯਤ ੭੧)
੨. ਈਸਾਈ ਮਤ ਦੱਸਦਾ ਹੈ:-
“ਜੋ ਕੋਈ ਈਸਾ ਦੀ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਨੂੰ ਉਲੰਘਦਾ ਹੈ, ਪਰਮੇਸ੍ਵਰ ਉਸ ਦਾ ਨਹੀਂ। ਜੇ ਕੋਈ ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਪਾਸ ਆਵੇ ਅਤੇ ਈਸਾ ਦੀ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਨਾਲ ਨਾ ਲਿਆਵੇ, ਤਾਂ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਘਰ ਨਾ ਵੜਨ ਦਿਓ ਅਤੇ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਸਲਾਮ ਨਾ ਕਰੋ। “ (ਅੰਜੀਲ ਯੁਹੰਨਾ ਦੀ ਚਿੱਠੀ ੨, ਅਮਕ ੯-੧੦-੧੧)
੩. ਹਿੰਦੂ ਧਰਮ ਉਪਦੇਸ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ:- ‘ਧਰਮ` ਜਾਣਨ ਦੀ ਇੱਛਾ ਵਾਲੇ ਨੂੰ ਵੇਦ ਦਾ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਉੱਤਮ ਹੈ। (ਮਨੁ ਅਧਿਆਇ ੨, ਸਲੋਕ ੧੩)
ਜੋ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤੀਆਂ ਵੇਦ ਤੋਂ ਵਿਰੁੱਧ ਹਨ, ਓਹ ਸਭ ਨਿਸਫਲ ਅਤੇ ਨਰਕ ਫਲ ਦੇਣ ਵਾਲੀਆਂ ਹਨ (ਮਨੁ ਅਧਿਆਇ ੧੨, ਸਲੋਕ ੯੫) I
‘ਵੇਦ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤੀ ਅਤੇ ਪੁਰਾਣਾ ਵਿੱਚ ਜਿਸ ਗੱਲ ਦਾ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਹੋਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਵੇਦ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਮੁੱਖ ਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਹੈ, ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤੀ ਅਤੇ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਵਿੱਚ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਹੋਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤੀ ਦਾ ਵਚਨ ਮੰਨਣ ਜੋਗ ਹੈ। ` (ਵਯਾਸ ਸੰਹਿਤਾ, ਅਧਿਆਇ ੧, ਸਲੋਕ ੪)
੪. ਇਸੇ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਲਈ:-
ੳ. ਭਾਈ ਮਨੀ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਭਗਤ ਰਤਨਾਵਲੀ ਵਿੱਚ ਲਿਖਦੇ ਹਨ:- ਕਿ ਜੋ ਵਚਨ ਅਪਣੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਾਂ ਦੇ ਸ਼ਬਦ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਹੋਵੇ, ਸੋਈ ਸੁਣੇ, ਸੋਈ ਪੜ੍ਹੇ। ਗੁਰਾਂ ਦੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾਂ ਹੋਰ ਬਚਨ ਨਾ ਸੁਣੇ।
ਅ. ਭਾਈ ਗੁਰਦਾਸ ਜੀ ਆਗਯਾ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ:- ਵਿਣੁ ਗੁਰ ਬਚਨੁ ਜੁ ਮੰਨਣਾ, ਊਰਾ ਪਰਥਾਉ (ਵਾਰ੨੭ ਪਉੜੀ ੧੭)
ੲ. ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਅਰਜਨ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਚ ਫੁਰਮਾਉਂਦੇ ਹਨ:-
ਸੋ ਛੂਟੈ ਮਹਾ ਜਾਲ ਤੇ ਜਿਸੁ ਗੁਰ ਸਬਦੁ ਨਿਰੰਤਰਿ।। (ਆਸਾ ਮ: ੫ ਪੰਨਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ੩੯੭)
ਧੁਰ ਕੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਆਈ।। ਤਿਨਿ ਸਗਲੀ ਚਿੰਤ ਮਿਟਾਈ।। (ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮ: ੫ ਪੰਨਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ੬੨੮)
ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਗਾਵਹ ਭਾਈ।। ਓਹ ਸਫਲ ਸਦਾ ਸੁਖਦਾਈ।। (ਸੋਰਠਿ ਮ: ੫ ਪੰਨਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ੬੨੮)
ਸ. ਸ੍ਰੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਰਾਮਦਾਸ ਸਵਾਮੀ ਦਾ ਵਾਕ ਹੈ:-
ਬਾਣੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੁਰੂ ਹੈ ਬਾਣੀ ਵਿਚਿ ਬਾਣੀ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਸਾਰੇ।।
ਬਾਣੀ ਕਹੈ ਸੇਵਕੁ ਜਨੁ ਮਾਨੈ ਪਰਤਖਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਿਸਤਾਰੇ।। ੫।। (ਨਟ ਅਸਟਪਦੀ ਮ: ੪ ਪੰਨਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ੯੮੨)
ਹ. ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਅਮਰਦਾਸ ਤੀਜੇ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹ ਦਾ ਮਹਾਂਵਾਕ ਹੈ:-
ਆਵਹੁ ਸਿਖ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਕੇ ਪਿਆਰਿਹੋ ਗਾਵਹੁ ਸਚੀ ਬਾਣੀ।। ਬਾਣੀ ਤ ਗਾਵਹੁ ਗੁਰੂ ਕੇਰੀ ਬਾਣੀਆ ਸਿਰਿ ਬਾਣੀ।।
ਜਿਨ ਕਉ ਨਦਰਿ ਕਰਮੁ ਹੋਵੈ ਹਿਰਦੈ ਤਿਨਾ ਸਮਾਣੀ।। ਪੀਵਹੁ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਸਦਾ ਰਹਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਰੰਗਿ ਜਪਿਹੁ ਸਾਰਿਗਪਾਣੀ।।
ਨਾਨਕੁ ਸਦਾ ਗਾਵਹੁ ਏਹ ਸਚੀ ਬਾਣੀ।। ੨੩।।
ਬਿਨਾ ਹੋਰ ਕਚੀ ਹੈ ਬਾਣੀ।। ਬਾਣੀ ਤ ਕਚੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਬਾਝਹੁ ਹੋਰ ਕਚੀ ਬਾਣੀ।।
ਕਚੇ ਸੁਣਦੇ ਕਚੇ ਕਚੀ ਆਖਿ ਵਖਾਣੀ।। ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਿਤ ਕਰਹਿ ਰਸਨਾ ਕਹਿਆ ਕਛੂ ਨ ਜਾਣੀ।।
ਜਿਨ ਕਾ ਹਿਰਿ ਲਇਆ ਮਾਇਆ ਬੋਲਨਿ ਪਏ ਰਵਾਣੀ।। ਕਹੈ ਨਾਨਕੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਬਾਝਹੁ ਹੋਰ ਕਚੀ ਬਾਣੀ।। ੨੪।।
(ਰਾਮਕਲੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੩ ਅਨਦੁ, ਪੰਨਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ੯੨੦)
ਕ. ਜਗਤ ਗੁਰੂ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਨਾਨਕ ਦੇਵ ਆਗਯਾ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ:-
ਸਭਸੈ ਊਪਰਿ ਗੁਰ ਸਬਦੁ ਬੀਚਾਰੁ।। ਹੋਰ ਕਥਨੀ ਬਦਉ ਨ ਸਗਲੀ ਛਾਰੁ।। ੨।।
(ਰਾਮਕਲੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੧ ਪੰਨਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ੯੦੪)
ਜੇ ਅਸੀਂ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਚਨਾਂ ਤੇ ਪੱਕਾ ਨਿਸਚਾ ਰੱਖੀਏ ਤਾਂ ਕਦੇ ਵੀ ਭਰਮ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੈ ਕੇ ਕਿਸੇ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਦੇ ਅਪ੍ਰਮਾਣ ਵਚਨ ਪਰ ਸ਼ਰਧਾ ਨਾ ਕਰੀਏ। ਜੇਕਰ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦੀ ਹੀ ਗੱਲ ਕਰੀਏ ਤਾਂ ਸ੍ਵਰਗਵਾਸੀ ਗਿਆਨੀ ਭਾਗ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਅੰਬਾਲੇ ਵਾਲੇ, ਸ੍ਵਰਗਵਾਸੀ ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸੀਪਲ ਹਰਭਜਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ (ਸ਼ਹੀਦ ਸਿੱਖ ਮਿਸ਼ਨਰੀ ਕਾਲਜ), ਸ੍ਵਰਗਵਾਸੀ ਗੁਰਮੁਖ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਸਿੱਖ ਕੌਮ ਦੇ ਮਹਾਨ ਵਿਦਵਾਨ ਗੁਰਬਖ਼ਸ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਕਾਲ਼ਾ ਅਫਗਾਨਾ, ਵਿਸ਼ਵ ਸਿੱਖ ਬੁਲੇਟਿਨ ਦੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਿਕ ਸ੍ਰ: ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਅਤੇ ਸ਼ੇਰ ਗਿੱਲ ਯੂ. ਐਸ. ਏ. , ਸ੍ਰ: ਜੋਗਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਸਪੋਕਸਮੈਨ, ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਜੋਸ਼, ਕੰਵਰ ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਪ੍ਰਤਾਪ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸੀਪਲ ਹਰਭਜਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਸਿੱਖ ਮਿਸ਼ਨਰੀ ਕਾਲਜ, ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਲ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਚੰਦਨ, ਗਿਆਨੀ ਜਗਮੋਹਣ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਗਿਆਨੀ ਸੁਰਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦਿੱਲੀ, ਜਸਬੀਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਕੰਧਾਰੀ ਸਾਬਕਾ ਪ੍ਰਿੰਸੀਪਲ ਮਿਸ਼ਨਰੀ ਕਾਲਜ ਚੌਂਤਾ, ਇੰਜ: ਜਗਤਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਸ੍ਰ ਪ੍ਰਭਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਧਵਨ ਦੁਬਈ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਸਤਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਸ਼ਾਰਜਾ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਰਘਬੀਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਅਲੈਨ ਅਤੇ ਹੋਰ ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਹੀ ਵਿਦਵਾਨ ਅਤੇ ਬੇਅੰਤ ਮਿਸ਼ਨਰੀ ਵਿਦਿਆਰਥੀ ਭਾਈ ਕਾਨ੍ਹ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾਭਾ ਦੇ ਵਿਚਾਰਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਪੂਰਣ ਸਹਿਮਤੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ। ਜਦ ਅਸੀਂ ਸਿੱਖ ਜਗਤ ਚ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰੇ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਾਂ ਦੀ ਪੜਚੋਲ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਤਾਂ ਸਾਡਾ ਸਿਰ ਸ਼ਰਮ ਨਾਲ ਝੁੱਕ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ। ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਕੋਈ ਵੀ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਦੀ ਕਸਵੱਟੀ ਤੇ ਖ਼ਰੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਉਤਰਦੀ ਸਗੋਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਾਹਿਬਾਨ ਦਾ ਘੋਰ ਅਪਮਾਨ ਕਰਦੀ ਹੈ। ਜਦ ਕੋਈ ਵਿਦਵਾਨ ਕਿਸੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਾਰੇ ਸਹੀ ਜਾਣਕਾਰੀ ਦੇਣ ਲੱਗਦਾ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਦੇ ਵੱਡੇ ਪੁਜਾਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਤ ਸਾਧ ਅਥਵਾ ਕਥਿਤ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਗਿਆਨੀ ਬੜੀ ਬੇਸ਼ਰਮੀ ਨਾਲ ਪੰਥ ਚੋਂ ਛੇਕ ਦੇਣ ਦੇ ਡਰਾਵੇ ਦੇਂਦੇ ਹਨ। ਵੱਡੇ ਵੱਡੇ ਇੱਜਤਦਾਰ ਲੋਕ ਇਸ ਮਾਫੀਆ ਗਿਰੋਹ ਤੋਂ ਡਰ ਕੇ ਦੜ ਵੱਟ ਕੇ ਚੁੱਪ ਕਰ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਹਨ। ਮੈਂ ਸਮਝਦਾ ਹਾਂ ਕਿ ਪੁਜਾਰੀਆਂ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਕੀਤਾ ਇਹ ਕੁਕਰਮ ਸਿੱਖ ਧਰਮ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੋਰ ਗਿਰਾਵਟ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ।
ਬੜੇ ਲੰਮੇ ਸਮੇਂ ਤੋਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਾਰੇ ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਚਰਚੇ ਚਲੇ ਹਨ ਅਤੇ ਚੱਲ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ। ਜਿਸ ਵਿਦਵਾਨ ਨੇ ਵੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦਾ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਕੀਤਾ ਉਸੇ ਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਪੰਥ ਚੋਂ ਛੇਕ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਗਿਆ। ਸਾਡੇ ਪੁਜਾਰੀਆਂ ਅਤੇ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰਕਾਂ ਨੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਜਗਤ ਨੂੰ ਕਦੇ ਵੀ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਾਰੇ ਠੀਕ ਜਾਣਕਾਰੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਦਿੱਤੀ। ਸਿੱਖ ਪੰਥ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਜਾਣਨਾ ਚਾਹੁੰਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਆਖਰ ਇਸ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਚ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਕੀ ਹੈ? ਜਿਸ ਦਾ ਭਾਰੀ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਹੋ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ। ਸੰਗਤਿ ਪੁਜਾਰੀਆਂ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਅਪਣਾਏ ਰੁੱਖੇ ਰੁੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਵੀ ਸਮਝਣਾ ਚਾਹੁੰਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਆਖਰ ਕਿਉਂ ਇਸ ਬਾਰੇ ਲਿਖਣ ਤੇ ਪਾਬੰਦੀ ਹੈ? ਇਹ ਸਿੱਖ ਜਗਤ ਦਾ ਜਨਮ ਸਿੱਧ ਅਧਿਕਾਰ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਉਹ ਜਿਸ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਅੱਗੇ ਪੁਜਾਰੀ ਮੱਥੇ ਟਿਕਵਾਉਂਦੇ ਹਨ, ਆਪ ਸਿੱਜਦੇ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ, ਭਾਰੀ ਰਕਮਾਂ ਬਟੋਰ ਕੇ ਅਖੰਡ ਪਾਠ, ਸਹਿਜ ਪਾਠ ਤੇ ਸੰਪਟ ਪਾਠ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ ਅਤੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਬਰਾਬਰ ਪ੍ਰਕਾਸ਼ ਕਰਨਾ ਚਾਹੁੰਦੇ ਹਨ ਬਾਰੇ ਸਹੀ ਸਹੀ ਜਾਣਕਾਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਗਿਆਨ ਹਾਸਲ ਕਰੇ। ਜੇਕਰ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਨਾਲ ਦੇਖੀਏ ਤਾਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਨੂੰ ਇੱਕ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਮੰਨ ਲੈਣਾ ਅਤੇ ਉਸ ਦਾ ਲੇਖਕ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਮਿੱਥ ਲੈਣਾ ਭਾਰੀ ਭੁੱਲ ਹੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਸਗੋਂ ਮਹਾਂ ਮੂਰਖਤਾ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਕਬਿ ਸੂਮ, ਕਬਿ ਸਯਾਮ, ਕਬਿ ਰਾਮ ਤੇ ਕਬਿ ਕਾਲ ਵਲੋਂ ਰਚੇ ਗਏ ਆਪੋ ਅਪਣੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਾਂ ਦਾ ਸੁਮੇਲ ਹੈ। ਆਖੀ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਸੋਧਕ ਕਮੇਟੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਨੇ ਗੈਰਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਗੰਢ ਤੁਪ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਯੋਜਨਾਬਧ ਤਰੀਕੇ ਨਾਲ ਕਵੀਆਂ ਨਾਲ ਵੀ ਠੱਠਾ ਕੀਤਾ ਹੈ। ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀਆਂ ਰਚਨਾਵਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਇੱਕ ਦੂਜੇ ਨਾਲ ਰਲਗੱਡ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਕਿ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀ ਕੁਟਿਲ ਚਾਲ ਨੰਗੀ ਨਾ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੇ। ਜੇਕਰ ਅਸੀਂ ਕਵੀ ਸੂਮ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਤੋਰੀਏ ਤਾਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦਾ ਮੁੱਢਲਾ ਕਵੀ ਹੋਣ ਦਾ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਣ ਹਾਸਿਲ ਹੈ। ਓਹ ਅਪਣੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਦਾ ਅਰੰਭ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ:-


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ।।
ਅਥ
ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਲਿਖਯਤੇ।। ਪਾਤਿਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦।।
ਨੋਟ:- ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦ ਕਵੀ ਨੇ ਨਹੀਂ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਬਲਕਿ ਸੋਧ ਕਮੇਟੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਜਾਂ ਕਿਸੇ ਹੋਰ ਸਿੱਖ ਧਰਮ
ਦੀ ਕੱਟੜ ਦੁਸ਼ਮਣ ਸੰਸਥਾ ਨੇ ਲਿਖ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਹੈ।
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਨਮਸਕਾਰ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਖੜਗ ਕੋ ਕਰੌ ਸੁ ਹਿਤੁ ਚਿਤੁ ਲਾਇ।।
ਪੂਰਨ ਕਰੌ ਗਿਰੰਥ ਇਹ ਤੁਮ ਮੁਹਿ ਕਰਹੁ ਸਹਾਇ।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੩੯)
ਤ੍ਰਿਭੰਗੀ ਛੰਦ।। ਸ੍ਰੀ ਕਾਲ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਉਸਤਤਿ।।
ਜਿਹ ਜਿਹ ਬਿਧ ਜਨਮਨ ਸੁਧਿ ਆਈ।। ਤਿਮ ਤਿਮ ਕਹੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਨਾਈ।।
ਪ੍ਰਥਮੇ ਸਤਿਜੁਗ ਜਿਹ ਬਿਧਿ ਲਹਾ।। ਪ੍ਰਥਮੇ ਦੇਬਿ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਕੋ ਕਹਾ।। ੧੦।।
ਪਹਿਲੇ ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਬਨਾਯੋ।। ਨਖ ਸਿਖ ਤੇ ਕ੍ਰਮ ਭਾਖ ਸੁਨਾਯੋ।।
ਛੋਰ ਕਥਾ ਤਬ ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਸੁਨਾਈ।। ਅਬ ਚਾਹਤ ਫਿਰ ਕਰੌ ਬਡਾਈ।। ੧੧।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੭੩)
ਅਥ ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਉਕਤਿ ਬਿਲਾਸ (ਪੰਨਾ ੭੩)
ਸ੍ਵੈਯਾ।। ਦੇਹਿ ਸਿਵਾ ਬਰ ਮੋਹਿ ਇਹੈ ………………………………।। ੨੩੧।।
ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਕਵਿੱਤਨ ਮੈ ਬਰਨਿਓ ਸਭ ਹੀ ਰਸ ਰੁਦ੍ਰ ਮਈ ਹੈ।।
ਏਕ ਤੇ ਏਕ ਰਸਾਲ ਭਇਓ ਨਖ ਤੇ ਸਿਖ ਲਉ ਉਪਮਾ ਸੁ ਨਈ ਹੈ।।
ਕਉਤਕ ਹੇਰ ਕਰੀ ਕਵਿ ਨੇ ਸਤਿਜੁਗ ਕੀ ਕਥਾ ਇਹ ਪੂਰੀ ਭਈ ਹੈ।।
ਜਾਹਿ ਨਮਿੱਤ ਪੜੈ ਸੁਨਿ ਹੈ ਨਰ ਸੋ ਨਿਸਚੈ ਕਰਿ ਤਾਹਿ ਦਈ ਹੈ।। ੨੩੨।।
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਤਿਯਸ ਕੋ ਕਰਿਓ ਜਾ ਸਮ ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਕੋਇ।।
ਜਿਹ ਨਿਮੱਤ ਕਵਿ ਨੇ ਕਹਿਓ ਸੁ ਦੇਹ ਚੰਡਕਾ ਸੋਇ।। ੨੩੩।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੯੬)
ਕਵੀ ਸੂਮ ਅਪਣੀ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾ ਤੇ ਮੋਹਰ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਲਾਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ:-
ਪੜੇ ਮੂੜ ਧਨੰ ਧਾਮ ਬਾਢੇ।। ਸੁਨੈ ਸੂਮ ਸੋਫੀ ਲਰੈ ਜੁੱਧ ਗਾਢੇ।।
ਜਗੈ ਰੈਣਿ ਜੋਗੀ ਜਪੈ ਜਾਪ ਯਾਕੋ।। ਧਰੈ ਪਰਮ ਜੋਗੀ ਲਹੇ ਸਿੱਧਤਾ ਕੋ।। ੮।। ੨੬੦।।
(ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕੇ ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰੇ ਪੰਨਾ ੧੧੮)
ਕਵੀ ਸੂਮ ਅਪਣੀ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾ ਦੇ ਜ਼ੌਹਰ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਖੂਬ ਦਿਖਾਉਂਦਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਅਪਣੇ ਕਵੀ ਹੋਣ ਦਾ
ਸਬੂਤ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ:-
ਸੂਰਨ ਕੇ ਲੋਮਾ ਭੇ ਖਰੇ।। ਕਾਤਰ ਨਿਰਖਿ ਧਾਮ ਰਨ ਬਰੇ।।
ਸੋਫੀ ਸੂਮ ਭਏ ਬਹੁ ਬਯਾਕੁਲ।। ਦਸੋ ਦਿਸਨ ਭਜਿ ਚਲੇ ਡਰਾਕਲ।। ੩੨੦।।
(ਚਾਰ ਸੌ ਚਾਰ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪੰਨਾ ੧੩੮੨)
ਅਤੇ ਅੰਤ ਚ ਅਪਣੇ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਰਚੇ ਗਏ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੀ ਸਮਾਪਤੀ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਕਾਵਿ ਬੰਦਾਂ ਰਾਹੀਂ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ:-
ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕਰੀ ਹਮ ਪਰ ਜਗਮਾਤਾ।। ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਕਰਾ ਪੂਰਨ ਸੁਭ ਰਾਤਾ।।
ਕਿਲਬਿਖ ਸਕਲ ਦੇਹ ਕੋ ਹਰਤਾ।। ਦੁਸ਼ਟ ਦੋਖਿਯਨ ਕੋ ਛੈ ਕਰਤਾ।। ੪੦੨।।
ਸ੍ਰੀ ਅਸਿਧੁਜ ਜਬ ਭਏ ਦਯਾਲਾ।। ਪੂਰਨ ਕਰਾ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਤਤਕਾਲਾ।।
ਮਨ ਬਾਂਛਤ ਫਲ ਪਾਵੈ ਸੋਈ।। ਦੂਖ ਨ ਤਿਸੈ ਬਿਆਪਤ ਕੋਈ।। ੪੦੩।।
ਚੌਪਈ।। ਸੰਬਤ ਸੱਤ੍ਰਹ ਸਹਸ ਭਣਿੱਜੈ।। ਅਰਧ ਸਹਸ ਫੁਨਿ ਤੀਨਿ ਕਹਿੱਜੈ।।
ਭਾਦ੍ਰਵ ਸੁਦੀ ਅਸ਼ਟਮੀ ਰਵਿਵਾਰਾ।। ਤੀਰ ਸਤੁੱਦ੍ਰਵ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੁਧਾਰਾ।। ੪੦੪।।
(ਚਾਰ ਸੌ ਚਾਰ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪੰਨਾ ੧੩੮੮)
ਕਵੀ ਸੂਮ ਅਪਣੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੇ ਰਚੇ ਜਾਣ ਦਾ ਢੁਕਵਾਂ ਵੇਰਵਾ ਸੱਚੋ ਸੱਚ ਬਿਆਨ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਬੜੇ ਮਾਣ ਨਾਲ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਇਹ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਮੈ 1753 ਸੰਬਤ ਨੂੰ ਭਾਦੋਂ ਮਹੀਨੇ ਦੇ ਚਾਨਣ ਪੱਖ ਦੀ ਅੱਠਿਓਂ ਦਿਨ ਰਵੀਵਾਰ ਨੂੰ ਸਤਿਲੁਜ ਦੇ ਕੰਢੇ ਬੈਠ ਕੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਪਰ ਹਯਾ ਦੇ ਅੰਨੇ ਸਾਡੇ ਪੁਜਾਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਤ ਸਾਧ ਇਸ ਨੂੰ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦ ਲਿਖ ਲਿਖ ਕੇ ਗੁਰ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਮੂਰਖ ਬਣਾਈ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ। ਕਵੀ ਸੂਮ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਗੱਲ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਦੀ ਜਿਸ ਨੂੰ ਸੋਧ ਕਮੇਟੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਨੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਨੰਬਰ ਤੇ ਰੱਖਿਆ ਹੈ। ਉਸ ਨੇ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਗਿਆਨ ਪ੍ਰਬੋਧ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਫਿਰ ਚਉਬੀਸ ਅਵਤਾਰ। ਉਸ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਸਬੂਤਾਂ ਦਾ ਵੇਰਵਾ ਮੈਂ ਆਪ ਸਮੂਹ ਸਿੱਖ ਜਗਤ ਸਾਮ੍ਹਣੇ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਕਰ ਰਿਹਾ ਹਾਂ:-
ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ।। ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਜੀ ਸਹਾਇ।।
ਵਾਰ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੧੧੮ ਤੋਂ ੧੨੭ ਤੱਕ)
ਅਤੇ
ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ।। ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਜੀ ਸਹਾਇ।।
ਅਥ ਗਿਆਨ ਪ੍ਰਬੋਧ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਲਿਖਯਤੇ।।
ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦ (ਪੰਨਾ ੧੧੮ ਤੋਂ ੧੨੭ ਤੱਕ)
ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ।। ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦
ਅਥ ਚਉਬੀਸ ਅਉਤਾਰ (ਪੰਨਾ ੧੫੫ ਤੋਂ ੨੫੪ ਤੱਕ)
ਸਿੱਖ ਧਰਮ ਦੇ ਮਹਾਂ ਨਿੰਦਕਾਂ ਨੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਪੰਥ ਨੂੰ ਕਮਜੋਰ ਕਰਨ ਲਈ ਅਤੇ ਧੋਖਾ ਦੇਣ ਲਈ ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ, ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ਅਤੇ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦ ਲਿਖ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਤਾਂ ਕਿ ਇਹ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਵ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜਾ ਸਕੇ ਕਿ ਇਹ ਦਸਮ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹ ਦੀ ਹੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਹੈ ਪਰ ਕਿਉਂ ਕਿ ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਭਗਾਉਤੀ ਦਾ ਪੁਜਾਰੀ ਹੈ ਉਹ ਅਪਣੀ ਹਰ ਰਚਨਾ ਚ ਉਸੇ ਦੀ ਜੈ ਜੈ ਕਾਰ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਉਸ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਸੁਰੂ ਕੀਤੇ ਚਉਬੀਸ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਦੇ ਪਹਿਲੇ ਪੜਾਅ ਦਾ ਅੰਤ ਓਹ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ:-
ਸੰਮਤ ਸੱਤ੍ਰਹ ਸਹਸ ਪਚਾਵਨ।। ਹਾੜਵਦੀ ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮੈ ਸੁਖ ਦਾਵਨ।।
ਤ੍ਵ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ਕਰਿ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੁਧਾਰਾ।। ਭੂਲ ਪਰੀ ਲਹੁ ਲੇਹੁ ਸੁਧਾਰਾ।। ੮੬੦।।
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਨੇਤ੍ਰ ਤੁੰਗ ਕੇ ਚਰਨ ਤਰ ਸਤਦ੍ਰੱਵ ਤੀਰ ਤਰੰਗ।।
ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਵਤ ਪੂਰਨ ਕੀਯੋ ਰਘੁਬਰ ਕਥਾ ਪ੍ਰਸੰਗ।। ੮੬੧।।
ਸਾਧ ਅਸਾਧ ਜਾਨੋ ਨਹੀ ਬਾਦ ਸੁਬਾਦ ਬਿਬਾਦਿ।।
ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਕਲ ਪੂਰਣ ਕੀਯੋ ਭਗਵਤ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ।। ੮੬੨।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੨੫੪)
ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਸੰਮਤ ੧੭੫੫ ਦੇ ਹਾੜ ਮਹੀਨੇ ਦੇ ਹਨੇਰ ਪੱਖ ਦੀ ਏਕਮ (ਪਹਿਲੀ) ਨੂੰ ਸਤਿਲੁਜ ਦੀ ਪਹਾੜੀ ਦੇ ਕੰਢੇ ਬੈਠ ਕੇ ਮੈਂ ਇਸ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਵਤ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਨੂੰ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਿਸ ਵਿੱਚ ਰਾਮ ਚੰਦਰ ਦੀ ਕਥਾ ਦਾ ਵਰਨਣ ਹੈ। ਕਵੀ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਇਹ ਭਗਵਤ (ਭਗਾਉਤੀ) ਦੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਸੰਭਵ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ। ਪਹਿਲੇ ਪੜਾਅ ਦਾ ਪਹਿਲਾ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਕਰਨ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਕਵੀ ਅਪਣੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੀ ਸਮਾਪਤੀ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਅੱਖਰਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ:-
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਸੱਤ੍ਰਹ ਸੈ ਪੈਤਾਲ ਮੈ ਕੀਨੀ ਕਥਾ ਸੁਧਾਰ।।
ਚੂਕ ਹੋਇ ਜਹ ਤਹ ਸੁ ਕਬਿ ਲੀਜਹੁ ਸਕਲ ਸੁਧਾਰ।। ੭੫੫।।
ਬਿਨਤ ਕਰੋ ਦੋਊ ਜੋਰਿ ਕਰਿ ਸੁਨੋ ਜਗਤ ਕੇ ਰਾਏ।।
ਮੋ ਮਸਤਕ ਤ੍ਵੈ ਪਗ ਸਦਾ ਰਹੈ ਦਾਸ ਕੇ ਭਾਇ।। ੭੫੬।।
(ਇਤਿ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਸਿਕੰਧੇ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਪੰਨਾ ੩੫੪)
ਇਸ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਕੀਤੇ ਤੀਜੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੀ ਪੁਸਟੀ ਉਸ ਦੀ ਅਪਣੀ ਹੀ ਜੁਬਾਨੀ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਹੁੰਦੀ ਹੈ:-
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਸਤ੍ਰਹ ਸੈ ਚਵਤਾਲ ਮੈਂ ਸਾਵਨ ਸੁਦਿ ਬੁਧਵਾਰ।।
ਨਗਰ ਪਾਵਟਾ ਮੋ ਤੁਮੋ ਰਚਿਯੋ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸੁਧਾਰ।। ੯੮੩।।
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਖੜਗਪਾਨ ਕੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਤੇ ਪੋਥੀ ਰਚੀ ਬਿਚਾਰ।।
ਭੂਲਿ ਹੋਇ ਜਹਂ ਤਹਿਂ ਸੁ ਕਬਿ ਪੜੀਅਹੁ ਸਭੈ ਸੁਧਾਰ।। ੯੮੪।।
(ਇਤਿ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਦਸਮ ਸਿਕੰਧੇ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਗ੍ਰੰਥੇ ਪੰਨਾ ੩੮੬)
ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਅਪਣੇ ਚੌਥੇ ਅਤੇ ਅੰਤਿਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੇ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਹੋਣ ਦੀ ਪੁਸਟੀ ਕਰਦਿਆਂ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ:-
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਸੱਤ੍ਰਹ ਸੈ ਪੈਤਾਲ ਮਹਿ ਸਾਵਨ ਸੁਦਿ ਥਿਤਿ ਦੀਪ।।
ਨਗਰ ਪਾਂਵਟ ਸੁਭ ਕਰਨ ਜਮਨਾ ਬਹੈ ਸਮੀਪ।। ੨੪੯੦।।
ਦਸਮ ਕਥਾ ਭਾਗਉਤ ਕੀ ਭਾਖਾ ਕਰੀ ਬਨਾਇ।।
ਅਵਰ ਬਾਸਨਾ ਨਾਹਿ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਧਰਮ ਜੁੱਧ ਕੇ ਚਾਇ।। ੨੪੯੧।। (ਦਸਮ ਸਿਕੰਧੇ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਪੰਨਾ ੩੮੬)
ਨੋਟ:- ਆਪ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਚੰਗੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਘੋਖ ਹੀ ਲਿਆ ਹੋਏਗਾ ਕਿ ਸੰਮਤ 1755 ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਆਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਜਾਂ 1745 ਅਤੇ 1744 ਤੇ ਫਿਰ 1745 ਇਹ ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਹੋ ਗਿਆ ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਸੋਧ ਕਮੇਟੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਸਣੇ ਪੁਜਾਰੀਆਂ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਤਾਂ ਸਾਧਾਂ ਦੇ, ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਮੂਰਖ ਸਮਝਦੇ ਹਨ। ਉਹ ਚੰਗੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਜਾਣਦੇ ਹਨ ਕਿ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਕੁਫਰ ਅੱਗੇ ਕਿਸੇ ਨੇ ਸਾਹ ਨਹੀਂ ਕੱਢਣਾ ਤੇ ਜੇਕਰ ਕਿਸੇ ਬੋਲਣ ਦੀ ਹਿੰਮਤ ਕੀਤੀ ਤਾਂ ਪੰਥ ਤੋਂ ਛੇਕਣ ਦਾ ਫਤਵਾ ਜੜ ਦੇਵਾਂਗੇ ਅਤੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੇ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਗੁਰੂਆਂ ਦੀ ਉਪਮਾ ਕੀਤੀ ਤੇ ਫਿਰ ਤਰਤੀਬ ਨਾਲ ਅਪਣੀ ਸ਼ਰਧਾ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਸਥਾਨ ਦੇ ਦਿੱਤਾ। ਲੱਗ-ਭੱਗ 500 ਵਾਰ ਤੋਂ ਵੀ ਵੱਧ ਹਰ ਸੱਵਯੇ ਤੇ ਚੌਪਈ ਅਥਵਾ ਹੋਰ ਛੰਦ ਬੰਦੀ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਓਹ ਅਪਣੇ ਆਪ ਨੂੰ ਕਬਿ ਸਯਾਮ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ ਪਰ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਅਣਡਿੱਠਾ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਮਹਾਂ ਗੰਦੇ ਤੇ ਬੇਸ਼ਰਮ ਲੋਕ ਇਸ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਕਹੀਂ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਹਨ ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਦੀ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਸੁੰਦਰ ਰੰਗ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਚ ਖੂਬ ਦੇਖਣ ਨੂੰ ਮਿਲਦੇ ਹਨ। ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਨੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਬਾਕੀ ਦੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਨਗਰ ਪਾਂਵਟਾ (ਪਾਉਂਟਾ) ਸੰਬਤ 1744 ਅਤੇ 1745 ਵਿੱਚ ਸਾਵਣ ਮਹੀਨੇ ਦੀ ਪੂਰਨਮਾਸੀ ਦਿਨ ਬੁੱਧਵਾਰ ਅਤੇ ਸਾਵਣ ਮਹੀਨੇ ਦੀ ਹੀ ਪੂਰਨਮਾਸੀ ਨੂੰ ਅਗਲੇ ਸਾਲ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਕੀਤੇ ਹਨ ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਚ ਕੋਈ ਦਮ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਪਾਉਂਟਾ ਨਗਰ ਜਮਨਾ ਦੇ ਕੰਢੇ ਕੋਈ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਹੈ।
ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਵਾਰੀ ਆਉਂਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਬਿ ਰਾਮ ਦੀ। ਤ੍ਰਿਯ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਦਾ ਇਹ ਮੁਢਲਾ ਕਵੀ ਹੋਣ ਦਾ ਮਾਣ ਰੱਖਦਾ ਹੈ। ਇਸ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਰਚੇ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਦੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਆਪ ਜੀ ਇਸੇ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੜ੍ਹਨ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਹੋ। ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਨੇ 150 ਤੋਂ ਵੀ ਵੱਧ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾਵਾਂ ਰੱਚ ਕੇ ਬਹੁਤਿਆਂ ਤੋਂ ਵਾਹ ਵਾਹ ਖੱਟੀ ਹੈ। ਸਾਡੇ ਪੁਜਾਰੀ ਇਸ ਵਿਚਾਰੇ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੱਸੀਂ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ। ਸੋਧ ਕਮੇਟੀ ਅਤੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਨੇ ਉਸ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਰਚੇ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦਾ ਸਮਾਂ ਤੇ ਸਥਾਨ ਲੁਕੋ ਲਿਆ ਹੈ ਫਿਰ ਵੀ ਚੋਰ ਦੀ ਦਾੜ੍ਹੀ ਚ ਤਿਣਕੇ ਦੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਅਸਲੀ ਚੇਹਰਾ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਹੋ ਜਾਣ ਤੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਪੰਥ ਲਈ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਹੈ।
ਕਵੀ ਸਯਾਮ ਦੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਕਬਿ ਕਾਲ ਵੀ ਅਜਿਹਾ ਕਵੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਉਸ ਦੇ ਆਦਿ ਤੇ ਅੰਤ ਦਾ ਖੁਰਾ ਖੋਜ ਮਿਟਾ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ। ਫਿਰ ਵੀ ਉਸ ਦੀਆਂ ਰਚਨਾਵਾਂ ਦੀ ਸਹਿਕਦੀ ਧੜ ਤੜਫ ਤੜਫ ਕੇ ਆਖਦੀ ਹੈ ਹੇ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖੋ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨਾ ਬਣਾਓ ਮੈ ਉਸ ਜੋਗਾ ਨਹੀਂ ਹਾਂ ਮੇਰੇ ਤੇ ਤਰਸ ਕਰੋ ਪਰ ਮਾਫੀਆ ਗਿਰੋਹ ਉਸ ਦੀ ਸੁਣਦਾ ਕਿੱਥੇ ਹੈ। ਹੁਣ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦੀ ਕਚੈਹਿਰੀ ਚ ਵਿਚਾਰਾ ਫਰਿਯਾਦ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਹਾਜ਼ਰ ਹੈ ਦੇਖਣਾ ਹੈ ਓਹ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਇਨਸਾਫ ਦੇਂਦੇ ਹਨ ਜਾਂ ਨਹੀਂ।
ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਨੂੰ ਹੇਠ ਲਿਖੇ ਉਪਦੇਸ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ:-
੧. ਪਿਓ ਅਪਣੀ ਧੀ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
੨. ਮਾਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਹੀ ਪੁੱਤ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦੀ ਹੈ ਜਾਂ ਯਾਰ ਨੂੰ ਪੁੱਤ ਬਣਾ ਕੇ ਹਮ ਬਿਸਤ੍ਰ ਹੋ ਸਕਦੀ ਹੈ।
੩. ਭੈਣ ਅਪਣੇ ਸਕੇ ਭਰਾ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦੀ ਹੈ।
੪. ਦੇਵਰ ਅਤੇ ਜੇਠ ਅਪਣੀ ਭਰਜਾਈ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦੇ ਹਨ।
੫. ਮੁੰਡਾ ਮੁੰਡੇ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
੬. ਧੀ ਅਪਣੇ ਪਿਓ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦੀ ਹੈ।
੭. ਪੁੱਤ ਅਪਣੀ ਮਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
੮. ਭਰਾ ਅਪਣੀ ਸਕੀ ਭੈਣ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
੯. ਭਰਜਾਈ ਦੇਵਰ ਤੇ ਜੇਠ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਭੋਗ ਕਰ ਸਕਦੀ ਹੈ।
੧੦. ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਭਾਂਗ, ਹਫੀਮ, ਚਰਸ, ਤੰਮਾਕੂ, ਗਾਂਜਾ, ਸ਼ਰਾਬ ਤੇ ਪੋਸਤ ਖੁੱਲ੍ਹ ਕੇ ਖਾ ਪੀ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੧. ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਬਾਲ ਸਫ਼ਾ ਲਗਾ ਕੇ ਰੋਮਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਸਾਫ ਕਰ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੨. ਕੁੱਠਾ ਖਾਣ ਨੂੰ ਪਵਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਸਮਝਦਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਨਸ਼ੇ ਨਾਲ ਕਬਾਬ ਖਾਣ ਲਈ ਪ੍ਰੇਰਨਾ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੩. ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਬਾਲ ਸਫ਼ਾ ਲਗਾ ਕੇ ਦਾੜ੍ਹੀ ਮੁੱਛਾਂ ਸਾਫ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਔਰਤ ਦਾ ਭੇਸ ਧਾਰ ਕੇ ਪਰਾਈਆਂ ਔਰਤਾਂ ਭੋਗ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ।
ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਰਹਿਤ ਮਰਯਾਦਾ ਦਾ ਭੋਗ ਪਾਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ:-
੧. ਪਰਾਈ ਇਸਤ੍ਰੀ ਜਾਂ ਪਰਾਏ ਮਰਦ ਦਾ ਸੰਗ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰਨਾ - ਦੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਅਤੇ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਨੂੰ ਮੂਲੋਂ ਹੀ ਨਿਕਾਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੨. ਨਸ਼ਿਆਂ ਦੀ ਵਰਤੋਂ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰਨੀ – ਦੀ ਉੱਤਮ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਨੂੰ ਓਹ ਟਿੱਚਰਾਂ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਭਾਂਗ, ਹਫੀਮ, ਚਰਸ, ਤੰਮਾਕੂ, ਗਾਂਜਾ, ਸ਼ਰਾਬ ਤੇ ਪੋਸਤ ਖਾਣ ਪੀਣ ਨੂੰ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੩. ਰੋਮਾਂ ਦੀ ਬੇਅਦਬੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਰਨੀ – ਬਾਲ ਸਫ਼ਾ ਲਗਾ ਕੇ ਬਾਲ ਸਾਫ਼ ਕਰਨ ਦੀ ਦੁਹਾਈ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੪. ਕੁੱਠਾ ਨਹੀਂ ਖਾਣਾ – ਦੀ ਖੁੱਲ ਕੇ ਮੁਖ਼ਾਲਫ਼ਿਤ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੫. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਕਤਲ ਕਰਨ ਦੇ ਰੁਝਾਨ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੬. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਕੁੜੀਆਂ ਨੂੰ ਮਿੱਤਰ ਨਾਲ ਭੱਜ ਜਾਣ ਲਈ ਵਰਗਲਾਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੭. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਚੋਰੀ ਕਰਨ ਲਈ ਅਤੇ ਠੱਗੀਆਂ ਮਾਰਨ ਲਈ ਉਤਸ਼ਾਹਿਤ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੮. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਪਤੀ ਪਤਨੀ ਦੇ ਪਵਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਰਿਸ਼ਤੇ ਨੂੰ ਸ਼ੱਕੀ ਬਣਾਉਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੯. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਮੁੱਚੀ ਔਰਤ ਜਾਤ ਨੂੰ ਦਬਾ ਕੇ ਰੱਖਣ ਦੀ ਦੁਹਾਈ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੦. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਔਰਤ ਨੂੰ ਕੁੱਟ ਕੇ ਕਾਬੂ ਚ ਰੱਖਣ ਲਈ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੧. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੂਜਿਆਂ ਦੇ ਘਰ ਲੁੱਟਣ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰੇਰਨਾ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਹਰ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਦਾ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ ਅਤੇ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਰਾਹਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਮੁੜ ਉਸਾਰਦਾ ਹੈ:-
੧. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਮੂਰਤੀ ਪੂਜਾ ਚ ਵਿਸ਼ਵਾਸ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੨. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਮੂਹ ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਤਾਵਾਂ ਦੀ ਪੂਜਾ ਲਈ ਪ੍ਰੇਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੩. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਵੇਦਾਂ ਦਾ ਪਾਠ-ਪਰਾਣਾਂ ਅਤੇ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਤੀਆਂ ਦੇ ਪਾਠ ਪੂਜਾ ਲਈ ਜ਼ੋਰ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੪. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਤੀਰਥ ਇਸ਼ਨਾਨ ਕਰਨ ਨੂੰ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੫. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਅਕਾਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਨੂੰ ਨਹੀਂ ਬਲ ਕਿ ਕਾਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਨੂੰ ਮੰਨਦਾ ਹੈ।
੬. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਰੱਬੀ ਹੋਂਦ ਤੋਂ ਮੁਨਕਰ ਹੈ।
੭. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਕਬਰਾਂ ਦੀ ਪੂਜਾ ਕਰਨ ਨੂੰ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੮. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਜੁਗਾਂ ਚ ਵਿਸ਼ਵਾਸ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੯. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਭੂਤਾਂ ਪ੍ਰੇਤਾਂ ਦੀ ਹੋਂਦ ਨੂੰ ਸਵੀਕਾਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੦. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਲੀ ਦੇਣ ਨੂੰ ਪੁੰਨ ਸਮਝਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੧. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਹਵਨ ਤੇ ਜੱਗ ਕਰਾਉਣ ਲਈ ਪੁਕਾਰ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੨. ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਬਾਰੇ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੀ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਸਿੱਖਿਆ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਲਕੁਲ ਉਲਟੀ ਹੈ।
੧੩. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦਾਨ ਕਰਨ ਨੂੰ ਬੜੀ ਮਹਤੱਤਾ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੪. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਅਪਣੀ ਔਰਤ ਬਾਮ੍ਹਣ ਨੂੰ ਦਾਨ ਕਰਨ ਲਈ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੫. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਰੱਬ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਂ ਦੇ ਪੇਟ ਤੋਂ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੬. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਨੀਵੀਆਂ ਜਾਤਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਮਖੌਲ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੭. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਗਨਾਂ ਅਪਸਗਨਾਂ ਦਾ ਖੂਬ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੮. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੂਜਿਆਂ ਦੀਆਂ ਔਰਤਾਂ ਜਬਰਦਸਤੀ ਖੋਹ ਕੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਘਰ ਰੱਖਣ ਲਈ ਉਤਸ਼ਾਹਿਤ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੧੯. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਅਵਤਾਰਾਂ ਚ ਵਿਸ਼ਵਾਸ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ।
੨੦. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਚ ਨਰਕ ਤੇ ਸਵਰਗ ਦੋਵੇਂ ਥਾਵਾਂ ਕਾਇਮ ਹਨ।
੨੧. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਚ ਕਾਮ ਹੀ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਵੱਡੀ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤੀ ਹੈ।
੨੨. ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਕੋਕ ਸਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਪੜ੍ਹਨ ਅਤੇ ਉਸ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਭੋਗ ਕਰਨ ਨੂੰ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ।
*ਕੁੱਝ ਅਪਣੇ ਬਾਰੇ*:-ਮੈਂ ਪਹਿਲੀ ਜਨਵਰੀ 2003 ਨੂੰ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਾਰੇ ਲਿਖਣਾ ਸ਼ੁਰੂ ਕੀਤਾ। ਜਦ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਸਪੋਕਸਮੈਨ ਮੈਗਜੀਨ ਰਾਹੀਂ ਇਹ ਜਾਣਕਾਰੀ ਮਿਲੀ ਕਿ ਚੰਡੀਗੜ੍ਹ ਵਰਲਡ ਸਿੱਖ ਕੰਨਵੈਨਸ਼ਨ ਅਕਤੂਬਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੋਣ ਜਾ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਇਸ ਕੰਨਵੈਨਸ਼ਨ ਵਿੱਚ ਹਾਜ਼ਰੀ ਭਰਨ ਲਈ ਸਪੋਕਸਮੈਨ ਚ ਦਿੱਤੇ ਫਾਰਮ ਨੂੰ ਫੋਟੋ ਸਮੇਤ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਦਫਤਰ ਭੇਜ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਅਤੇ ਰਾਤ ਦਿਨ ਅਣਥੱਕ ਮਿਹਨਤ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਾਰੇ ਤਕੜੀ ਸਮੱਗ੍ਰੀ ਇਕੱਠੀ ਕਰ ਲਈ। ਮੇਰੀ ਇੱਛਾ ਸੀ ਕਿ ਮੈਂ ਸਰਬੱਤ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਸਮੇਲਨ ਦੀ ਸਟੇਜ ਤੋਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਰੱਖਾਂ। ਮੈਂ 1960 ਤੋਂ (ਬਾਲ ਉਮਰ ਤੋਂ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਅੱਜ ਤਾਂਈ) ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਸਬਦਾਂ ਦੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ, ਕਵਿਤਾਵਾਂ ਤੇ ਲੈਕਚਰ ਨਿਸ਼ਕਾਮ ਰਹਿ ਕੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਸਟੇਜਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਕਰਦਾ ਆ ਰਿਹਾ ਹਾਂ। 16 ਅਕਤੂਬਰ 2003 ਨੂੰ ਮੈਂ ਚੰਡੀਗੜ੍ਹ, ਪਹੁੰਚ ਕੇ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਸਤਿਕਾਰ ਯੋਗ ਮੇਜਰ ਜਨਰਲ ਨਰਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਨਿਵਾਸ ਸਥਾਨ ਤੇ ਮਿਲਿਆ ਅਤੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਲਿਖੇ ਲੇਖ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਦਿਖਾਏ। ਮੇਜਰ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਝੱਟ ਹੀ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਅਪਣੀ ਕਾਰ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰ: ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪ੍ਰੋਫੈਸਰ ਆਫ਼ ਸਿੱਖਇਜ਼ਮ ਦੇ ਕੋਲ ਲੈ ਗਏ ਜਿੱਥੇ ਕਈ ਪੁਰਾਣੇ ਮਿੱਤ੍ਰਾਂ (ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੋਸ਼, ਕੰਵਰ ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਪ੍ਰਤਾਪ ਸਿੰਘ ਤੇ ਗੁਰਚਰਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਗਰੋਵਰ) ਨੂੰ ਮਿਲ ਕੇ ਮਨ ਨੂੰ ਬੜੀ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਹੋਈ। ਮੈਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਲਿਖੇ ਲੇਖ ਸ੍ਰ: ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਪੜ੍ਹਨ ਲਈ ਦਿੱਤੇ ਅਤੇ ਇਸੇ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਸ੍ਰ: ਜੋਗਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਸਪੋਕਸਮੈਨ ਨੂੰ ਲਿਖੇ ਗਏ ਸਾਰ ਅਤੇ ਲੇਖ ਦਿਖਾਏ। ਸ੍ਰ: ਜੋਗਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਨੇ ਕੁੱਝ ਪੰਨੇ ਹੋਰ ਲਿਖਣ ਦੀ ਸਲਾਹ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਜਦ ਕਿ ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਮੇਰੇ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਲਿਖੇ ਗਏ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਦੇ ਸਾਰਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਹੋਰ ਵਿਸਥਾਰ ਦੇਣ ਲਈ ਕਿਹਾ, ਮੇਰੇ ਮਿਤ੍ਰ ਗੁਰਚਰਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਗਰੋਵਰ ਨੇ ਲੇਖਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਛੋਟੇ ਛੋਟੇ ਟ੍ਰੈਕਟਾਂ ਚ ਛਾਪਣ ਲਈ ਅਪਣੀ ਇੱਛਾ ਜ਼ਾਹਿਰ ਕੀਤੀ ਪਰ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਸ੍ਰ: ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਅਤੇ ਸ੍ਰ: ਜੋਗਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਸਲਾਹ ਬਹੁਤ ਪਸੰਦ ਆਈ। ਮੈਂ ਸਰਬੱਤ ਖਾਲਸਾ ਸਮੇਲਨ ਵਿੱਚ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਆਖਿਰ ਚ ਪਰ ਸ੍ਰ: ਹਰਦੇਵ ਸਿੰਘ ਗਿੱਲ ਯੂ. ਐਸ. ਏ. ਤੋਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਬੋਲਿਆ। ਮੈਂ ਸਟੇਜ ਤੋਂ ਇਹ ਚੈਲਿੰਜ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਕਿ ਜੇਕਰ ਕੋਈ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦਾ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਹੋਇਆ ਸਾਬਤ ਕਰ ਦੇਵੇ ਤਾਂ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਭਾਈ ਲਾਲੋ ਫਾਉਂਡੇਸ਼ਨ ਵੱਲੋਂ ਇੱਕ ਮਿਲੀਅਨ (ਦਸ ਲੱਖ) ਰੁਪਇਆ ਇਨਾਮ ਵੱਜੋਂ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜਾਏਗਾ ਅਤੇ ਇੱਕ ਮਿਲੀਅਨ (ਦਸ ਲੱਖ) ਰੁਪਇਆ ਉਸ ਸੰਤ-ਸਾਧ ਨੂੰ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜਾਏਗਾ ਜੋ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਦੀ ਕਸਵੱਟੀ ਤੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਆਪ ਨੂੰ ਸੰਤ ਸੰਗਤਿ ਵਿੱਚ ਸਿੱਧ ਕਰ ਦੇਵੇ। ਇਸ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ 03-12-2003 ਨੂੰ ਮੋਹਾਲੀ ਫੇਜ 6 ਦੇ ਗੁਰਦੁਆਰਾ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੇ ਪਿੱਛੇ ਬਣੇ ਲੰਗਰ ਦੀ ਇਮਾਰਤ ਤੇ ਪਹਿਲੀ ਮੰਜਿਲ ਤੇ ਇੱਕ ਇਕੱਤ੍ਰਤਾ ਹੋਈ ਜਿਸ ਵਿੱਚ ਸ਼ਾਮਿਲ ਹੋਣ ਲਈ ਸ੍ਰ: ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਜੋਸ਼ ਨੇ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਵੀ ਸੱਦ ਲਿਆ। ਇਸ ਇਕਤ੍ਰੱਤਾ ਵਿੱਚ ਵਿਸਵ ਸਿੱਖ ਬੁਲੇਟਿਨ ਦੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਿਕ ਸ੍ਰ: ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਕੰਵਰ ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਪ੍ਰਤਾਪ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਗਿਆਨੀ ਜਗਮੋਹਣ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਮਹਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਜੋਸ਼, ਸ੍ਰ: ਉਪਕਾਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਫਰੀਦਾਬਾਦ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਸੁਰਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਇੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਘੱਗਾ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਹਰਬੰਸ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਕਾਲਰਾ, ਦਮਦਮੀ ਟਕਸਾਲ ਦੇ ਮੁਖ ਬੁਲਾਰੇ ਅਤੇ ਖੰਡੇਧਾਰ ਦੇ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਭਾਈ ਮੋਹਕਮ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ, ਸ੍ਰ: ਸੁਖਦੇਵ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਤੋਂ ਇਲਾਵਾ ਕੁੱਝ ਹੋਰ ਪੰਥ ਦਰਦੀ ਜੁੜ ਬੈਠੇ ਸਨ ਜਿਸ ਵਿੱਚ ਮੁੱਖ ਵਿਸ਼ਾ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਹੀ ਸੀ। ਸ੍ਰ: ਇੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਘੱਗਾ ਭਾਈ ਮੋਹਕਮ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪਾਸੋਂ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਬਾਰੇ ਸਪੱਸਟੀ-ਕਰਣ ਮੰਗਦੇ ਰਹੇ ਕਿ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੀ ਕਥਾ ਅਤੇ ਪ੍ਰਕਾਸ਼ ਦਮਦਮੀ ਟਕਸਾਲ ਚ ਕਿਉਂ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ? ਉਹ ਅਪਣੇ ਸੁਭਾ ਜਾਂ ਜਥੇਬੰਦੀ ਦੀ ਰਣਨੀਤੀ ਦੇ ਦਬਾਓ ਜਾਂ ਝੁਕਾਓ ਕਾਰਨ ਗੱਲ ਗੋਲ ਮੋਲ ਕਰਦੇ ਰਹੇ ਤੇ ਆਖਰ ਕਹਿਣ ਲੱਗੇ ਕਿ ਅਸੀਂ ਰਾਗ ਮਾਲਾ-ਚੌਪਈ-ਸਸਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਮ ਮਾਲਾ ਪੁਰਾਣ ਚੌਬੀਸ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਤੇ ਗੱਲ ਕਰਨ ਨੂੰ ਤਿਆਰ ਨਹੀਂ। ਸ੍ਰ: ਗੁਰਤੇਜ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੇ ਦੱਖਲ ਦੇਂਦੇ ਹੋਏ ਕਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਬਾਰੇ ਤੁਹਾਡੀ ਕੀ ਰਾਇ ਹੈ? ਪਰਨੋਗ੍ਰਾਫੀ ਨੂੰ ਵੀ ਤੁਸੀਂ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਮੰਨਦੇ ਹੋ? ਇੱਥੇ ਆ ਕੇ ਭਾਈ ਮੋਹਕਮ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਘਬਰਾ ਗਏ ਪਰ ਕਿਸੇ ਗੱਲ ਦਾ ਓਹ ਢੁਕਵਾਂ ਉੱਤਰ ਨਾ ਦੇ ਸਕੇ। ਮੈਂ ਪੂਰੇ ਠਰੰਮੇ ਨਾਲ ਸਭ ਦੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਸੁਣਨ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਆਖਿਆ ਕਿ ਜੇਕਰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਕਿਸੇ ਰਚਨਾ ਨੂੰ (ਜੇਕਰ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਲਿਖੀ ਹੈ) ਕੋਕ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਜਾਂ ਕਾਮ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਲ ਨੱਥੀ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਉਸ ਅੱਗੇ ਮੱਥੇ ਟੇਕੇ ਤੇ ਟਿਕਵਾਏ ਜਾਣ ਕੀ ਇਹ ਸ਼ਰਮ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋਏਗੀ? ਸਭ ਨੇ ਮੇਰੀ ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਦੀ ਪ੍ਰੋੜਤਾ ਕੀਤੀ। ਮੈਂ ਫਿਰ ਕਿਹਾ ਕਿ ਜੇਕਰ ਜਪੁ ਜੀ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਨੂੰ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਕਾਮ ਭਰਪੂਰ ਕਾਵਿ ਰਚਨਾਵਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਨੱਥੀ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਕਿਹਾ ਜਾਏ ਕਿ ਇਹ ਤੁਹਾਡਾ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਕੀ ਸ਼ਰਮਨਾਕ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋਏਗਾ? ਫਿਰ ਸਭ ਨੇ ਹਾਂ ਚ ਸਹਿਮਤੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਾਈ। ਇਕੱਤ੍ਰਤਾ ਦੀ ਸਮਾਪਤੀ ਤੋਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਸਭ ਵਿਦਵਾਨ ਵੀਰਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਬੇਨਤੀ ਕੀਤੀ ਕਿ ਓਹ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਵੀਰਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਅਨਪੜ੍ਹ ਨਾ ਸਮਝਣ ਬਲਕਿ ਅਪਣੇ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰ ਕਰਨ ਦੇ ਤੌਰ ਤਰੀਕੇ ਅਤੇ ਬੋਲੀ ਨੂੰ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਸੁਭਾਓ ਅਨਸਾਰ ਢਾਲਣ।
ਮੈਂ 23.12.2003 ਨੂੰ ਵਾਪਿਸ ਦੁਬਈ ਪੁੱਜਾ। ਇੱਕ ਹਫਤਾ ਪਹਾੜ ਜਿੱਡੇ ਕਾਰਜ ਨੂੰ ਸਫਲ ਬਣਾਉਣ ਹਿੱਤ ਮੈਂ ਸੋਚਾਂ ਸੋਚਦਾ ਰਿਹਾ। ਮੈਂ ਗੁਰੂਦੁਆਰੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਸਨਮੁੱਖ ਖੜੇ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਅਰਦਾਸ ਕੀਤੀ ਕਿ ਸੱਚੇ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਸੱਚ ਲਿਖਣ ਅਤੇ ਬੋਲਣ ਲਈ ਬਿਬੇਕ ਬੁੱਧੀ ਦੇਣੀ ਤਾਂ ਕਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦਾ ਅਪਮਾਨ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲਿਆਂ ਅਤੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਕੌਮ ਨੂੰ ਬੁੱਧੂ ਬਨਾਣ ਵਾਲਿਆਂ ਦੇ ਚੇਹਰੇ ਨੰਗੇ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਸਹੀ ਦਿਖ ਪੇਸ਼ ਕਰ ਸਕਾਂ। ਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਦੀ ਅਪਾਰ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਨਾਲ ਮੈਂ ਪਹਿਲੀ ਜਨਵਰੀ 2004 ਨੂੰ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੇ ਤ੍ਰਿਯ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਦੇ ਦੁਬਾਰਾ ਤੋਂ ਸਾਰ ਲਿਖਣੇ ਸ਼ੁਰੂ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤੇ। ਸਾਰ ਲਿਖਦਿਆਂ ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਵਾਰ ਮੈਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਆਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੀ ਸ਼ਰਮ ਮਹਿਸੂਸ ਕਰਦਾ ਕਿ ਮੇਰੇ ਬਾਰੇ ਸਮਾਜ ਕੀ ਸੋਚੇਗਾ? ਰਿਸ਼ਤੇਦਾਰ ਕੀ ਕਹਿਣਗੇ? ਮੇਰੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਬੱਚੇ ਕੀ ਆਖਣਗੇ ਕਿ ਪਿਓ ਨੇ ਕਿਹੜਾ ਵਿਸ਼ਾ ਚੁਣਿਆ ਹੈ? ਦੂਜੇ ਪਾਸੇ ਮੇਰੀ ਜਾਗ੍ਹਦੀ ਜ਼ਮੀਰ ਰਾਤ ਦਿਨ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਹੁੱਜਾਂ ਮਾਰਦੀ ਕਿ ਜਸਬਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਨੂੰ ਛੁਪਾਏਂਗਾ ਅਤੇ ਪੰਥ ਵਿਰੋਧੀਆਂ ਦੇ ਟੋਲੇ ਚ ਰਲੇਂਗਾ ਤਾਂ ਤੇਰੇ ਤੋਂ ਨਿਕੰਮਾ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਹੋਰ ਕੋਈ ਨਹੀਂ ਜੰਮਣਾ। ਕਈ ਵਾਰ ਭਾਵੁਕ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਮੈਂ ਭੁੱਬਾਂ ਮਾਰ ਕੇ ਇਕੱਲਾ ਬਹਿ ਕੇ ਰੋਇਆ। ਮੇਰੇ ਸਾਮ੍ਹਣੇ ਹੁਣ ਦੋ ਹੀ ਰਸਤੇ ਸਨ, ਇੱਕ ਇਹ ਕਿ ਮੈਂ ਬਾਕੀ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਸਮਾਜ ਦੀ ਸ਼ਰਮ ਤੋਂ ਡਰ ਕੇ ਚੁੱਪ ਕਰ ਜਾਵਾਂ ਤੇ ਦੂਜਾ ਗੁਰੂ ਦੇ ਹੋ ਰਹੇ ਅਤੇ ਕੀਤੇ ਜਾ ਰਹੇ ਅਪਮਾਨ ਨੂੰ ਜੱਗ ਜਾਹਿਰ ਕਰ ਦੇਵਾਂ। ਮੈਂ ਦੂਜੇ ਰਸਤੇ ਨੂੰ ਚੁਣਨ ਦਾ ਫੈਸਲਾ ਕਰ ਲਿਆ। ਮੈਨੂੰ ਦੁਬਈ ਅਪਣੇ ਨਿੱਘੇ ਮਿੱਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਤੇ ਬੜਾ ਮਾਣ ਹੈ। ਮੈਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਮਨ ਦੀ ਅਵਸੱਥਾ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਅੱਗੇ ਜ਼ਾਹਿਰ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤੀ। ਮੇਰੇ ਮਿਤ੍ਰ ਰੂਪ ਛੋਟੇ ਵੀਰ ਸ੍ਰ: ਸਤਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਸ਼ਾਰਜਾ ਵਾਲਿਆਂ ਨੇ ਮੇਰੀ ਹਰ ਲਿਖਤ ਨੂੰ ਕੰਪਿਯੂਟਰ ਤੇ ਪੂਰੀ ਲਗਨ ਅਤੇ ਤਨ ਦੇਹੀ ਨਾਲ ਛਾਪਣਾ ਸੁਰੂ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤਾ। ਪਰਮ ਪਿਆਰੇ ਮਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਸ੍ਰ: ਪ੍ਰਭਜੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਧਵਨ ਨੇ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਹਰ ਪੱਲ ਹੱਲਾ ਸ਼ੇਰੀ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਅਤੇ ਹਰ ਪ੍ਰਕਾਰ ਦੀ ਸਹਾਇਤਾ ਕਰਨ ਦਾ ਭਰੋਸਾ ਦਿੱਤਾ। ਸ੍ਰ: ਰਘਬੀਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਅਲਾਇਨ (ਯੂ. ਏ. ਈ.) ਨੇ ਜਿੱਥੇ ਇਸ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਨੂੰ ਸਫਲ ਹੋਣ ਲਈ ਦੁਆਵਾਂ ਦਿੱਤੀਆਂ ਉੱਥੇ ਅਪਣਾ ਬਣਦਾ ਯੋਗਦਾਨ ਵੀ ਦਿੱਤਾ। ਮੈਂ ਯੂ. ਏ. ਈ. ਦੇ ਸਮੂਹ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਦਾ ਧੰਨਵਾਦੀ ਹਾਂ ਜਿਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੇ ਹਰ ਸਮੇਂ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਸਲਾਹਿਆ ਅਤੇ ਹੱਲਾਸ਼ੇਰੀ ਦਿੱਤੀ।
ਅੱਜ 22 ਅਪ੍ਰੈਲ 2004 ਦਿਨ ਵੀਰਵਾਰ ਵੈਸਾਖ ਸੁਦੀ ਨੂੰ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੇ ਪਹਿਲੇ ਪੜਾ ਨੂੰ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਕਰ ਕੇ ਮੈਂ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਮਹਿਸੂਸ ਕਰ ਰਿਹਾ ਹਾਂ। ਸਮੂਹ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਅਤੇ ਸਮੂਹ ਤਖਤਾਂ ਅਥਵਾ ਤਿੰਨੋ ਯੁਨੀਵਰਸਿਟੀਆਂ ਤੇ ਇਸ ਲਿਖਤ ਨੂੰ ਨਜ਼ਰਸਾਨੀ ਕਰਾਣ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਰੂਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਛਪਵਾ ਕੇ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਹੋਰ ਵੀ ਖੁਸ਼ੀ ਹੋ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ। ਮੈਂ ਇੱਕ ਛੋਟੇ ਜਿਹੇ ਪਿੰਡ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਹਾਂ ਜੋ ਚੰਡੀਗੜ੍ਹ ਰੋਪੜ ਸ਼ਾਹੀ ਸੜਕ ਦੇ ਕੰਢੇ ਵੱਸਦਾ ਹੈ। ਮੈਂ ਪਿੰਡ ਦੇ ਸਰਕਾਰੀ ਸਕੂਲ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਹੀ ਮੁਢਲੀ ਵਿੱਦਿਆ ਗ੍ਰਹਿਣ ਕੀਤੀ ਹੈ। ਮੇਰੀ ਬੋਲੀ ਅਤੇ ਲਿਖਤ ਬਿਲਕੁਲ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਹੈ ਜਿਸ ਤੇ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਬੜਾ ਮਾਣ ਹੈ। ਮੈਂ ਅਪਣੀ ਇਸ ਪੁਸਤਕ ਵਿੱਚ ਇਲਾਕੇ ਦੀ ਬੋਲੀ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਬੋਲੀ ਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਵਧੇਰੇ ਵਰਤਿਆ ਹੈ। ਜੇਕਰ ਸਰਲ ਅਤੇ ਸਾਦੀ ਬੋਲੀ ਨਾਲ ਕਿਸੇ ਦੇ ਮਨ ਨੂੰ ਤਕਲੀਫ਼ ਪਹੁੰਚੇ ਤਾਂ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਇੱਕ ਪੇਂਡੂ ਵੀਰ ਜਾਣ ਕੇ ਮੁਆਫ ਕਰ ਦੇਣਾ। ਤੁਹਾਡੇ ਵਡ ਮੁੱਲੇ ਵਿਚਾਰਾਂ ਦੀ ਮੈਂ ਉਡੀਕ ਕਰਾਂਗਾ ਜਿਹੜੇ ਵੀਰ ਮੇਰਾ ਵਿਰੋਧ ਗਿਆਨ ਦੇ ਅਦਾਰ ਤੇ ਕਰਨਗੇ ਮੈਂ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦਾ ਵੀ ਧੰਨਵਾਦੀ ਹੋਵਾਂਗਾ ਤੇ ਜਿਹੜੀ ਮੇਰੀ ਲਿਖਤ ਨੂੰ ਸਲਾਹੁਣਗੇ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦਾ ਵੀ ਰਿਣੀ ਹੋਵਾਂਗਾ।
ਦਾਸਨ ਦਾਸ; ਮੇਰਾ ਪਤਾ;
Jasbinder Singh Khalsa
ਜਸਬਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਖਾਲਸਾ Ludas
ਮੁਖ ਸੇਵਾਦਾਰ P. O. Box # 50237
ਭਾਈ ਲਾਲੋ ਫਾਉਂਡੇਸ਼ਨ Dubai (U. A. E.)


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

ੴ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ
ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਜੀ ਸਹਾਇ।।
ਅਥ ਪਖਯਾਨ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਲਿਖਯਤੇ
ਪਾਤਿਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦।।
ਪਾਤਰ: ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ
ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦਾ ਮੁਖ ਲੇਖਕ ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਅਪਣੇ ਇਸ਼ਟ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਦੀ ਦਿਲ ਖੋਲ੍ਹ ਕੇ ਉਸਤਤ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਉਹ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਹੇ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਮੇਰੇ ਲਈ ਤੂੰਹੀ ਖੜਗਧਾਰੀ ਅਤੇ ਬਾਢਵਾਰੀ ਹੈ। ਮੈਂ ਤੈਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਤੀਰ-ਤਲਵਾਰ ਤੇ ਕਾਤੀ-ਕਟਾਰੀ ਮੰਨਦਾ ਹਾਂ। ਤੇਰੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੀ ਮੈਂ ਹੱਲਬੀ-ਜੁਨੱਬੀ ਤੱਕਦਾ ਹਾਂ। ਜਿੱਧਰ ਭੀ ਮੈਂ ਤੈਨੂੰ ਤੱਕਣ ਦੀ ਕੋਸ਼ਿਸ਼ ਕਰਦਾ ਹਾਂ ਉੱਧਰ ਹੀ ਤੂੰ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਖੜੀ ਨਜ਼ਰ ਆਉਂਦੀ ਹੈਂ। ਜੋਗ ਮਾਯਾ ਅਤੇ ਬਾਕਬਾਨੀ (ਸੁਰਸਵਤੀ) ਰੂਪਾ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਵਾਨੀ ਸਭ ਤੇਰੇ ਹੀ ਤਾਂ ਰੂਪ ਹਨ। ਸੱਚ ਪੁੱਛੋ ਤਾਂ ਬਿਸ਼ਨ-ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਤੇ ਰੁਦ੍ਰ ਰਾਜੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਭੀ ਤੂੰ ਹੀ ਨਜ਼ਰ ਆਉਂਦੀ ਹੈਂ। ਮੈਨੂੰ ਯਕੀਨ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਤੂੰ ਬਿਸ੍ਵਮਾਤਾ ਹੈਂ ਤੇ ਸਭ ਥਾਈਂ ਤੂੰ ਬਿਰਾਜਦੀ ਹੈਂ। ਦੇਵਤੇ ਤੇ ਦੈਂਤ ਤੇਰੇ ਹੀ ਤਾਂ ਪੈਦਾ ਕੀਤੇ ਹਨ। ਤੁਰਕ ਤੇ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਭੀ ਤੂੰ ਹੀ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਪੈਦਾ ਕੀਤੇ। ਤੇਰਾ ਡਰਾਉਣਾ ਰੂਪ ਅਤੇ ਅੰਤਾਂ ਦੀ ਸੁੰਦਰਤਾ ਬਿਆਨੋ ਬਾਹਰ ਹੈ। ਅਪਣੇ ਮੁੱਖ ਤੋਂ ਚਾਰੋਂ ਬੇਦ ਤੇਰੇ ਹੀ ਤਾਂ ਉਚਾਰਣ ਕੀਤੇ ਹਨ।
(*ਇਹ ਵੱਖਰੀ ਗੱਲ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਧਰਮ ਵੇਦਾਂ ਦਾ ਰਚਾਇਤਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਨੂੰ ਮੰਨਦਾ ਹੈ ਪਰ ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਨੂੰ)
*ਤੇਰੀ ਬਹਾਦਰੀ ਦਾ ਲੇਖਾ ਜੋਖਾ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋ ਸਕਦਾ। ਤੂੰ ਹੀ ਸੁੰਭ-ਨਿਸੁੰਭ ਦੈਤਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਰਿਆ। ਨਰਸਿੰਘ ਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਧਾਰ ਕੇ ਤੂੰ ਹਰਨਾਖਸ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਰਿਆ। ਦਾੜ੍ਹ ਦੈਂਤ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਰਨਵਾਲੀ ਭੀ ਤੂੰ ਤੇ ਰਾਮ ਦਾ ਅਵਤਾਰ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਹਠੀ (ਰਾਵਣ) ਮਾਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਭੀ ਤੂੰ। ਫਿਰ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਨ ਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਧਾਰ ਕੇ ਕੰਸ ਨੂੰ ਖਪਾਯਾ। ਤੈਨੂੰ ਲੋਕ ਜਾਲਪਾ ਤੇ ਕਾਲਕਾ ਭੀ ਆਖਦੇ ਹਨ। ਚੌਦਾਂ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਤੇਰਾ ਹੀ ਰਾਜ ਹੈ। ਤੂੰ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਹੈਂ ਅਤੇ ਮਾਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਕਾਲ ਦੀ ਰਾਤ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਘੁੰਮਦੀ ਹੈਂ। ਤੈਨੂੰ ਲੋਕ ਉਗ੍ਰਾ ਅਤੇ ਅਤਿਉਗ੍ਰਾ ਦੇ ਰੂਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਭੀ ਜਾਣਦੇ ਹਨ ਤੇ ਤੈਨੂੰ ਚੌਦਾਂ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਦੀ ਰਾਣੀ ਆਖਦੇ ਹਨ ਰਾਜੇਸ਼ਵਰੀ ਦੇ ਸਰੂਪ ਚੋਂ ਹੁੰਦੀ ਹੋਈ ਤੂੰ ਬਿਯਾਸ ਦੀ ਬਾਣੀ (ਪੁਰਾਣਾਂ) ਵਿੱਚ ਛੁੱਪੀ ਹੈਂ। ਕਦੇ ਸ਼ੇਸਨਾਗ ਦੇ ਫਣ ਤੇ ਤੂੰ ਸੇਜ ਵਿਛਾਈ ਤੇ ਕਦੇ ਸ਼ੇਰ ਦੀ ਸਵਾਰੀ ਕੀਤੀ। ਚੰਡ ਅਤੇ ਮੁੰਡ ਦੈਂਤਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਖਪਾਉਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਤੇ ਰਕਤਬੀਜ ਨਾਲ ਜੁੱਧ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲੀ ਭੀ ਤੂੰ ਹੀ ਹੈਂ। ਮਹਿਖਾਸੁਰ-ਧੁਮ੍ਰਾਛ-ਜਵਾਲਾਛਸ ਦੈਂਤਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਖਪਾਯਾ। ਕੌਚ-ਬਕ੍ਰਤਾਪਬਿਡਾਲਾਛ-ਚਿੱਛੁਰਾਛਸ ਤੋਂ ਰੱਖਿਆ ਕੀਤੀ। ਡੌਰੂ ਬਜਾਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਭੀ ਤੂੰ ਹੀ ਹੈਂ। ਲੋਕੀਂ ਤੈਨੂੰ ਜਯੰਤੀਮੰਗਲਾ-ਕਪਾਲਿਨ ਤੇ ਭੱਦ੍ਰਕਾਲੀ ਭੀ ਕਹਿੰਦੇ ਹਨ ਤੇ ਦੁਰਗਾ ਅਤੇ ਸਿਵ ਜੀ ਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਭੀ ਤੇਰਾ ਹੀ ਗਿਣਦੇ ਹਨ। ਹੇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਮੈ ਤੈਨੂੰ ਨਮਸਕਾਰ ਕਰਦਾ ਹਾਂ।
ਸਵੇਰ ਤੋਂ ਸ਼ਾਮ ਤੱਕ ਤੂੰ ਲਾਲ ਬਸਤ੍ਰ ਧਾਰਣ ਕਰਦੀ ਹੈਂ ਤੇ ਤੇਰੇ ਗਲੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਮੁਰਦਿਆਂ ਦੀਆਂ ਖੋਪੜੀਆਂ ਦਾ ਹਾਰ ਹੈ। ਤੂੰ ਮੱਛ ਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਧਾਰਿਆ ਤੇ ਕੱਛ ਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਸਮੁੰਦ੍ਰ ਨੂੰ ਰਿੜਕਿਆ। ਨਿਹਕਲੰਕੀ ਦੇ ਰੂਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਸਭ ਮਲੇਛਾਂ ਦਾ ਨਾਸ ਕੀਤਾ। ਹੇ ਮਾਂ (ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਾਉਤੀ) ਅਪਣਾ ਚੇਲਾ ਜਾਣ ਕੇ ਮੇਰੇ ਤੇ ਮੇਹਰ ਕਰਨੀ ਅਤੇ ਜੋ ਮੇਰੇ ਚਿੱਤ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੈ ਉਹ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਦੇਣਾ।
*ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਅਪਣੇ ਇਸ਼ਟ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਦੀ ਉਸਤਤ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਸਬਦਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਕਰਦਾ ਹੈ:-
*ਦਿਲ ਤਾਂ ਚਾਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਅਨਤਰਿਆਂ ਹੀ ਸਿੰਧ ਨੂੰ ਤਰ ਕੇ ਪਾਰ ਕਰ ਜਾਂਵਾਂ ਪਰ ਬਿਨਾ ਨੌਕਾ (ਬੇੜੀ) ਦੇ ਕਿਵੇਂ ਤਰਿਆ ਜਾਏ। ਮੈਂ ਤਾਂ ਤੇਰਾ ਹੀ ਨਾਂ ਧਿਆਉਂਦਾ ਹਾਂ। ਗੂੰਗਾ ਤੇਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਨਾਲ ਅਪਣੇ ਮੂੰਹ ਤੋਂ ਖਟ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਸੁਣਾ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਪਿੰਗਲਾ ਪਰਬਤਾਂ ਤੇ ਚੜ੍ਹ ਸਕਦਾ ਹੈ। ਅੰਨ੍ਹਿਆਂ ਨੂੰ ਅੱਖਾਂ ਮਿਲ ਜਾਂਦੀਆਂ ਹਨ ਤੇ ਬੋਲੇ ਸੁਣਨ ਲਗ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਹਨ। ਤਰਬੂਜ ਤੇ ਔਰਤ ਦੇ ਗਰਭ ਦਾ ਕੋਈ ਭੇਦ ਨਹੀਂ ਪਾ ਸਕਦਾ। ਜੇਕਰ ਤੇਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਹੋ ਜਾਏ ਤਾਂ ਕੁੱਛ ਕੁੱਛ ਜੋੜ ਤੋੜ ਕੇ ਦੱਸ ਸਕਦਾ ਹਾਂ। ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਮੈਂ ਤੇਰੀ ਅਰਾਧਨਾ ਕਰਦਾ ਹਾਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਬਲ ਅਤੇ ਬੁੱਧੀ ਅਨੁਸਾਰ ਜੋ ਤੂੰ ਮੈਨੂੰ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਹੈ। ਡਰਦਾ ਹਾਂ ਕਿ ਘੱਟ ਕਵਿਤਾ ਲਿਖੀ ਜਾਣ ਤੇ ਮੇਰਾ ਕੋਈ ਹਾਸਾ ਹੀ ਨਾ ਉਡਾਏ। ਇਸੇ ਲਈ ਮੈਂ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਪ੍ਰਸੰਗ ਵਰਨਣ ਕਰਨ ਲਈ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਦੀ ਅਰਾਧਨਾ ਕੀਤੀ ਹੈ ਮੇਰੇ ਹਿਰਦੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਤੂੰ ਨਦੀ ਸਮਾਨ ਹੈਂ ਤੇ ਲਹਿਰਾਂ ਬਣ ਬਣ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਹੋਣਾ।
ਮੇਰੇ ਘਾਹ ਸਮਾਨ ਤੇ ਮੇਹਰ ਕਰਨੀ। ਹੇ ਗਰੀਬ ਨਿਵਾਜ (ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਾਉਤੀ) ਤੇਰੇ ਤੋਂ ਬਿਨਾ ਮੇਰਾ ਹੋਰ ਕੋਈ ਨਹੀਂ। ਹੇ ਪ੍ਰਭੂ ਮੇਰੀਆਂ ਭੁੱਲਾਂ ਮੁਆਫ ਕਰ ਦੇਣੀਆਂ। ਮੈਂ ਅਪਣੇ ਆਪ ਨੂੰ ਭੁੱਲਣਹਾਰ ਕਬੂਲਦਾ ਹਾਂ। ਜੋ ਤੇਰੀ ਸੇਵਾ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਛਿਨ ਮਾਤਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਧੰਨ ਦੇ ਭੰਡਾਰ ਭਰ ਦੇਂਦਾ ਹੈਂ।
*ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਅਨਤਰਿਯਾ ਜਯੋਂ ਸਿੰਧੁ ਕੋ ਚਹਤ ਤਰਨ ਕਰਿ ਜਾਉਂ।।
ਬਿਨੁ ਨੌਕਾ ਕੈਸੇ ਤਰੈ ਲਏ ਤਿਹਾਰੋ ਨਾਉਂ।। ੪੨।।
ਮੂਕ ਉਚਰੈ ਸ਼ਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਖਟ ਪਿੰਗ ਗਿਰਨ ਚੜਿ ਜਾਇ।।
ਅੰਧ ਲਖੈ ਬਧਰੋ ਸੁਨੈ ਜੌ ਤੁਮ ਕਰੋ ਸਹਾਇ।। ੪੩।।
ਅਰਘਗਰਭ ਨ੍ਰਿਪ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਨ ਕੋ ਭੇਦ ਨ ਪਾਯੋ ਜਾਇ।।
ਤਊ ਤਿਹਾਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਤੇ ਕਛੁ ਕਛੁ ਕਹੋ ਬਨਾਇ।। ੪੪।।
ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਮਾਨਿ ਤੁਮ ਕੋ ਕਹੋ ਜਥਾ ਬੁੱਧਿ ਬਲੁ ਹੋਇ।।
ਘਟਿ ਕਬਿਤਾ ਲਖਿਕੈ ਕਬਹਿ ਹਾਸ ਨ ਕਰਿਯਹੁ ਕੋਇ।। ੪੫।।
ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਧਯਾਇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਵਤੀ ਬਰਨੌ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਪ੍ਰਸੰਗ।।
ਮੋ ਘਟ ਮੈ ਤੁਮ ਹਵੈ ਨਦੀ ਉਪਜਹੁ ਬਾਕ ਤਰੰਗ।। ੪੬।।
ਸਵੈਯਾ।। ਮੇਰ ਕਿਯੋ ਤ੍ਰਿਣ ਤੇ ਮੁਹਿ ਜਾਹਿ ਗਰੀਬ ਨਿਵਾਜ ਨ ਦੂਸਰ ਤੋਸੌ।।
ਭੂਲ ਛਿਮੋ ਹਮਰੀ ਪ੍ਰਭੁ ਆਪਨ ਭੂਲਨਹਾਰ ਕਹੂੰ ਕੋਊ ਮੋਸੌ।।
ਸੇਵ ਕਰੈ ਤੁਮਰੀ ਤਿਨ ਕੇ ਛਿਨ ਮੈ ਧਨ ਲਾਗਤ ਧਾਮ ਭਰੋਸੋ।।
ਯਾ ਕਲਿ ਮੈ ਸਭ ਕਾਲਿ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਨ ਕੀ ਭਾਰੀ ਭੁਜਾਨ ਕੋ ਭਾਰੀ ਭਰੋਸੋ।। ੪੭।।
ਇਤੀ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪਖਯਾਨੇ ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰੇ ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਧਯਾਇ ਸਮਾਪਤਮ ਸਤੁ ਸੁਭਮ ਸਤੁ।। ੧।। ੪੮।। ਅਪਜੂੰ।।
*ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਭਗਾਉਤੀ ਦੀ ਉਸਤਤ ਵਿੱਚ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਇਹ ਮੰਗਲਾ ਚਰਨ ਹੈ। ਹਰ ਲੇਖਕ ਅਪਣੀ ਸਫਲਤਾ ਜਾਂ ਅਪਣੀ ਰਚਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਹੋ ਜਾਣ ਲਈ ਜੋਦੜੀ ਕਰਦਾ ਆਇਆ ਤੱਕੀਦਾ ਹੈ। ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਦੀ ਇਸ ਰਚਨਾ ਤੇ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹੀ ੧੦ ਲਿਖਣਾ ਸੰਪਾਦਕ ਅਤੇ ਸੋਧ ਕਮੇਟੀ ਦੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ ਉਪਜੀ ਘ੍ਰਿਣਾ ਪ੍ਰਤੱਖ ਜਾਹਿਰ ਕਰਦੀ ਹੈ।
੧੪੬੯ ਈਸਵੀ ਵਿੱਚ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਹੋਈ ਸਿੱਖ ਕੌਮ ਨੇ ੨੩੯ ਸਾਲ ਦਾ ਲੰਮਾ ਪੈਂਡਾ ਤਹਿ ਕਰਦਿਆਂ ੧੭੦੮ ਈਸਵੀ ਤੱਕ ਸਮੁੱਚੀ ਦੁਨੀਆਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਪਣੀ ਵੱਖਰੀ ਪਹਿਚਾਣ ਤੇ ਹੋਂਦ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਕਰ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਸੀ ਜਿਸ ਕੌਮ ਦੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਰੂਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਮੁੱਖ ਆਗੂ ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਹੋਣ ਕੀ ਉਸ ਗੁਰੂ ਨੂੰ ਸਿੱਖ ਕੌਮ ਬਾਰੇ ਜਾਣਕਾਰੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਸੀ ਜਾਂ ਉਹ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਹੀ ਗਿਣਦੇ ਸਨ। ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਮੁਖਾਰ ਬਿੰਦ ਤੋਂ ਇਹ ਅਖਵਾਉਣਾ ਕਿ:-
*ਤੁਹੀ ਦੇਵ ਤੂੰ ਦੈਤ ਤੈ ਜਛੁ ਉਪਾਏ।। ਤੁਹੀ ਤੁਰਕ ਹਿੰਦੂ ਜਗਤ ਮੈ ਬਨਾਏ।।
ਤੁਹੀ ਪੰਥ ਹ੍ਵੈ ਅਵਤਰੀ ਸ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟਿ ਮਾਂਹੀ।। ਤੁਹੀ ਬਕ੍ਰਤ ਤੇ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਬਾਦੋ ਬਕਾਹੀ।। ੩।।
*ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰੇ ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਧਯਾਇ।। ੧।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੮੦੯)
ਹਾਸੋ ਹੀਣਾ ਲਗਦਾ ਹੈ। ਸਿੱਖ ਧਰਮ ਕਿਸੇ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਜਾਂ ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਤੇ ਦੀ ਹੋਂਦ ਨੂੰ ਨਹੀਂ ਮੰਨਦਾ। ਸਿੱਖ ਧਰਮ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦਾ ਰਚਣਹਾਰ ਇੱਕ ਅਕਾਲ ਪੁਰਖ ਨੂੰ ਮੰਨਦਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਉਸੇ ਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਸਰਬ ਸ਼ਕਤੀਮਾਨ ਕਹਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਸਿੱਖ ਧਰਮ ਦਾ ਵਿਸ਼ਵਾਸ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਦੁਨੀਆਂ ਚ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੋਈ ਹਰ ਤਾਕਤ ਅਤੇ ਸਮੂਹ ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਤੇ ਰੱਬ ਦੇ ਦਰ ਦੇ ਮੰਗਦੇ ਹਨ, ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਤੋਂ ਕਿਸੇ ਭਗਉਤੀ ਦੀ ਉਸਤਤ ਕਰਾਉਣਾ ਨੀਚਤਾਈ ਦੀਆਂ ਸਭ ਹੱਦ ਬੰਨੇ ਟੱਪਣ ਸਮਾਨ ਹੈ। ਜੋ ਮਨੁੱਖ ਜਾਣਬੁੱਝ ਕੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਬਦਨਾਮ ਕਰ ਰਹੇ ਹਨ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੁ ਦੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਨਹੀਂ ਕਿਹਾ ਜਾ ਸਕਦਾ। ਇਹ ਰਚਨਾ ਕਵੀ ਰਾਮ ਦੀ ਲਿਖੀ ਹੈ ਸਿੱਧ ਕਰਨ ਲਈ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀ ਅਪਣੀ ਹੀ ਕਲਮ ਤੋਂ ਲਿਖਿਆ ਹਥਲਾ ਬੰਦ ਪੜ੍ਹਨਾ ਲਾਹੇਬੰਦ ਰਹੇਗਾ।
*ਧੂਮਰੀ ਧੂਰਿ ਭਰੇ ਧੁਮਰੇ ਤਨ ਧਾਏ ਨਿਸਾਚਰ ਲੋਹ ਕਟੀਲੇ।।
ਮੇਚਕ ਪਬਨ ਸੇ ਜਿਨਕੇ ਤਨ ਕੌਚ ਸਜੇ ਮਦਮੱਤ ਜਟੀਲੇ।।
ਰਾਮ ਭਨੈ ਅਤਿਹੀ ਰਿਸਿ ਸੋ ਜਗ ਨਾਇਕ ਸੌ ਰਨ ਠਾਟ ਠਟੀਲੇ।।
ਤੇ ਝਟਦੈ ਪਟਕੇ ਛਿਤ ਪੈ ਰਨ ਰੌਰ ਪਰੇ ਰਨ ਸਿੰਘ ਰਜੀਲੇ।। ੨੨।। *ਚੰਡੀ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰੇ ਪ੍ਰਥਮ ਧਯਾਇ।। ੧।। (ਪੰਨਾ ੮੧੧)
ਆਓ ਅੱਗੇ ਅੱਗੇ ਪੜ੍ਹਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਮੰਦ ਕਰਮੀਆਂ ਦੇ ਮੰਦੇ ਕਰਮ ਅਤੇ ਮੰਦੀ ਸੋਚ ਜਿਸ ਅਧੀਨ ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਨੂੰ ਅਤਿ ਗੰਦੀ ਭਾਸ਼ਾ ਵਰਤ ਕੇ ਬਦਨਾਮ ਕਰਨ ਦੀ ਕੋਸ਼ਿਸ ਕੀਤੀ ਗਈ ਹੈ। ਕਵੀ ਦੁਆਰਾ ਵਰਤੇ ਕੁੱਝ ਖਾਸ ਸ਼ਬਦ: *ਹੋ ਮਾਰਿ ਕਟਾਰੀ ਮਰਿਹੋਂ ਘਰੀ ਨ ਜੀਵ ਹੋਂ।। ੪।।
ਨਗਰੀ ਚਿਤ੍ਰਵਤੀ
*ਪਾਤਰ: ਚਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਸਿੰਘ (ਨ੍ਰਿਪ), ਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਮਤੀ (ਸੁਤਾ), ਹਨਿਵਤਿ ਸਿੰਘ, ਦਿਜਬਰ (ਬ੍ਰਾਹਮਣ), ਨ੍ਰਿਪ ਸੁਤ ਅਤੇ ਸਹਸ (੧੦੦) ਸਖੀ ਦਿਜਬਰ (ਬ੍ਰਾਹਮਣ)
ਚਿਤ੍ਰਵਤੀ ਨਗਰੀ ਦੇ ਰਾਜਾ ਚਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਸਿੰਘ ਦੇ ਘਰ ਬਹੁਤ ਧੰਨ-ਰਥ-ਹਾਥੀ ਤੇ ਬਾਜ ਸਨ। ਓਹਦਾ ਰੂਪ ਤੱਕ ਕੇ ਸੁਰੀ-ਅਸੁਰੀ ਤੇ ਕਿੰਨ੍ਰਨੀ ਅਪਣਾ ਮਨ ਡੋਲਦੀਆਂ ਸਨ। ਇੱਕ ਇੰਦਰਲੋਕ ਦੀ ਅਪਸਰਾ ਓਹ ਤੇ ਮਰ ਮਿਟੀ। ਬਣਾਈ ਸਕੀਮ-ਭੇਜੀ ਦੂਤਿਕਾ-ਕੀਤਾ ਰਾਜਾ ਰਾਜੀ-ਹੋਈ ਸ਼ਾਦੀ-ਜੰਮਿਆ ਪੁੱਤਇਸ ਪੁੱਤ ਨੂੰ ਤੱਕ ਕੇ ਮਹਾ ਰੁਦ੍ਰ ਤੇ ਕਾਮਦੇਵ ਦੇ ਹਿਰਦੇ ਉਪਜੀ ਈਰਖਾ।
ਬਹੁਤ ਸਾਲ ਅਪਸਰਾ ਨਾਲ ਰਾਜੇ ਨੇ ਮਨਮਰਜੀ ਦੇ ਕੀਤੇ ਭੋਗ ਤੇ ਆਖਰ ਇਹ ਵਿਚਾਰੀ ਜਾ ਪੁੱਜੀ ਇੰਦ੍ਰਲੋਕ। ਬਿਨਾ ਔਰਤ ਦੇ ਰਾਜਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਵਿਆਕੁਲ-ਸੱਦੇ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੀ-ਬਣਾਈ ਤਸਵੀਰ ਤੇ ਲੱਗੇ ਹੋਰ ਔਰਤ ਨੂੰ ਭਾਲਣ ਤੇ ਆਖਰ ਇੱਕ ਕੰਨਿਆ ਜਾ ਲੱਭੀ ਓੜਛੇ (ਉੜੀਸਾ) ਦੇਸ ਵਿੱਚ। ਰਾਜੇ ਬੁਲਾਏ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੀ-ਲੁਟਾਇਆ ਧਨ-ਕੀਤੀ ਇੱਕਠੀ ਸੈਨਾ-ਧਾਰੇ ਸਾਸਤ੍ਰ-ਭੱਜਿਆ ਉੜੀਸਾ ਨੂੰ-ਬਹੁਤੀ ਸੈਨਾ ਨਾਲ ਹਨਿਵਤ ਸਿੰਘ (ਪਤਾ ਨਹੀਂ ਪੁੱਤ ਹੈ ਜਾਂ ਸੈਨਾ ਪਤੀ) ਕੀਤਾ ਅੱਗੇ ਤੇ ਆਪ ਰਿਹਾ ਪਿੱਛੇ (ਸ਼ਾਇਦ ਡਰਪੋਕ ਹੋਏ) ਮਾਰਿਆ ਓੜਛਾ (ਉੜੀਸਾ) ਦਾ ਰਾਜਾ ਤੇ ਕੀਤੀ ਓਸ ਦੀ ਧੀ ਕਾਬੂ। ਪੜ੍ਹਨੇ ਪਾਇਆ ਦਿਜਬਰ (ਬ੍ਰਾਮ੍ਹਣ) ਕੋਲ ਤੇ ਨਾਲ ਭੇਜਿਆ ਪੁੱਤ। ਜੁਆਨ ਕੁੜੀ ਰਾਜੇ ਦੇ ਪੁੱਤ ਤੇ ਹੋਈ ਮੋਹਿਤ ਕਹਿੰਦੀ:-
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਅਤਿ ਅਨੂਪ ਸੁੰਦਰ ਸਰਸ ਮਨੋ ਮੈਨ ਕੇ ਐਨ।।
ਮੋ ਮਨ ਕੋ ਮੋਹਤ ਸਦਾ ਮਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਤਿਹਾਰੇ ਨੈਨ।। ੨੪।। (ਦੁਤਿਯ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪੰਨਾ ੮੧੫)
ਸਵੈਯਾ।। ਬਾਨ ਬਧੀ ਬਿਰਹਾ ਕੇ ਬਲਾਇ ਯੋ ਰੀਝਿ ਰਹੀ ਲਖਿ ਰੂਪ ਤਿਹਾਰੋ।।
ਭੋਗ ਕਰੋ ਮੋਹਿ ਸਾਥ ਭਲੀ ਬਿਧਿ ਭੁਪਤਿ ਕੋ ਨਹਿ ਤ੍ਰਾਸ ਬਿਚਾਰੋ।।
ਸੋ ਨ ਕਰੈ ਕਛੁ ਚਾਰੁ ਚਿਤੈਬੇ ਕੋ ਖਾਇ ਗਿਰੀ ਮਨ ਮੈਨ ਤਵਾਰੋ।।
ਕੋਟਿ ਉਪਾਇ ਰਹੀ ਕੈ ਦਯਾ ਕੀ ਸੋ ਕੈਸੇ ਹੂੰ ਭੀਜਤ ਭਯੋ ਨ ਅਠਯਾਰੋ।। ੨੫।।
(ਦੁਤਿਯ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪੰਨਾ ੮੧੫)
ਦੋਹਰਾ।। ਚਿਤ ਚੇਟਕ ਸੋ ਚੁਭਿ ਗਯੋ ਚਮਕਿ ਚਕ੍ਰਿਤ ਭਯੋ ਅੰਗ।।
ਚੋਰਿ ਚਤੁਰ ਚਿਤ ਲੈ ਗਯੋ ਚਪਲ ਚਖਨ ਕੇ ਸੰਗ।। ੨੬।।
ਹੇਰ ਰੂਪ ਤੁਹਿ ਬਸਿ ਭਈ ਗਹੋਂ ਕਵਨ ਕੀ ਓਟ।।
ਮਛਰੀ ਜਯੋਂ ਤਰਫੈ ਪਰੀ ਚੁਭੀ ਚਖਨ ਕੀ ਚੋਟ।। ੨੭।। (ਦੁਤਿਯ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪੰਨਾ ੮੧੫)
ਰਾਜੇ ਦੇ ਪੁੱਤ ਨੇ ਠੁਕਰਾਇਆ ਹੁਸਨ। ਹੁਸਨ ਖਾਧੀ ਈਰਖਾ-ਜਾ ਪਹੁੰਚੀ ਰਾਜੇ ਪਾਸ-ਕੀਤੀ ਸ਼ਿਕਾਇਤ-ਅਪਣੇ ਹੀ ਨਹੂੰਆਂ ਨਾਲ ਕੀਤਾ ਅਪਣਾ ਹੀ ਚੇਹਰਾ ਜਖ਼ਮੀ। ਰਾਜੇ ਤੱਕਿਆ-ਖਾਧਾ ਗੁੱਸਾਦੌੜਿਆ ਅਪਣੇ ਹੀ ਪੁੱਤ ਨੂੰ ਮਾਰਨ ਲਈ ਪਰ ਸਿਆਣੇ ਮੰਤ੍ਰੀਆਂ ਸਮਝਾਇਆ ਕਿ ਤ੍ਰਿਯਾ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਦਾ ਭੇਦ ਕਿਸੇ ਨੇ ਨਹੀਂ ਪਾਇਆ:-
ਚੌਪਈ।। ਬਚਨ ਸੁਨਤ ਕ੍ਰੁੱਧਿਤ ਨ੍ਰਿਪ ਭਯੋ।। ਮਾਰਨ ਹੇਤ ਸੁਤਹਿ ਲੈ ਗਯੋ।। ਮੰਤ੍ਰਿਨ ਆਨਿ ਰਾਵ ਸਮੁਝਾਯੋ।। ਤ੍ਰਿਯ ਚਰਿੱਤ੍ਰ ਨ ਕਿਨਹੂੰ ਪਾਯੋ।। ੩੦।। (ਦੁਤਿਯ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਪੰਨਾ ੮੧੫)
*ਨੋਟ:- ਪਤਾ ਨਹੀਂ ਸਾਡੇ ਧਰਮ ਦੇ ਰਖਵਾਲੇ ਕਿਸ ਮਜਬੂਰੀ ਵੱਸ ਅਜਿਹੇ ਊਲ ਜਲੂਲ ਨੂੰ ਗੁਰੁ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਨਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਜੋੜਦੇ ਹਨ। ਸਾਡੀਆਂ ਧਾਰਮਿਕ ਅਖਵਾਉਂਦੀਆਂ ਸੰਸਥਾਵਾਂ ਜੋ ਦਸਮ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੀ ਹਮਾਇਤ ਕਰਦੀਆਂ ਹਨ, ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀ ਨੀਯਤ ਖਰੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਜਾਪਦੀ। ਜਦ ਅਜਿਹਾ ਗੰਦਾ ਲਿਟਰੇਚਰ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਜਾਂ ਧੀ ਪੜ੍ਹੇਗੀ ਓਹਦਾ ਆਚਰਣ ਕਿਸ ਪੱਧਰ ਦਾ ਹੋਏਗਾ ਕੋਈ ਲੁਕਿਆ ਛੁਪਿਆ ਨਹੀਂ। ਧਰਮ ਦੇ ਦੋਖੀਆਂ ਦੀ ਹਰ ਸੰਭਵ ਕੋਸ਼ਿਸ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਗਿਆਨ ਤੋਂ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਤੋੜ ਕੇ ਗੁਮਰਾਹ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਾਏ ਅਤੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਹਿਬ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਨੂੰ ਗੰਧਲਾ ਕੀਤਾ ਜਾਏ। ਹਰ ਗੁਰਸਿੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਅਪਣਾ ਫਰਜ਼ ਪਹਿਚਾਣਦਿਆਂ ਖਬਰਦਾਰ ਹੋਣ ਦੀ ਲੋੜ ਹੈ।
*


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ​ਮਨਮੀਤ ਸਿੰਘ​ਵਿਗਿਆਨ ਦੇ ਪਸਾਰਾ ਵੱਧਣ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਮਨੁਖ ਦੀ ਧਰਮ ਵਲੋਂ ਰੁਚੀ ਘਟਦੀ ਜਾ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ। ਇਸਦਾ ਕਾਰਣ ਭੀ ਬੜਾ ਮਜੇਦਾਰ ਅਤੇ ਰੌਚਕ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਮਨੁਖ ਧਰਮ ਨੂੰ ਭੀ ਸਾਇੰਸ ੳਤੇ ਪਰਖਣਾ ਚਾਹ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ, ਜੇ ਪੂਰੇ ਤੌਰ ਤੇ ਠੀਕ ਭੀ ਭਾਪਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਅਜ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਨੇ ਦੁਨਿਆਂ ਦੇ ਹਰ ਖੇਤਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਪਣਾ ਝੰਡਾ ਝੁਲਾਇਆ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਦੁਸਰੇ ਪਾਸੇ ਧਰਮ ਨੇ ਕਈ ਸਦੀਆਂ ਤੋਂ ਹੀ ਮਨੁਖ ਨਾਲ ਸੰਬਧਤ ਹਰ ਖੇਤਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਪਣਾ ਆਧਿਕਾਰ ਕੀਤਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਹੈ। ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦਾ ਹਰ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਭੋਤਿਕਤਾ ਅਤੇ ਪਦਾਰਥਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਸਬੰਧਤ ਹੋਂਦਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਪਾਸੇ ਜਿਆਦਾਤਰ ਧਰਮ ਹਜਾਰਾਂ ਸਾਲ ਤੌ ਚਲੀ ਆ ਰਹੀਆਂ ਕਥਾ ਕਹਾਣੀਆਂ ਤੇ ਅਧਾਰਿਤ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਸਾਰੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਪਰਤਖ ਰੂਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਦਿੱਸਦੇ ਹਨ ਅਤੇ ਨਤੀਜਾ ਕੱਢਣ ਵਾਲੇ ਹੁੰਦੇ ਹਨ। ਐਸਾ ਜਰੂਰੀ ਨਹੀ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਕਿ ਧਰਮ ਦੀਆਂ ਸਾਰੀਆਂ ਗੱਲਾ ਸਚ ਹੋਣ, ਕਿਉਂਕਿ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਜਿਆਦਾਤਰ ਕਥਾ ਕਹਾਣੀਆਂ ਮਨੋ ਕਲਪਤ ਅਤੇ ਮਿਥਿਹਾਸਕ ਹੋਂ ਸਕਦੀਆਂ ਹਨ। ਜਿਸਦੇ ਕਰਕੇ ਮਨੁਖ ਜਦ ਧਰਮ ਨੂੰ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤਾਂ ਦੇ ਪਰਖਣ ਲਗਦਾ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਧਰਮ ਦੀਆਂ ਕਥਾ ਕਹਾਣਿਆ ਅਤੇ ਮਨਤਾਵਾਂ ਝੂਠੀਆਂ ਅਤੇ ਅਸੰਭਵ ਦਿਸਣ ਲੱਗ ਪੈਦੀਆਂ ਹਨ। ਜਿਸਦੇ ਕਰਕੇ ਮਨੁਖ ਦੇ ਸਾਹਮਣੇ ਦੋਰਾਹੇ ਵਾਲੀ ਅਵਸਥਾ ਆ ਬਣਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ੳਹ ਧਰਮ ਨੂੰ ਮੰਨੇ ਜਾਂ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਨੂੰ। ਇੱਕ ਪਾਸੇ ਉਹ ਹਜਾਰਾਂ ਵਰ੍ਹਿਆਂ ਤੋ ਚਲੇ ਆ ਰਹੇ ਧਰਮ ਤੋਂ ਵੀ ਇਨਕਾਰੀ ਨਹੀ ਹੋਣਾ ਚਾਹੁੰਦਾ ਤੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਪਾਸੇ ੳਹ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੀਆਂ ਦਲੀਲਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਵੀ ਨਹੀ ਛੱਡਣਾ ਚਾਹੁੰਦਾ। ਸੋ ਮਨੁਖ ਲਈ ਧਰਮ ਅਤੇ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਤੇ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਾ ਕਰਣਾ ਓਖਾ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਜਾ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ। ਜਿਸ ਕਰਕੇ ਮਨੁਖ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਫਾਇਦਿਆਂ ਕਰਕੇ ਸਾਇੰਸ ੳਤੇ ਤੇ ਪੂਰਾ ਯਕੀਨ ਰਖਦਾ ਹੈ ਲੇਕਿਨ ਧਰਮ ਵਲੋਂ ਅਣਜਾਣ ਜਿਹਾ ਹੋ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਉਹ ਆਪਣੇ ਆਪ ਨੂੰ ਕਰਮਕਾਂਡੀ ਧਰਮੀ ਮਨੁਖ ਬਣਾਦਾਂ ਜਾ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ।
ਇਸ ਤੱਥ ਨੂੰ ਵਿਚਾਰਣ ਲਈ ਇੱਕ ਮਿਸਾਲ ਤੇ ਗੱਲ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਾਂ। ਮੁਸਲਿਮ ਭਾਈਆਂ ਦੇ ਧਾਰਮਕ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਸੱਤ ਧਰਤੀਆਂ ਹਨ ਤੇ ਇਸ ਤੋਂ ਵਧੀਕ ਨਹੀ ਹਨ। ਇਹ ਗੱਲ ਕੁਰਾਨ ਦੀ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਇਸ ਲਈ ਕੁਰਾਨ ਸ਼ਰੀਫ਼ ਉਤੇ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਾ ਰਖਣ ਵਾਲੇ ਹਰ ਇੱਕ ਸੱਚੇ ਮੁਸਲਮਾਨ ਲਈ ਪੱਕੀ ਤੇ ਯਕੀਨ ਜੋਗ ਹੈ। ਪਰ ਜੋ ਮਨੁਖ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੀ ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਨੂੰ ਜਾਣਦਾ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕੇਵਲ ਸੋਰਮੰਡਲ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੀ ਨੌ ਧਰਤੀਆਂ ਤੌ ਵੱਧ ਹਨ ਤਾਂ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਕੁਰਾਨ ਸ਼ਰੀਫ ਦੀ ਇਸ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ ਅਸ਼ਰਧਾ ਅਤੇ ਅਵਿਸ਼ਵਾਸ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੋ ਜਾਏਗਾ। ਜੋ ੳਸਨੂੰ ਕੁਰਾਨ ਸ਼ਰੀਫ ੳਤੇ ਪੂਰਣ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਾ ਹੋਣ ਨਹੀ ਦੇਵੇਗਾ ਤੇ ੳਸਦਾ ਇਹ ਅਵਿਸ਼ਵਾਸ ਹੀ ੳਸਨੂੰ ਕਰਮਕਾਂਡੀ ਮਨੁਖ ਬਣਾ ਦੇਵੇਗਾ। ਕਰਮਕਾਂਡੀ ਬਨਣ ਤੇ ੳਸਦੇ ਸਾਰੇ ਆਤਮਕ ਬੱਲ ਦੇ ਨਾਸ ਹੋ ਜਾਣ ਵਿੱਚ ਕੋਈ ਵਧੀਕ ਸਮਾਂ ਨਹੀ ਲਗੇਗਾ। ਇਹ ਹੀ ਗੱਲ ਪੋਰਾਣਿਕ ਕਥਾਵਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਭੀ ਹੈ। ਅਸੀਂ ਚੰਗੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਜਾਣਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਕਿ ਮਾਰਡਨ ੳੜਨ ਖਟੋਲੇ ਬੋਇੰਗ ਨੂੰ ਬਨਾੳਣ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਸਾਇੰਸਦਾਨ ਭੇਟ ਚਣ ਗਏ ਤੇ ੳਸਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਕਰੀਬ 100 ਵਰ੍ਹਿਆਂ ਦੀ ਅਥਾਹ ਮਿਨਹਤ ਬਾਦ ਹੀ ਮਨੁਖ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੌ ਉਡ ਸਕਿਆ। ਅਸੀਂ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਮਿਥਿਹਾਸਕ ਕਹਾਣੀਆਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਵਾਰ ਦੇਵੀ ਦੇਵਤਿਆਂ ਨੂੰ ੳਡਾਈ ਫਿਰਦੇ ਹਾਂ। ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਮਿਥਿਹਾਸਕ ਕਹਾਣੀਆਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਅਸੀਂ ਐਸੀਆਂ ਅਨੇਕਾਂ ਗੱਲਾ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਾਂ ਜੋ ਕਿ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤਾਂ ਅਤੇ ਤਰਕਾਂ ਉਤੇ ਖਰੀਆਂ ਨਹੀ ਉਤਰਦੀਆਂ ਹਨ। ਜੋ ਕਿਸੀ ਭੀ ਮਨੁਖ ਲਈ ਧਰਮ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ ਅਸ਼ਰਧਾ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਣ ਲਈ ਕਾਫੀ ਹਨ। ਇਸ ਲਈ ਅੱਜ ਮਨੁਖ ਧਰਮ ਤੋਂ ਅਵੇਸਲਾ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਆਪਣੇ ਵਲੋਂ ਬਣਾਏ ਨਿਤ ਨਵੇਂ ਹਲਕੇ ਅਤੇ ਕੋਝੇ ਦਰਸ਼ਨ ੳਤੇ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਾ ਕਰੀ ਬੈਠਾ ਹੈ। ਇਸੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਇਸਾਈ ਮਤ ਨਾਲ ਸਬੰਧਤ ਇੱਕ ਹੋਰ ਮਿਸਾਲ ਬੜੀ ਕਾਰਗਰ ਹੋਵੇਗੀ। ਇੱਕ ਸਮਾਂ ਸੀ, ਜਦ ਬਾਈਬਲ ਇਹ ਕਹਿੰਦੀ ਸੀ ਕਿ ਧਰਤੀ ਚੱਪਟੀ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਗੇਲਿਲਓ ਜੋ ਕਿ ਇੱਕ ਮਹਾਨ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦਾਨ ਹੈ ਨੇ ਖੋਜ ਕੀਤੀ ਕਿ ਧਰਤੀ ਗੋਲ ਹੈ। ਗੇਲਿਲਓ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਨੂੰ ਬੜੀ ਤੇਜੀ ਨਾਲ ਸਮਝਦੇ ਹੋਏ ਇਸਾਈ ਆਗੂਆਂ ਨੇ ਗੋਲਿਲਓ ਨੂੰ ਕਹਿਆ ਕਿ ਬਾਈਬਲ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਤੇ ਧਰਤੀ ਗੋਲ ਤੇ ਇਸ ਲਈ ਧਰਤੀ ਗੋਲ ਹੀ ਹੈ। ਤੇਰੀ ਖੋਜ ਸਹੀ ਨਹੀ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਤੂੰ ਵੀ ਬਾਈਬਲ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਸਹਿਮਤ ਹੋ ਜਾਂ ਨਹੀ ਤੇ ਤੈਨੂੰ ਮੋਤ ਦੇ ਘਾਟ ਉਤਾਰ ਦਿੱਤਾ ਜਾਵੇਗਾ। ਲੇਕਿਨ ਗੇਲਿਲਓ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੀ ਆਪਣੀ ਖੋਜ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਅਟਲ ਰਿਹਾਂ। ਜਿਸ ਕਰਕੇ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਮੌਤ ਦੀ ਸਜਾ ਦੇ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਗਈ। ਈਸਾਈ ਆਗੂਆਂ ਨੂੰ ਉਸ ਸਮੇਂ ਇਸ ਖੋਜ ਦੇ ਨਤੀਜਿਆਂ ਬਾਬਤ ਪੂਰਾ ਅੰਦਾਜਾ ਸੀ। ਜੇ ਗੇਲਿਲਉ ਦੀ ਇਹ ਖੋਜ ਸਹੀ ਹੋਈ ਤਾਂ ਈਸਾਈ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਦਾ ਬਾਈਬਲ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ ਨਿਸਚਾ ਡਗਮਗਾ ਜਾਵੇਗਾ ਤੇ ਈਸਾਈ ਮਤ ਪਤ੍ਰੀ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਸ਼ੰਕਾ ਪੈ ਜਾਵੇਗੀ ਜੋ ਈਸਾਈ ਮਤ ਲਈ ਵੱਡਾ ਭਾਰੀ ਨੁਕਸਾਨ ਹੋਵੇਗੀ। ਸੋ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਨੇ ਗੇਲਿਲਓ ਨੂੰ ਮੋਤ ਦੇ ਘਾਟ ਉਤਾਰ ਕੇ ਈਸਾਈਮਤ ਦਾ ਸਿਰ ਉਚਾ ਰਖਿਆ ਤੇ ਕੁੱਝ ਸਮੇਂ ਬਾਦ ਬਾਈਬਲ ਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਸੋਧ ਲਿਆ। ਅੱਜ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਭੀ ਇਹ ਮਨੰਦੀ ਹੈ ਕੀ ਧਰਤੀ ਗੋਲ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਬਾਈਬਲ ਵੀ। ਅੱਜ ਠੀਕ ਏਹੋ ਜਿਹੇ ਹਾਲਾਤ ਸਿੱਖ ਕੌਮ ਵਿੱਚ ਵੀ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਨੂੰ ਲੈ ਕੇ ਬਣੇ ਹੋਏ ਨੇ। ਇਸ ਕਰਕੇ ਕੋਮ ਦੇ ਵਿਦਵਾਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਨਾਲ ਆਮ ਸੰਗਤਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਵੀ ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਦਾ ਵੱਡਾ ਮਤਭੇਦ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੇਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਤ ਹੈ ਜਾਂ ਨਹੀ। ਲੇਕਿਨ ਸਿੱਖ ਕੋਮ ਦੇ ਆਗੂਆਂ ਵਲੋਂ ਪਿਛਲੇ 280 ਸਾਲਾਂ ਤੋ ਨਿਰਣਾ ਦੇਣਾ ਤਾਂ ਦੂਰ ਹੋਇਆ, ਪੰਥਕ ਪਧਰ ਦੇ ਕੋਈ ਵਡਾ ਭਾਰੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਤਕ ਬੀ ਨਹੀ ਕੀਤਾ ਗਿਆ ਕਿ ਇਸ ਮਤਭੇਦ ਨੂੰ ਦੂਰ ਕਿੱਦਾਂ ਕੂੰ ਕਰਨਾ ਹੈ। ਜੇ ਪੰਥਕ ਆਗੂ ਗਰਬਾਣੀ ਨੂੰ ਅਧਾਰ ਬਣਾ ਕੇ ਮਤਭੇਦ ਦੂਰ ਕਰਨ ਦਾ ਜਤਨ ਕਰਦੇ ਤਾਂ ਸਾਰਾ ਮਸਲਾ ਹਲ ਹੋ ਜਾਣਾ ਸੀ। ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਹੀ ਸੰਸਾਰ ਭਰ ਵਿੱਚ ਐਸੀ ਧਾਰਮਿਕ ਰਚਨਾ ਹੈ ਜੋ ਕਿ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਅਤੇ ੳਸਦੇ ਗੁਝੇ ਭੇਦਾਂ ਤੋਂ ਵੀ ਅਗੇ ਹੈ। ੳਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਲੋਂ ਕੇਵਲ ਤੇ ਕੇਵਲ ਆਪਣੀਆਂ ਜਥੇਦਾਰੀਆਂ ਨੂੰ ਹੀ ਬਚਾਉਣ ਦਾ ੳਪਰਾਲਾ ਕੀਤਾ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ। ੳਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਈਸਾਈ ਆਗੂਆਂ ਵਾਲੀ ਸੂਝਬੂਝ ਕਿਧਰੇ ਵੀ ਨਹੀ ਦੇਖ ਸਕਦੇ। ਅਸੀਂ ਆਪਣੇ ਆਪ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੀ ਧੜੇ ਬਣਾਏ ਰਖੇ ਹੋਏ ਨੇ। ਇਹ ਧੜੇ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਅਖੌਤੀ ਜਥੇਦਾਰਾਂ ਦੀ ਹਉਮੈ ਤੇ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੇ ਨਿਜੀ ਸਵਰਥਾਂ ਦੀ ਪੂਰਤੀ ਕਰਦੇ ਹਨ। ਯਾਦ ਰਹੇ ਜੇ ਸਾਡਾ ਤਾਰੀਕਾ ਇਹ ਹੀ ਰਿਹਾ ਤਾਂ ਨਾ ਤੇ ਸਾਡੇ ਕੋਲ ਪੰਥ ਹੋਵੇਗਾ ਤੇ ਨਾ ਹੀ ਇਸ ਪੰਥ ਦੀਆਂ ਜੱਥੇਦਾਰੀਆਂ। ਜੇ ਬਚੇਗਾ ਤੇ ਬਸ ਓਹ ਪਛਤਾਵਾ ਕਿ ਅਸੀਂ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਵਲੋਂ ਬਖਸ਼ੇ ਦੁਨੀਆ ਦੇ ਸਭ ਤੋਂ ਨਵੇਕਲੇ ਧਰਮ ਨੂੰ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਦੂਜਿਆਂ ਨਾਲ ਮਿਲਗੋਭਾ ਕਰਕੇ ੳਜਾੜ ਲਿਆ ਹੈ। ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਨਾਲ ਅਸੀਂ ਆਪਣੇ ਮਤਭੇਦਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਉਲਝ ਕੇ ਗੁਰਮਤਿ ਦੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰ ਤੋ ਭੀ ਸਖਣੇ ਹੋ ਰਹੇ ਹਾਂ। ਜਿਸਦੇ ਸਦਕਾ ਵਿਰਾਸਤ ਵਿੱਚ ਮਿਲੇ ਸਾਡੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਦਾ ਪ੍ਰਚਾਰ ਦੂਜੇ ਆਪਣਾ ਠੱਪਾ ਲਾ ਕੇ ਹੀ ਕਰਦੇ ਰਹਿਣਗੇਂ ਤੇ ਅਸੀਂ ਕੇਵਲ ਗੂੰਗੇ ਬਣ ਕੇ ਹਮੇਸ਼ਾ ਵਾਂਗੂ ਹੀ ਇਹ ਤਮਾਸ਼ਾ ਵੇਖਦੇ ਰਵਾਗੇਂ ਕਿ ਅਸੀਂ ਆਪਣਾ ਭਲਾ ਤੇ ਨਾ ਕਰ ਸਕੇ ਸਗੋਂ ਗਵਾਂਢੀ ਹੀ ਸਾਡਾ ਮਾਲ ਚੌਰੀ ਕਰ ਆਪਣਾ ਘਰ ਭਰੀ ਗਏ।
ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਵਿੱਚ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਬਾਰੇ ਅਧਿਆਇ ਦੋ ਦੇ ਵਿੱਚ ਵਰਣਨ ਮਿਲਦਾ ਹੈ। ਜੋ ਕਿ ਵਿਚਾਰਨ ਤੇ ਇਉਂ ਭਾਸਦਾ ਹੈ ਜਿਵੇ ਇਹ ਹਿੰਦੂਵਾਦੀ ਕਥਾ ਕਹਾਣੀਆਂ ਤੋਂ ਪ੍ਰੇਰਿਤ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਕਿਸੀ ਭੀ ਪੱਧਰ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੁ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੀ ਵਿਚਾਰਧਾਰਾ ਨਾਲ ਮੇਲ ਨਹੀ ਖਾਂਦੀ ਤੇ ਨਾ ਹੀ ਇਹ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਤਰਕਾਂ ਉਤੇ ਖਰੀ ਉਤਰਦੀ ਹੈ। ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਿਚਾਰਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਪਸੀ ਵਿਰੋਧਾਭਾਸ ਭੀ ਹੈ। ਜਿਸ ਕਰਕੇ ਇਸ ਵਿਸ਼ੇ ਤੇ ਕਿਸੀ ਭੀ ਸਧਾਰਨ ਵਿਚਾਰਵਾਨ ਲਈ ਦੁਬਿਧਾ ਬਣ ਜਾਣਾ ਕੋਈ ਔਖਾ ਨਹੀਂ। ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਦੇ ਛੰਤ 10 ਤੋਂ 13 (ਆਧਿਆਇ 2) ਵਿੱਚ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਬਾਰੇ ਦੋ ਵੱਖ ਵੱਖ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਕੀਤੇ ਹਨ। ਛੰਦ 10 ਦੀਆਂ ਪਹਿਲੀ ਦੋ ਸਤਰਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਕਾਲ ਵਲੋਂ ਉਅੰਕਾਰ ਨੂੰ ਰਚ ਕੇ ਉਸ ਪਾਸੋ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਕੀਤੀ ਗਈ ਹੈ।
*ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮ ਕਾਲ ਜਬ ਕਰਾ ਪਸਾਰਾ ॥
ੳਅੰਕਾਰ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਉਪਾਰਾ ॥​*ੳਅੰਕਾਰ ਵਲੋਂ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਦੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਕਰਵਾਉਣ ਮਗਰੋਂ ਇਹ ਰਾਜੇ ਹੋਏ
*ਕਾਲ ਸੈਣ ਪ੍ਰਥਮੈ ਭਾਇਓ ਭੂਪਾ ॥
ਅਧਿਕ ਅਤੁਲ ਬਲਿ ਰੂਪ ਅਨੂਪਾ ॥ 10 ॥

ਕਾਲਕੇਤ ਦੂਸਰ ਭੂਅ ਭਇਓ ॥
ਕ੍ਰੂਰਬਰਸ ਤੀਸਰ ਜਗ ਭਯੋ ॥
ਕਾਲਧੁਜ ਚਤੁਰਥ ਨ੍ਰਿਪ ਸੋਹੈ ॥
ਜਿਹ ਤੇ ਭਥੋ ਜਗਤ ਸਭ ਕੋ ਹੈ ॥11 ॥​*ੳਅੰਕਾਰ ਵਲੋਂ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਥਾਪਣ ਦੇ ਬਾਦ ਚਾਰ ਰਾਜੇ ਹੋਏ - 1 ਕਾਲ ਸੈਣ ਜੋ ਕਿ ਬੜਾ ਬਲੀ ਹੋਇਆ ਉਸਦੇ ਮਗਰੋਂ ਕਾਲਕੇਤ ਦੂਜਾ ਤੇ ਕ੍ਰੂਰਬਰਸ ਤੀਜਾ ਰਾਜਾ ਹੋਇਆ। ਚੋਥਾ ਰਾਜਾ ਕਾਲਧੁਜ ਹੋਇਆ ਤੇ ਜਿਸ ਤੋਂ ਅੰਗੇ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਹੋਈ। 12 ਵੇਂ ਛੰਦ ਵਿੱਚ ਰਾਜਾ ਕਾਲਧੁਜ ਦੀ ਹੀ ਸਿਫਤ ਕੀਤੀ ਗਈ
*ਸਹਸ੍ਰ ਗਛ ਜਾ ਕੋ ਸੁਭ ਸੋਹੈ ॥
ਸਹਸ ਪਾਦ ਜਾ ਕੇ ਤਨਿ ਮੋਹੈ ॥
ਸੇਖ ਨਾਗ ਪਰ ਸੋਇਬੋ ਕਰੈ ॥
ਜਗ ਤਿਹ ਸੇਖ ਸਾਇ ਉਚਰੈ ॥ 12 ॥​*ਇਸ ਤੋਂ ਅਗਲੇ ਹੀ ਛੰਦ ਵਿੱਚ ਰਾਜਾ ਕਾਲਧੁਜ ਵਲੋਂ ਰਚੀ ਗਈ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਦੀ ਘਟਨਾ ਦਾ ਵ੍ਰਤਾਂਤ ਦਸਿਆ ਗਿਆ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਕੰਨ ਦੇ ਮੈਲ ਨਾਲ ਕਾਲਧੁਜ ਨੇ ਮਧੁ ਅਤੇ ਕੀਟਭ ਰਾਖਸ਼ ਬਣਾਏ ਅਤੇ ਦੂਜੇ ਕੰਨ ਦਾ ਮੈਲ ਕਢਿਆ ਜਿਸ ਨਾਲ ਇਹ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਹੋਈ।
ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਰਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਪੰਜ ਛੰਦ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੀ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਬਾਰੇ ਦੋ ਅਲਗ ਅਲਗ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਪ੍ਰਗਟ ਕੀਤੇ ਗਏ ਹਨ। ਜਿਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦਾ ਵਿਰੋਧਾਭਾਸ ਹੀ ਇਸ ਰਚਨਾ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ ਸੰਦੇਹ ਨੂੰ ਵਧਾਂਦਾ ਹੈ। ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਵਿੱਚ ਵੱਖ ਵੱਖ ਇਲਾਕਿਆਂ ਦੀਆਂ ਭਾਸਾਂ ਦੇ ਲਗਭਗ 300 ਸਾਲ ਦੇ ਲਮੇ ਸਮੇਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਹੋਏ ਮਹਾਪੁਰਖਾਂ ਦੀਆਂ ਰਚਨਾਵਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਵਿਰੋਧਾਭਾਸ ਨਹੀ ਆਉਂਦਾ ਤੇ ਇਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਕਿਉਂ ਆਇਆ ਹੈ? ਇਥੇਂ ਗੱਲ ਕੇਵਲ ਵਿਰੋਧਾਭਾਸ ਤੇ ਹੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਮੁੱਕ ਜਾਂਦੀ, ਵਿਸ਼ਾ ਤਾਂ ਇਹ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਬਾਰੇ ਜੋ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਦੀ ਹੈ ਉਹ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਅਤੇ ਅੱਜ ਦੀ ਮਾਰਡਨ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਜੋ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਪੇਸ਼ ਕਰ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਭੀ ਮੇਲ ਨਹੀ ਖਾਂਦੀ।
ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਦੇ ਸਬੰਧ ਵਿੱਚ ਸੰਨ 1965 ਵਿੱਚ ਡਾਂ ਐਲਨ ਸੈਂਡੇਜ (ਜੋ ਇੱਕ ਵੱਡੇ ਸਾਇੰਸਦਾਨ ਸੀ) ਨੇ ਪਲਸੇਟਿੰਗ ਯੂਨੀਵਰਸ ਥਿਊਰੀ (ਗਤੀਸ਼ੀਲ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ) ਪੇਸ਼ ਕੀਤੀ। ਜਿਸ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ “ਲਗਭਗ ਹਰ 41 ਅਰਬ ਸਾਲ ਦੇ ਵਕਫੇ ਪਿਛੋ ਸਾਡਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਇੱਕ ਵਡੇ ਵਿਸਫੋਟ ਵਜੋਂ ਪੈਦਾ ਹੋਇਆ ਤਦ ਤੋਂ ਹੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਲਗਾਤਾਰ ਫੈਲ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ। ਅਗਲੇ 29 ਅਰਬ ਸਾਲਾਂ ਤਕ ਇਸ ਦੇ ਫੈਲਣ ਦਾ ਅੰਦਾਜਾ ਹੈ। ਤਦ ਇਹ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਗੁਰੂਤਾ ਖਿੱਚ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਭਾਵ ਹੇਠ ਫੈਲਣ ਤੋਂ ਰੁਕ ਜਾਵੇਗਾ ਅਤੇ ਫਿਰ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਵਿੱਚ ਪਦਾਰਥਾਂ ਦਾ ਸੁੰਗੜਨਾ ਸ਼ੁਰੂ ਹੋ ਜਾਵੇਗਾ। ਇਵੇਂ ਹੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਤੋਂ ਬਾਦ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਦੇ ਸਬੰਧ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਧੁਨਿਕ ਸਾਇੰਸਦਾਨਾਂ ਵਲੋਂ ਦਿਤੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਪ੍ਰਕਰਤੀਵਾਦ (Naturalistic theory) ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਦਾ ਵਿਕਾਸ ਕਰੋੜਾਂ ਵਰ੍ਹਿਆਂ ਤਕ ਹੋਣ ਵਾਲੀ ਭੋਤਕ ਅਤੇ ਰਸਾਯਨਿਕ ਪ੍ਰਕਿਰਆਵਾਂ (Physico - Chemical Proccess) ਕਰਕੇ ਹੈ। ਇਸ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਨੂੰ A.I. oparin ਨੇ ਆਪਣੀ ਕਿਤਾਬ The origin oflife ਵਿੱਚ ਪੇਸ਼ ਕੀਤਾ ਹੈ। ਇਸ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਇਹ ਧਾਰਣਾਂ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਾਈ ਗਈ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਵਿਕਾਸ ਹੋਲੀ ਹੋਲੀ ਧਰਤੀ ਦੇ ਪਦਾਰਥਾਂ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਹੋਇਆ।
ਇੱਥੇ ਦਿਤੇ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਵਿਚਾਰਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਦੇ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਮੇਲ ਨਹੀਂ ਖਾਂਦੇ ਤੇ ਦੋਨਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਬੜਾ ਭਾਰੀ ਅੰਤਰ ਹੈ। ਸਾਇੰਸ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਇੱਕ ਵੱਡੇ ਵਿਸਫੋਟ ਦੇ ਹੋਣ ਤੇ ਧਰਤੀ ਬਣੀ ਤੇ ਉਸੀ ਵਿਸਫੋਟ ਦੇ ਮਗਰੋਂ ਹੀ ਧਰਤੀ ਆਪਣੀ ਹੋਂਦ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਈ ਤੇ ਉਸਦੇ ਪਦਾਰਥਾਂ ਦੇ ਨਾਲ ਹੀ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਦਾ ਅਰੰਭ ਅਤੇ ਵਿਕਾਸ ਹੋਇਆ। ਦੂਜੇ ਪਾਸੇ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਪਹਿਲ ਤਾਂ ਕਾਲ (ਸਮਾਂ ਜਾਂ ਉਜੈਨ ਦਾ ਦੇਵਤਾ) ਨੇ ਉਅੰਕਾਰ ਦੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਕੀਤੀ। ਉਸਦੇ ਮਗਰੋ ਚਾਰ ਰਾਜੇ ਥਾਪੇ, ਚੋਥੇਂ ਰਾਜੇ ਵਲੋਂ ਕਢੇ ਗਏ ਕੰਨ ਦੇ ਮੈਲ ਤੋਂ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਹੋਈ। ਜੇ ਮੰਨ ਲਿਆ ਜਾਵੇਂ ਕਿ ਕੰਨ ਦੇ ਮੈਲ ਨਾਲ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਥਾਪੀ ਗਈ ਹੈ ਤਾਂ ਬੜੇ ਹੀ ਸਵਾਲ ਉਠਣਗੇ। ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਤੋਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਹੋਏ ਰਾਜੇ ਕਿੱਥੋਂ ਦੇ ਰਾਜੇ ਹੋਏ? ਜੇ ਰਾਜੇ ਹੋਏ ਤੇ ਪਰਜਾ ਕਿੱਥੇਂ ਸੀ? ਜੇ ਚੋਥੇ ਰਾਜੇ ਨੇ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਬਣਾਈ ਤਾਂ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਦੇ ਤਿਨ ਰਾਜੇ ਕਿਵੇਂ ਰਾਜੇ ਬਣੇ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਬਨਣ ਤੇ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਉਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਕੰਨਾਂ ਦੀ ਮੈਲ ਕਿੱਥੋਂ ਅਤੇ ਕਿਸ ਪਦਾਰਥ ਦਾ ਆਇਆ ਆਦਿ। ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਦਾ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਦੇ ਸਬੰਧ ਵਿੱਚ ਆਇਆ ਵਰਣਨ ਨਾ ਤੇ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਸਿਧਾਂਤਾਂ ਮਤਾਬਿਕ ਹੈ ਓਰ ਨਾ ਹੀ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦੀ ਫਿਲਾਸਫੀ ਨਾਲ ਇਤਫਾਕ ਰਖਦਾ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਸਾਰਾ ਦਾ ਸਾਰਾ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਕ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਕਿਸੇ ਸਿੱਖੀ ਦੇ ਪ੍ਰਬਲ ਵਿਰੋਧੀ ਵਲੋਂ ਲਿਖਤ ਉਸਦੀ ਮਨੋਕਲਪਨਾ ਤੋਂ ਵੱਧ ਹੋਰ ਕੁਛ ਭੀ ਨਹੀ ਹੋ ਸਕਦਾ।
ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਦੇ ਮਹਾਨ ਚਰਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਲ ਇਸ ਹਲਕੀ ਅਤੇ ਕੌਝੀ ਮਨੌਕਲਪਨਾ ਨੂੰ ਜੋੜਨਾ ਕੇਵਲ ਗੁਰੁ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਪਤ੍ਰੀ ਅਗਿਆਨਤਾ ਦਾ ਹੀ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਾਵਾ ਹੈ। ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਨੇ ਅਪਣੇ ਸੰਪੂਰਣ ਜੀਵਨ ਵਿੱਚ ਕੇਵਲ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹ ਵਲੋਂ ਦਰਸਾਏ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਤੇ ਹੀ ਪਹਿਰਾ ਦੇਂਦੇ ਹੋਏ, ਸਦਾ ਲਈ ਸਿੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਉਸੀ ਸ਼ਬਦ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਲ ਜੋੜਿਆ ਜਿਸਦੀ ਪਰੰਪਰਾ ਗੁਰੂ ਨਾਨਕ ਪਾਤਸ਼ਾਹ ਨੇ ਖੁਦ ਆਪ ਸ਼ੁਰੂ ਕੀਤੀ। ਜਿੱਥੇਂ ਤਕ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ ਬਾਰੇ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੀ ਫਿਲਾਸਫੀ ਦੀ ਗੱਲ ਹੈ, ਉਹ ਪੂਰੇ ਤੌਰ ਨਾਲ ਵਿਗਿਆਨਕ ਸੋਚ ਨਾਲ ਢੁਕਵੀਂ ਬੈਠਦੀ ਹੈ, ਜਿੱਥੇ ਤਕ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੀ ਬਾਣੀ ਦਾ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਹੈ ਉਹ ਇਸ ਵਿਗਿਆਨਕ ਸੋਚ ਤੋਂ ਹਾਲੇਂ ਵੀ ਬਹੁਤ ਅਗੇ ਹੈ।
ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੇ ਗਤਿਸ਼ੀਲ ਸਿਧਾਂਤ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਦੀ ਉਤਪਤੀ 12 ਅਰਬ ਸਾਲਾਂ ਪਹਿਲੇ ਇੱਕ ਵਿਸਫੋਟ ਹੋਇਆ ਤੇ ਉਸ ਦੇ ਮਗਰੋ ਇਹ ਪਦਾਰਥ ਖਿਲਰ ਗਏ ਅਤੇ ਓਹ ਅਗਲੇ 29 ਅਰਬ ਸਾਲਾਂ ਤਕ ਇੱਕ ਦੂਜੇ ਤੋ ਦੂਰ ਜਾਂਦੇ ਰਹਿਣਗੇ ਅਤੇ 41 ਅਰਬ ਸਾਲਾਂ ਲਈ ਫਿਰ ਗਰੂਤਾ ਕਾਰਣ ਸੁੰਗੜਨੇ ਚਾਲੂ ਹੋ ਜਾਣਗੇ ਜਦ ਉਹ ਸਾਰੇ ਪਦਾਰਥ ਮੂੜ ਇਕਠੇ ਹੋ ਜਾਣਗੇ ਤਾਂ ਫਿਰ ਤੋਂ ਇਹ ਪਦਾਰਥ ਆਪਸ ਤੋ ਦੂਰ 41 ਅਰਬ ਸਾਲਾਂ ਲਈ ਦੂਰ ਹੋਣ ਲਗਣਗੇ। ਉਹ ਫਿਰ ਇਕਠੇ ਹੋਣ ਲਗਣਗੇ ਤੇ ਇਹ ਕ੍ਰਮ ਬਰਾਬਰ ਹੀ ਚਲਦਾ ਰਿਹਾ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਚਲਦਾ ਰਹੇਗਾ। ਸੋ ਅਜ ਤਕ ਭੀ ਸਾਇੰਸਦਾਨ ਇਸ ਗੱਲ ਨੂੰ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਿਤ ਨਹੀ ਹੋ ਸਕੇ ਕਿ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਵਿਸਫੋਟ ਕਦੋ ਹੋਇਆ ਤੇ ਪਦਾਰਥਾਂ ਦੇ ਖਿਲਰਣ ਦਾ ਇਹ ਕਿਨਵਾਂ ਚੱਕਰ ਹੈ? ਜਿਸ ਸਬੰਧ ਵਿੱਚ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦਾ ਫਰਮਾਨ ਹੈ
*ਥਿਤਿ ਵਾਰ ਨਾ ਜੋਗੀ ਜਾਣੈ ਰੁਤਿ ਮਹਾ ਨਾ ਕੋਈ ॥
ਜਾ ਕਰਤਾ ਸਿਰਠੀ ਕੋ ਸਾਜੇ ਆਪੇ ਜਾਣੈ ਸੋਈ ॥​*ਜੇ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦੀਆ ਉਪਰਾਲੀਆਂ ਸਤਰਾਂ ਨੂੰ ਖੁੱਲੇ ਦਿਮਾਗ ਨਾਲ ਵਿਚਾਰੀਏ ਤਾਂ ਇਹ ਗੱਲ ਪੂਰੀ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਸਾਫ਼ ਦਿੱਸਦੀ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਜਦ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਵਲੋਂ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦਾ ਪਸਾਰਾ ਨਹੀ ਪਸਾਰਿਆ ਗਿਆ ਹੋਵੇਗਾ ਤਾਂ ਸਮੇ ਦੀ ਭੀ ਕੋਈ ਹਸਤੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਹੋਵੇਗੀ, ਜਦ ਉਸਦੀ ਹਸਤੀ ਹੀ ਨਹੀ ਸੀ ਤਾਂ ਉਸਦੀ ਗਿਣਤੀ ਕਰਨਾ ਔਖਾ ਹੀ ਨਹੀ ਸਗੋ ਨਾਮੁਨਕਿਨ ਹੈ। ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨੇ ਇਹ ਸਾਰਾ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਬਣਾਇਆ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਇਸ ਵਿੱਚ ਉਸਨੇ ਕਿਸੀ ਕੋਲੋਂ ਮਦਦ ਨਹੀ ਲਈ ਕਿਉਂ ਕਿ ਉਦੋਂ ਤਾਂ ਕੋਈ ਸੀ ਭੀ ਨਹੀ।
*ਆਪਨ ਖਲ ਆਪਿ ਵਰਤੀਜਾ ॥
ਨਾਨਕ ਕਰਨੈਹਾਰੁ ਨ ਦੂਜਾ ॥​*ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨੇ ਇਹ ਸਾਰੀ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਆਪਣੇ ਹੀ ਭਾਣੈ ਨਾਲ ਆਪ ਹੀ ਬਣਾਈ ਤੇ ਜਦ ਉਸਦਾ ਭਾਣਾ ਹੋਵੇਗਾ ਤਾਂ ਉਹ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਆਪਣੀ ਇਸ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਨੂੰ ਸਮੇਟ ਲਵੇਗਾ।
*ਜਾ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਤਾਂ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਉਪਾਏ ॥
ਅਪਨੈ ਬਾਣੈ ਲਏ ਸਮਾਏ ॥​*ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਨੇ ਇਹ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਕੋਈ ਪਹਿਲੀ ਵਾਰ ਨਹੀ ਬਣਾਈ ਉਸਨੇ ਇਹ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਕਈ ਵਾਰ ਬਣਾਈ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਕਈ ਵਾਰ ਸਮੇਟ ਵੀ ਲਈ ਹੈ।
*ਕਈ ਬਾਰ ਪਸਰਿਉ ਪਸਾਰਾ ॥​*ਸਾਇੰਸ ਹਾਲੇ ਤਕ ਜਿੱਥੇ ਨਹੀ ਪਹੁੰਚ ਸਕੀ, ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਨੇ ਉਹ ਭੇਦ 500 ਸਾਲ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਹੀ ਖੋਲ ਦਿਤੇ ਹਨ। ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਅਤੇ ਸਾਇੰਸਦਾਨਾਂ ਦੇ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਆਪਸ ਵਿੱਚ ਬ੍ਰਹਿਮੰਡ ਦੀ ਰਚਨਾ ਬਾਰੇ ਹੀ ਨਹੀ ਸਗੋਂ ਉਨ੍ਹਾਂ ਦੀ ਗਿਣਤੀ ਬਾਰੇ ਵੀ ਕਾਫੀ ਮਿਲਦੇ ਹਨ।
*ਪਾਤਲਾ ਪਾਤਾਲ ਲਖ ਅਗਾਸਾ ਅਗਾਸ ॥​*ਜਿਥੋਂ ਤਕ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਦਾ ਸੰਬੰਧ ਹੈ ਤੇ ਉਥੇ ਭੀ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਅਤੇ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦੇ ਵਿਚਾਰਾ ਵਿੱਚ ਡੂੰਘੀਆਂ ਸਮਾਨਤਵਾਂ ਹਨ। ਸਾਇੰਸਦਾਨਾਂ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਜੀਵਨ ਲਈ ਸਭ ਤੋ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਹਵਾ ਸੀ, ਉਸਦੇ ਮਗਰੋ ਪਾਣੀ ਬਣਾਇਆ ਤੇ ਪਾਣੀ ਦੀ ਹੋਂਦ ਪਿਛੋ ਹੀ ਧਰਤੀ ਤੇ ਧਰਤੀ ਦੇ ਪਦਾਰਥਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਜੀਵਨ ਦਾ ਵਿਕਾਸ ਹੋਇਆ ਤੇ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਮੁਤਾਬਿਕ ਪਹਿਲੋ ਪਹਿਲ ਪਰਮਾਤਮਾ ਆਪ ਸੀ ਤੇ ਫਿਰ ਪਵਨ ਤੇ ਪਾਣੀ ਹੋਇਆ।
*ਸਾਚੇ ਤੇ ਪਵਨਾ ਭਇਆ ਪਵਨੈ ਤੇ ਜਲੁ ਹੋਇਆ ॥
ਜਲ ਤੇ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣੁ ਸਾਜਿਆ ਘਟਿ ਘਟਿ ਜੋਤਿ ਸਮੋਇ ॥
ਪਉਣੁ ਪਾਣੀ ਸੁੰਨੈ ਤੇ ਸਾਜੇ ॥
ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟਿ ਉਪਾਇ ਕਾਇਆ ਗੜ ਗਾਜੇ ॥​*ਇਸ ਤਰ੍ਹਾਂ ਨਾਲ ਸਾਡੇ ਸਾਮਣੇ ਸ਼ੀਸ਼ੇ ਵਾਂਗੂ ਸਾਫ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦਾ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਧਾਰਾ ਨਾਲ ਕਿਧਰੇ ਭੀ ਕੋਈ ਵਿਰੋਧਾਭਾਸ ਨਹੀ ਹੈ। ਅੱਜ ਦੀ ਮਾਰਡਨ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਭੀ ਉਹੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਪੇਸ਼ ਕਰ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ ਜੋ ਅੱਜ ਤੋ 500 ਸਾਲ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਵਿੱਚ ਸਤਿਗੁਰਾਂ ਨੇ ਬਖਸ਼ੇ ਸੀ। ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦਾ ਪੂਰੇ ਤੋਰ ਨਾਲ ਵਿਗਿਆਨਕ ਹੋਣ ਕਾਰਣ ਹੀ ਅੱਜ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਤੇ ਨਿਸਚਾ ਰਖਣ ਵਾਲੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਦਾ ਭੋਰਸਾ ਆਪਣੇ ਗੁਰੂ ਤੋਂ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੀ ਕਿਸੀ ਨਵੀ ਖੋਜ ਕਰਕੇ ਨਹੀ ਟੁੱਟ ਸਕਦਾ। ਜੋ ਗੱਲ ਅੱਜ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਕਰਦੀ ਹੈ, ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਵਿੱਚ ਉਸ ਨੂੰ ਪਹਿਲਾਂ ਹੀ ਖੋਲਿਆ ਜਾ ਚੁਕਾ ਹੁੰਦਾ ਹੈ। ਜਿੱਥੇ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦਾ ਪਸਾਰਾ ਵਧਣ ਨਾਲ ਲੋਕਾਂ ਵਿਚੋਂ ਧਰਮ ਉਡ ਪੁਡ ਰਹਿਆ ਹੈ, ੳਥੇ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਦੇ ਰਸੀਏ ਦਾ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਪ੍ਰਤੀ ਨਿਸ਼ਚਾ ਅਤੇ ਸ਼ਰਧਾ ਦਿਨੋ ਦਿਨ ਵੱਧਦੀ ਜਾ ਰਹੀ ਹੈ।
ਦੂਜੇ ਪਾਸੇ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਦੀ ਵਿਚਾਰ ਕਿਸੀ ਭੀ ਪੱਧਰ ਤੇ ਸ੍ਰਿਸਟੀ ਦੇ ਸਬੰਧ ਵਿੱਚ ਗੁਰਬਾਣੀ ਅਤੇ ਸਾਇੰਸ ਦੀ ਕਸੌਟੀ ਉਤੇ ਖਰੀ ਨਹੀਂ ਉਤਰਦੀ। ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰ ਨਾਟਕ ਦੀ ਵਿਸ਼ਾ ਸਮਗਰੀ ਭੀ ਬਚਿਤ੍ਰਤਾ ਅਤੇ ਵਿਰੋਧਭਾਸ ਪੈਦਾ ਕਰਣ ਲਈ ਹੀ ਘੜੀ ਜਾਪਦੀ ਹੈ। ਇਹ ਰਚਨਾ ਕਿਸੀ ਵੀ ਦ੍ਰਿਸ਼ਟੀ ਕੋਣ ਨਾਲ ਗੁਰੂ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਿੰਘ ਜੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾ ਹੋ ਕੇ ਕਿਸੀ ਪੋਰਾਣਿਕ ਕਥਾਵਾਂ ਦੇ ਮਹਿਰ ਦੀ ਮਨੋਕਲਪਨਾ ਤੋ ਵਧੀਕ ਕੁਛ ਭੀ ਨਹੀ ਭਾਸਦੀ।


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 8, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Why don't you just admit that you can't understand Gurmukhi? Otherwise. Gurakhar fonts aren't hard to find.


What soever das will replpy below wil be proof that das has read Gurmukhi and Punjabi.Das did not know which fonts were there for above verse.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 8, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Using Bal is wrong but how about using sodis and bedis? Isn't that caste system? You don't see sodis and bedis but you see randhawas and others.
> 
> Who said chariter is a bad term? What dasam granth says is bad. It says that the creator of universe doesn't know the inside of women.


Sodi or perhaps Bhala is there in Guru Granth Sahib Ji and Randhawa in Vars of Bhai Gurdas.But in all the cases people talked about are not Singhs.Without Baptism or say after Baptism of sabre.

Kala Afghana Sahib said so qouting Gyani Naryan Singh Ji and you have edited the whole articlce of Mr Bal perhaps as he is not Anti Kala Afghana Ji.

And das begs you to not to get confused with Brahma as creator.Some other confusions are there and give the verse and das wil do the correct interpetaions.

like one is chrecters of these ladies/ablas oh endless!
making them they repend oh creator!.

So far people misinterpret them.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 8, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Also, not all of dasam granth is braj basha so don't think you are scholar. In fact, it uses a lot of Punjabi words commonly used as poets were from Punjab area. So we can say that it is a mixture.


Well only a few words in Charitropakhyan are in Punjabi while Var Bhagauti Ji Ki is in Punjabi and Mitr Piare Nu is in Punjabi.

Das will expose the weakness of Bhag Singh Ji ambala's understanding of Punjabi also.Some terms in Punjabi are nothing to do with Aryan vocabulary more in case of jatts as they have caucasian back ground.

Gyani Bhag Singh Ji may not be knowing this.Best example is they took word Khera for the caste of jatts.While caste is Khahira(as could be seen in Charitropakhyan regarding Heer Ranjah).Khera has other meaning for sythians residing as Jaat,Gujer or Rajputs.An Arya Samaji could not tell that.
(Khera may means blossem like flower and also means place where ancester is worshipped viz Bumiya Khera).

Before Sikhism jatts use to worship dead ancestors.Place for them was best in village. Still called Khera in hindu jaat Areas.(punjab has 108 villages of them.).


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 8, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Also make this clear. If Raam is attribute of God then what does Kab Shyam or kib sXwm in Gurmukhi mean? Shows you got no clue about Viakaran. No wonder you do whatever aarth you want. So tell me what does poet Shyam mean. If you was to translate shyam as black, then tell me what does poet black mean? If you want to do aarth, tell me what was God doing writing chariters? Also, if God said those chariters, Guru Sahib would have respected it even more than Guru Granth Sahib Ji but there is no mention of Dasam Granth in Punjab before around the 1800s. Therefore, there is no doubt that poet shyam is poet, no doubt that poet raam is a poet, no doubt that poet kal is poet. No doubt that poet soom is poet.
> 
> I will post more later when I get time.


 
Well Dark is attribute of Akal and all colours are attribute of Akal

ਪੰਨਾ 23, ਸਤਰ 13
ਆਪੇ ਬਹੁ ਬਿਧਿ ਰੰਗੁਲਾ ਸਖੀਏ ਮੇਰਾ ਲਾਲੁ ॥
आपे बहु बिधि रंगुला सखीए मेरा लालु ॥
Āpė baho biḏẖ rangulā sakẖī&shy;ė mėrā lāl.
He Himself loves in so many ways. O sister soul-brides, He is my Beloved.
ਮਃ 1   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

ਪੰਨਾ 726, ਸਤਰ 13
ਆਪੇ ਹਰਿ ਇਕ ਰੰਗੁ ਹੈ ਆਪੇ ਬਹੁ ਰੰਗੀ ॥
आपे हरि इक रंगु है आपे बहु रंगी ॥
Āpė har ik rang hai āpė baho rangī.
The Lord Himself is absolute; He is The One and Only; but He Himself is also manifested in many forms.
ਮਃ 4   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

only two are given as if das gives a long whole verse manu crux will be lost.

Das gave you a verse from Bhagt nam Dev where Akal is told to be a Shyam.

Fact is Guru Granth Sahib Ji themsevles are work of God and not by any human.Guru over there is also God and not any Human.

God does self description vide charecterss.

In wrong also god only does work as we do not have any satan in Gurmat.If you want you can import one from semtic faiths but in them also at deeper side only God is there.Das is talking on the same issue with Bhai Aziz on smoe other thread.Hindus also have good and Bad but no Bad in us.It is apprant.

From deep black hole does energy comes in to visible form of light.Wehere attractiono is strong we do not get light coming out even.


There is no Kavi Soom but fun is made for some Teli calling him soom Sufi.So read whole the Chartropakhyan again and carefully.Das requests you for tyhe number of Chreacter where Soom Sufi is the poet?

Are you aware that your Kahan Singh Nabha aknowledges the doubt sorted by Bhai Sukha Singh ji of Marhi Kambo Ki after killing Massa Rangarh.

And that was much before 1800s.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 8, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> I didn't read all of your stuff about Charanjit SIngh Bal. Email him what you are saying about him. Don't talk nonsense behind someone's back. He will answer his own queries. I am not going to be lawyer for all writers and defend them but I will mention some things.
> 
> You doubt Guru more than anyone. I can tell from your writings. You have shanka om Pooraa Guru. You are saying that Guru wasn't able to make Sikhs strong enough to control Punjab. Sikhs stopped following Guru isn't fault of Guru. Sikhs were low in number and Sikhs were strong enough to hold off the Mughals and did establish a raaj but it was lost due to Dasam Granth and hindu practices introduced through it. Now Vijaydeep, with his RSS (Rastrya Sikh Sangat) and crew have only one motive and that is to slowly merge Sikhs back into Hindus or kill them slowly through literature such as dasam granth. You guys want to fool uneducated Sikhs to think that Dasam Granth is credible and then do proper arth of dasam granth and prove Sikhs to be hindus.


 
Bhai you have brought bal over here so bring him here and we will talk.It will be good for the site.

Yuo again want to say that Bhai Kahan Singh Nabha is wrong and Sakhi of Dasham Granth coming into existance much before Sikhs defeating  Mughals is wrong.

Dasham Guru Bani and whole of Dasham Granth's compositions were there before we defeat Moghuls.

Rather das precives that yourself want to say that Dasham Granth is powerfull enhugh to defeat the infalliable Guru Granth sahib Ji and arrangement been done by Guru.Starng thing.

coming to RSS facter.Well mnay buddies of das over here who know him personal;y are aware that only motive of das is to finish of Hinduism and let them merge with us.And we can do it with power of Guru Granth Sahib Ji(faith in that makes us fearless).

So sory for the mental state of fear mongrels.Das eats beef and if you meet him you will be proven what das means.

Mostly guys with fear with RSS do not give das thier phone numbers but all have number of Das.God knows the truth.

It is you who belive in existance of Hinduism.for das it is work of Britishers.




> ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 1. 8
> ਸੋਰਠ ਮ: 3 ਸ: ਗ: ਗ: ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ 646


 

ਮਃ ੩ ॥ 
मः ३ ॥ 
Mehlā 3. 
Third Mehl: 

ਸਹਜੇ ਜਾਗੈ ਸਹਜੇ ਸੋਵੈ ॥ 
सहजे जागै सहजे सोवै ॥ 
Sehjė jāgai sehjė sovai. 
He wakes in peace, and he sleeps in peace. 

ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਉਸਤਤਿ ਹੋਵੈ ॥ 
गुरमुखि अनदिनु उसतति होवै ॥ 
Gurmukẖ an&shy;ḏin usṯaṯ hovai. 
The Gurmukh praises the Lord night and day. 

ਮਨਮੁਖ ਭਰਮੈ ਸਹਸਾ ਹੋਵੈ ॥ 
मनमुख भरमै सहसा होवै ॥ 
Manmukẖ bẖarmai sahsā hovai. 
The self-willed manmukh remains deluded by his doubts. 

ਅੰਤਰਿ ਚਿੰਤਾ ਨੀਦ ਨ ਸੋਵੈ ॥ 
अंतरि चिंता नीद न सोवै ॥ 
Anṯar cẖinṯā nīḏ na sovai. 
He is filled with anxiety, and he cannot even sleep. 

ਗਿਆਨੀ ਜਾਗਹਿ ਸਵਹਿ ਸੁਭਾਇ ॥ 
गिआनी जागहि सवहि सुभाइ ॥ 
Gi&shy;ānī jāgeh saveh subẖā&shy;ė. 
The spiritually wise wake and sleep in peace. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਨਾਮਿ ਰਤਿਆ ਬਲਿ ਜਾਉ ॥੨॥ 
नानक नामि रतिआ बलि जाउ ॥२॥ 
Nānak nām raṯi&shy;ā bal jā&shy;o. ||2|| 
Nanak is a sacrifice to those who are imbued with the Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||2|| 

ਪਉੜੀ ॥ 
पउड़ी ॥ 
Pa&shy;oṛī. 
Pauree: 

ਸੇ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿ ਜੋ ਹਰਿ ਰਤਿਆ ॥ 
से हरि नामु धिआवहि जो हरि रतिआ ॥ 
Sė har nām ḏẖi&shy;āvahi jo har raṯi&shy;ā. 
They alone meditate on the Lord's Name, who are imbued with the Lord. 

ਹਰਿ ਇਕੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿ ਇਕੁ ਇਕੋ ਹਰਿ ਸਤਿਆ ॥ 
हरि इकु धिआवहि इकु इको हरि सतिआ ॥ 
Har ik ḏẖi&shy;āvahi ik iko har saṯi&shy;ā. 
They meditate on the One Lord; the One and Only Lord is True. 

ਹਰਿ ਇਕੋ ਵਰਤੈ ਇਕੁ ਇਕੋ ਉਤਪਤਿਆ ॥ 
हरि इको वरतै इकु इको उतपतिआ ॥ 
Har iko varṯai ik iko uṯpaṯi&shy;ā. 
The One Lord is pervading everywhere; the One Lord created the Universe. 

ਜੋ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿ ਤਿਨ ਡਰੁ ਸਟਿ ਘਤਿਆ ॥ 
जो हरि नामु धिआवहि तिन डरु सटि घतिआ ॥ 
Jo har nām ḏẖi&shy;āvahi ṯin dar sat gẖaṯi&shy;ā. 
Those who meditate on the Lord's Name, cast out their fears. 

ਗੁਰਮਤੀ ਦੇਵੈ ਆਪਿ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਹਰਿ ਜਪਿਆ ॥੯॥ 
गुरमती देवै आपि गुरमुखि हरि जपिआ ॥९॥ 
Gurmaṯī ḏėvai āp gurmukẖ har japi&shy;ā. ||9|| 
The Lord Himself blesses them with Guru's Instruction; the Gurmukh meditates on the Lord. ||9|| 

ਸਲੋਕ ਮਃ ੩ ॥ 
सलोक मः ३ ॥ 
Salok mehlā 3. 
Shalok, Third Mehl: 

ਅੰਤਰਿ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਨ ਆਇਓ ਜਿਤੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਸੋਝੀ ਪਾਇ ॥ 
अंतरि गिआनु न आइओ जितु किछु सोझी पाइ ॥ 
Anṯar gi&shy;ān na ā&shy;i&shy;o jiṯ kicẖẖ sojẖī pā&shy;ė. 
Spiritual wisdom, which would bring understanding, does not enter into his mind. 

ਵਿਣੁ ਡਿਠਾ ਕਿਆ ਸਾਲਾਹੀਐ ਅੰਧਾ ਅੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਇ ॥ 
विणु डिठा किआ सालाहीऐ अंधा अंधु कमाइ ॥ 
viṇ diṯẖā ki&shy;ā salāhī&shy;ai anḏẖā anḏẖ kamā&shy;ė. 
Without seeing, how can he praise the Lord? The blind act in blindness. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਸਬਦੁ ਪਛਾਣੀਐ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਸੈ ਮਨਿ ਆਇ ॥੧॥ 
नानक सबदु पछाणीऐ नामु वसै मनि आइ ॥१॥ 
Nānak sabaḏ pacẖẖāṇī&shy;ai nām vasai man ā&shy;ė. ||1|| 
O Nanak, when one realizes the Word of the Shabad, then the Naam comes to abide in the mind. ||1|| 

ਮਃ ੩ ॥ 
मः ३ ॥ 
Mehlā 3. 
Third Mehl: 

ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 
इका बाणी इकु गुरु इको सबदु वीचारि ॥ 
Ikā baṇī ik gur iko sabaḏ vīcẖār. 
There is One Bani; there is One Guru; there is one Shabad to contemplate. 

ਸਚਾ ਸਉਦਾ ਹਟੁ ਸਚੁ ਰਤਨੀ ਭਰੇ ਭੰਡਾਰ ॥ 
सचा सउदा हटु सचु रतनी भरे भंडार ॥ 
Sacẖā sa&shy;uḏā hat sacẖ raṯnī bẖarė bẖandār. 
True is the merchandise, and true is the shop; the warehouses are overflowing with jewels. 

ਗੁਰ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਤੇ ਪਾਈਅਨਿ ਜੇ ਦੇਵੈ ਦੇਵਣਹਾਰੁ ॥ 
गुर किरपा ते पाईअनि जे देवै देवणहारु ॥ 
Gur kirpā ṯė pā&shy;ī&shy;an jė ḏėvai ḏėvaṇhār. 
By Guru's Grace, they are obtained, if the Great Giver gives them. 

ਸਚਾ ਸਉਦਾ ਲਾਭੁ ਸਦਾ ਖਟਿਆ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ॥ 
सचा सउदा लाभु सदा खटिआ नामु अपारु ॥ 
Sacẖā sa&shy;uḏā lābẖ saḏā kẖati&shy;ā nām apār. 
Dealing in this true merchandise, one earns the profit of the incomparable Naam. 

ਵਿਖੁ ਵਿਚਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਿਆ ਕਰਮਿ ਪੀਆਵਣਹਾਰੁ ॥ 
विखु विचि अम्रितु प्रगटिआ करमि पीआवणहारु ॥ 
vikẖ vicẖ amriṯ pargati&shy;ā karam pī&shy;āvaṇhār. 
In the midst of poison, the Ambrosial Nectar is revealed; by His Mercy, one drinks it in. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੁ ਸਲਾਹੀਐ ਧੰਨੁ ਸਵਾਰਣਹਾਰੁ ॥੨॥ 
नानक सचु सलाहीऐ धंनु सवारणहारु ॥२॥ 
Nānak sacẖ salāhī&shy;ai ḏẖan savāraṇhār. ||2|| 
O Nanak, praise the True Lord; blessed is the Creator, the Embellisher. ||2|| 

ਪਉੜੀ ॥ 
पउड़ी ॥ 
Pa&shy;oṛī. 
Pauree: 

ਜਿਨਾ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਕੂੜੁ ਵਰਤੈ ਸਚੁ ਨ ਭਾਵਈ ॥ 
जिना अंदरि कूड़ु वरतै सचु न भावई ॥ 
Jinā anḏar kūṛ varṯai sacẖ na bẖāv&shy;ī. 
Those who are permeated by falsehood, do not love the Truth. 

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਬੋਲੈ ਸਚੁ ਕੂੜਾ ਜਲਿ ਜਾਵਈ ॥ 
जे को बोलै सचु कूड़ा जलि जावई ॥ 
Jė ko bolai sacẖ kūṛā jal jāv&shy;ī. 
If someone speaks the Truth, falsehood is burnt away. 

ਕੂੜਿਆਰੀ ਰਜੈ ਕੂੜਿ ਜਿਉ ਵਿਸਟਾ ਕਾਗੁ ਖਾਵਈ ॥ 
कूड़िआरी रजै कूड़ि जिउ विसटा कागु खावई ॥ 
Kẖūṛi&shy;ārī rajai kūṛ ji&shy;o vistā kāg kẖāv&shy;ī. 
The false are satisfied by falsehood, like the crows who eat manure. 

ਜਿਸੁ ਹਰਿ ਹੋਇ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਲੁ ਸੋ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਈ ॥ 
जिसु हरि होइ क्रिपालु सो नामु धिआवई ॥ 
Jis har ho&shy;ė kirpāl so nām ḏẖi&shy;āva&shy;ī. 
When the Lord grants His Grace, then one meditates on the Naam, the Name of the Lord. 

ਹਰਿ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਰਾਧਿ ਕੂੜੁ ਪਾਪੁ ਲਹਿ ਜਾਵਈ ॥੧੦॥ 
हरि गुरमुखि नामु अराधि कूड़ु पापु लहि जावई ॥१०॥ 
Har gurmukẖ nām arāḏẖ kūṛ pāp leh jāv&shy;ī. ||10|| 
As Gurmukh, worship the Lord's Name in adoration; fraud and sin shall disappear. ||10|| 




Read all the verses toagather as whole Gurbani has the relavence.There is only one Guru,one Bani and One Verse.

no hindu no RSS no differance between our Texts or Texts of Semitics.

No duality has to be thought thats the real meaning of qoute.

If we see anything beside or toher then God we neeed to worry and talk fear of RSS.It is yourself who think us as weak that RSS or Hindus can absorb us or due to influence of any verse Britishers defeated us.It was by our own guys siding by them got us defeated.And further some of us wag tailed to them.

how did a person called Maculife came to us? was not this a good result for defeat?

Das will now answer Gurmukhi things given by Dubai Guy.It will take some time as das will be back after a few hours.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 8, 2007)

Gurfateh



The Khalsa Fauj said:


> I didn't read all of your stuff about Charanjit SIngh Bal. Email him what you are saying about him. Don't talk nonsense behind someone's back. He will answer his own queries. I am not going to be lawyer for all writers and defend them but I will mention some things.





The Khalsa Fauj said:


> You doubt Guru more than anyone. I can tell from your writings. You have shanka om Pooraa Guru. You are saying that Guru wasn't able to make Sikhs strong enough to control Punjab. Sikhs stopped following Guru isn't fault of Guru. Sikhs were low in number and Sikhs were strong enough to hold off the Mughals and did establish a raaj but it was lost due to Dasam Granth and hindu practices introduced through it. Now Vijaydeep, with his RSS (Rastrya Sikh Sangat) and crew have only one motive and that is to slowly merge Sikhs back into Hindus or kill them slowly through literature such as dasam granth. You guys want to fool uneducated Sikhs to think that Dasam Granth is credible and then do proper arth of dasam granth and prove Sikhs to be hindus.




Bhai you have brought bal over here so bring him here and we will talk.It will be good for the site.

Yuo again want to say that Bhai Kahan Singh Nabha is wrong and Sakhi of Dasham Granth coming into existance much before Sikhs defeating  Mughals is wrong.

Dasham Guru Bani and whole of Dasham Granth's compositions were there before we defeat Moghuls.

Rather das precives that yourself want to say that Dasham Granth is powerfull enhugh to defeat the infalliable Guru Granth sahib Ji and arrangement been done by Guru.Starng thing.

coming to RSS facter.Well mnay buddies of das over here who know him personal;y are aware that only motive of das is to finish of Hinduism and let them merge with us.And we can do it with power of Guru Granth Sahib Ji(faith in that makes us fearless).

So sory for the mental state of fear mongrels.Das eats beef and if you meet him you will be proven what das means.

Mostly guys with fear with RSS do not give das thier phone numbers but all have number of Das.God knows the truth.

It is you who belive in existance of Hinduism.for das it is work of Britishers.



> ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 1. 8
> ਸੋਰਠ ਮ: 3 ਸ: ਗ: ਗ: ਸ: ਪੰਨਾ 646





ਮਃ ੩ ॥मः ३ ॥Mehlā 3.Third Mehl:
ਸਹਜੇ ਜਾਗੈ ਸਹਜੇ ਸੋਵੈ ॥सहजे जागै सहजे सोवै ॥Sehjė jāgai sehjė sovai.He wakes in peace, and he sleeps in peace.
ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਅਨਦਿਨੁ ਉਸਤਤਿ ਹੋਵੈ ॥गुरमुखि अनदिनु उसतति होवै ॥Gurmukẖ an&shy;ḏin usṯaṯ hovai.The Gurmukh praises the Lord night and day.
ਮਨਮੁਖ ਭਰਮੈ ਸਹਸਾ ਹੋਵੈ ॥मनमुख भरमै सहसा होवै ॥Manmukẖ bẖarmai sahsā hovai.The self-willed manmukh remains deluded by his doubts.
ਅੰਤਰਿ ਚਿੰਤਾ ਨੀਦ ਨ ਸੋਵੈ ॥अंतरि चिंता नीद न सोवै ॥Anṯar cẖinṯā nīḏ na sovai.He is filled with anxiety, and he cannot even sleep.
ਗਿਆਨੀ ਜਾਗਹਿ ਸਵਹਿ ਸੁਭਾਇ ॥गिआनी जागहि सवहि सुभाइ ॥Gi&shy;ānī jāgeh saveh subẖā&shy;ė.The spiritually wise wake and sleep in peace.
ਨਾਨਕ ਨਾਮਿ ਰਤਿਆ ਬਲਿ ਜਾਉ ॥੨॥नानक नामि रतिआ बलि जाउ ॥२॥Nānak nām raṯi&shy;ā bal jā&shy;o. ||2||Nanak is a sacrifice to those who are imbued with the Naam, the Name of the Lord. ||2||
ਪਉੜੀ ॥पउड़ी ॥Pa&shy;oṛī.Pauree:
ਸੇ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿ ਜੋ ਹਰਿ ਰਤਿਆ ॥से हरि नामु धिआवहि जो हरि रतिआ ॥Sė har nām ḏẖi&shy;āvahi jo har raṯi&shy;ā.They alone meditate on the Lord's Name, who are imbued with the Lord.
ਹਰਿ ਇਕੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿ ਇਕੁ ਇਕੋ ਹਰਿ ਸਤਿਆ ॥हरि इकु धिआवहि इकु इको हरि सतिआ ॥Har ik ḏẖi&shy;āvahi ik iko har saṯi&shy;ā.They meditate on the One Lord; the One and Only Lord is True.
ਹਰਿ ਇਕੋ ਵਰਤੈ ਇਕੁ ਇਕੋ ਉਤਪਤਿਆ ॥हरि इको वरतै इकु इको उतपतिआ ॥Har iko varṯai ik iko uṯpaṯi&shy;ā.The One Lord is pervading everywhere; the One Lord created the Universe.
ਜੋ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਹਿ ਤਿਨ ਡਰੁ ਸਟਿ ਘਤਿਆ ॥जो हरि नामु धिआवहि तिन डरु सटि घतिआ ॥Jo har nām ḏẖi&shy;āvahi ṯin dar sat gẖaṯi&shy;ā.Those who meditate on the Lord's Name, cast out their fears.
ਗੁਰਮਤੀ ਦੇਵੈ ਆਪਿ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਹਰਿ ਜਪਿਆ ॥੯॥गुरमती देवै आपि गुरमुखि हरि जपिआ ॥९॥Gurmaṯī ḏėvai āp gurmukẖ har japi&shy;ā. ||9||The Lord Himself blesses them with Guru's Instruction; the Gurmukh meditates on the Lord. ||9||
ਸਲੋਕ ਮਃ ੩ ॥सलोक मः ३ ॥Salok mehlā 3.Shalok, Third Mehl:
ਅੰਤਰਿ ਗਿਆਨੁ ਨ ਆਇਓ ਜਿਤੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਸੋਝੀ ਪਾਇ ॥अंतरि गिआनु न आइओ जितु किछु सोझी पाइ ॥Anṯar gi&shy;ān na ā&shy;i&shy;o jiṯ kicẖẖ sojẖī pā&shy;ė.Spiritual wisdom, which would bring understanding, does not enter into his mind.
ਵਿਣੁ ਡਿਠਾ ਕਿਆ ਸਾਲਾਹੀਐ ਅੰਧਾ ਅੰਧੁ ਕਮਾਇ ॥विणु डिठा किआ सालाहीऐ अंधा अंधु कमाइ ॥viṇ diṯẖā ki&shy;ā salāhī&shy;ai anḏẖā anḏẖ kamā&shy;ė.Without seeing, how can he praise the Lord? The blind act in blindness.
ਨਾਨਕ ਸਬਦੁ ਪਛਾਣੀਐ ਨਾਮੁ ਵਸੈ ਮਨਿ ਆਇ ॥੧॥नानक सबदु पछाणीऐ नामु वसै मनि आइ ॥१॥Nānak sabaḏ pacẖẖāṇī&shy;ai nām vasai man ā&shy;ė. ||1||O Nanak, when one realizes the Word of the Shabad, then the Naam comes to abide in the mind. ||1||
ਮਃ ੩ ॥मः ३ ॥Mehlā 3.Third Mehl:
ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥इका बाणी इकु गुरु इको सबदु वीचारि ॥Ikā baṇī ik gur iko sabaḏ vīcẖār.There is One Bani; there is One Guru; there is one Shabad to contemplate.
ਸਚਾ ਸਉਦਾ ਹਟੁ ਸਚੁ ਰਤਨੀ ਭਰੇ ਭੰਡਾਰ ॥सचा सउदा हटु सचु रतनी भरे भंडार ॥Sacẖā sa&shy;uḏā hat sacẖ raṯnī bẖarė bẖandār.True is the merchandise, and true is the shop; the warehouses are overflowing with jewels.
ਗੁਰ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਤੇ ਪਾਈਅਨਿ ਜੇ ਦੇਵੈ ਦੇਵਣਹਾਰੁ ॥गुर किरपा ते पाईअनि जे देवै देवणहारु ॥Gur kirpā ṯė pā&shy;ī&shy;an jė ḏėvai ḏėvaṇhār.By Guru's Grace, they are obtained, if the Great Giver gives them.
ਸਚਾ ਸਉਦਾ ਲਾਭੁ ਸਦਾ ਖਟਿਆ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ॥सचा सउदा लाभु सदा खटिआ नामु अपारु ॥Sacẖā sa&shy;uḏā lābẖ saḏā kẖati&shy;ā nām apār.Dealing in this true merchandise, one earns the profit of the incomparable Naam.
ਵਿਖੁ ਵਿਚਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਿਆ ਕਰਮਿ ਪੀਆਵਣਹਾਰੁ ॥विखु विचि अम्रितु प्रगटिआ करमि पीआवणहारु ॥vikẖ vicẖ amriṯ pargati&shy;ā karam pī&shy;āvaṇhār.In the midst of poison, the Ambrosial Nectar is revealed; by His Mercy, one drinks it in.
ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੁ ਸਲਾਹੀਐ ਧੰਨੁ ਸਵਾਰਣਹਾਰੁ ॥੨॥नानक सचु सलाहीऐ धंनु सवारणहारु ॥२॥Nānak sacẖ salāhī&shy;ai ḏẖan savāraṇhār. ||2||O Nanak, praise the True Lord; blessed is the Creator, the Embellisher. ||2||
ਪਉੜੀ ॥पउड़ी ॥Pa&shy;oṛī.Pauree:
ਜਿਨਾ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਕੂੜੁ ਵਰਤੈ ਸਚੁ ਨ ਭਾਵਈ ॥जिना अंदरि कूड़ु वरतै सचु न भावई ॥Jinā anḏar kūṛ varṯai sacẖ na bẖāv&shy;ī.Those who are permeated by falsehood, do not love the Truth.
ਜੇ ਕੋ ਬੋਲੈ ਸਚੁ ਕੂੜਾ ਜਲਿ ਜਾਵਈ ॥जे को बोलै सचु कूड़ा जलि जावई ॥Jė ko bolai sacẖ kūṛā jal jāv&shy;ī.If someone speaks the Truth, falsehood is burnt away.
ਕੂੜਿਆਰੀ ਰਜੈ ਕੂੜਿ ਜਿਉ ਵਿਸਟਾ ਕਾਗੁ ਖਾਵਈ ॥कूड़िआरी रजै कूड़ि जिउ विसटा कागु खावई ॥Kẖūṛi&shy;ārī rajai kūṛ ji&shy;o vistā kāg kẖāv&shy;ī.The false are satisfied by falsehood, like the crows who eat manure.
ਜਿਸੁ ਹਰਿ ਹੋਇ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਲੁ ਸੋ ਨਾਮੁ ਧਿਆਵਈ ॥जिसु हरि होइ क्रिपालु सो नामु धिआवई ॥Jis har ho&shy;ė kirpāl so nām ḏẖi&shy;āva&shy;ī.When the Lord grants His Grace, then one meditates on the Naam, the Name of the Lord.
ਹਰਿ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਰਾਧਿ ਕੂੜੁ ਪਾਪੁ ਲਹਿ ਜਾਵਈ ॥੧੦॥हरि गुरमुखि नामु अराधि कूड़ु पापु लहि जावई ॥१०॥Har gurmukẖ nām arāḏẖ kūṛ pāp leh jāv&shy;ī. ||10||As Gurmukh, worship the Lord's Name in adoration; fraud and sin shall disappear. ||10||





Read all the verses toagather as whole Gurbani has the relavence.There is only one Guru,one Bani and One Verse.

no hindu no RSS no differance between our Texts or Texts of Semitics.

No duality has to be thought thats the real meaning of qoute.

If we see anything beside or toher then God we neeed to worry and talk fear of RSS.It is yourself who think us as weak that RSS or Hindus can absorb us or due to influence of any verse Britishers defeated us.It was by our own guys siding by them got us defeated.And further some of us wag tailed to them.

how did a person called Maculife came to us? was not this a good result for defeat?

Das will now answer Gurmukhi things given by Dubai Guy.It will take some time as das will be back after a few hours.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

Other states joined British because British gave something when they took over a rule while Ranjit never gave anything and just killed you. Those states who joined British had no better option. Also, Bhai Kaan Singh Nabha never believed in dasam granth but had no choice as he didn't want to be excommunicated from Panth. There weren't many knowledgeable Sikhs at that time. If you don't understand the situation of that time or if you don't understand what Kaan Singh was doing, it is best to keep quiet. As for aarth done by Giani Bhaag Singh and Prof. Sahib Singh, they knew Gurbani Viakaran and tried to follow it. You seem to have no clue about viakaran.


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## drkhalsa (Aug 8, 2007)

Dear Friend 


some points need mention here

In Debate it is more apropiate that if you want to provide reference maerial ( written by somebody) then plz try to read it yourself and brings main points in post ( preferably in english )
\s everybody here dont understand Gurmukhi

When we are judging something that is related to ( even if it is negative ) Such a great personality like Guru Gobind Singh Ji 
Second hand information should be avioded as it can mislead you and you can miss something relevant 
I am saying this because personally I used to feel same as you about Dasam Granth but only to a point when I havent read it myself , Once I was listening to Baba Virsa Singh and he talked about it and this prompted me to explore it further myself ( not through other peoples review on it ) and my Opinion changed for ever 

In any case this just my opinion and I am not trying to generalise it here 





> Prof. Sahib Singh, they knew Gurbani Viakaran and tried to follow it.



Viakaran was kind of Discovered by Prof Sahib Singh so it is not strange that he followed it!





Thanks

Jatinder Singh


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

I have read all of dasam granth and have read many parts such as tria chariters and bachitter natak many times. Here please do aarth of each word according to viakaran and then do aarth of the tukhs. We will move forward after that.

*kQw sqRvI rwm kib aucrI ihq icq lwie[*
*bhuir kQw bMDn inimq mn mY kihXo aupwie[ 1[{cirqr # 18, 4.1, 71}*


I have done my own study on dasam granth so I don't need to listen to scholars or anyone else.

As for viakaran, Prof. Sahib Singh wasn't the first one to discover it. There have been Sikhs in the past who have tried to understand it. E.g. include Prof. Gurmukh Singh, Giani Ditt Singh, etc.

I pulled those quotes out myself. I didn't have to listen to some scholar. I can understand each word from there.

There are many more tukhs such as the one above. Poet Shyam says the following.
*dohrw*
*mDu kItB ky bD nimq jw idn jgq murwir[*
*su kib s@Xwm qw ko khY cOdsvo Avqwr[ 4[ {24 Avqwr 37}*
*Dohra*
*Mud Keetub Kay Budh Namitt Jaa Dinn Jagat Muraar.*
*So Kub Syaam Taa Ko Khai Chadusvo Avtaar| 4| {24 Avtar, 37}*

*sohq shY sB goipn ky kib sXwm khY idRg AMjn Awjy[ ..[ 454[ {ikRsn Avqwr 2, 20}
Sohat Shai Sabh Gopan Kay Kub SHyam Khai Drigg Aanjan Aajay| …| 454|

moih igrY Dr pY su qRIXw kib sXwm khY icqvY hir jw so[ 606[ {ikRsn Avqwr 2, 43}
Mohe Girai Dhur Pai Su Treya Kub Shyam Khai Chittvai Hur Ja So| 606|


Xw ibiD BI iqh Taur kQw iqh ky kib sXwmih mMgl gwey[ 1006[ {ikRsn Avqwr 4, 8}
Yaa Bidh Bhee Teh Thaour Katha The Kay Kub Shyamhe Mungal Gaaye| 1006|

kib sXwm BnY iqh Awhv mY su rhy kyaU bIr Pty eI Pty[ 1614[ {ikRsn Avqwr 5, 46}
Kub Shyam Bhnai The Aahav Mai Su Rhay Kaeou Bir Ftay Ee Ftay| 1614|

n sMKM n ck®M n gdw n isAwmM ] Asçrj rUpM rhMq jnmM ] {pMnw 1359}
Na Sunkhung, Na Chukkrung, Na Gdaa, Na Seyaamung || Ascharraj Roopung Rahuntt Junmung || {Page 1359 of Guru Granh Sahib Ji}
Doesn’t have a conch,  doesn’t wear a chakkar, doesn’t carry a mace, is not black || Wonderous form, is far away from birth.*


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## drkhalsa (Aug 8, 2007)

Dear Friend 

I was just pointing out whatever i thought might be helpful 
I made mistake of persuming about your post and also about your knowledge about Dasam Granth I realized it only after reading your other Post 
So Forgive me for that 

I respect your conclusion and I happy that you arrived on your own at them 

Thanks for your posts


Jatinder Singh


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

No problem.


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## Parma (Aug 8, 2007)

So sex is a issue. I thought we learned to love first. Sex is just a pleasure from the fruits of love. If there is no love and only sex niether person will feel happiness. Speak to many individuals. Without the love they are never settled. Always talking about other people from the opposite sex and so on. Speak to any man or women in love and they are never confused on how they react or feel in life. Have a relationship without sex and many will not last without love or trust faith it wont last. There has been alot of emphasis on sex in this debate, but what for? To learn about it? Or to conform some seedy thoughts in life. I dont know maybe i've misunderstood the debate. What is it about then?


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 8, 2007)

Do you know that worrd Lund doesn't appear in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Bhagat Kabir Ji says aap hee kutt jaa-ee. Not app lund kutt jaa-ee. Relationships based on sexual pleasure don't last long. They are just mere husband and wife getting together. Number of divorces is at an all time high and sex is prevalent in the society. It isn't only sex either. It is how it is described and how it is promoted. Gurbani says Purr Triya Naa Paikhay Nayttr. Don't look at other women with your eyes. Very sound and clear. Not only that, what are you going to do with poets? The ones who identify themselves throughout.


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## Parma (Aug 9, 2007)

This person can not be a sikh but a sick person. Trying to project these thoughts as a part of the gurbarni. Sikhism is a religion based on being pure. Want to be filthy and i can teach anyone on how to be clean. Regard my sword or my words.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 9, 2007)

pRQm jwr jb Dkw lgwXo[ qb rwnI lY Fol bjwXo[
jb iqh ilMg su Bg qy kwFw[ iqRX idX Fol Fmwkw gwFw[ 10[*{cirqr 387, 5.6, 52}*
*Pratham Yaar Jub Dhakka Lgaayo|| Tub Ranee Lai Dhol Bjaaayo|*
*Jub The Ling Su Bhug Tay Kaadaa| Triyeh Diyeh Dhol Dhamakaa Gaadaa| 10| {Chariter 387, 4.6, 52}*
*When the lover first pushed it in, the queen took the drum and sounded it.*
*When (the king) took out the {censored} from the {censored}, woman started beating the drum.*


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 11, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Other states joined British because British gave something when they took over a rule while Ranjit never gave anything and just killed you. Those states who joined British had no better option. Also, Bhai Kaan Singh Nabha never believed in dasam granth but had no choice as he didn't want to be excommunicated from Panth. There weren't many knowledgeable Sikhs at that time. If you don't understand the situation of that time or if you don't understand what Kaan Singh was doing, it is best to keep quiet. As for aarth done by Giani Bhaag Singh and Prof. Sahib Singh, they knew Gurbani Viakaran and tried to follow it. You seem to have no clue about viakaran.


Bhai

Ranjit Singh was defeated more due to Sikhs siding with Britishers and he tried his lelve best to reduce Nihungs as they acted over judicial power ways.Anyway Patiala King further killed all Akali forces with deception and they ran into Deccan.

Here more then books playing any thinga part onto us Ranjit's not helping Afghans,Marthas(Holker etc.) and not making an alliance of all native forces against Britihsers.

coming to Nabha Sahib.What prevented the Great Vidwan from saying the truth.for Truth only did Prof Gurmuck Singh ,Ambala Ji and Kala Afghana Sahib do suffer.

But he is the one who did substantiate the presense of book in question in Punjab before Massa Rangarh was killed wide Sakhi of Bhai Mehtab Singh of Marhi Kambo Ki.

Das is with bowed head takes compliment about his bad Grammer or Viakram but there is something called Sabadawali or voculary realted thing also.Did you mean same for Viakran?Akal Bless.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 11, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Do you know that worrd Lund doesn't appear in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Bhagat Kabir Ji says aap hee kutt jaa-ee. Not app lund kutt jaa-ee. Relationships based on sexual pleasure don't last long. They are just mere husband and wife getting together. Number of divorces is at an all time high and sex is prevalent in the society. It isn't only sex either. It is how it is described and how it is promoted. Gurbani says Purr Triya Naa Paikhay Nayttr. Don't look at other women with your eyes. Very sound and clear. Not only that, what are you going to do with poets? The ones who identify themselves throughout.


Bhai term Indri is used.

Page 299, Line 3
ਇੰਦ੍ਰੀ ਬਸਿ ਕਰਿ ਸੁਣਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ॥
इंद्री बसि करि सुणहु हरि नामु ॥
Inḏrī bas kar suṇhu har nām.
Subdue the desires of your sexual organs, and listen to the Lord's Name.
*Guru Arjan Dev*   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 471, Line 9
ਤਗੁ ਨ ਇੰਦ੍ਰੀ ਤਗੁ ਨ ਨਾਰੀ ॥
तगु न इंद्री तगु न नारी ॥
Ŧag na inḏrī ṯag na nārī.
There is no sacred thread for the sexual organ, and no thread for woman.
*Guru Nanak Dev*   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 565, Line 8
ਇੰਦ੍ਰੀ ਵਿਆਪਿ ਰਹੀ ਅਧਿਕਾਈ ਕਾਮੁ ਕ੍ਰੋਧੁ ਨਿਤ ਸੰਤਾਵੈ ॥੧॥
इंद्री विआपि रही अधिकाई कामु क्रोधु नित संतावै ॥१॥
Inḏrī vi&shy;āp rahī aḏẖikā&shy;ī kām kroḏẖ niṯ sanṯāvai. ||1||
The sensory organs are totally engrossed in sensuality; sexual desire and anger constantly afflict him. ||1||
*Guru Amar Das*   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]Page 1195, Line 7
ਇੰਦ੍ਰੀ ਕੀ ਜੂਠਿ ਉਤਰਸਿ ਨਾਹੀ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਅਗਨਿ ਕੇ ਲੂਠੇ ॥੨॥
इंद्री की जूठि उतरसि नाही ब्रहम अगनि के लूठे ॥२॥
Inḏrī kī jūṯẖ uṯras nāhī barahm agan kė lūṯẖė. ||2||
The impurity of the sexual organs does not depart; the Brahmin is burnt by the fire. ||2||
*Devotee Kabir*   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

and it is slang from Sanskrit word Jananindriya.

Term Lund you are talking about has origeon in the Dravidian language like the terms being used Rojh(Nilgai in Sanskrit) Jhankhara(Jhinke in Telugu or Barasingha) any way Chukna in Punjabi is from Tukko of Tamil.

Just as language used by lower castes is used or non Aryan is used.Das does not find that you should have any objection.Bhagmal being an Arya SAMAJI COULD HAVE SUCH THING but das begs to tell you not to be carried away by covert attempt of upper caste to let us be severed from real outcaste people for whom Gurmat is made.

Kings,mony lenders are targeted and exposed and truth about them is told to people who have been enslved for ages.Exposing wrong in work of global policmen and policemen does not encourge wrong thing.Here God exposes the evil and does not encourages that.Akal Bless.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 11, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> I have read all of dasam granth and have read many parts such as tria chariters and bachitter natak many times. Here please do aarth of each word according to viakaran and then do aarth of the tukhs. We will move forward after that.
> 
> *kQw sqRvI rwm kib aucrI ihq icq lwie[*
> *bhuir kQw bMDn inimq mn mY kihXo aupwie[ 1[{cirqr # 18, 4.1, 71}*
> ...


 
Das was removed the doubts by yourself in the link below.Das is not posting all the stuff.

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/hard-talk/14908-some-observations-over-two-topics-singh-4.html

Coming to holy verse you have provided above.Das is thankfull to yuorself for providing the same.

when ever we find some verse negating the God.We over here talk fixing only some attribute to God.So read it God is not Black only.As Black or Dark is one of the attribute of God.


ਗੁਸਾਂਈ ਗਰਿਸ੍ਟ ਰੂਪੇਣ ਸਿਮਰਣੰ ਸਰਬਤ੍ਰ ਜੀਵਣਹ ॥ 
गुसांई गरिस्ट रूपेण सिमरणं सरबत्र जीवणह ॥ 
Gusāŉ&shy;ī garist rūpėṇ simarṇaŉ sarbaṯar jīvṇah. 
The Lord of the World is Supremely Beautiful; His Meditation is the Life of all. 

ਲਬਧ੍ਯ੍ਯੰ ਸੰਤ ਸੰਗੇਣ ਨਾਨਕ ਸ੍ਵਛ ਮਾਰਗ ਹਰਿ ਭਗਤਣਹ ॥੫੪॥ 
लबध्यं संत संगेण नानक स्वछ मारग हरि भगतणह ॥५४॥ 
Labḏẖa&shy;yaŉ sanṯ sangėṇ Nānak savacẖẖ mārag har bẖagaṯ&shy;ṇeh. ||54|| 
In the Society of the Saints, O Nanak, He is found on the path of devotional worship of the Lord. ||54|| 

ਮਸਕੰ ਭਗਨੰਤ ਸੈਲੰ ਕਰਦਮੰ ਤਰੰਤ ਪਪੀਲਕਹ ॥ 
मसकं भगनंत सैलं करदमं तरंत पपीलकह ॥ 
Maskaŉ bẖagnanṯ sailaŉ karḏamaŉ ṯaranṯ papīlkeh. 
The mosquito pierces the stone, the ant crosses the swamp, 

ਸਾਗਰੰ ਲੰਘੰਤਿ ਪਿੰਗੰ ਤਮ ਪਰਗਾਸ ਅੰਧਕਹ ॥ 
सागरं लंघंति पिंगं तम परगास अंधकह ॥ 
Sāgraŉ laŉgẖanṯ pi&shy;angaŉ ṯam pargās anḏẖkah. 
the cripple crosses the ocean, and the blind sees in the darkness, 

ਸਾਧ ਸੰਗੇਣਿ ਸਿਮਰੰਤਿ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਸਰਣਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਹਰੇ ॥੫੫॥ 
साध संगेणि सिमरंति गोबिंद सरणि नानक हरि हरि हरे ॥५५॥ 
Sāḏẖ sangėṇ simranṯ gobinḏ saraṇ Nānak har har harė. ||55|| 
meditating on the Lord of the Universe in the Saadh Sangat. Nanak seeks the Sanctuary of the Lord, Har, Har, Haray. ||55|| 

ਤਿਲਕ ਹੀਣੰ ਜਥਾ ਬਿਪ੍ਰਾ ਅਮਰ ਹੀਣੰ ਜਥਾ ਰਾਜਨਹ ॥ 
तिलक हीणं जथा बिप्रा अमर हीणं जथा राजनह ॥ 
Ŧilak hīṇaŉ jathā biprā amar hīṇaŉ jathā rājnah. 
Like a Brahmin without a sacred mark on his forehead, or a king without the power of command, 

ਆਵਧ ਹੀਣੰ ਜਥਾ ਸੂਰਾ ਨਾਨਕ ਧਰਮ ਹੀਣੰ ਤਥਾ ਬੈਸ੍ਨਵਹ ॥੫੬॥ 
आवध हीणं जथा सूरा नानक धरम हीणं तथा बैस्नवह ॥५६॥ 
Āvaḏẖ hīṇaŉ jathā sūrar Nānak ḏẖaram hīṇaŉ ṯathā baisnveh. ||56|| 
or a warrior without weapons, so is the devotee of God without Dharmic Faith. ||56|| 

ਨ ਸੰਖੰ ਨ ਚਕ੍ਰੰ ਨ ਗਦਾ ਨ ਸਿਆਮੰ ॥ 
न संखं न चक्रं न गदा न सिआमं ॥ 
Na saŉkẖaŉ na cẖakaraŉ na gaḏā na si&shy;āmaŉ. 
God has no conch-shell, no religious mark, no paraphernalia; he does not have blue skin. 

ਅਸ੍ਚਰਜ ਰੂਪੰ ਰਹੰਤ ਜਨਮੰ ॥ 
अस्चरज रूपं रहंत जनमं ॥ 
Ascẖaraj rūpaŉ rahanṯ janmaŉ. 
His Form is Wondrous and Amazing. He is beyond incarnation. 

ਨੇਤ ਨੇਤ ਕਥੰਤਿ ਬੇਦਾ ॥ 
नेत नेत कथंति बेदा ॥ 
Nėṯ nėṯ kathanṯ bėḏā. 
The Vedas say that He is not this, and not that. 

ਊਚ ਮੂਚ ਅਪਾਰ ਗੋਬਿੰਦਹ ॥ 
ऊच मूच अपार गोबिंदह ॥ 
Ūcẖ mūcẖ apār gobinḏah. 
The Lord of the Universe is Lofty and High, Great and Infinite. 

ਬਸੰਤਿ ਸਾਧ ਰਿਦਯੰ ਅਚੁਤ ਬੁਝੰਤਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਬਡਭਾਗੀਅਹ ॥੫੭॥ 
बसंति साध रिदयं अचुत बुझंति नानक बडभागीअह ॥५७॥ 
Basanṯ sāḏẖ riḏ&shy;yaŉ acẖuṯ bujẖanṯ Nānak badbẖāgī&shy;ah. ||57|| 
The Imperishable Lord abides in the hearts of the Holy. He is understood, O Nanak, by those who are very fortunate. ||57|| 
Kindly read all life if meditation of God and also have a look over great thing called Baishnav beeing writtan.

Like Shakta Bhag Singh Ji condem Vaishanva is sect worshipping Vishnu.It means something else over here.Why should not Shakat means something else over in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.Like Syam ,Ram and Kal are attributes of Akal.So are you and all creeation.

Das begs you to study Guru Granth Sahib Ji correctly before passing commetns over Dasham Granth Sahib Ji.

Also ask any of your missionary frined,what does this means?
ਪੰਨਾ 1068, ਸਤਰ 15
ਦੂਜੈ ਭਾਇ ਦੁਸਟਾ ਕਾ ਵਾਸਾ ॥
दूजै भाइ दुसटा का वासा ॥
Ḏūjai bẖā&shy;ė ḏustā kā vāsā.
The evil people live in the love of duality.
ਮਃ 3   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

Kindly ask best of your missioanry buddy what is Duja Bhav?

And kindly let das also undserstand that what do you mean by that?Then only we will be able to come closer.All clours and hues are Akal.

waiting for the reply and from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 11, 2007)

* Gurfateh*
*Gurfateh*
*



kQw sqRvI rwm kib aucrI ihq icq lwie[
bhuir kQw bMDn inimq mn mY kihXo aupwie[ 1[{cirqr # 18, 4.1, 71}

Click to expand...

 
As das has no fonts of this over here in cyber cafe das requsts anyone to translitrate these lines so that das can *
explain this.Is this is Charitropakahyan 18?

first line.
Seveteenth Story absoerbed poet said keeping benefit stuck in mind.again a story for binding(in reigns) said a way in mind..1..(Charitro Pakhayan 18).18th ben told after 17th is over.So succeeding the 17th.Akal Bless.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Aug 11, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> pRQm jwr jb Dkw lgwXo[ qb rwnI lY Fol bjwXo[
> jb iqh ilMg su Bg qy kwFw[ iqRX idX Fol Fmwkw gwFw[ 10[*{cirqr 387, 5.6, 52}*
> *Pratham Yaar Jub Dhakka Lgaayo|| Tub Ranee Lai Dhol Bjaaayo|*
> *Jub The Ling Su Bhug Tay Kaadaa| Triyeh Diyeh Dhol Dhamakaa Gaadaa| 10| {Chariter 387, 4.6, 52}*
> ...


 

Daer brother,

Should we use the same termanolgy in Guru Granth Sahib Ji where Indri is used?

or say over here?
Page 93, Line 10
ਅਵਰਮਰਤਮਾਇਆਮਨੁਤੋਲੇਤਉਭਗਮੁਖਿਜਨਮੁਵਿਗੋਇਆ॥੩॥
अवरमरतमाइआमनुतोलेतउभगमुखिजनमुविगोइआ॥३॥
Avar maraṯ māiā man ṯolė ṯao bẖag mukẖ janam vigoiā. ||3||
When others die, you measure your own wealth in your mind; you waste your life in the pleasures of the mouth and sexual organs. ||3||
*Devotee Baini* - view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok


anyway das will explain the Charitropakahyan 387.

Bhai Here a stroy of a King of Marwar is been told.That Hindu king who is beheld as divine by Hindus is been told to be made fool by his queen.

Here by sound of drum she let her husband understands that she is taking out water from the well while in truth she used that to supress her immoral act.

This way she ditched king of Marwars.Such kings who could not control thier wifes and are befooled by them.Are they worthy to stay as rulers?

Left people did use same way against Nehru and Lady Mouth Beaten and againt Risputin and tzariana.

So das hopes yuo have understod.Also read verse 3 about filthy mindedness of Kings of that time.At end 6940 also points to a coded verse.An art of deception being told also without hackers knowing what exactly it means.Hacker will understand only an errotica.

9-4=5.so from 5th verse and +6 ie till 11th verse.

Anyway das has to go to local Akhara till 5:30 pm IST so das will reply the post by Dubaye Guy some other day.He declared the reward of RS 1 Crore to de bunk him.Das will rather tell him later to use that mony to let Missioaries also learn the fighting skills and set up thier own Gurudwara independant of any intereferance.That was main code in das's observation about SSI's work by Bhai Sumra.

Das is for peacefull settle ment between pro and Anti Dasham Grath lobbies and want Anti one to not to use all of it rather not to use any of it.More neaer to Kala Afghana Ji then to Amabala Ji.

Our faith goes by trend set by Ninth Master to give life for those whose Ideas even are not followed by self.So das will try to set up a centre for Kala Afghana gruop near Delhi.

Just to see if at all they can surivie if they are given a chance to preach and manage an institution themselves.So far das has seen them survivng on fear and condemnation and putting all blame onto others.Akal Bless.Das is ready face more of the doubts.Akal Bless.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 11, 2007)

vijaydeep Singh said:


> Gurfateh
> 
> Bhai
> 
> ...


 
Looks like you don't know activities of Ranjit Singh. Read about what he did and what is promoted in dasam granth. He did all those wrong things which are present in dasam granth. E.g. he got hindufied, became a womanizer, became a druggy, didn't trust sikhs, didn't trust his mother (in law), etc. How did character of Sikhs suddenly became low and they lost everything? Answer is dasam granth.

Kaan Singh Nabha prepared an encyclopedia. Encyclopedia doen't mean those are your beliefs. He is just telling what the story is. Doesn't mean he believes it or not.

As for viakaran, unless you know viakaran, vocabulary doesn't help at all. If you come to Toronto, I will introduce you to someone who knows vocabulary and knows how to aarth better than anyone I know. Probably even better than Prof. Sahib Singh.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Aug 11, 2007)

vijaydeep Singh said:


> Gurfateh
> 
> Should we use the same termanolgy in Guru Granth Sahib Ji where Indri is used?
> 
> ...


 
There is a difference between saying sexual intercourse and ****. You can see that one term is not allowed to be posted while other is. One is civillized language while other is that of someone who is morally corrupt and has no clue how to respect others. You posting tukhs from Guru Granth Sahib won't help as they all go against you. That above tukh goes against you too as it says sexual organs and not **** or {censored}.



vijaydeep Singh said:


> Gurfateh
> Anyway das has to go to local Akhara till 5:30 pm IST so das will reply the post by Dubaye Guy some other day.He declared the reward of RS 1 Crore to de bunk him.Das will rather tell him later to use that mony to let Missioaries also learn the fighting skills and set up thier own Gurudwara independant of any intereferance.That was main code in das's observation about SSI's work by Bhai Sumra.
> 
> Das is for peacefull settle ment between pro and Anti Dasham Grath lobbies and want Anti one to not to use all of it rather not to use any of it.More neaer to Kala Afghana Ji then to Amabala Ji.
> ...


 
I don't understand what you are saying about Samra there. As for fighting skills, if we need to pick up weapons to get rid of dasam granth, we will. Dasam Granth chelas are free to shoot me anytime they want. No worries. I won't attack anyone unless I am provoked. I am not provoked easily.

As for setting up centres, we won't accept anyone's centres. Hraam dii kmaa-ee will always be hraam dee kmaa-ee. Also, we don't need anyone to set up centres. When time comes, we will free Akaal Takht and do what needs to be done.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Nov 27, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Looks like you don't know activities of Ranjit Singh. Read about what he did and what is promoted in dasam granth. He did all those wrong things which are present in dasam granth. E.g. he got hindufied, became a womanizer, became a druggy, didn't trust sikhs, didn't trust his mother (in law), etc. How did character of Sikhs suddenly became low and they lost everything? Answer is dasam granth.
> 
> Kaan Singh Nabha prepared an encyclopedia. Encyclopedia doen't mean those are your beliefs. He is just telling what the story is. Doesn't mean he believes it or not.
> 
> As for viakaran, unless you know viakaran, vocabulary doesn't help at all. If you come to Toronto, I will introduce you to someone who knows vocabulary and knows how to aarth better than anyone I know. Probably even better than Prof. Sahib Singh.


 

First something about Ranjit Singh.Even before Ranjit Singh there were Masands.who were even lower.Then there were no Dasham Granth Sahib but Guru Granth Sahib Ji.So you need to understand the logic?

Then what about our Kala Afghana Sahib?
can you take the gurantee of his charecter?

What about acts of Ambala sahib while he was Bhagmal?


Then as per logic of Mahan Kosh as yourelf say have you read Gurmat Sudhakar? of Nabha Sahib.

Did menitoneing of a few things does not means endorement then Amabala Sahib's book againt Dasham Granth also does not means to have his endrosement.

Lastly about  Grammer ,bring that great scholoar over here online.Then we can decide that how good scholar that person his.

But being spritualy enlightened and being schlar are two differnt things.

Viakran deals with rules while vobulary deals with meaning of varius terms.Which many Punajbis are so far unaware.

Lastly there was a person called Hira Singh Dalewalia.He was a leader of Misl and from Virk family of Kasur.He eloped with the widow sister in law of Devan of Jallendher .named Ranjan,.


During sieze of Jallendher by Singh Raghuretas were givne a free hands to marry and forceable convert Pathan ladies.

This happened during the time of Ahamad Sah Abdali.

Till we are not in batle field on ground,it is not possible to understand the word of soliders.

If you come to India das will try to learn the newer  Viakran from yourself but by that time das requests you to learn Viakran from the schlar you have  mentioned.As weather of own side or of oppsite side schlar has to be requested and education by him to learnt.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Nov 27, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> There is a difference between saying sexual intercourse and ****. You can see that one term is not allowed to be posted while other is. One is civillized language while other is that of someone who is morally corrupt and has no clue how to respect others. You posting tukhs from Guru Granth Sahib won't help as they all go against you. That above tukh goes against you too as it says sexual organs and not **** or {censored}.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
As Akal is in all so all term Bhog is attributed to Akal in Guru Granth Sahib.

ਪੰਨਾ 432, ਸਤਰ 19http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=432&punjabi=t&id=19864
ਜੁਗੁ ਜੁਗੁ ਜੋਗੀ ਖਾਣੀ ਭੋਗੀ ਪੜਿਆ ਪੰਡਿਤੁ ਆਪਿ ਥੀਆ ॥੯॥
जुगु जुगु जोगी खाणी भोगी पड़िआ पंडितु आपि थीआ ॥९॥
Jug jug jogī kẖāṇī bẖogī paṛi&shy;ā pandiṯ āp thī&shy;ā. ||9||
through each and every age, He Himself has been the Yogi, the enjoyer, the Pandit and the scholar. ||9||
ਮਃ 1   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 507, ਸਤਰ 14http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=507&punjabi=t&id=22719
ਸੂਰਨ ਮਹਿ ਸੂਰਾ ਤੂੰ ਕਹੀਅਹਿ ਭੋਗਨ ਮਹਿ ਭੋਗੀ ॥
सूरन महि सूरा तूं कहीअहि भोगन महि भोगी ॥
Sūran meh sūrā ṯūŉ kahī&shy;ahi bẖogan meh bẖogī.
Among warriors, You are called the Warrior. Among indulgers, You are the Indulger.
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 514, ਸਤਰ 2http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=514&punjabi=t&id=22972
ਕਾਇਆ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਆਪਿ ਵਸਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਆਪੇ ਰਸ ਭੋਗੀ ॥
काइआ अंदरि आपि वसि रहिआ आपे रस भोगी ॥
Kā&shy;i&shy;ā anḏar āp vas rahi&shy;ā āpė ras bẖogī.
The Lord Himself dwells within the body; He Himself is the Enjoyer of pleasures.
ਮਃ 3   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

ਪੰਨਾ 1074, ਸਤਰ 3http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1074&punjabi=t&id=46060
ਤੂ ਵਡ ਰਸੀਆ ਤੂ ਵਡ ਭੋਗੀ ॥
तू वड रसीआ तू वड भोगी ॥
Ŧū vad rasī&shy;ā ṯū vad bẖogī.
You are the great party-goer, You are the great enjoyer.
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1150, ਸਤਰ 16http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1150&punjabi=t&id=49396
ਆਪਿ ਨਿਰਬਾਣੀ ਆਪੇ ਭੋਗੀ ॥੨॥
आपि निरबाणी आपे भोगी ॥२॥
Āp nirbāṇī āpė bẖogī. ||2||
He Himself is in the detachment of Nirvaanaa, and He Himself is the Enjoyer. ||2||
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]
Lastly coming to fighting and librating Akal Takhat.Yuor self are welcome.

What so far das has understood about about Chelas of Kala Afghana that instead to doing something constructive,they are hell bent to destroy all the Panthic things.

and all offers to set up thier own independant oragansation to prove some thing positive have been proven to be falling on the deaf ears.

Das is told by some buddies that in past Britishers used Bhasaueias and in present congress and left used Kale Afghaniyes in the guise of spokemen to weakned the Panth.

Das feels that yourself are misguied by them as they hvae by now started to attack Sikh Missioary Collage Ludhiyana(read Sikh Phulwari of november).

Jhank Rahe Hain Ghar Ke Dusham Ghar Ki he Diwaron Se.
Sambhal Ke Rehana Apen Ghar Ke Chipe Huye Ghaddaron Se.

As per Kale Afghaniyas
not only Amrit Sanchar but Karahn Pradsad is also conspiracy of Hindus to absorb Gurmat.

With such a great scholars.We hardly need RSS to do any thing Bad to us.:8-


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## vijaydeep Singh (Nov 27, 2007)

Gurfateh

Das when ever gets the chance will take care of Dubai's person issue been rasied as das has by mercy of Akal answer to all of his issue but a bit less of time.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 27, 2007)

There is no need for RSS because you are doing their work and promoting porn book. I don't care about what kala afgana says. All I know is Guru Sahib didn't write dasam granth. As for your historical reference about missal period, Sikhs were lost by that time. They were even fighting each other. Teaching of dasam granth were prevalent by that time. That is all it tells me. I blame dasam granth. As for masands and mahants, they were the ones who promotes this dirty book so there is no doubt about their actions. They also were the ones who did parkash of dasam granth at Gurudwaras.

I gave your Gurbani references which mentiong on granth and one Guru in the thread you linked yourself. Read them.

As for ling and lund. There is a big difference. It is the difference between saying animals mated or animals ****** each other. One is social language and one is *******ed. Don't play the low caste card as it won't work.


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## kds1980 (Nov 28, 2007)

> There is no need for RSS because you are doing their work and promoting porn book



Dear khalsa fauj ji

Just because vijaydeep singh ji accept dasam granth that does not mean he is doing work of Rss.if accepting dasam granth is promoting rss the what about taksal,Akj and majority of other sikh instituition that accept dasam granth.

Almost whole sikhsangat.com beleive that dasam granth is written by guru gobind singhji


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Panthic Weekly: BREAKING: Nexus between Sikh Parchariks and the RSS revealed at Rulda Son's Funeral

That is all I got to say about RSS and Gyani Thakur Singh followers. The Voice of Sikh Youth (Powered by Invision Power Board) guys are non-Indian and don't know jack about Gurmat. They also don't try dirty tactics like vijaydeep.


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## kds1980 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Panthic Weekly: BREAKING: Nexus between Sikh Parchariks and the RSS revealed at Rulda Son's Funeral
> 
> That is all I got to say about RSS and Gyani Thakur Singh followers. The Voice of Sikh Youth (Powered by Invision Power Board) guys are non-Indian and don't know jack about Gurmat. They also don't try dirty tactics like vijaydeep.



There are very knowledgeable sikhs on sikhsangat.com like Namstang.Just read his ongoing thread about bhasuria mentality of sikh missionaries because they are anti dasam granth.These types of people cannot even tolerate even a single word against dasam granth.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

I know namastang very well and also know how clean his talk is. I have talked to him before on the phone. I have challenged him many times to dasam granth debate but he has never accepted the challenge.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> guys are non-Indian and don't know jack about Gurmat.


 

what is the link between being indian and gurmat?


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## kds1980 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> I know namastang very well and also know how clean his talk is. I have talked to him before on the phone. I have challenged him many times to dasam granth debate but he has never accepted the challenge.



Namstang was just an example.There are many like him on sikhawareness too.The fact is that these people will never accept that dasam granth is not word of guru gobind singh,while you people will never accept that dasam granth is word of guru gobind singh ji.So what's the solution?


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Indian has to do with Punjabi and Punjabi has to do with vast knowledge of Gurmukhi which is needed to aarth Guru Granth Sahib Ji's shabads.

As for namastang and company, none of them have been able to back up dasam granth. No one because falsehood can't be defended.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Solution is to follow only Guru Granth Sahib Ji and make maraydas according to teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji as Guru Gobind Singh Ji said.

Guru Maaneo Granth.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Follow Gurbani when it says:
Ikaa Bani Ik Gur Ikko Shabad Veechar

Tayraa Keetaa Jaato Naahee Maino Joag Kee Toaee

Guru Sahib thanked Waheguru for giving bani to complete the thaal with three vastoos. Then I don't know where dasam granth comes from.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Indian has to do with Punjabi and Punjabi has to do with vast knowledge of Gurmukhi which is needed to aarth Guru Granth Sahib Ji's shabads.
> 
> As for namastang and company, none of them have been able to back up dasam granth. No one because falsehood can't be defended.


 

so only indians (punjabis specifically) can understand gurbani?  does that mean only punjabis can be sikhs?

i wonder if Guru Nanak Dev ji spoke punjabi when he travelled to Mecca?  do you think people understood him?  i wonder why our Gurus travelled so much to spread the word of God to people who could never understand it?

i find your comment insulting.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Solution is to follow only Guru Granth Sahib Ji and make maraydas according to teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji as Guru Gobind Singh Ji said.
> 
> Guru Maaneo Granth.


 

what maryada is based only on Guru Granth Sahib ji?  how is that even possible?  Guru Granth Sahib ji is a manual for how to reach God.  it's not a do and don't manual for daily life...  

Sikhi is divided into two parts, spritual and temporal (miri and piri, but i'm sure you know that).  Guru Granth Sahib ji is obviously the spritual manual...  what do you suggest we use for the temporal?  the teachings of the tenth master seem to work fine for the vast majority of sikhs.  what would you suggest instead?


just curious, do you wear a turban and keep a beard?  if so, why?  does guru granth sahib ji tell you to?  or does the rehat maryada tell you to?


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## kds1980 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Solution is to follow only Guru Granth Sahib Ji and make maraydas according to teachings of Guru Granth Sahib Ji as Guru Gobind Singh Ji said.
> 
> Guru Maaneo Granth.



Well there is no dispute over following guru granth sahib.The question is whether dasam granth is word of guru gobind singh ji or not.his dispute is taking bitter turn and its weakening   panth.No side is going to accept other's arguement.
.also what about 5ks, many youngster question now where it is written in guru granth sahib that sikh have to wear 5ks


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## kds1980 (Nov 28, 2007)

kelly_kaur said:


> so only indians (punjabis specifically) can understand gurbani?  does that mean only punjabis can be sikhs?
> 
> i wonder if Guru Nanak Dev ji spoke punjabi when he travelled to Mecca?  do you think people understood him?  i wonder why our Gurus travelled so much to spread the word of God to people who could never understand it?
> 
> i find your comment insulting.



I agree with you kelly.Punjabi's have no monopoly over sikhism and gurbani.This mentality was  one of the reason that sikhism is now mainly limited to punjabi's


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

kelly_kaur said:


> so only indians (punjabis specifically) can understand gurbani? does that mean only punjabis can be sikhs?
> 
> i wonder if Guru Nanak Dev ji spoke punjabi when he travelled to Mecca? do you think people understood him? i wonder why our Gurus travelled so much to spread the word of God to people who could never understand it?
> 
> i find your comment insulting.


 
I am not saying only Punjabis can be Sikhs. I am saying knowledge of Gurmukhi is neccesary to interpret Gurbani. 90% of punjabis also can't interpret Gurbani. It takes hard work and courage and time.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> I am not saying only Punjabis can be Sikhs. I am saying knowledge of Gurmukhi is neccesary to interpret Gurbani. 90% of punjabis also can't interpret Gurbani. It takes hard work and courage and time.


 


so why make the comment about them not being indian?  one can learn gurmukhi no matter one's country of origin.  

i know this is true because i'm learning it now.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

kelly_kaur said:


> what maryada is based only on Guru Granth Sahib ji? how is that even possible? Guru Granth Sahib ji is a manual for how to reach God. it's not a do and don't manual for daily life...
> 
> Sikhi is divided into two parts, spritual and temporal (miri and piri, but i'm sure you know that). Guru Granth Sahib ji is obviously the spritual manual... what do you suggest we use for the temporal? the teachings of the tenth master seem to work fine for the vast majority of sikhs. what would you suggest instead?
> 
> ...


 
Guru Granth Sahib Ji mentions to wear kakkars. Dasam granth doesn't say anywhere to wear dastaar or 5 kakkars.

Guru Granth Sahib Ji is our complete Guru, capable of leading Sikhs spiritually and temporaly. Rehat maryada is made and can be made without having dasam granth. Dasam granth doesn't even believe in keeping rehats. It says don't do any karam kaand and says to praise 4 armed, drug taking, angry, evil, mahaakaal who likes to engage in war.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Guru Granth Sahib Ji mentions to wear kakkars. Dasam granth doesn't say anywhere to wear dastaar or 5 kakkars.


 

please show me where this is written, i was not aware of it.  thanks.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

kelly_kaur said:


> so why make the comment about them not being indian? one can learn gurmukhi no matter one's country of origin.
> 
> i know this is true because i'm learning it now.


 
That is great. Of course non-Indians can learn Gurmukhi and get great at it. However, the youth which defends dasam granth on forums isn't great. They have never read dasam granth yet promote it. There is no doubt you can get great at interpreting Gurbani. However, you do need to learn viakaran and how to interpret Gurbani based on basic Sikh principles such as God never takes birth, God doesn't have a shape, God is agam aagochar, etc. etc.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

kelly_kaur said:


> please show me where this is written, i was not aware of it. thanks.


 
Saabat Soorat Dastaar Siraa
(Clarifies hair and turban)

And if you have hair, you need a comb or you can welcome lice.
(Clarifies kangaa)

Par Triiyy Roop Na Paykhai Nayttarr
(clarifies kaschera)

Jatt Pahaaraa Dheeraj Suneaar
Aahran Matt Vaid Hatheeaar
Bhao Khallaa Aagan Tap Taao
So kara there to remind you of God and to live inside hukam
(clarifies karraa)

Jay Jeevai Patt Lathee Jaaye
Sabh Haraam Jay Taa Kish Khaaye
(Clarifies kirpaan)


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Saabat Soorat Dastaar Siraa
> (Clarifies hair and turban)
> 
> And if you have hair, you need a comb or you can welcome lice.
> ...


 
i see.  so it's not that Guru Granth Sahib ji actually specifies the panj kakars, but you have inferred from some vague passages that they're actually talking about physical articles.  got it.

i also like your kanga logic. 

however, from your post, i don't see where it's mentioned that we must carry panj kakars on our person or even what these kakars are. 

but it's a good start.  

you do know that twisting gurbani for your own purposes is kind of frowned upon, right?


did you know that sabat soorat dastar sira is not as simple as a physical turban, but refers to the "complete being", meaning one who has met God?   "let your complete being (god consiousness) be your turban".  it doesn't actually say "wear a turban".  

gurbani often has a deeper meaning than one sees at first glance.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Wrong translations again. Show me where in dasam granth it says to keep 5 kakkars directly. All it does is promote worship of weapons which is anti-Gurmat anyways.

Other direct sources can be found in rehatnamas and hukamnamas.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

i again invite you to show me your source for "correct" translations, as you seem to find the most commonly accepted translations as invalid.

where do rehetnamas come from?  you said everything comes from guru granth sahib only...  i'm looking for specific mention of panj kakars in SSGS and i do not find it.  

so are you now saying the current panthic rehat maryada is acceptable?


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Yes, follow the rehat maryada. It is made by Panth.


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## Archived_Member1 (Nov 28, 2007)

The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Yes, follow the rehat maryada. It is made by Panth.


 

i do, thanks.  interestingly it includes reciting banis from dasam patshah...  do you do this?


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Nov 28, 2007)

Recitations are from dasam granth and not dasam paatshah. Writing paatshahi 10 in heading doesn't make it paatshahi 10. Yes, until maryada is fixed, follow it as is.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 18, 2007)

Gurfateh


> ```
> There is no need for RSS because you are doing their work and promoting porn book. I don't care about what kala afgana says.
> ```


 

Bhai kindly prove that cryptogrphay is porn.Prove that das is harming the panth.

Kindly tel the fault of das.

regarding Kala Afghana Ji.Well you say what he has said.Even thye article of Bal sahib which talks about throwing off of Professor and Ambala Ji off the Panth also talk of same injustice of Akal Takhat onto dear Afghana Ji.

Sant Sipahi Magzine are highly Anti RSS but pro Dasham Granth.

While Sikh Missioanry Collage is highyl anti to spokesmen and Indiaawareness(as spokemsman is banned from Panth so they sell thier magzine with name of India Awareness.As Dasham Granth Nirnai from Bhag Sing Amabala is banned they sell it with the name of Dasham Granth Darpan(book with this name is pro Dasham Granth by Bhai Harbans Singh Ji)this is the proof of thier Truth fulness).Read issues of Sikh Phulwari of november and December.



> All I know is Guru Sahib didn't write dasam granth.


 
Someone great like you said that he knew that Guru did not write Japu Ji Sahib.

Why?

As no Mahala and no Raga in them.So much doubters should be or should not be trusted is up to Panth.


> As for your historical reference about missal period, Sikhs were lost by that time. They were even fighting each other.


 
Does it mean that Guru Mahraj System of Khalsa was not everlasting?

Think over it.

Had Sikhs were lost then how could they defeat Nadir or Ahmad Shah or Marathas?


> Teaching of dasam granth were prevalent by that time. That is all it tells me. I blame dasam granth.


 
Bhai can you think that Adi Guru Granth Sahib(which is necter) can be defeated by poision called Dasham Granth Sahib.Yes Dasham Granth Sahib is poision.But we as Bhujangis or snakes are immune to poision and are capable to use the same onto our foes.

So Bhai is you get immortaltiy from Guru Granth Sahib ie salvation while being alive.Das feels that you will not find any immorality inf Dasham Granth Sahib.

Das begs you to read more of Guru Granth Sahib and make love for God.Who is in all and does all.


> As for masands and mahants, they were the ones who promotes this dirty book so there is no doubt about their actions. They also were the ones who did parkash of dasam granth at Gurudwaras.


 
There were Masands like Great Bhai Pheru Ji and Mahants like Baba Adan Shah Ji(who preached faith to Muslims).Das would like a proof that why did they only are to be blamed for Prakash of Dasham Granth Sahib Ji in Gurudwaras.

Is Prakash of Guru Granth Sahib Ji,covered with blanket or in AC rule valid?

Do we bow to Guru Granth Sahib Ji do we bow to object or God?

Does Guru Manyo Granth has term Granth as singular or plural?



> I gave your Gurbani references which mentiong on granth and one Guru in the thread you linked yourself. Read them.


 
Das did gace interpetaion onto that telling yourself that one Guru and one Bani means that one source for all Banis. There is no second Bani at all.

Nanak naam Chardi Kala Tere Bhane Sarbat Da Bhala.is it from Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

What is the reason that Ninth Master had to add his own Bani if he added at all after texts was done by Fourth Form?

Why should we say that Tenth Form did not write any Bani at all?

Why should be trust Huqumnammah and why to trust texts outside Guru Granth Sahib Ji teling Granth Ji as a Guru.

Single thing is to be belived is to is if any thing in universe is not as per Guru Granth Sahib Ji.It talks of infinity.poor idiot like das can not talk more of that.



> As for ling and lund. There is a big difference. It is the difference between saying animals mated or animals ****** each other. One is social language and one is *******ed. Don't play the low caste card as it won't work.


 
The differance is there between Nirbhai and Nirbhau(as per Satyarth Prakash former is OK and later is not due civilised language ir Aryan Language and he attacked our Bani).But Bani has to go for the masses.Which Guru knew.

what you call social is termed as civilised by Aray Samajis and all others are Anarya or uncivilised.But masses of India are what many so called socail people say 'uncivilised'.


Das is not playing any caste card but is sure that Bhag Singh Ji,who was an ex Arya Samaji did not know about them,nor of thier history.But our Gurus were not like them.

ਪੰਨਾ 1106, ਸਤਰ 13
ਨੀਚਹ ਊਚ ਕਰੈ ਮੇਰਾ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਕਾਹੂ ਤੇ ਨ ਡਰੈ ॥੧॥
नीचह ऊच करै मेरा गोबिंदु काहू ते न डरै ॥१॥
Nīcẖah ūcẖ karai mėrā gobinḏ kāhū ṯė na darai. ||1||
You exalt and elevate the lowly, O my Lord of the Universe; You are not afraid of anyone. ||1||
ਭਗਤ ਰਵਿਦਾਸ ਜੀ   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]


Many a times some words are thaought to be lowly at one time but when the lower people using them get political power.They become acceptalbe.

Lastly in past during indigo rebellion and rebelion of 1857 propoganda warfare was there.

Best way to see this is interpetation of 10th Chapter of Manu Samriti by castiest forces.

May be texts against Asura(native) could have such things.But often Asuras like Ravana were Brahmins.And writer like Valmiki was one lower then Chandal Kshvapach or dog eater(what people call Churha).

Akal Bless.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 18, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> Recitations are from dasam granth and not dasam paatshah. Writing paatshahi 10 in heading doesn't make it paatshahi 10. Yes, until maryada is fixed, follow it as is.


Tommorow if some say that just by name Nanak in Guru Granth Sahib Ji's verse does not make it from Guru?Then bro what will happen?

Next yourself are the same person who has been not liking Taksal and AKJ for thier not following Rahit Maryada(Anti meat or 5 morning Banis plus two in eving and night).

So this justify thier Demand also to change in Rahit Maryada.If they demand they are demons but if Other Great Singhs demand they are heros.Well all right.Akal Bless.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 18, 2007)

------------------DELETED PERSONAL REMARKS-----------------When Guru Sahib talks about bringing and supporting neech, Guru Sahib is talking about poor and downgraded people. It has nothing to do with sexual story readers or promoters. If you can't tell the difference, your issue. Of course Panth can fix the maryada. There is no doubt about it and Panth will fix it. Only Gurbani is what is present in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Anything outside, isn't Gurbani. I don't know where you are bringing issues about Japuji Sahib and other banis in Guru Granth Sahib Ji. I smell hidden agenda to defame GurSikhs by saying they are questioning Guru Granth Sahib Ji which is not even 0% true. No GurSikh questions Guru Granth Sahib Ji but dasam granth is going to go and no RSS can stop it. Sant Sipahi isn't anti-RSS, he is pro RSS. It is all a tactic of RSS to get dasam granth promoted. Lamba writing 2-3 articles about RSS doesn't make him anti-RSS. I judge based on if you believe in dasam granth or not.

Belief in dasam granth = RSS
Non-belief in dasam granth = usually non-RSS

Very simple and clear
Listen, hear and cheer

I don't care and don't have time for satyaa parkash or aathya parkash or madya parkash or whatever. They have nothing to do with Gurmat. Those who dont know viakaran think that Gurbani doesn't make sense. Satya parkah writer swami was a fool and idiotic so he didn't know either. Those who bring him in and think they are Sikhs are even bigger foolers.

--------PLEASE USE A CIVIL TONGUE KHALSA FAUJ--------------


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 18, 2007)

ਪੰਨਾ 1106, ਸਤਰ 13
ਨੀਚਹ ਊਚ ਕਰੈ ਮੇਰਾ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਕਾਹੂ ਤੇ ਨ ਡਰੈ ॥੧॥
Nīcẖah ūcẖ karai mėrā gobinḏ kāhū ṯė na darai. ||1||
You exalt and elevate the lowly, O my Lord of the Universe; You are not afraid of anyone. ||1||

It does not mean make low life literature such as dasam granth to high life. It means, get rid of vikaars in people and make them great. ------------PERSONAL REMARKS-----------------

--------PLEASE USE A CIVIL TONGUE KHALSA FAUJ--------------


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 19, 2007)

> The Khalsa Fauj said:
> 
> 
> > ------------------DELETED PERSONAL REMARKS-----------------
> ...




Strange thing is thatat one place same person trys to be judge of civil tongue and same person uses such tongue.God knows.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 19, 2007)

Gurfateh


The Khalsa Fauj said:


> ਪੰਨਾ 1106, ਸਤਰ 13
> ਨੀਚਹ ਊਚ ਕਰੈ ਮੇਰਾ ਗੋਬਿੰਦੁ ਕਾਹੂ ਤੇ ਨ ਡਰੈ ॥੧॥
> Nīcẖah ūcẖ karai mėrā gobinḏ kāhū ṯė na darai. ||1||
> You exalt and elevate the lowly, O my Lord of the Universe; You are not afraid of anyone. ||1||
> ...


 
Are yourself not aware the weak and poor other then being spritual sound had to plotically and socio economically sound.

Panth has to work,for doing on gorund,what has to be done in book.Kindly come on gournd.We have had a misl ruled by Bhai Beeru Singh Raghureta at Gujranwala.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 19, 2007)

Gurfateh

Some Truths about anti Dasham Granth guys.

Well if Sangat wants das can provide a lists of those guys who are Anti Dasham Granth Sahib,who have left back ground.

Das will write something about power of Panth.

If we are one we are capable to rule.While when we are divided oppresor could rule us.


In past we had first Anti Dasham Granth person,Profesor Gurmukh Singh actualy been accused of being soft of Britishers and taking help from the person who was mani reason for the defeat of Sikhs in Anglo Singh war.Sikh Missionary Collage has materail telling about that.

Next we have Teja Singh Ji of Bhsaour agained blamed to be agent og Britishers.


When Britishers went off.We Had Congres as our rulers.

During emergency Mrs Indira Gandhi made all oppanat subdued and she bacame the dectator.

Only SGPC and Akal Takaht due to its power of faith remained undisturbed and were main hub to sucessfully fight her.

Comunist Party of India(CPI) with russian support did suport Mrs Gandhi and thier cadres overtook educational and press intstituations(From thence Anti Sikh crept overe there too).

She in order to divivde Sikhs sometime used Sants,sometime Budhadal,sometimes she did use meat issue and only at that time of 1976 did 
Bhag Singh Ambala borught Anti Dasham Granth book so that Sikh be divided.

(Bhag Singh's old name was bhagmal and was an Arya Samaji and had conduct of Krishna(referance boob by Bhai Harbans Singh Ji)).

During that time did some Sant was also been suported by congres and Gurbax Singh Khalsa(who later became Kala Afghana) was planted in faith from Punjab police.

Ambala was puished and he also apologised for mis conduct.Gurbax reamiend with sant.

But when Akalis were in Punjab rule and BJP at centrea Gurbax with the name of Kala Afghana was brought in by the congress so that let Sikhs instead of converting more people in Panth,should start fighting among themselves.

He was thrown out of Panth.Later his relative Joginder of spokesmen also joined him.He was also thrown out.

Till congress later stayed in Punjab all govenemt tender news etc. were givne to spokesmen and it was made to establish against Akal Takhat and SGPC.

As rule has again changed so thier power has lessoned.Once congres is also off the rule in India all voices of decent of Dasham Granth will cease to exists.

Das persoanly has no enimity for Anti Dasham Granth people.

Das has nothing if they folow or do not follow Gurmat.

But when they spread wrong interpetations and they are replied back they use foul lnagugae,which is another proff of communists.


Reason for comunsts being against us is due to the fact we are the only power,which are capable to take the whole world and and anti thesei to leftism.

Till we are there no China can take India nor its allies Muslims take the west.

Thier main agenda is to spread lies and panick and ultimately make our children faithless.

Das thinks that our dear brother TKF is misguided by such guys.das still loves him.

Lastly was will repeat that Tenth Master saying that Guru Granth Sahib Ji are our Guru is not writtan in Guru Granth Sahib  so that makes it unfit to voice of Guru saying of Guru.Strange thing.

But if Bani is Guru,then why is not Bani of Tenth Master our Guru.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 19, 2007)

vijaydeep Singh said:


> Gurfateh
> 
> 
> Are yourself not aware the weak and poor other then being spritual sound had to plotically and socio economically sound.
> ...



I have no clue what you are talking about or how missals are related to dasam granth as per your case. It does not make sense at all. I don't care about Teja Singh.

I just abide by Gurmat of ONE:
One God
One Guru (Guru Granth)
One Panth

That is it. Anything outside Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not Gurbani because Gurbani has been sealed with Mundaawni.

Anything outside Guru Granth Sahib Ji has to be judged and if it doesn't clearly pass the test of Guru Granth Sahib Ji, it isn't Gurbani or Sikh scripture.

Dasam Granth doesn't so it is under the knife for examination and it is beign exposed.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 19, 2007)

I don't care if you love me or not. I don't need any statements full of pakhand from you. Pakhand and cleverness will not get you Gurmat or Guru or God. Only thing I care about is if Guru loves me or not which Guru Ji does.

---------------STOP GETTING PERSONAL. USING WORDS LIKE PAAKHAND DO NOT HELP------------------


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 20, 2007)

Gurfateh


> I have no clue what you are talking about or how missals are related to dasam granth as per your case.


Which Misls do you talk about dear?

It is something anyway what Nabha Sahib talked about Sakhi of Bhai Sukha Singh Ji?



> It does not make sense at all. I don't care about Teja Singh.


 
What does not male sense?

But vies of yourself are like that of Babu Teja Singh Ji .



> I just abide by Gurmat of ONE:
> One God
> One Guru (Guru Granth)
> One Panth


Das talked about Duja Bhav having something second to God.What is differance between yourself and that idol worshipper who has many demi gods.

Here yourself talked about Three entity.But Guru is one ,Guru Guru Eko Ves Anek.Same Guru in all forms.In Panth and Granth Guru is visisble.

One God,which is bound by text.
One Guru,which is interpreted by way some non spritual greatmen.
one Panth,only those who accede to some narrow minded idealogy.

That is not the Gurmat Dear bro.

When our mind is no more and we are in control of Guru,our mind is overtaken by thoughts of Guru.We do not think but Guru thinks there we say Gurmat.

Rest is manmat.Views of sel mind.


> That is it. Anything outside Guru Granth Sahib Ji is not Gurbani because Gurbani has been sealed with Mundaawni.


 
Mundavani was writtan much before Verse unto the Ninth Master.

Had there been a full stop then Bani unto Tenth Master might not have came.

Do you want to prove that at the Time of Fifth Master there was a full stop of coming of the Bani but later God changed the mind and send the new Bani.

If God can change mind then why not mind could be changed more then one time.

But by the way why does Salok Mahal Panjawan comes after Mundavini?

Has this been Mangacharan then it should ahve had comme before sealing why did it comes after Mundavini?

Why does both of then ends with ..1.. 

So does Raagmala?

Are you aware that oldest version Madhavnam Kamkandla is there in manuscript of the Kankroli and it is around the time of Tenth Master and during then only was Alam living.

See another simlar Mudavini.

ਸਲੋਕੁ ਮਃ ੩ ॥ 
सलोकु मः ३ ॥ 
Salok mehlā 3. 
Shalok, Third Mehl: 

ਥਾਲੈ ਵਿਚਿ ਤੈ ਵਸਤੂ ਪਈਓ ਹਰਿ ਭੋਜਨੁ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਸਾਰੁ ॥ 
थालै विचि तै वसतू पईओ हरि भोजनु अम्रितु सारु ॥ 
Thālai vicẖ ṯai vasṯū pa&shy;ī&shy;o har bẖojan amriṯ sār. 
Upon the plate, three things have been placed; this is the sublime, ambrosial food of the Lord. 

ਜਿਤੁ ਖਾਧੈ ਮਨੁ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤੀਐ ਪਾਈਐ ਮੋਖ ਦੁਆਰੁ ॥ 
जितु खाधै मनु त्रिपतीऐ पाईऐ मोख दुआरु ॥ 
Jiṯ kẖāḏẖai man ṯaripaṯ&shy;ī&shy;ai pā&shy;ī&shy;ai mokẖ ḏu&shy;ār. 
Eating this, the mind is satisfied, and the Door of Salvation is found. 

ਇਹੁ ਭੋਜਨੁ ਅਲਭੁ ਹੈ ਸੰਤਹੁ ਲਭੈ ਗੁਰ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 
इहु भोजनु अलभु है संतहु लभै गुर वीचारि ॥ 
Ih bẖojan alabẖ hai sanṯahu labẖai gur vīcẖār. 
It is so difficult to obtain this food, O Saints; it is obtained only by contemplating the Guru. 

ਏਹ ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ ਕਿਉ ਵਿਚਹੁ ਕਢੀਐ ਸਦਾ ਰਖੀਐ ਉਰਿ ਧਾਰਿ ॥ 
एह मुदावणी किउ विचहु कढीऐ सदा रखीऐ उरि धारि ॥ 
Ėh muḏāvaṇī ki&shy;o vicẖahu kadẖī&shy;ai saḏā rakẖī&shy;ai ur ḏẖār. 
Why should we cast this riddle out of our minds? We should keep it ever enshrined in our hearts. 

ਏਹ ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਪਾਈ ਗੁਰਸਿਖਾ ਲਧੀ ਭਾਲਿ ॥ 
एह मुदावणी सतिगुरू पाई गुरसिखा लधी भालि ॥ 
Ėh muḏāvaṇī saṯgurū pā&shy;ī gursikẖā laḏẖī bẖāl. 
The True Guru has posed this riddle. The Guru's Sikhs have found its solution. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਜਿਸੁ ਬੁਝਾਏ ਸੁ ਬੁਝਸੀ ਹਰਿ ਪਾਇਆ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਘਾਲਿ ॥੧॥ 
नानक जिसु बुझाए सु बुझसी हरि पाइआ गुरमुखि घालि ॥१॥ 
Nānak jis bujẖā&shy;ė so bujẖsī har pā&shy;i&shy;ā gurmukẖ gẖāl. ||1|| 
O Nanak, he alone understands this, whom the Lord inspires to understand. The Gurmukhs work hard, and find the Lord. ||1|| 

ang (645).



> Anything outside Guru Granth Sahib Ji has to be judged and if it doesn't clearly pass the test of Guru Granth Sahib Ji, it isn't Gurbani or Sikh scripture.


Agreed but das again asks you that where in Guru Granth Sahib did Tenth Master wrote that Sikhs should behold them as Guru.We use only Bani Guru Guru Hai Bani and Sabad Guru Surat Dhun Chela and does justfy this with Guru Manyo Granth.

So in the same way we could prove the work of the Tenth Master.


> Dasam Granth doesn't so it is under the knife for examination and it is beign exposed.


 
Brother it does.Das is proving and welcomes more doubt.

But why bring under knife.We should be briging everything under the light.

Knife is anyway a form of Akal as per Dasham Granth Sahiubh Ji.

So far oposers of Shri Dasham granth Sahib Ji are being exposed.

Like yourself Amabala Sahib also fought with some one saying that he does know thw grammer.But he himself(Ambala Ji) could not explain the grramer.

Reason for Kala Afghan Sahib not coming to Akal Takhat is also behind the same.

Kala Afghan says that as some Bhatts had some probelms with Guru ,Guru sent some to get them(He is equating himslefs with Bhatts,tommorow,he may try to add him Bani in Guru Granth Sahib.Another Anti Dasham Granth guys Niranakaris wrote thier own Avtar Bani).

Main reason is that both did not write thier books but gave thier name.

Das is surprised that people who actualy wrote the books did not have couarage to own them.



The Khalsa Fauj said:


> I don't care if you love me or not. I don't need any statements full of pakhand from you. Pakhand and cleverness will not get you Gurmat or Guru or God. Only thing I care about is if Guru loves me or not which Guru Ji does.


Bhai das does not need anything else if faith is Akal.

If yourself know that Guru Sahib love you then das bows his head to you.

Forgive das if he das ever offended yourself.Like many other friends of Das,who are Anti Dasham Granth Sahib,das aslo beholds yourself as one of his brilliant brother.

Also even if we have differant opinins about Guru Granth Sahib Ji yet Guruship of them binds us as Gurubhai.Also we have same God Akal though our preceptions are differnt.

Das will anyway will keep on troubling yourself for help in common causes for which das is aware that our opinion is same like.
1.Increase in numerical and plotical power of us.
2.stopage of rituals often by illitrate sants or other Karmkandis.
3.Removal of gender,racial and regional bias with ourself.

Akal Bless you.

Das is happy that at this stage you care for the benefit of the Panth.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 20, 2007)

Saloak Mahala 5 is part of Mundawni. Guru Sahib thanks God for courage to write granth.

Ikaa Bani Ik Gur Ikko Shabad Veechar [Pg. 646]
(one bani of Guru Granth, one Guru which is Guru Granth Sahib Ji's bani, and veechar of shabad of Guru Granth Sahib Ji).

If you can't be true to Guru Granth Sahib Ji, how can you be true to Panth? Weird.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 20, 2007)

Also, since mundawni is the seal, bani of 9th paatshah was added before mundawni. Same way, if 10th master wrote any bani, it would have been added before mundawni. Guru Ji didn't have lack of pens, paper or writers. These writings were written later by anti-Sikhs to fool Sikhs and break Sikhs away from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.


Guru Granth Sahib Ji has two baraa maahas, dasam granthis wrote two also and added them in krishan avtar for krishan. Guru Ji wrote Sukhamani, dasam granthis wrote sukhamana which was later removed from dasam granth.
Guru Ji wrote vars in prasie of God while dasam granthis wrote vars in praise of durgaa.


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## The Khalsa Fauj (Dec 20, 2007)

Teja Singh Bhasaur rejected bhagat bani and wanted to add dasam granth to Guru Granth Sahib Ji. He is more similar to you than me so please try again. Maybe you are running out of excuses to defend dirt so you trying to defame me by labeling me a Teja Singh Bhasaur agent with whom I don't even share views with him.



> Knife is anyway a form of Akal as per Dasham Granth Sahiubh Ji.
> 
> So far oposers of Shri Dasham granth Sahib Ji are being exposed.


 
Only thing being exposed here is dasam granth. Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the cannon which Sikhs have to judge other scriptures. Gurbani says God is Akaal Moorat but you want to make into 4 armed, dancer with bracelets and anklets. Therefore, I don't know how you can keep dasam granth and say you follow Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Choose either one. Dasam Granth or Guru. Choice is yours.

Very simple and clear
no need to fear.
Make the right choice
Of truth I spead the voice.


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## Parma (Dec 20, 2007)

After reading this discussion. I have realised that someone is against dasam granth and someone is for it. Now mr vijaydeep singh, I dont know what you are on about. Your statements make no sense, I can follow your thoughts for a while but then it stops making sense, does the arguement require english lessons. I think thus a person should learn to understand english properly before a person tries to argue and make a point in english! Mr Khalsa Fauj makes more clear and understandable statements. Not saying my english is perfect but at least it makes sense, I hope? Anyway I am on no ones side of this arguement not properly yet, as at the moment this discussion doesnt make sense, it could be the simple fact that mr vijaydeep you refer to yourself as das, just be clearer on your statements. My thoughts though... The Guru Granth Sahib is our holy book, not the dasam granth. No doubt its a holy book, but the filth about sex written in it sounds so graphic it could sound more like a porno? Where would our books end quran maybe? Will there was also a kabir mentioned in our Guru Granth sahib? I dont know. Hopefully you lot will provide the answers!!


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 21, 2007)

Gurfateh


> Saloak Mahala 5 is part of Mundawni. Guru Sahib thanks God for courage to write granth.


may be then like other verse there could have been some 2 writtan after double II.

Did Guru write the Granth? or did he compiled?

Is not bani by God only ie Khasam ki Bani?

Why some thing been writtan out side the seal?
Kindly explain what conects Mundavini with Salok Mahal Panjavan and why not thanks was given before the sealing?



> Ikaa Bani Ik Gur Ikko Shabad Veechar [Pg. 646]
> (one bani of Guru Granth, one Guru which is Guru Granth Sahib Ji's bani, and veechar of shabad of Guru Granth Sahib Ji).


 
ਮਃ ੩ ॥ 
मः ३ ॥ 
Mehlā 3. 
Third Mehl: 

ਇਕਾ ਬਾਣੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਰੁ ਇਕੋ ਸਬਦੁ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 
इका बाणी इकु गुरु इको सबदु वीचारि ॥ 
Ikā baṇī ik gur iko sabaḏ vīcẖār. 
There is One Bani; there is One Guru; there is one Shabad to contemplate. 

ਸਚਾ ਸਉਦਾ ਹਟੁ ਸਚੁ ਰਤਨੀ ਭਰੇ ਭੰਡਾਰ ॥ 
सचा सउदा हटु सचु रतनी भरे भंडार ॥ 
Sacẖā sa&shy;uḏā hat sacẖ raṯnī bẖarė bẖandār. 
True is the merchandise, and true is the shop; the warehouses are overflowing with jewels. 

ਗੁਰ ਕਿਰਪਾ ਤੇ ਪਾਈਅਨਿ ਜੇ ਦੇਵੈ ਦੇਵਣਹਾਰੁ ॥ 
गुर किरपा ते पाईअनि जे देवै देवणहारु ॥ 
Gur kirpā ṯė pā&shy;ī&shy;an jė ḏėvai ḏėvaṇhār. 
By Guru's Grace, they are obtained, if the Great Giver gives them. 

ਸਚਾ ਸਉਦਾ ਲਾਭੁ ਸਦਾ ਖਟਿਆ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਪਾਰੁ ॥ 
सचा सउदा लाभु सदा खटिआ नामु अपारु ॥ 
Sacẖā sa&shy;uḏā lābẖ saḏā kẖati&shy;ā nām apār. 
Dealing in this true merchandise, one earns the profit of the incomparable Naam. 

ਵਿਖੁ ਵਿਚਿ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਪ੍ਰਗਟਿਆ ਕਰਮਿ ਪੀਆਵਣਹਾਰੁ ॥ 
विखु विचि अम्रितु प्रगटिआ करमि पीआवणहारु ॥ 
vikẖ vicẖ amriṯ pargati&shy;ā karam pī&shy;āvaṇhār. 
In the midst of poison, the Ambrosial Nectar is revealed; by His Mercy, one drinks it in. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਸਚੁ ਸਲਾਹੀਐ ਧੰਨੁ ਸਵਾਰਣਹਾਰੁ ॥੨॥ 
नानक सचु सलाहीऐ धंनु सवारणहारु ॥२॥ 
Nānak sacẖ salāhī&shy;ai ḏẖan savāraṇhār. ||2|| 
O Nanak, praise the True Lord; blessed is the Creator, the Embellisher. ||2|| 
Bhai this state could be obtained by the mercy of Akal.

We are told to behold One only as voice,one only as guide and one one as verse.Ie God minfests in all and all is One.

Few more questions.

Was Guru Granth Sahib Ji writtan at that time?

were verse onto Three Gurus and Sikhs been already writtan at that time?

If it seals bani at the time of the Third Master then what about the bani writtan after that time?


> If you can't be true to Guru Granth Sahib Ji, how can you be true to Panth? Weird.


 
Bhai das has no power to be true to Panth nor to Granth as only Akal exists and by mercy of Akal Truth is realised and we are no longer you and me.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 21, 2007)

Gurfateh


> Also, since mundawni is the seal, bani of 9th paatshah was added before mundawni.


 
Mundavini also means something giving solace to heart.Seal is not the only meaning.

we have first to decide that weather Ninth Master added his Bani or Tenth Master added his fathers Bani soorrry Bani onto his father.

But what was preventing Tenth Master to have another books or two.Say even if it is seal say for your benefit.Then say after sealing one book why can not he by mercy of Akal make more books.


two reasons could be there.
1.As das has seldom seen missionry doing Santokh and Prakash,they do not know that present Swaroop of Guru Granth Sahib Ji is themselve not easy to carry by a single person at head more if he is weak.Then in past to carry book to long disances it was easy to have two books by two people then one book with tow in it by one person.
2.Then why not even a single verse of Tenth Master is added to Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

Say had he added then people could have ben fast enough to say that only that one verse is authantic and rest is a hoax.(any way das can prove one verse in Guru Granth Sahib Ji vide Ram but himself feels some what no sure).
Same way, if 10th master wrote any bani, it would have been added before mundawni. Guru Ji didn't have lack of pens, paper or writers. These writings were written later by anti-Sikhs to fool Sikhs and break Sikhs away from Guru Granth Sahib Ji.




> Guru Granth Sahib Ji has two baraa maahas, dasam granthis wrote two also and added them in krishan avtar for krishan.


 
Bhai there are mnay instance where what so ever is attributed to krishan is attributed to Akal in Guru Granth Sahib.

So have look.Das gace it to you before.


ਪੰਨਾ 606, ਸਤਰ 18http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=606&punjabi=t&id=26455
ਕਰਿ ਬਾਲਕ ਰੂਪ ਉਪਾਇਦਾ ਪਿਆਰਾ ਚੰਡੂਰੁ ਕੰਸੁ ਕੇਸੁ ਮਾਰਾਹਾ ॥
करि बालक रूप उपाइदा पिआरा चंडूरु कंसु केसु माराहा ॥
Kar bālak rūp upā&shy;iḏā pi&shy;ārā cẖandūr kans kės mārāhā.
The Beloved Himself assumed the form of the child, and killed the demons Chandoor, Kansa and Kaysee.
ਮਃ 4   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 874, ਸਤਰ 11http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=874&punjabi=t&id=37329
ਕੇਸੀ ਕੰਸ ਮਥਨੁ ਜਿਨਿ ਕੀਆ ॥
केसी कंस मथनु जिनि कीआ ॥
Kėsī kans mathan jin kī&shy;ā.
The Lord, who killed Kaysee and Kans,
ਭਗਤ ਨਾਮਦੇਵ ਜੀ   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]ਪੰਨਾ 1390, ਸਤਰ 8http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?Action=Page&Param=1390&punjabi=t&id=59212
ਦੁਆਪੁਰਿ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਮੁਰਾਰਿ ਕੰਸੁ ਕਿਰਤਾਰਥੁ ਕੀਓ ॥
दुआपुरि क्रिसन मुरारि कंसु किरतारथु कीओ ॥
Ḏu&shy;āpur krisan murār kans kirṯārath kī&shy;o.
In the Brass Age of Dwaapur Yuga, You were Krishna; You killed Mur the demon and saved Kans.
ਭਟ ਕਲ-ਸਹਾਰ   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]

So Kale Afghaniyes have no answer for them.

all is Akal and all praises are for Akal.


> Guru Ji wrote Sukhamani, dasam granthis wrote sukhamana which was later removed from dasam granth.


Give proof.And which copy?


> Guru Ji wrote vars in prasie of God while dasam granthis wrote vars in praise of durgaa


 
durga is attribute of Akal as Guru is termed as Parvati Mai as per Japu Ji Sahib.Rember the thing.God is Durga but Durga as demi godess is not God.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 21, 2007)

Gurfateh


> Teja Singh Bhasaur rejected bhagat bani and wanted to add dasam granth to Guru Granth Sahib Ji.


 
News to das.

Ambala Ji prasied guys from Bhasuar to doubt Dasham Granth Sahib,they also wrote that they replaced Bhagauti with Satnam Ji in thier Ardas.

Either yourself have not read the book by him or you have read the second version,where such parts could be dited as Nirankari's praises are edited.

Das does not think that yourself are lieing dear bro.



> He is more similar to you than me so please try again. Maybe you are running out of excuses to defend dirt so you trying to defame me by labeling me a Teja Singh Bhasaur agent with whom I don't even share views with him.


 
Ego hurting,when ego is there,slander is there.

In Rahiras Sahib we say Sakat Nindak Dust Khin Mai Bidrain.

So if das is slander or has ego for you Akal will remove it.But if yourself have same then also it is in hand of Akal.

So Ambala Sahib proves your sharing views with Babu Teja Singh Ji.He was accused of removing the Bani and a new hoax that he wanted to add anything.Rather he tried to remove bani as Bhatt Bani and Bhagat Bani were failing his Anti Dasham Granth Sahib tirade.Same a few guys from missionarys are doing this.




> Only thing being exposed here is dasam granth.


 
Anti Dasham Granth Kale Afghaniyees are been exposed over here.


> Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the cannon which Sikhs have to judge other scriptures.


 
Ambala Sahib said this as standard.But now there has been advance in violance so word cannon is been used.

Das thinks that such thing is from of Nayya Mat(which actualy Ambala Sahib also told in his book while teling about some verse).

This is 5th Hindu Darshan while ours is the 7th.

This way did Dayananda used to make Vedas as standard and condem other faiths.Same way was used by an ex Arya Samaji.

anyway only a finite thing could be made as a standard.Gurbani is infinite as Guru is Apar.(refreances could be provided about it that God only is Guru and Guru God is infintie,while there is an attempt in some Sikhs to bind God with text say like Wahabis do with holy Bible,Arya Samajis do with Holy Vedas and Protestants do with Holy Bible,such tenedency is the mani reason of conflict in the world).Young men tend to hate God due to such things.


> Gurbani says God is Akaal Moorat but you want to make into 4 armed, dancer with bracelets and anklets.


 
Akal is eternal and Entity stands for moorat.

Say if some times an entity is cool then we can not say that it may never be hot.

and then we talk of infinite God to whom all attributes belong.4arms,dance,bracelts or anklets even outside Bani are attributes of God.

Anyway das gave you referance above about Akal haivng a Chakra in hand and four arms and in Guru Granth Sahib we have Truban of God also.


ang 727ਖੂਬੁ ਤੇਰੀ ਪਗਰੀ ਮੀਠੇ ਤੇਰੇ ਬੋਲ ॥ 
खूबु तेरी पगरी मीठे तेरे बोल ॥ 
Kẖūb ṯėrī pagrī mīṯẖė ṯėrė bol. 
How handsome is your turban! And how sweet is your speech. 

ਦ੍ਵਾਰਿਕਾ ਨਗਰੀ ਕਾਹੇ ਕੇ ਮਗੋਲ ॥੨॥ 
द्वारिका नगरी काहे के मगोल ॥२॥ 
Ḏavārikā nagrī kāhė kė magol. ||2|| 
Why are there Moghals in the holy city of Dwaarikaa? ||2|| 



ang 727


ਆਪੇ ਹਰਿ ਇਕ ਰੰਗੁ ਹੈ ਆਪੇ ਬਹੁ ਰੰਗੀ ॥ 
आपे हरि इक रंगु है आपे बहु रंगी ॥ 
Āpė har ik rang hai āpė baho rangī. 
The Lord Himself is absolute; He is The One and Only; but He Himself is also manifested in many forms. 

ਜੋ ਤਿਸੁ ਭਾਵੈ ਨਾਨਕਾ ਸਾਈ ਗਲ ਚੰਗੀ ॥੨੨॥੨॥ 
जो तिसु भावै नानका साई गल चंगी ॥२२॥२॥ 
Jo ṯis bẖāvai nānkā sā&shy;ī gal cẖangī. ||22||2|| 
Whatever pleases Him, O Nanak, that alone is good. ||22||2|| 

ang726



> Therefore, I don't know how you can keep dasam granth and say you follow Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Choose either one. Dasam Granth or Guru. Choice is yours.


 
Das has choosen the interpetaion of Guru Granth Sahib Ji as per Gurmat and not as per 5th hindu philosophy.So das finds no conflict.

Anyway das has no objection for your choosing only one Great Text and not other.But das is sorry that yourself can not force das at all.But Akal can force you to be at the side of Das.Then nothing can stop you bro to respect the writing of the Tenth Master.Which by now you have said does not exists at all.
Views are same like that of 
1.Nirankaris
2.Bhasauris
3.Kale Afghaniyes.



> Very simple and clear
> no need to fear.
> Make the right choice
> Of truth I spead the voice


Good poem

Bhai till we have I,till then we will be off the Truth.And Guru Granth Sahib Ji are simplers to be understod with devotion then logic which is weak else Dayanada would have been a Sikh.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 21, 2007)

Gurfateh


Parma said:


> After reading this discussion. I have realised that someone is against dasam granth and someone is for it. Now mr vijaydeep singh, I dont know what you are on about. Your statements make no sense, I can follow your thoughts for a while but then it stops making sense, does the arguement require english lessons. I think thus a person should learn to understand english properly before a person tries to argue and make a point in english! Mr Khalsa Fauj makes more clear and understandable statements. Not saying my english is perfect but at least it makes sense, I hope? Anyway I am on no ones side of this arguement not properly yet, as at the moment this discussion doesnt make sense, it could be the simple fact that mr vijaydeep you refer to yourself as das, just be clearer on your statements. My thoughts though... The Guru Granth Sahib is our holy book, not the dasam granth. No doubt its a holy book, but the filth about sex written in it sounds so graphic it could sound more like a porno? Where would our books end quran maybe? Will there was also a kabir mentioned in our Guru Granth sahib? I dont know. Hopefully you lot will provide the answers!!


 
Bhai Nagra Ji,


Das is sory that his English is not up to the Mark.Das will try to improve.


Sometimes sprituality is something out of 5 senses.

Das finds are contradiction and a bias over here.



> I hope? Anyway I am on no ones side of this arguement not properly yet, as





> The Guru Granth Sahib is our holy book, not the dasam granth. No doubt its a holy book, but the filth about sex written in it sounds so graphic it could sound more like a porno?


 
anyway how many porn ore of India have you read?

How mnay porns have secret messages about weakness of the politicaly powerfull people.Perhaps the neaerest could be Prem Margi Sufis,who could have used same way to defeat Hindus.

Our books will end like the Quran of Wahabis if we try to bind God with any book as God makes all.

Kabir has two meanigs in Guru Granth Sahib Ji.

One as a devotee and another as Big ie God is Arbi.Haqa Kabir Kareem Tu.


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## vijaydeep Singh (Dec 21, 2007)

Gurfateh

Kinldy refer to Ang 1429 of Guru Granth Saihb Ji.

ਜਿਹ ਸਿਮਰਤ ਸੰਕਟ ਮਿਟੈ ਦਰਸੁ ਤੁਹਾਰੋ ਹੋਇ ॥੫੭॥੧॥ 
जिह सिमरत संकट मिटै दरसु तुहारो होइ ॥५७॥१॥ 
Jih simraṯ sankat mitai ḏaras ṯuhāro ho&shy;ė. ||57||1|| 
Meditating in remembrance on it, my troubles are taken away; I have received the Blessed Vision of Your Darshan. ||57||1|| 

End of Salok Mahala Nauvan.


||1||  shows the end.


ਤਮ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ਚਰਨ ਲਗਿ ਤਰੀਐ ਸਭੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਪਸਾਰੋ ॥੧॥ 
तम संसारु चरन लगि तरीऐ सभु नानक ब्रहम पसारो ॥१॥ 
Ŧam sansār cẖaran lag ṯarī&shy;ai sabẖ Nānak barahm pasāro. ||1|| 
The dark world-ocean is crossed over, by grasping the Feet of the Lord; O Nanak, it is all the extension of God. ||1|| 

End of Mundavini Mahala Panjavan with ||1|| 


ਨਾਨਕ ਨਾਮੁ ਮਿਲੈ ਤਾਂ ਜੀਵਾਂ ਤਨੁ ਮਨੁ ਥੀਵੈ ਹਰਿਆ ॥੧॥ 
नानक नामु मिलै तां जीवां तनु मनु थीवै हरिआ ॥१॥ 
Nānak nām milai ṯāŉ jīvāŉ ṯan man thīvai hari&shy;ā. ||1|| 
O Nanak, if I am blessed with the Naam, I live, and my body and mind blossom forth. ||1|| 

end of Salok Mahal Nauvan with||1|| 


Had there been||2|| ||1||  over here then only it could have been proven that Salok Mahala Panjavan is part of Mundavini Mahal Panjavan.

If more help is needed Das is ready.


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## Archived_Member1 (Dec 24, 2007)

parma ji, i really don't think that kind of response was necessary...  vijaydeep singh is a respected contributor to this forum.  even if english isn't his first language, i think he's doing a great job of sharing his knowledge.  i think the personal attacks and hatred at other faiths are totally unnecessary.

thanks.


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## spnadmin (Dec 25, 2007)

Parma ji

I am very sorry that you have chosen to make a mockery of my earlier comment. Only forum leaders and you yourself are able to edit your post. Since you chose a course of action -- mockery -- I have deleted the entire comment. I have also taken a page capture of how you mimicked my editorial comments.

*Warning: *The entire matter will be reviewed in the leaders' section. Please refrain in the future from hate language.


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## Parma (Dec 28, 2007)

I will make a suggestion. Personal attacks?? Ok i commented on the user using english!! I was not trying to be rude just speaking the truth. How can i reply to anyones article if the english is not understandable. I might as well be reading latin.. Yes there are many respected members of this forum no problems. Hatred against other faiths.. ? If you mean comments in the past then they were to people contributing nothing to sikhism but to promote there faiths. So lets turn the name of this forum from sikh philosophy to religious philosophy, that would be more fitting. I would understand the action, *plus mr Vijadeep in an unprovoked way assumes in his message I read pornograhy!!* *What hypocracy*, if to discuss another faith brings our faith brighter fine, but then again why look at our faith at all. I want to find explaintions on my life from my faith i have chosen not anothers if i am wrong for promoting that then fine. You should not have named the site sikh philosophy forum. No worries!! Take it easy,!! lol p.s. ALL i COULD GAIN FROM THIS DISCUSSION WAS someone promoting parts of pornography from the dasam granth as our faith, i dont know maybe I did pick the wrong religion?? Which religion promotes pornography???
Nothing i want to discuss further. How does the sinful turn into a saint and a saint into a sinner its a very thin line. PROMOTE IT!! SEE IT!! BECOME IT!! = Religion. Maybe I have mis interpreted some comments not my fault.. I would understand if I could, nothing horrible against anyone just the truth. (LATIN). I would only regret something if I had made the first personal attack as stated above. Whoever decides to ban me I havent done nothing wrong attack a sikh and one must defend themselves, maybe a bit harsh my attack but, no one measures a slap when they smack someone! Sorry if its caused a lot of fuss!! *Do what you have to do!!*_ I dont know were I did mimick anyone but if i did_ *THEN SO WHAT!!! A LIONS HEART IS THE HEART OF A TRUE SINGH!! 1:}--}:2:}--}:3:}--}:4:}--}:5 K *


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## vijaydeep Singh (May 29, 2008)

Gurfateh

Bhai Parma Nagara Ji,


Das is and will never be prmoting any poronogrphy.rather he has an urge to share something with yourself.

Chartitopakhyans are more a sort of criptography.Message online till date are also been used to to be send via poronography online.

Oldest profession on earth is of prostitutes and second one is of spies.Das is one of the spy so find Charitropakhan overlapping his proffesional sylabi.

Even if missionaries are ablbe to make a Khalistan by thier own.They in thier intelligence unit will have to encourage or perform or take note of many things which are foound obectioanble in Charitro Pakhayan.


One input for Mundavini.


ਮੁੰਦਾਵਣੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥ 
मुंदावणी महला ५ ॥ 
Munḏāvaṇī mehlā 5. 
Mundaavanee, Fifth Mehl: 

ਥਾਲ ਵਿਚਿ ਤਿੰਨਿ ਵਸਤੂ ਪਈਓ ਸਤੁ ਸੰਤੋਖੁ ਵੀਚਾਰੋ ॥ 
थाल विचि तिंनि वसतू पईओ सतु संतोखु वीचारो ॥ 
Thāl vicẖ ṯinn vasṯū pa&shy;ī&shy;o saṯ sanṯokẖ vīcẖāro. 
Upon this Plate, three things have been placed: Truth, Contentment and Contemplation. 

ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾਮੁ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਕਾ ਪਇਓ ਜਿਸ ਕਾ ਸਭਸੁ ਅਧਾਰੋ ॥ 
अम्रित नामु ठाकुर का पइओ जिस का सभसु अधारो ॥ 
Amriṯ nām ṯẖākur kā pa&shy;i&shy;o jis kā sabẖas aḏẖāro. 
The Ambrosial Nectar of the Naam, the Name of our Lord and Master, has been placed upon it as well; it is the Support of all. 

ਜੇ ਕੋ ਖਾਵੈ ਜੇ ਕੋ ਭੁੰਚੈ ਤਿਸ ਕਾ ਹੋਇ ਉਧਾਰੋ ॥ 
जे को खावै जे को भुंचै तिस का होइ उधारो ॥ 
Jė ko kẖāvai jė ko bẖuncẖai ṯis kā ho&shy;ė uḏẖāro. 
One who eats it and enjoys it shall be saved. 

ਏਹ ਵਸਤੁ ਤਜੀ ਨਹ ਜਾਈ ਨਿਤ ਨਿਤ ਰਖੁ ਉਰਿ ਧਾਰੋ ॥ 
एह वसतु तजी नह जाई नित नित रखु उरि धारो ॥ 
Ėh vasaṯ ṯajī nah jā&shy;ī niṯ niṯ rakẖ ur ḏẖāro. 
This thing can never be forsaken; keep this always and forever in your mind. 

ਤਮ ਸੰਸਾਰੁ ਚਰਨ ਲਗਿ ਤਰੀਐ ਸਭੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਪਸਾਰੋ ॥੧॥ 
तम संसारु चरन लगि तरीऐ सभु नानक ब्रहम पसारो ॥१॥ 
Ŧam sansār cẖaran lag ṯarī&shy;ai sabẖ Nānak barahm pasāro. ||1|| 



The dark world-ocean is crossed over, by grasping the Feet of the Lord; O Nanak, it is all the extension of God. ||1|| 
(Ang 1429

Kindly see the point that there is tippi over Mundvini making it a seal.

while we see in Ang 645.

ਸਲੋਕੁ ਮਃ ੩ ॥ 
सलोकु मः ३ ॥ 
Salok mehlā 3. 
Shalok, Third Mehl: 

ਥਾਲੈ ਵਿਚਿ ਤੈ ਵਸਤੂ ਪਈਓ ਹਰਿ ਭੋਜਨੁ ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤੁ ਸਾਰੁ ॥ 
थालै विचि तै वसतू पईओ हरि भोजनु अम्रितु सारु ॥ 
Thālai vicẖ ṯai vasṯū pa&shy;ī&shy;o har bẖojan amriṯ sār. 
Upon the plate, three things have been placed; this is the sublime, ambrosial food of the Lord. 

ਜਿਤੁ ਖਾਧੈ ਮਨੁ ਤ੍ਰਿਪਤੀਐ ਪਾਈਐ ਮੋਖ ਦੁਆਰੁ ॥ 
जितु खाधै मनु त्रिपतीऐ पाईऐ मोख दुआरु ॥ 
Jiṯ kẖāḏẖai man ṯaripaṯ&shy;ī&shy;ai pā&shy;ī&shy;ai mokẖ ḏu&shy;ār. 
Eating this, the mind is satisfied, and the Door of Salvation is found. 

ਇਹੁ ਭੋਜਨੁ ਅਲਭੁ ਹੈ ਸੰਤਹੁ ਲਭੈ ਗੁਰ ਵੀਚਾਰਿ ॥ 
इहु भोजनु अलभु है संतहु लभै गुर वीचारि ॥ 
Ih bẖojan alabẖ hai sanṯahu labẖai gur vīcẖār. 
It is so difficult to obtain this food, O Saints; it is obtained only by contemplating the Guru. 

ਏਹ ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ ਕਿਉ ਵਿਚਹੁ ਕਢੀਐ ਸਦਾ ਰਖੀਐ ਉਰਿ ਧਾਰਿ ॥ 
एह मुदावणी किउ विचहु कढीऐ सदा रखीऐ उरि धारि ॥ 
Ėh muḏāvaṇī ki&shy;o vicẖahu kadẖī&shy;ai saḏā rakẖī&shy;ai ur ḏẖār. 
Why should we cast this riddle out of our minds? We should keep it ever enshrined in our hearts. 

ਏਹ ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਪਾਈ ਗੁਰਸਿਖਾ ਲਧੀ ਭਾਲਿ ॥ 
एह मुदावणी सतिगुरू पाई गुरसिखा लधी भालि ॥ 
Ėh muḏāvaṇī saṯgurū pā&shy;ī gursikẖā laḏẖī bẖāl. 
The True Guru has posed this riddle. The Guru's Sikhs have found its solution. 

ਨਾਨਕ ਜਿਸੁ ਬੁਝਾਏ ਸੁ ਬੁਝਸੀ ਹਰਿ ਪਾਇਆ ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਘਾਲਿ ॥੧॥ 
नानक जिसु बुझाए सु बुझसी हरि पाइआ गुरमुखि घालि ॥१॥ 
Nānak jis bujẖā&shy;ė so bujẖsī har pā&shy;i&shy;ā gurmukẖ gẖāl. ||1|| 
O Nanak, he alone understands this, whom the Lord inspires to understand. The Gurmukhs work hard, and find the Lord. ||1|| 


A similar work with Mudavini being writtan which mean a riddle due to lack of Tippi inspite of the fact that in both we have plate and three things.


But does tippi makes are relavence let us see.
see ang

ਰਾਮਕਲੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੩ ਅਨੰਦੁ 
रामकली महला ३ अनंदु 
Rāmkalī mehlā 3 ananḏ 
Raamkalee, Third Mehl, Anand ~ The Song Of Bliss: 

ੴ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਪ੍ਰਸਾਦਿ ॥ 
ੴ सतिगुर प्रसादि ॥ 
Ik&shy;oaŉkār saṯgur parsāḏ. 
One Universal Creator God. By The Grace Of The True Guru: 

ਅਨੰਦੁ ਭਇਆ ਮੇਰੀ ਮਾਏ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਮੈ ਪਾਇਆ ॥ 
अनंदु भइआ मेरी माए सतिगुरू मै पाइआ ॥ 
Anand bẖa&shy;i&shy;ā mėrī mā&shy;ė saṯgurū mai pā&shy;i&shy;ā. 
I am in ecstasy, O my mother, for I have found my True Guru. 


then see over here.
ਪੰਨਾ 922, ਸਤਰ 17
ਅਨਦੁ ਸੁਣਹੁ ਵਡਭਾਗੀਹੋ ਸਗਲ ਮਨੋਰਥ ਪੂਰੇ ॥
अनदु सुणहु वडभागीहो सगल मनोरथ पूरे ॥
Anaḏ suṇhu vadbẖāgīho sagal manorath pūrė.
Listen to the song of bliss, O most fortunate ones; all your longings shall be fulfilled.
ਮਃ 3   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]


Das has a question that if  ਅਨੰਦੁ=ਅਨਦੁ   then why is not ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ= ਮੁੰਦਾਵਣੀ ???

So why do we make falsehood of the seal?


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## Astroboy (May 29, 2008)

*[SIZE=-1]SGGS Gurmukhi-Gurmukhi Dictionary[/SIZE]* [SIZE=-0] ਆਨੰਦ, ਸੁਖ, ਖ਼ੁਸ਼ੀ, ਆਤਮਕ ਆਨੰਦ। [/SIZE] 
*[SIZE=-1]Mahan Kosh Encyclopedia[/SIZE]* [SIZE=-0] ਦੇਖੋ, ਅਨੰਦ. "ਅਨਦੁ ਕਰੈ ਸਾਸਿ ਸਾਸਿ ਸਮਾਰੈ". (ਆਸਾ ਮਃ ੫). [/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]
Mahan Kosh data provided by Bhai Baljinder Singh (RaraSahib Wale);  See http://www.ik13.com


[/SIZE]


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## Astroboy (May 29, 2008)

*[SIZE=-1]ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ search results :-

SGGS Gurmukhi-Gurmukhi Dictionary[/SIZE]* [SIZE=-0] ਮੋਹਰ ਲਾ ਕੇ ਬੰਦ ਕੀਤੀ, ਬੁਝਾਰਤ, ਅੜਾਉਣੀ, ਭੇਤ ਵਾਲੀ ਗਲ [/SIZE] 
*[SIZE=-1]Mahan Kosh Encyclopedia[/SIZE]* [SIZE=-0] ਮੁਦ੍ਰਣ (ਮੁਹਰਛਾਪ ਲਾਉਣ) ਦੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਯਾ. ਮੁੰਦਣਾ. ਸ੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਸਾਹਿਬ ਵਿੱਚ ਮੁੰਦਾਵਣੀ ਸ਼ਬਦ ਦੋ ਥਾਂਈਂ ਆਇਆ ਹੈ. ਭਾਰਤ ਵਿੱਚ ਰੀਤਿ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਮਹਾਰਾਜਿਆਂ ਦੇ ਖਾਨ ਪਾਨ ਦਾ ਪ੍ਰਬੰਧ ਕਰਨ ਵਾਲਾ ਸਰਦਾਰ, ਆਪਣੇ ਸਾਮ੍ਹਣੇ ਭੋਜਨ ਤਿਆਰ ਕਰਵਾਕੇ ਦੇਗਚੇ ਆਦਿ ਬਰਤਨਾਂ ਪੁਰ ਮੁਹਰ ਲਾਦਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ, ਤਾਕਿ ਕੋਈ ਅਸ਼ੁਭਚਿੰਤਕ ਜ਼ਹਿਰ ਆਦਿ ਭੋਜਨ ਵਿੱਚ ਨਾ ਮਿਲਾ ਸਕੇ. ਫੇਰ ਜਦ ਥਾਲ ਪਰੋਸਦਾ ਹੈ ਤਦ ਕੀ ਥਾਲ ਪੁਰ ਸਰਪਸ਼ ਦੇਕੇ ਮੁਹਰ ਲਾ ਦਿੰਦਾ ਹੈ, ਅਰ ਉਹ ਮੁਹਰ ਜਿੰਮੇਵਾਰ ਸਰਦਾਰ ਦੇ ਰੂਬਰੂ ਮਹਾਰਾਜਾ ਦੇ ਸੰਮੁਖ ਖੋਲ੍ਹੀ ਜਾਂਦੀ ਹੈ. ਇਸ ਉੱਪਰਲੇ ਭਾਵ ਨੂੰ ਲੈਕੇ ਇਹ ਵਾਕ ਹੈ- "ਏਹ ਮੁਦਾਵਣੀ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਪਾਈ ਗੁਰਸਿਖਾਂ ਲਧੀ ਭਾਲਿ". (ਮਃ ੩. ਵਾਰ ਸੋਰ) ਭਾਵ ਇਹ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਗੁਰਉਪਦੇਸ਼ ਸਿੱਖਾਂ ਦੇ ਮਨ ਦ੍ਰਿੜ੍ਹ ਕਰਾਕੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਨੇ ਸਿੱਖ ਮਰਯਾਦਾ ਦੀ ਮੁਹਰਛਾਪ ਲਾ ਦਿੱਤੀ ਹੈ, ਤਾਕਿ ਨਿਯਮਾਂ ਵਿੱਚ ਗੜਬੜ ਨਾ ਹੋਵੇ. ਦੂਜਾ "ਮੁੰਦਾਵਣੀ ਮਃ ੫" ਸਰਲੇਖ ਹੇਠ ਸ਼੍ਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥਸਾਹਿਬ ਦੇ ਭੋਗ ਪੁਰ ਪਾਠ ਹੈ, ਜਿਸ ਦਾ ਭਾਵ ਅੰਤਿਮ ਮੁਹਰਛਾਪ ਹੈ. ਸਮਾਪਤੀ ਪੁਰ ਮੁਦ੍ਰਣ ਕਰਕੇ ਇਹ ਉਪਦੇਸ਼ ਹੈ ਕਿ ਇੱਥੇ ਧਰਮਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਦੇ ਪਾਠ ਦਾ ਭੋਗ ਹੈ। (2) ਬੁਝਾਰਤ. ਅਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਕੂਟ. [/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]
Mahan Kosh data provided by Bhai Baljinder Singh (RaraSahib Wale);  See http://www.ik13.com[/SIZE]


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## vijaydeep Singh (May 29, 2008)

Gurfateh


(2) ਬੁਝਾਰਤ does not it means a riddle?


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## Astroboy (May 29, 2008)

vijaydeep Singh said:


> Gurfateh
> 
> 
> (2) ਬੁਝਾਰਤ does not it means a riddle?




ਦੇਇ *ਬੁਝਾਰਤ* ਸਾਰਤਾ ਸੇ ਅਖੀ ਡਿਠੜਿਆ ॥
देइ बुझारत सारता से अखी डिठड़िआ ॥
Ḏė*ė bujẖāraṯ sārṯā sė akẖī diṯẖ*ṛi*ā.
The riddles and hints are given, and he sees them with his eyes.
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok

[/SIZE]ਕਹਾ *ਬੁਝਾਰਤ*ਿ ਬੂਝੈ ਡੋਰਾ ॥
कहा बुझारति बूझै डोरा ॥
Kahā bujẖāraṯ būjẖai dorā.
How can a riddle be understood by the deaf?
ਮਃ 5   -  [SIZE=-1]view Shabad/Paurhi/Salok[/SIZE]


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